Thread: zomg, a lucid dream! (sharing my experience) XD

Nice, I just had my first lucid myself tonight. I woke up with a headache too and I thought it was pretty odd, so maybe it is related to LDs. I managed to fly in my dream, but it ruined the stability of it.

Congratulations on your lucids! I haven't tried flying in a lucid dream, but I don't think there would be any problems. Just do it! I did do invisibility once, which basically just made everyone ignore me.

I don't think I've ever awoken from a lucid dream with a headache.

I did woke up with headaches, my first times. I think that happens, because you have to think alot and use your mind, to actually "think" in a dream.... you get my point? haha.

Yeah, I do. I reckon the idoser I listen to before also contributes too. Once I listened to a 30min track of idoser and I woke up the next morning with a bad headache. And once I was in deep meditation and the next morning I woke up with a nose bleed. It was the strangest thing, I think my brain is just not used to this deep mind altering stuff..

I tried iDoser and it didn't really work for me. I think there are better ways to entrain the brain - I definitely got a headache after using iDoser. But I've never had a headache after a lucid dream.

I don't know how common it is to fall after flapping your arms, but I'm inclined to believe that wouldn't work so well. To fly is all about your intention to fly and really believing that you can. It helps me to think about this: If I were going to actually fly in real life, how would I move my body? Moving like I mean to fly helps me to believe that I will so I get better results.

When I look at my hands, I get really freaked out. lol Normally I'm missing fingers. Not like they've been chopped off... but like they never grew there at all! And then some fingers will be missing and then reappear and look normal, while other fingers that used to look normal disappear! Seeing missing fingers freaked me out so much I tried to wake myself up. It turned out to be a false awakening, because I looked at a clock and the time kept changing...

Did you know you were dreaming while you held that boy's hand? If you didn't, then that part probably wasn't lucid.

^^ gee! hahaha, that sounds freaky! Missing fingers. I'm worried to look in mirrors if I lucid again. I've heard thats totally twisted. I'm glad my hands where just doubled blurs. lol

I don't know. I think I may have been cause I was trying to get him to hold my hand too and I was really focused on our hands. And afterwards when we got to this sound boothy thing I was lucid. And even if I wasn't, do you think I was slipping in and out of lucidity? Because that happens to people right? They are lucid then not, then again lucid..?

I haven't heard of anybody else missing fingers - that might just be my weirdness. lol

Oh no! I didn't talk about the mirrors thing to make you worry about it. Just be aware that your state of mind determines everything that happens in the dream. That is, you ARE the mirror as well as the reflection, as well as the person standing at the mirror to see the reflection. So if you are feeling afraid, you will see it where ever you are, because it's a part of you showing up in your reality. Being afraid in a dream is like being afraid of yourself. So don't worry about it, it's just you playing tricks on yourself.

Your brainwaves cycle through the night. It's not just one straight line of brainwaves, so to speak. If you were to see them, you'd notice that they move up and down like a wave... sometimes you'd be more lucid as the wave moves "up" more into the alpha frequency and less lucid as you move down, deeper than alpha. The deeper your brainwaves go, the harder it is to stay conscious.

So it makes sense to slip in and out of lucidity, as you put it.

Your super consciousness of trying to hold his hand may have been you experiencing an "up" swing from a normal dream into more consciousness as your brainwaves cycled. By the time you made it to that booth, you may have been riding the crest of your lucidity wave. That's what is recognized as a lucid dream.

I wouldn't worry too much about labeling which parts were lucid and which weren't - just recognizing that you were going lucid and then actually becoming lucid are good things! Keep that up (and let go of fear), and you'll have more lucid dreams in no time.

Originally Posted by 156curses

^^ gee! hahaha, that sounds freaky! Missing fingers. I'm worried to look in mirrors if I lucid again. I've heard thats totally twisted. I'm glad my hands where just doubled blurs. lol
?

I looked into a mirror in my 2nd lucid. I got scared and woke up. Really pissed since it was the first thing I did in the dream, and the lucid got wasted. Just be ready for a possibly frightening reflection. Mine was sorta evil looking.

Originally Posted by horsey101

I looked into a mirror in my 2nd lucid. I got scared and woke up. Really pissed since it was the first thing I did in the dream, and the lucid got wasted. Just be ready for a possibly frightening reflection. Mine was sorta evil looking.

Did you lucid from a false awakening? I did. And in my room I have these two big mirrors for cuboard doors. I avoided it the first time cause my room was well dark. I wonder why it is a mirror reflection is often scary? Is it your subconcious showing you what you really think of yourself? Or did it start somewhere in the history of lucid dreaming and the idea passed around to lucid dreamers all about?

@flyinghawkins
I've seen diagrams about the brainwaves going up and down during sleep and REM and such being greatest at the height of a wave ( - if that makes sense) - is this why we have several dreams a night sometimes? Or do we keep the same dream throughout all waves (on some occasions)?

Thanks for your feedback!

Originally Posted by 156curses

I've seen diagrams about the brainwaves going up and down during sleep and REM and such being greatest at the height of a wave ( - if that makes sense) - is this why we have several dreams a night sometimes? Or do we keep the same dream throughout all waves (on some occasions)?

Well, you are dreaming the entire time. lol When brainwaves dip lower in the wave, most people lose consciousness. But when you come to the peak of a wave you are closer to a waking state even though you are still asleep. Those are the times you become lucid.

There's always stuff going on in the background. That is, even if you're not aware of it, your subconscious is still stewing around back there creating dreams and you're living them. In a way, all dreams are extensions of the same one. Only they are broken up by what you are conscious of - the break in between is where you haven't mastered lucidity. Does that make sense?

You are practicing to be lucid in alpha state, which is where lucid dreaming most often takes place. Let me be clear when I say lucid: it means that you are still aware that you are dreaming whether you are riding the wave low or high.

Originally Posted by flyinghawkins

Your brainwaves cycle through the night. It's not just one straight line of brainwaves, so to speak. If you were to see them, you'd notice that they move up and down like a wave... sometimes you'd be more lucid as the wave moves "up" more into the alpha frequency and less lucid as you move down, deeper than alpha. The deeper your brainwaves go, the harder it is to stay conscious.

If that's true, than dreams must actually be very very short.
Look at this diagram of Delta brain waves (adults slow wave sleep) :

One second of EEG signal!

Originally Posted by Yarbskoo

If that's true, than dreams must actually be very very short.
Look at this diagram of Delta brain waves (adults slow wave sleep) :

One second of EEG signal!

That's about right. It might seem short to look at it, but that's just how fast your brain moves.

I have a real life story that illustrates this perfectly:
My cousin was once skiing down a mountain with some friends. He moved only a little faster than them, skiing ahead but never leaving their line of sight.

My cousin isn't a very experienced skier, and he slipped and rolled down the mountain, bumping his head as he went down.

He was knocked unconscious from the impact and began to dream. He recounted it as a very vivid and detailed dream that lasted for about 30 minutes.

When he woke up he was lying on his back, and saw his friends only just coming down the mountain behind him. He asked them how long he'd been out, expecting to hear 30 minutes judging from the length of the dream he'd just had. But his friends told him he'd only been out for about 15 seconds!

I'm sure there are more examples like this. This is just one that happened to someone I know personally - he was pretty emphatic about how long that dream seemed to be. And yet there was no way it would have taken 30 minutes for his friends to catch up with him lying there.

Originally Posted by flyinghawkins

That's about right. It might seem short to look at it, but that's just how fast your brain moves.

I have a real life story that illustrates this perfectly:
My cousin was once skiing down a mountain with some friends. He moved only a little faster than them, skiing ahead but never leaving their line of sight.

My cousin isn't a very experienced skier, and he slipped and rolled down the mountain, bumping his head as he went down.

He was knocked unconscious from the impact and began to dream. He recounted it as a very vivid and detailed dream that lasted for about 30 minutes.

When he woke up he was lying on his back, and saw his friends only just coming down the mountain behind him. He asked them how long he'd been out, expecting to hear 30 minutes judging from the length of the dream he'd just had. But his friends told him he'd only been out for about 15 seconds!

I'm sure there are more examples like this. This is just one that happened to someone I know personally - he was pretty emphatic about how long that dream seemed to be. And yet there was no way it would have taken 30 minutes for his friends to catch up with him lying there.

For those kind of dreams(30min long compared to 15seconds IRL), it is due to time dilation if that's the correct word. In ETWOLD, an example was given which illustrates this. If in a theatre, the actors showed a clock at midnight, then put off the light and turned them back on with the clock at 6am, your brain automatically assumes that 6hr have passed, even thought it might have been more like 10seconds or so

Time dilation... I didn't know that! How curious....

It makes me think that reality might not be just the way we think it is, if our brains can really just assume 6 hours passed by because of a trick like that. What else could be tricking us that we don't know about? You'd think the calculations in the brain would be accurate... but it looks like that's not always so.

So what do we have to measure reality against, if what we perceive to be "reality" is so changeable?



What do you guys think?

And as far as dreaming goes, I tend to believe that we are dreaming all the time. So even though the brain hits that lucid point for only a second or two at a time, it's not like we stop becoming involved in dreams when we aren't at the top of the wave.

Do you think it's possible to extend awareness to points below that peak level? Or by lucid dreaming do we learn to make the brainwaves peak more often? I'm not sure on that one.

I'm not so sure what you mean 'hawkins.. What eles exactly could the brain be tricking us about in reality? Are you saying we mightn't be able to tell the difference between reality and dreams? Therefore, we could be dreaming constantly, or when we don't exspect it in reality? I'm confused..

I think by being lucid,the peaks in our brainwaves are more frequent. Its us being aware. And no, I don't think we can extend out awareness during the lows of our brainwaves. You could probably push your awareness back up by using a technique such as rubbing your hands together or grasping something around you but while doing that you'd be making your brainwaves rise to the peaks again, wouldn't you? Is this what you meant.

And I've never heard that 30 minute dream in 30 seconds thing! I mean, I've heard how some people recall having dreams that last months on end, and that definition could indeed justify those sort of dreams. The sub concious works INCREDIBLY fast every single day, day in, day out, controling your blood flow, reactions, heartbeat and so on - so I guess I wouldn't be suprised of the brain creating such a fast dream for you cousin, 'hawkins, after he knocked himself out. Just another amazing quality of the human brain. How I love the brain! Its so cool! hahahahaha I'm such a nerd.. I love learning about all the qualties of the brain.

Originally Posted by 156curses

How I love the brain! Its so cool!

Not only that, but it's tasty too!
ep203_zombies_widescreen.jpg
OM NOM NOM

Originally Posted by 156curses

I'm not so sure what you mean 'hawkins.. What eles exactly could the brain be tricking us about in reality? Are you saying we mightn't be able to tell the difference between reality and dreams? Therefore, we could be dreaming constantly, or when we don't exspect it in reality? I'm confused..

I think by being lucid,the peaks in our brainwaves are more frequent. Its us being aware. And no, I don't think we can extend out awareness during the lows of our brainwaves. You could probably push your awareness back up by using a technique such as rubbing your hands together or grasping something around you but while doing that you'd be making your brainwaves rise to the peaks again, wouldn't you? Is this what you meant.

Yeah, in a way. What I mean is, I don't know what else the brain could be tricking us about in reality, and that's the freaky bit. If the brain thinks in speeds that equal 30 minutes worth of data in 15 seconds, that's pretty much your processing speed. So that's how fast your brain is interpreting all the physical stimulus surrounding you and painting a picture of your perceptions. Your perception is what you think reality is... you know, the temperature of a room, how bright it is, the objects in the room with you, etc...
But the perception of the brain can be tricked! If it is processing so fast, but the stimulus wasn't real, the brain would paint the picture of your perceived reality using something that isn't real. A false stimulus, like in the example with the theatre show where they could change your perception of reality by making it feel 6 hours later just by changing the numbers on a clock, can translate into what your reality is! It can change any part of your reality just by putting something in there to fake out the brain. Does that make more sense?

So I was asking what else could possible have that effect on the brain. Especially stuff that we think is ordinary and real but really may not be, just because something is tweaking out the brain. It really is like living in another dream...

After I read this I searched the internet to see if it is possible to be conscious during lower states (you gotta love the internet!). And guess what I found?

You can stay lucid!! Really deep meditators, like yogis and other spiritual practitioners, depending on their skill level can actually stay lucid all the way down to Theta. Do you know how deep Theta is? That's the equivalent of a coma! O.O

So maybe by lucid dreaming you're learning to ride the waves of your own brain? Y'know, stay anchored like you just said by rubbing your hands together or grabbing things etc so matter how deep you go you're still lucid. I think your brainwaves go where ever they will go depending on your sleep cycle, activity level, etc.
But when you get to be lucid of all your brainwaves, it might be possible to control where they go? Kind of like learning to ride a bike. At first, it goes where ever because you don't know how to ride it. But once you learn, you can control it just like it's a part of you... and in this case, brain waves are a part of you. lol Do you think that might work?

@ Yarbskoo

Lol. Sweet mohawk on the right.

@flyinghawkins, (now that we're WAY off topic)
I'd like to correct you on something.
Actually, I think I'll just explain the different brainwave patterns.
Beta

When the brain is aroused and actively engaged in mental activities, it generates beta waves. These beta waves are of relatively low amplitude, and are the fastest of the four different brainwaves. The frequency of beta waves ranges from 15 to 40 cycles a second. Beta waves are characteristics of a strongly engaged mind. A person in active conversation would be in beta. A debater would be in high beta. A person making a speech, or a teacher, or a talk show host would all be in beta when they are engaged in their work.

Alpha

The next brainwave category in order of frequency is alpha. Where beta represented arousal, alpha represents non-arousal. Alpha brainwaves are slower, and higher in amplitude. Their frequency ranges from 9 to 14 cycles per second. A person who has completed a task and sits down to rest is often in an alpha state. A person who takes time out to reflect or meditate is usually in an alpha state. A person who takes a break from a conference and walks in the garden is often in an alpha state.

Theta

The next state, theta brainwaves, are typically of even greater amplitude and slower frequency. This frequency range is normally between 5 and 8 cycles a second. A person who has taken time off from a task and begins to daydream is often in a theta brainwave state. A person who is driving on a freeway, and discovers that they can't recall the last five miles, is often in a theta state--induced by the process of freeway driving. The repetitious nature of that form of driving compared to a country road would differentiate a theta state and a beta state in order to perform the driving task safely.

Individuals who do a lot of freeway driving often get good ideas during those periods when they are in theta. Individuals who run outdoors often are in the state of mental relaxation that is slower than alpha and when in theta, they are prone to a flow of ideas. This can also occur in the shower or tub or even while shaving or brushing your hair. It is a state where tasks become so automatic that you can mentally disengage from them. The ideation that can take place during the theta state is often free flow and occurs without censorship or guilt. It is typically a very positive mental state.

Delta

The final brainwave state is delta. Here the brainwaves are of the greatest amplitude and slowest frequency. They typically center around a range of 1.5 to 4 cycles per second. They never go down to zero because that would mean that you were brain dead. But, deep dreamless sleep would take you down to the lowest frequency. Typically, 2 to 3 cycles a second.

When we go to bed and read for a few minutes before attempting sleep, we are likely to be in low beta. When we put the book down, turn off the lights and close our eyes, our brainwaves will descend from beta, to alpha, to theta and finally, when we fall asleep, to delta.

It is a well known fact that humans dream in 90 minute cycles. When the delta brainwave frequencies increase into the frequency of theta brainwaves, active dreaming takes place and often becomes more experiential to the person. Typically, when this occurs there is rapid eye movement, which is characteristic of active dreaming. This is called REM, and is a well known phenomenon.

When an individual awakes from a deep sleep in preparation for getting up, their brainwave frequencies will increase through the different specific stages of brainwave activity. That is, they will increase from delta to theta and then to alpha and finally, when the alarm goes off, into beta. If that individual hits the snooze alarm button they will drop in frequency to a non-aroused state, or even into theta, or sometimes fall back to sleep in delta. During this awakening cycle it is possible for individuals to stay in the theta state for an extended period of say, five to 15 minutes--which would allow them to have a free flow of ideas about yesterday's events or to contemplate the activities of the forthcoming day. This time can be an extremely productive and can be a period of very meaningful and creative mental activity.

Hope you learned something new!

Whoops, I got excited.... I apologize for the topic change.

Of course, you're right Yarbskoo - I've mixed up my delta and theta patterns. And the flow of the patterns and activity range you took the time to post make perfect sense as well.

When I talked about the deep states, I meant lucidity in terms of meditative awareness in a deep delta. This is what was so impressive to me. And it would take a similarly deep focus to be able to extend the state of Theta in sleeping to waking transition.

Thanks for catching me on that! I do appreciate it.

I looked in the miror during a false awakening and looked exactly the same except for the fact that I had bed hair lol. I supose the only reason to wory about looking in a mirror is if you wory about looking in mirrors.

Originally Posted by flyinghawkins

Thanks for catching me on that! I do appreciate it.

Glad I could help!

Originally Posted by MadMonkey

. I supose the only reason to wory about looking in a mirror is if you wory about looking in mirrors.

Agreed. Who knew FDR was talking about dreaming all this time?

Wow! To be in such a low state of meditation that is close to a coma I would find to be quite scary. How would you pull yourself out of that one? Would it feel like SP? It certainly would be incredible but somewhat scary too - but thats the wrong mindset to use if you were to go into that state.. I'm not sure if this is exactly meditation, but when I've attempted it for self hypnosis or whatnot, I can make myself feel heavy or light and floating, and I can feel my heartbeat strongly in my left palm. I remember now - it wasn't the idoser that made me nose bleed the morning after, but this meditation where I felt I had all these strange controls. I had been reading about how these people could control their body temperature, blood flow and heartbeat and stuff from meditation - so I gave it a shot focusing on my heartbeat in my left palm. Would this be using alpha brainwaves?

- BY THE WAY, thanks to all of you who have posted and contributed to my thread. I've learnt a lot and I'm really glad you've all taken such an interest in posting here. Perhaps from all this information other viewers can learn something new too.

Generally, If you're focusing, you're in Beta. If you're relaxing, you're in Alpha. If you're sleepy and operating on autopilot, you're in theta. If you're in Delta, you're asleep.

If you were meditating, you were probably in alpha. You said you were focusing though, so you might have been in low beta. You can't know for sure without electroencephalography, and to be honest, it really doesn't matter. Instead of trying to reach different different brainwave patterns, you should instead focus on levels of concentration or awareness. I doubt people who meditate are thinking "I must be in theta." Then again, I could be wrong!

Originally Posted by MadMonkey

I looked in the miror during a false awakening and looked exactly the same except for the fact that I had bed hair lol. I supose the only reason to wory about looking in a mirror is if you wory about looking in mirrors.

So me expecting a distorted reflection gave me one? Makes sense considering the nature of dreams.