Is the EU attempting to circumvent democracy?

**Original Poster** · 11-20-2011 11:59 PM

Eurocrats imposed on Greece and Italy: I'd rather be governed by the first 100 people in the phone book | Mail Online

This article's about how the legislatures in Italy and Greece threw out the popular elected PMs in replaced them with unelected puppets put in place specifically to overrule popular opinion.

**Xei** · 11-21-2011 12:06 AM

Yep, it's extremely concerning.

The sooner the whole thing falls down, the better.

**Original Poster** · 11-21-2011 12:20 AM

It seems like the world is begging for some kind of revolution

**Seroquel** · 11-21-2011 12:30 AM

**lawilahd** · 11-21-2011 01:14 AM

The new world order is starting

but seriously by the looks of things it does seem that way.

**DeeryTheDeer** · 11-21-2011 02:09 AM

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

It seems like the world is begging for some kind of revolution

Maybe the theories about 2012 ARE true.

**Original Poster** · 11-21-2011 05:16 AM

**juroara** · 11-21-2011 07:33 AM

Seeing any democratic nation lose even a tiny percent of its democratic process really concerns me

No I take that back, with the industrial military complex potentially being an international force - losing democracy is scary.

**ThePreserver** · 11-22-2011 05:41 AM

What replaces regimes in a revolution? More people hungry for power. I'm all for getting rid of some of our leaders... but we have to consider the possibility that maybe, JUST MAYBE, revolution won't actually make things better?! *gasp*

(ALthough in Europe that is disgusting. They should be elected, not selected... I hope they don't expect Europeans to just accept that.)

**Original Poster** · 11-22-2011 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by ThePreserver

What replaces regimes in a revolution? More people hungry for power. I'm all for getting rid of some of our leaders... but we have to consider the possibility that maybe, JUST MAYBE, revolution won't actually make things better?! *gasp*

(ALthough in Europe that is disgusting. They should be elected, not selected... I hope they don't expect Europeans to just accept that.)

The problem is that without a revolution, things will continue to get worse.

At the very least a full scale revolt is required to shake the tumor off our legislative system.

**Alric** · 11-22-2011 08:17 AM

We need to elect Ron Paul. I think he has a very good chance given current circumstances. He has been predicting everything that is happening now for over 20 years, and knows what he is doing. If he doesn't get elected as president, I think we can assume there is simply no will to ever fix anything. And then we are all doomed.

**Xei** · 11-22-2011 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

The problem is that without a revolution, things will continue to get worse.

The revolution in Egypt doesn't seem to have done much good.

**tommo** · 11-22-2011 02:09 PM

The revolting against the product of their revolution now lol

Still.... it is the only way.

**Xei** · 11-22-2011 02:14 PM

The revolution against Mubarak was only successful because the army stood aside. Now they're revolting against the army... it's hard to be optimistic.

**Original Poster** · 11-22-2011 05:59 PM

Because the military took advantage of the power vacuum, the Egyptians should have therefore supported their puppet dictator because at least then they had the illusion of a civil government. Is that the point you're making?

**ninja9578** · 11-22-2011 06:46 PM

Bankers trying to get rid of democracy and replace it with kleptocracy? Shocking

The people haven't been in charge of large chunks of the western world in quiet some time. The EU and The United States are both controlled by this man:

**Xei** · 11-22-2011 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

Because the military took advantage of the power vacuum, the Egyptians should have therefore supported their puppet dictator because at least then they had the illusion of a civil government. Is that the point you're making?

Yep you read my text with a masterfully objective eye as always, I love all despots and forms of oppression and I think it's only right that they should stay that way forever.

Originally Posted by ninja9578

Bankers trying to get rid of democracy and replace it with kleptocracy?

The Euro is being propped up by bureaucrats due to political hubris. Most of them are want unity for idealistic reasons but are too stupid or too in denial to realise they're having the opposite effect, as always.

**cmind** · 11-23-2011 01:13 AM

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

It seems like the world is begging for some kind of revolution

Have you read or heard of The Fourth Turning? It's a book that postulates a 4-generation cycle of history in the West (and America in particular) that's been going on for at least the past several hundred years. Every 80 years or so, there's a major revolution or conflict. The last one was the Depression/WW2. Before that it was the Civil War, and before that it was the American revolution.

It's been about 80 years...

Originally Posted by Xei

The revolution against Mubarak was only successful because the army stood aside. Now they're revolting against the army... it's hard to be optimistic.

It's worse. It was successful because the army actively defended the protesters.

**Original Poster** · 11-24-2011 01:03 AM

But now the army is stepping down as well because the demonstrators wouldn't let them keep power.

**Xei** · 11-24-2011 01:22 AM

Since when was the army stepping down?

You realise 'the demonstrators wouldn't let the army keep power' is like saying 'the ant wouldn't let the boot crush him'?

**Original Poster** · 11-24-2011 01:30 AM

Originally Posted by Xei

Since when was the army stepping down?

You realise 'the demonstrators wouldn't let the army keep power' is like saying 'the ant wouldn't let the boot crush him'?

Egyptian Army Commits To Civilian Power Transfer, Peace With Israel

And you're wrong. The army trying to retain power from a people that will not be slaves is like a boat trying to beat the ocean.

**ThePreserver** · 11-24-2011 01:44 AM

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

Egyptian Army Commits To Civilian Power Transfer, Peace With Israel

And you're wrong. The army trying to retain power from a people that will not be slaves is like a boat trying to beat the ocean.

(Strange analogy... because boats usually float on the ocean...)

Egypt... are they promoting peace with Israel because they are afraid the US will start another war against an "oppressive, Anti-Israeli regime" that arises? Interesting. Let's see who our foreign aid is siphoned to this time! (I'm guessing some major power player in the military who isn't willing to give up power completely.)

**tommo** · 11-24-2011 02:02 AM

Interesting.

And the ocean can beat a boat. Which is what Omnis was saying. Try going over a 50m wave in a boat and staying afloat when it come crashing down.

**Original Poster** · 11-24-2011 02:48 AM

A boat can manipulate the ocean to keep afloat but it's still kept afloat by the will of the ocean. I was going to say storm but the people don't riot every second of every day and I was going for the most truthful analogy I could, not the most appeasing to the people.

Egypt has already sacrificed more than 2000 innocents so they can have a real democracy, it's not fair to them for me to act like this revolution is an easy transition. This people has fought tooth and nail to be free. And they won't stop fighting until they see that freedom. No amount of clever power grabbing will stop them.

I only hope Greece and Italy can follow suit and kick out their tyrannical governments as well.

**cmind** · 11-24-2011 03:36 AM

Originally Posted by Xei

Since when was the army stepping down?

You realise 'the demonstrators wouldn't let the army keep power' is like saying 'the ant wouldn't let the boot crush him'?

Since you're all on the subject of bad analogies, this one also sucks. Being stepped on rarely actually kills ants. Trust me, I've stepped on plenty of ants in my time.

(I still agree with Xei)