Thread: Gods Cannot Have Consciousness

Originally Posted by O'nus

What you are doing is exactly what semantics is.

You are saying:
- Consciousness = God
- God = consciousness

This is semantics. You're attaching a conceptual word to another.



Unfortunately, there is no objective means to understanding this. Language functions on objective means. You are trying to objectively define God. God cannot be objectified.

Thus, your argument falls in on itself for your own reasoning. It's not like you're "wrong" just trying too hard to defend yourself when I'm not really arguing anything. You just can't arbitrarily label "consciousness" as "God" an expect it to fly.



I have extensively read about the collective consciousness via Carl Jung - the originator of that term and synchronism.

Keep in mind - they are beliefs which means there is no proof of it. The onus is on you to offer proof and reasoning and yet you cannot. Semantically dodging the idea by associating terms is not an effective means.



Maybe if all consciousness were one. However, the fact is that your phenomenological experience is independent from mine which means that cannot be - yet.

It is just an idea. Don't arbitrarily throw words around and mingle with definitions to try and "prove" something.

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this is very simple, follow me here

I BELIEVE GOD IS CONSCIOUSNESS. I am not arbitrarily throwing around words and mingling definitions just to argue with you. I am telling you...what I HONESTLY BELIEVE. And I can honestly tell you, THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN THE SAME, and yes that includes others who come from a hindu, christian, jewish, muslim or buddhist background. And I know because I have talked to them.

this is NOT an argument that what I am saying is true. I dont have to bring you the burden of proof because that is not the point I was making

but don't tell me what I do or what I don't believe in. okay?

my argument was SIMPLE. very simple. pay attention. You can not argue with theists who believe God is consciousness, that God is not conscious. For OBVIOUS reasons.

to theists such as me, you argument is pointless because it doesn't even consider our God in your little bubble

just thought you should know.

if you want to continue your stand, then you need to stop pretending that this is not a legitimate belief. Stop calling it semantics and accept it for what it means. Understand the belief, all that it implies, then argue.

there is a difference between not understanding something, because its new to you, and refusing to understand something just so you can make your argument absolute. but all the latter does, is put your argument in a closed box

Originally Posted by juroara

I BELIEVE GOD IS CONSCIOUSNESS.

Please explain how this is not semantics?

I believe grapes are oranges.

What's the difference? There's obviously more to how you define God, so it is vastly different than consciousness and contains more than what just consciousness contains.

I am not arbitrarily throwing around words and mingling definitions just to argue with you. I am telling you...what I HONESTLY BELIEVE. And I can honestly tell you, THERE ARE THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN THE SAME, and yes that includes others who come from a hindu, christian, jewish, muslim or buddhist background. And I know because I have talked to them.

Please do not mention how many people believe what you believe to try and defend it... The whole world was convinced the earth was the center of the universe, and they were all wrong.

This is besides the point though, obviously, just telling you for future reference that it is an ineffective means of argument.

this is NOT an argument that what I am saying is true. I dont have to bring you the burden of proof because that is not the point I was making

but don't tell me what I do or what I don't believe in. okay?

I am not telling you anything. Stop acting like a defensive melodramatic teenager.

The point I was making is that there is obviously more to what you believe than just "God is consciousness" and there is obviously more to God than the confines of consciousness. Come on now, we both know that. You've studied these religions - you know consciousness is just a small part of what God is.

my argument was SIMPLE. very simple. pay attention. You can not argue with theists who believe God is consciousness, that God is not conscious. For OBVIOUS reasons.

I didn't say that.

to theists such as me, you argument is pointless because it doesn't even consider our God in your little bubble

I'm not in a bubble. Realize that you are contriving your God - not me.

if you want to continue your stand, then you need to stop pretending that this is not a legitimate belief. Stop calling it semantics and accept it for what it means. Understand the belief, all that it implies, then argue.

I await for you to elaborate beyond semantics then. It is all you have offered so far. That is my only point. Otherwise, if God is just consciousness, then every single person IS God. Furthermore, how does cognitive research affect that? blah blabh blahb lbahblablaba... irrelevant right? EXACTLY MY POINT. That is because, as you just read that, a flood of other things associated to God that are not just contrived to consciousness came in - and you have not shared that but made obvious leeway to it.

there is a difference between not understanding something, because its new to you, and refusing to understand something just so you can make your argument absolute. but all the latter does, is put your argument in a closed box

It is unfortunate how often people accuse others of exactly what they are doing.

Originally Posted by TTTman

There you finally have the solution. This whole concept of God/gods is impossible to prove via logic and reasoning.

Finally..? I've been saying it the whole damn time! You just "finally" realized that I'm not as stupid as you thought. Now who is the prejudice one?

The very reason that it cannot be proven via logic and reasoning is the very reason why I don't believe in God. It goes both ways, realize. If you give leeway or truth to things that cannot be logically proven or reason; then I am God and you cannot prove otherwise.

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Originally Posted by O'nus

The very reason that it cannot be proven via logic and reasoning is the very reason why I don't believe in God.

Oh, why would you create a topic such as this one? Is it really about anything, or is it just conceptual entertainment?



It's a matter of paradigm awareness. "God" has many synonyms, if that helps. "Self", "Nature" and "Reality" can all be used as "God". None can be objectively proven, and the latter term of "God" may be the most misleading of them all (wisdom of Buddhism). This is beside the point however, after all, Reality is nameless anyway.

I BELIEVE GOD IS CONSCIOUSNESS.

Wrong. Please look up the respective definitions for those two words. Use the word 'consciousness' to mean consciousness in future. Congratulations, you are now an atheist.

Originally Posted by really

Oh, why would you create a topic such as this one? Is it really about anything, or is it just conceptual entertainment?

It's about the topic I set forth in the first post. Why are you asking me this? This argument takes on the premise of the idea of a creator. It's an analytical game, if you want to put it that way.

I presume you think it is a bias argument?

It's a matter of paradigm awareness. "God" has many synonyms, if that helps. "Self", "Nature" and "Reality" can all be used as "God". None can be objectively proven, and the latter term of "God" may be the most misleading of them all (wisdom of Buddhism). This is beside the point however, after all, Reality is nameless anyway.

Please don't do that - I have already defined which God I am referring to.

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Originally Posted by O'nus

It's about the topic I set forth in the first post. Why are you asking me this? This argument takes on the premise of the idea of a creator. It's an analytical game, if you want to put it that way.

I presume you think it is a bias argument?

I think it's just conceptual entertainment; analytical games. If you don't believe in God anyway, why put this forth?

Originally Posted by really

I think it's just conceptual entertainment; analytical games. If you don't believe in God anyway, why put this forth?

I don't know - it's a paramount waste of time. Just like my education and life.

What do you suggest..??

(Note; this is not sarcasm)

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Originally Posted by O'nus

I don't know - it's a paramount waste of time. Just like my education and life.

What do you suggest..??

(Note; this is not sarcasm)

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Why ask me? I have no idea who you are, let alone myself. (Hint)