Thread: Nicotine & Sleep

Nicotine patches DEFINATELY boost your dreams. LD....possibly too. I know I have extremely intense dreams if I wear a patch overnight.

However if you don't smoke....use the lighter patches. You don't want to get addicted to nicotine.

Funny thing about nicotine is that it is actually a hallucinogen (So are NDE's btw). Native Americans used to use a highly potent Tobacco variety that could induce hallucinations. If you roll a loose cigarette and pump tobacco smoke over it (like a mechanical smoker through a setup of tubes, holders, seals, and a pump) it will acumulate a nicotine rich resin. Let it dry and smoke it if you're brave. Don't do too much. Nicotine hits pretty fast when you smoke it, when you get those hallucinations, stop. You can OD on nicotine and have a heart attack (Hence the NDE reference...)

Or you could just get a patch and LD...

I am a smoker as well (Yeah I am 16 ) but uhh I smoke camel wides.. (more smoke I Geuss) can this be done with camel wides? without unrolling it?
Also I find if I smoke half a cig, then put it back for latter.. when i smoke the half it fells alot stronger. why is that?

Resin, son, resin

Well, not quite... but same concept, I do believe. The tarry goodness of the first half, including some extra nicotine, condenses out of the smoke of the first half and hangs out in the last half (look at the nasty brown paper on your clipped cigarettes and you'll see what I mean), so you're smoking tobacco that's had a nicotine bath...

Originally Posted by ZotC

Resin, son, resin

Well, not quite... but same concept, I do believe. The tarry goodness of the first half, including some extra nicotine, condenses out of the smoke of the first half and hangs out in the last half (look at the nasty brown paper on your clipped cigarettes and you'll see what I mean), so you're smoking tobacco that's had a nicotine bath...

LOL I guess being a pothead I assumed the process of resination was obvious.

I guess it just goes to show that despite blatant statements and warnings of death...teenagers will do just about anything to get high these days.

ohh ok! I see.. but it has to sit and dry right? it wont work if you keep smokeing it.. obviously?

have to try this

I've smoked wet resin but yeah, let it dry a little bit first or you'll probably get a nasty flood of nic resin in your mouth because the tar from tobacco tends to be pretty watery depending on the humidity of the product you are smoking (And good tobacco has a fair bit of moister in it).

Furthermore don't go overboard with it. Measure and resinate with small amounts first. You don't want to have a heart attack. Which Nicotine WILL cause.

...and long before it causes a heart attack, it can cause many other nasty things like fainting, vomiting, etc., etc.

Originally Posted by ZotC

...and long before it causes a heart attack, it can cause many other nasty things like fainting, vomiting, etc., etc.

naah little details

Puff at your own risk... I personally prefer the nicotine patch. I got it yesterday, and have experienced 3 lucid dreams since, one during my nap and two at night.

The problem with Cigarettes is they are really "crack nicotine"! The nicotine has been freebased slightly to enhance quick absorption. Smokers tend to have sleep difficulties because the nicotine wears off long before the night is over. The smoker wakes up early and doesn't remember dreams better because acetylcholine is lowered toward the end of the night. Smokers tend to have more vivid dreams when they quit smoking.

The reason patches induce LD's is that the nicotine is released slowly. They are relatively expensive and require a prescription in many places. If you could compress tobacco into a tight pill that would dissolve slowly, you could possibly make a cheap substitute for the patch. The slow release wouldn't upset the digestive system like eating tobacco would.

If you want to try chemical enhancers for LD's, I wouldn't start with nicotine. Try nonaddictive substances first. The risk of addiction is real enough and there are several vitamin combinations that are effective.

TruthHunter

Originally Posted by TruthHunter

The problem with Cigarettes is they are really "crack nicotine"! The nicotine has been freebased slightly to enhance quick absorption.

Methinks you're talking out of your buttocks.
The nicotine in a cigarette is partially "free base" because that's how it naturally occurs in the tobacco plant... Phillip Morris isn't cooking up nicotine salt into nicotine base

Originally Posted by TruthHunter

The reason patches induce LD's is that the nicotine is released slowly. They are relatively expensive and require a prescription in many places. If you could compress tobacco into a tight pill that would dissolve slowly, you could possibly make a cheap substitute for the patch. The slow release wouldn't upset the digestive system like eating tobacco would.

a) Many insurances covers smoking cessation, including the patch. Also, in New York state, anyone can get the patch for free from the NYS Smokers Quitline.

b) Please, by all means, be the first to test this "tobacco pill" idea for us. Because once again...

Originally Posted by TruthHunter

If you want to try chemical enhancers for LD's, I wouldn't start with nicotine. Try nonaddictive substances first. The risk of addiction is real enough and there are several vitamin combinations that are effective.

Right... anyone who picks up a nicotine habit just to dream is, well... a moron. Just ask any smoker, we'll readily admit it: it's a filthy, dirty, damn-near impossible-to-kick habit, and we're all in love/hate with it, for better or for worse... "for worse" much more so than "for better".

If you want to try chemical enhancers for LD's, I wouldn't start with nicotine. Try nonaddictive substances first. The risk of addiction is real...

Couldn't have said it myself. I've done coke and not been addicted. I've smoked meth, become addicted (2 months...not as bad as some have it) then quite. I've smoked marijuana for five years, quit for seven months, smoke for a year and then quit recently all with very little difficulty (All for personal reasons).

I have been smoking cigarettes for almost 8 years now and can't go more than several hours without becoming extremely manic and irritable. Traits I have trained myself rigidly through NLP, rationalization, meditation and martial discipline....disapear in a few hours without nicotine.

It is the most addictive drug I have ever encountered.

Originally Posted by Mad Stratter

Methinks you're talking out of your buttocks.
The nicotine in a cigarette is partially "free base" because that's how it naturally occurs in the tobacco plant... Phillip Morris isn't cooking up nicotine salt into nicotine base

Quite the contrary.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...es-widely.html

a) Many insurances covers smoking cessation, including the patch. Also, in New York state, anyone can get the patch for free from the NYS Smokers Quitline.

b) Please, by all means, be the first to test this "tobacco pill" idea for us. Because once again...

I think he more than hinted at the difficulty of producing it via homemade chemistry. While I personally have enough chemistry experience to do this including Alkaloid extractions from plants, pharmacuetical extractions (DXM) and conversion, etc. and I know making a time-release pill isn't too difficult though determining a consitant time-scale for release of that garage engineered product is still extremely difficult, I wouldn't recommend trying this nor would I do it myself. If I could quit smoking cigarettes I would never touch another form of nictotine with religious zeal.

Right... anyone who picks up a nicotine habit just to dream is, well... a moron. Just ask any smoker, we'll readily admit it: it's a filthy, dirty, damn-near impossible-to-kick habit, and we're all in love/hate with it, for better or for worse... "for worse" much more so than "for better".

We agree here.

It is the most addictive drug I have ever encountered.
[/QUOTE]


Hands down. I was addicted to oxycontin for quite some time, and then became a full blow junkie, doing heroin every single day for the better part of a year... I've since quit the dope, but , guess what... I'm still smoking?

I always heard nicotine was more addictive than heroin, now I can confirm it myself.

Originally Posted by Euthanatos

Quite the contrary.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...es-widely.html

Link is busted... I'd like to read it though if you can find a working mirror.

Originally Posted by Euthanatos

It is the most addictive drug I have ever encountered.

Hands down. I was addicted to oxycontin for quite some time, and then became a full blow junkie, doing heroin every single day for the better part of a year... I've since quit the dope, but , guess what?... I'm still smoking

I always heard nicotine was more addictive than heroin, now I can confirm it myself.

Originally Posted by Euthanatos

Quite the contrary.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...es-widely.html

Link is busted... I'd like to read it though if you can find a working mirror.

If you have read the "advanced Lucid Dreaming" you know that Nicotine is VERY usefull
To bad that you can't use it as a supplement until you have reached the age for buying nicotine in whatever country you're in :p

Originally Posted by Mad Stratter

I always heard nicotine was more addictive than heroin, now I can confirm it myself.

Yup.

Link is busted... I'd like to read it though if you can find a working mirror.

Works for me. IDK why it's not working for you.

'Crack' nicotine in cigarettes varies widely

• 15:24 28 July 2003 by Gaia Vince

Some cigarettes have a "kick" containing 35 times more "freebase" nicotine - the most addictive form - than others, researchers have found. The findings could help rate the addictiveness of different brands, they say.
"Free-base" nicotine is a particularly potent form of the naturally-occurring tobacco drug because it is in an extremely volatile, uncombined form. This means it can be much more rapidly absorbed by the lungs and brain than nicotine derivatives such as nornicotine or its salts.
The new study is the first into the amount of "free-base" nicotine contained in common brands of cigarettes and found wide-ranging differences. The researchers at Oregon Health and Science University used a laboratory smoking device and a gas chromatograph-mass spectrometer to collect and analyse smoke from 11 brands of cigarettes. The study measured the first three puffs of smoke from each cigarette.
"Measurements ranged from about one per cent free-base nicotine in the first few puffs to 36 per cent for a specialty US brand," says lead researcher James Pankow. "One type of Marlboro, the leading US brand of king-sized filter cigarettes, contained about 10 per cent free-base nicotine."
Crack cocaine

Previous research has shown that a drug's addictiveness is influenced by the speed at which it is delivered to the brain and absorbed into and from the blood stream.
"The study shows that the modern cigarette does to nicotine what crack does to cocaine," says addiction expert Jack Henningfield, at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine. The notorious addictiveness of smoking crack results from the vapourised cocaine reaching the brain almost immediately.
Ian Jones, a nicotine expert at Bath University, UK, adds: "Free-base nicotine is the most damaging form because it is the optimal configuration for binding to the nicotine receptors in the brain, heart and rest of the body. If the binding efficiency is increased, it means the concentration of nicotine at the receptors is higher and so it is very addictive."
"The first few puffs are the most important in terms of addiction, because nicotine reaches the brain within seconds," Jones told New Scientist
Ammonia and urea

The amount of freebase nicotine in cigarette smoke increases as the alkalinity, or pH, increases. This factor can be influenced by the use of certain additives.
"It is likely that ingredients such as ammonia and urea account for this addiction-enhancing effect. But you can also adjust the chemistry of the smoke by adjusting the blend. Some types of tobacco give a more basic blend," Pankow told New Scientist.
"There was tremendous amount of documentation revealed during litigation in the US of manipulation of the freebase levels and the FDA certainly believed there was manipulation of cigarette chemistry," he adds.
"What is clear is that the modern cigarette is a highly engineered nicotine delivery device and it's not just a matter of tobacco rolled-up in a piece of paper," Pankow says. "Even the so-called 'additive-free' cigarettes are highly engineered."
Journal reference: Journal of Chemical Research in Toxicology (DOI: DOI: 10.1021/tx0340596)

I am aware of Nicotine being considered the most addictive drug, but I however, am pretty sure that I can control the use of it without becomming addicted. I started smoking very lightly about a year ago (half a cig, here, half a cig there). Most of the time, I smoke only in social environments b/c almost all of my friends are addicted smokers. But even now, I can smoke a cigarette or two (or more) and go a couple days, even a week, w/o smoking. The thing is, I would say that I know a thing or two about how addiction/dependency works. I had an encounter with abusing Adderall (Amphetamines) last year but never got to the point where I absolutely needed it. I would get high off of it no more than once a month and put it off intentionally for that long just to avoid becomming addicted to it. Now don't get me wrong, I wouldn't deny having an addictive personality or having family members with it (dad was an alcoholic, sister was a coke addict and is an alcoholic). The desire of wanting to get high was definitely there, but I just ignored them and stuck with my schedule. Its the same with cigarettes. Yesterday, I had my first cigarette after going three days without one and I had one this morning. I went the entire week, last week, w/o a cigarette to prove to myself that I can quit whenever I want if the time calls for it. I'm not bragging or anything, I'm simply trying to avoid a lecture from some of you older, more experienced guys.

Now on to the topic: Since my dad and step-mom are heavy smokers, they were prescribed Chantix some time ago and left it sitting in the cabinet b/c they "aren't ready to quit". I was just talking to my friend last night about dreams when he mentioned nicotine patches having an effect on dreams (specifically inducing vivid, strange, and unusual dreams). So I'm going to take one tonight along with some 5-HTP or Melatonin and report back with my results, then put off any usage of it for a month.

Smoking helps me not sleep, which I'm pretty sure is not what we're all going for.

You are too funny, Mad Stratter.
But I appreciate the information you offered TruthHunter and especially the information posted by Euthanatos.
I started smoking when I was about 13 years old. My dad was giving me a hard time about sneaking out of the house just to smoke when I was about 16 and said I probably wasn't **really** smoking anyhow. That night I stayed up late, practicing inhaling lmbo. Previously, I felt if it came out of my nose I was doing in right. Wrong!
By the time I was 18 years old, I was smoking 4 packs a day every day. I was pregnant with my first child and going through EXTREME emotional problems and didn't really understand the possible dangers to my child (he was born healthy and almost 8 pounds). I smoked heavily throughout each of my 4 pregnancies.
I have ALWAYS had intense dreams. Smoking has never hindered nor helped my dreams nor my recall. But I never did wake up early for a smoke and back then I never even wanted a cigarette until I was awake for awhile.
I'm a "natural" when it comes to dreaming lol. I remember my dreams from as early as about 4 years of age- even though the rest of my childhood has been mostly forgotten.

About 8 years ago I quit smoking. I used the patch for maybe little over a month if that. I dreamed about smoking though extremely frequently. But I never really wanted to smoke in life. Until April 28 of last year. My kids were living with my half-sister and she sent me an extremely nasty email. She closed the letter with- "by the way. Happy birthday." She knows I don't celebrate birthdays, having been one of Jehovah's Witnesses (me not her). Her nastiness, closing words, having been "excommunicated" by my congregation and missing my kids threw me over the edge and I started smoking that day. I went directly to 3 packs a day.
Neither my dreams nor my recall changed.

I've quit several times since then for as long as a month. I've used the patch and the mints. If I use a patch right before going to sleep, I have trouble staying asleep. Other than that, they don't add anything nor take away anything from my dreaming experiences or recall.

Nowadays I smoke right before the moment I go to sleep (I put it out, roll over on my couch and fall right to sleep), and when I wake up I light one first thing. But again, neither my dreams nor recall have changed.

So, I'm very curious about how and why certain things work well for other people. I very rarely LD. When I do, it's by accident.

I too would strongly caution against using the patch or anything nicotine related to help trigger LD or vivid dreams. It's much too dangerous and much too addictive to take lightly.

I took Chantix last night along with 5-HTP and I can't believe it actually worked! I was incredibly happy after I realized I was dreaming. My very first dream was lucid (I know b/c I woke up immediately after it). It wasn't too long though, probably lasted 10 to 15 minutes. I also ended up having and recalling four non-lucid dreams (rather strange I should note). I have to say that nicotine can really be addictive for reasons other than catching a buzz through smoking. But staying true to my post above, I'm going to cease use of Chantix until Sunday, to keep three, solid nicotine-free days. I took 0.5 mgs and am now curious as to how Chantix would affect my dreams at 1 mg (that would be a shame if it would keep me up all night).

I'm guessing that it's the alertness that nicotine causes that was responsible for my immediate recognition that I was dreaming. I just found myself standing on a hill in a field, between two houses; it was also very sunny. I can't explain how clear it was to me that I was dreaming (I never do RCs).

Conclusion: I would recommend Chantix to any LDs who, like me, have trouble becoming lucid (or having DILDs) spontaneously and is looking for that boost to get them started for one night every so often. I wouldn't suggest using it everyday for obvious reasons. I should also note that I used auto-suggestion while listening to music, before falling asleep, and was pretty convinced of what I was telling myself (I will lucid dream!) mainly b/c I had taken Chantix, so auto-suggestion is (always) recommended if you want better results from Chantix.

Originally Posted by Oros

If you have read the "advanced Lucid Dreaming" you know that Nicotine is VERY usefull
To bad that you can't use it as a supplement until you have reached the age for buying nicotine in whatever country you're in :p

every one knows that you can get nicotine anywhere in the world no matter age just find a alcoholic and pay him little extra

Just don't do it, there are a lot of less dangerous ways of increasing your lucid rate.

I don't really see the need to spend money on patches. Just use chewing tobacco. When I suggested making a pill, I didn't mean something complex, just tightly compressed tobacco. Chewing tobacco lingers plenty long enough to have effect

When you smoke, the tobacco enters your system quickly and also leaves quickly. With chew, it stays longer and is entering your blood stream after you have gone back to sleep.

Since I started experimenting, I have had several lucid dreams using tobacco. I have had to work hard at not getting into regular daytime use. Its like..."Just a little nip"..."That was stupid"..."spit it out"... later..."Just a little nip"...ad nauseum...

I have to remind myself that it won't help to take it regularly. So I've been doing it about once a week. It seems to work every time for me if I do it that way. Mucuna Pruriens helps a little, but the nicotine alone seems to be sufficient.

The last time I did it was really weird. I was trying to relax and go to sleep in WBTB. I though I was awake and heard a hissing sound. I "left" my body and went up through the ceiling, then awakened. It wasn't actually an OBE in my opinion as what I saw was not my real surroundings. Upon reflection, I realized that I had actually been dreaming that I was lying in bed sensing my body. Would that be a false WILD?