Need WILD help!

[LucidJuggalo]

Greeting, citizens of DV. I'm currently having a spot of trouble trying to successfully WILD. I try to fall asleep for 9:30-10 (PM) and wake up at 4, stay up for a short while, then go back to 'sleep'. During this I'll lie on my back perfectly still and focus on my breathing until I feel very relaxed/body starting to feel numb (sometimes with a mantra like ''I am dreaming'' on the exhale) and then I try to divert my focus on to my dream body (I work better with physical sensations so I try to imagine what limbs feel like, surfaces, etc, but I also try to visualise what's happening as well) but this is the stage I think I struggle most with. It's really hard to keep up and often find myself wandering off. (Sometimes I get those memory imprints though) Although, most of the time I either give up or fall asleep. I have no idea if I've reached SP before either. I get to a point where I 'can't reli feel my body' and it's 'hard' to move but I don't know whether that's just because I've been really still for ages, because I can move if I focus on doing so. (or is that natural?) Also, regarding daytime naps, I can't pull that off either? I do the same as described above, and get quite deep into it, but that's it really.

[Romulan]

When you can't feel your body, that is the onset of SP. It's normal to be able to move when you want to at this point. Just don't move and try to fall asleep. Make sure your mind is blank and watch any imagery passively. Just tell yourself your falling asleep nothing special. You can do this with afternoon naps, but try to do it around 11AM-2PM

[LucidJuggalo]

Oooh I see. Awesome Do you mean both the body and mind falling asleep, or...? 'Cause that's something I don't get either. We're meant to remain conscious but fall asleep? I struggle with doing that. I can make the body go to sleep (I think) but my mind is still really active, and although I see HI and try to watch it passively it just fades out eventually. Then after a while it'll start again. This just keeps repeating though. And I see. Maybe that's where I was messing up then. I'd try like at 3 |:

[Romulan]

Yeah 3 might be too late as REM might wear off but it all depends on how much you slept the night before, and the day before and when you woke up. Also, when I say just try to fall asleep I mean just your body, but keep a small strand of awareness in your mind. If your body isn't going into full SP after a while then it is all your mind. You need to find a personal balance of awareness so that your body can fall asleep but your mind is just conscious enough to let the body fall asleep and not keep it up. Try blanking your mind, and really really just relaxing, but when you feel your about to fall asleep mentally, then use an anchor to bring back some awareness. Anchors can range from a physical feeling such as a slight numbing pain like if your hand is slightly under your body, or it can be the feeling of earplugs or a sleeping mask, or a mantra of some sort. It's really all up to personal preference. Your need to try many things and find what works for you because everybody is different. All that I've explained above is the reason why WILD'ing is one of the hardest to master but definitely not impossible. If you believe you can do it, then you can.

[LucidJuggalo]

Hmm... Well, this morning, this is what I did: Accidentally woke up an hour late for some reason (found myself holding my alarm?) but went through with a WILD nonetheless. First I set up the anchor, which took me a while to get, but eventually sorted it (crossed my legs so it was a bit painful) and just tried to slow down my breathing and focus on going to sleep. I experienced HI (not as much as usual) and also SP I think. There were points where I felt really heavy and couldn't move, like something was being laid on top of me, but I kept thinking about auditory hallucinations and voices which sketched me out a tad ('cause I'm home alone currently, and will be until tomorrow) so maybe that kept me up. But anyway, after an hour of this I gave up because I really wasn't getting anywhere and the anchor was starting to hurt too much (afraid I was gonna cut off circulation or w/e) and tried to go back to sleep. Only prob was, I felt too awake and this took me a while. Eventually, however, I did start drifting off. I remember certain points where I could see people/scenes with my mind's eye and, to an extent, was conscious of what was happening without actually being aware. I lost this 'awareness' shortly after though which was annoying. Although, this kept happening until I eventually fell asleep! I wasn't lucid at any point, but I think I was definitely on to something there.

[Romulan]

That's great that a scene was starting to take place. If you can learn to keep your mind aware during this you should transition into a LD within minutes. Also, the anchor you used might not be the best for you. I tried to use a similar anchor and I just found it annoying. You really need to not think about much during this because, you basically need to make your body think your mind is asleep, and it won't think that if you have constant thoughts in your head. Also, don't focus too much on any of the HI. Just watch it passively, let things come and go. Concentrating too much on the HI will hold you back from entering full SP. It's really hard to get this down and also not become extremely excited or scared when really vivid hallucinations occur, but everytime a really vivid hallucination occurs or I feel myself entering full SP, I tell myself "It's nothing, nothing is going on, I'm just falling asleep." Because sometimes I get too excited and the SP or HI recedes. Anyways, main point is don't try too hard (It will keep you up), and don't NOT try too hard (You'll fall asleep, unaware.) Like I said you need to find a personal balance on awareness. I hope that helped, don't give up, and keep trying.

[LucidJuggalo]

Yeah that helps a lot, thx Only thing is, those times where I'm really close and randomly getting vivid/long memory imprints or dreams forming or w/e is when I've usually given up and tried to go back to sleep (so I'm not focusing on remaining conscious), and no matter how hard I try to get to that point when I'm actually trying, it doesn't work?

[KingYoshi]

Ah, exactly. A common problem people have with WILDs, is they try too hard. If you find yourself laying awake for long periods of time, the problem is, you simply aren't falling asleep. When I first started WILDing, I also found that when I gave up and rolled over...I would often hit SP. So, I started practicing this and developed a WILDing technique that involves rolling over to a new position several times (if necessary) during my WILD process. There is a link in my signature if you would like to check it out. They key to falling asleep while keeping consciousness is your anchor. You basically keep a certain amount of attention to the your anchor while you are trying to fall asleep. Stay very relaxed and just try to witness/watch/observe yourself falling asleep. Like Rom said, WILDing is all about finding that balance in consciousness. It is definitely a finesse technique, but the more familiar you are with it, the easier it gets. Keep practicing and gaining experience. Good luck to you!

[LucidJuggalo]

Dude this looks like the missing piece of the puzzle! I shall try this tonight and report back

[LucidJuggalo]

Meh, I failed to do so because I slept through my alarm AGAIN ¬¬ I shall try tomorrow though.

[KingYoshi]

Lol, I also have problems with sleeping through alarms. I had to go out and buy one of those massive bell and hammer alarms just so I would wake up for class.

[LucidJuggalo]

Rofl XD Yeah that would certainly do the trick..

[LucidJuggalo]

Okay, I finally have some results! This morning I managed to wake up at the 'correct' time (my usual time is 4, which I woke up at, although I still slept through my alarm because I set it for 3) I had just finished a REM period by the looks of it (check my dream journal for the dream, which I surprisingly remembered loads of) and then decided to WILD after recording what I had just experienced. I had no luck. HOWEVER, I refer to dream related success. In terms of consciousness and SP, I can safely say I felt something different to every other time. I experienced a VERY strange sense of reality. I kinda zoomed into the darkness behind my eyelids/my face and that felt fixed. Although everything around me felt haywire. Like it was distorted and considerably bigger than me (that's a really poor description, although it's not the first time I've experienced this 'feeling' (it used to happen loads when I was small) and it's even happened during waking reality too in the past) But yeah. That happened and more of my body felt zoned out this time. Not just my arms. Although I could still move them if I tried, it wasn't just like moving a limb just like that kinda thing. And it was all over this time, so I can definitely say I am making progress here! But yeah. From waking up to giving up, 2 hours passed. I then spent ages awake just trying to fall asleep. Then, guess what BAM baby, I found myself in a dream, lucid from the point of entry. (Is that a really long WBTB or just a DILD btw?) But yeah, once that faded out, and I woke up, I just thought ''No. Not happening yet.'' and was able to pull myself back into ANOTHER dream. Completely lucid again. And once that faded out, I did likewise a 3rd time! DEILD loves me?

[KingYoshi]

Yeah, DEILDs are pretty easy when used to chain lucids/extend lucids. As for the first dream, if you never lost consciousness from the point of being awake to being in the dream, it was a WILD. If you did lose consciousness, but realized you were dreaming at the very beginning of the dream, this would be a DILD. Either way, congrats on your success!

[LucidJuggalo]

I honestly can't remember now tbh. I didn't see it form in front of me (which means it wasn't a wild, right?) I just tried to go to sleep, with the idea fixed in my head that I WOULD know if I was dreaming or not, and then found myself lucid right at the beginning of a dream.

[KingYoshi]

Hmm...well most likely it was a DILD/MILD, but you don't necessarily have to see a dream slowly form for it to be a WILD. The only requirement for a lucid dream to be considered a WILD, is transitioning from the waking state to the dream state without a lapse in consciousness. If you can't remember, then it is likely that you had a brief lapse in consciousness. This would mean the LD was a DILD/MILD.