Thread: Question for Atheists.

Originally Posted by windsfury

It most surely is not. Well, not for the virus itself, that would actually be ridiculous, but for it's wide-spread disaster.

No, it really is pretty idiotic.

You can't blame Christians for causing something they had absolutely no knowledge about; and it's very debatable to what extent they caused it.

The Crusades and such, sure, you can possibly blame Christianity for that. But blaming Christians for a pandemic is asinine.

I don't think these kind of arguments help anybody though, and in fact I think they're wrong anyway. Religion is often used as a scapegoat for the true motives behind human atrocities; it makes no more sense to blame religion for various warcrimes than it does to blame atheism for the actions of Stalin; the causes of these acts were in fact people.

Originally Posted by Bowie

Because they killed cats?

Do i have to spit it out? Can't you see why religion is evil in so many way's? Religious facism is a big thing in the world.

Originally Posted by sora12

Hello there.
I am interested in knowing when some of you who are Atheist became/ realized you were atheist and or how? (Sorry if I worded the question in a weird way.) Lately, I've been doubting my belief in God. I grew up all my life believing in him and I've never really given a second thought to his existence. So I just wanted to see if anybody went through a similar experience before they became Atheist and stuff like that.

I grew up a "Christian." I put it in quotes because I never went to Church, or read the Bible, so I can't really claim I was a Christian because I didn't share all of the Christian beliefs. After coming here after a while I went to Deism. I then ended up getting caught up in everyday life and work and left for a long time from here and I eventually ended up becoming an Atheist, or I guess I'm Atheist. I don't believe in God, but I don't deny that there can't be one. It's possible, I just don't see it anymore. I never did think that he interacted with the lives of people, or anything on Earth. I never believed that much in prayers, I never believed in miracles. So, to say I was a Christian at one time is hard to do. I know how religion is though, I've grown up in the Bible Belt.

Really, I can't believe in something that's supposed to be kind and caring with all the suffering that goes on in every day life of other people. If one exists it's cruel and heartless. I don't know a whole lot about other religions, but I know Christianity is a load of crap. You can figure that out just by reading the Bible, or even just doing some research over it.

How can we ever put faith in such a schooling when the main source of ideals are embodied in a man who did the democratic walk of life, while common behavior sways from that belief.. The only Christians that are left are racist republicans. Self centered greedy conservatives that do the exact opposite of what Jesus's words conveyed. Just the simple fact that they preach his word & defile the word, is a clear representation that Christianity is a concept & not a religion. All those Republican Christians are actually elitest Catholics. If i were to claim to be a Christian, i would make it very clear that Catholics/Republicans are not included in the faith. Infact, Jesus stood against all of that crap. He stood for unalienable human rights & restraint. A restraint that doesnt include Jethro blowing you away with a shot gun cause you wouldnt get off his porch. All these morons joining the armed forces over some fake religious war funded by these rich elite evangelical satan worshipers. Religion is Satan. All wars are financial agendas driven by people that think they are God. God is money. But to turn away from the concepts of good will can only prove to tilt into a communistic or anarchy based system. I dont think we need to be anymore non humanitarian, Caring about people around you reassures sustainability, although this can be achieved by tribal communities that share the task. As any controlling force, our schools have made that very clear by eliminating art courses & increasing sports. They want gladiators for there arena, not philosophers or profits. People that use there minds are a threat to big governments economic monopoly. So i say fuck there Roman rule & be smarter than these scum that have been indoctrinating us with lies. Can you catch a football, or can you mentally shatter your opponent. Which one of these attributes will take you to the top of the work force?? It is clear that human cognition has proven that survival of the fittest is a cerebral game now. But the Jesus concept is the best psychi of humanitarianism, that has simply been exploited to make us take a slap on both cheeks, while they poison our food & water & lie to us about land rights so banks can take us for a ride. Face it, they tell us to follow ideals that set us up as victims & martyres. While they profit from both sides of the good & evil spectrum. Take the fake war on drugs.. Military troops protect poppy fields, The CIA harvests the crops & ships it back into America, They empower the big drug pushers like Hells Angels,bloods,crypts. They put heavy sentences on users, then they get our kids all strung out on drugs & got there fist so far up into our business that we cant even pay the bills. I hope Jesus gets here soon. LOL...

That post had nothing to do with religion ^^^

Originally Posted by Dreamsayer

fuk da poleez

good post

Originally Posted by Hughes1123

Well, after reading plenty of posts, I just wanna say a couple of things.
1. No one has the definite answer on what religion is true and not true. If you do have this answer, you must be a god.
2. Every religion is a belief. Even atheism. What you believe is what you believe. YOU believe it is true and that is what matters.
3. No religion is wrong. How could it? Is it not a belief?

Also I wanted to say what I think is faulty about religions. You can have the same religion but you could be taught it differently. Each church or whatever you have has a main person that tells you what they believe in. Do you remember back in English class when the teacher had you read a book then you would debate with the whole class in what you believed was right or wrong. It is the same with religion. What the person in the church tells you is what they believe. What they believe this stands for and what kind of symbol this is. All religion is what you believe. So believe what you believe and not what others tell you to believe.

No.

Religion - a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny; "he lost his faith but not his morality"
an institution to express belief in a divine power;

Atheist - someone who denies the existence of god or any divine power; denial of the supernatural

Atheism is NOT a religion. It is a view; Its a choice.

Originally Posted by Acid

Atheism is NOT a religion. It is a view; Its a choice.

I agree that atheism is not a religion, but where did he say it was a religion? He just said it was a belief.

2. Every religion is a belief. Even atheism.

Implying atheism is a religion. And it isn't a belief...it's a lack in belief. It isn't the belief that god doesn't exist...it's the lack of belief that a god does exist.

Originally Posted by Mario92

Implying atheism is a religion. And it isn't a belief...it's a lack in belief. It isn't the belief that god doesn't exist...it's the lack of belief that a god does exist.

What exactly does negating change? One could say that Christianity, for example, is the lack of belief that a god doesn't exist.

Claiming atheism is a religion is like saying "not collecting stamps" is a hobby.

I think it's fair to say that all worldviews are powered by a set of deeply-held beliefs, though I wouldn't say "Atheism is a belief" just like I wouldn't say "Christianity is a belief"

Originally Posted by SourCherryBoy

What exactly does negating change? One could say that Christianity, for example, is the lack of belief that a god doesn't exist.

Well, for example, atheism includes "pure" agnosticism. e.g. the people who are 100% on the fence. Since they do not believe in a god, they are atheists de facto. They didn't choose to not believe in a god, they just do.

Originally Posted by Mario92

Well, for example, atheism includes "pure" agnosticism. e.g. the people who are 100% on the fence. Since they do not believe in a god, they are atheists de facto. They didn't choose to not believe in a god, they just do.

They just do not believe in a God then?

Originally Posted by Cosmix

They just do not believe in a God then?

Basically. If you genuinely don't know, then you don't really believe in a god, do you?

another way to put it is that belief for or against a god requires active commitment. Simply not having a commitment for believing in a god does not mean you commit to believing there isn't one.

Originally Posted by Mario92

Well, for example, atheism includes "pure" agnosticism. e.g. the people who are 100% on the fence.

Agnostic does NOT mean "undecided" or "on the fence" or any such weak nonsense. It's a STRONG assertion that not only do we not know, but that we CANNOT know, and that it's okay.

Originally Posted by Replicon

Agnostic does NOT mean "undecided" or "on the fence" or any such weak nonsense. It's a STRONG assertion that not only do we not know, but that we CANNOT know, and that it's okay.

Durrrrr. And yet we still have a person who does not actively believe in a god. Agnosticism isn't a stand-alone system...it's a part of the atheism/theism system. My use of "on the fence" was in describing the people who claim that they absolutely don't know, and aren't biased in either direction. At the end of the day, lack of belief for whatever reason still equals atheist.

Sssshhhh....you had me at "Durrrr."

Well, maybe in some cases. I do believe Agnostic are a special breed. Although we havent had any calls from a God, some of us are still waiting on one. The substantial open minded right brain thinkers are actually in the Spiritualist realm, which embodies much of the NON religions such as Buddhism/Hinduism amongst a wide array of possibilities which would still allow for the kind guester of accepting a swell hearted Jesus to dinner if he so existed. Yet this allowing for Scientific aspects to somewhat play presidence over our rational behavior. So it is still an open minded believe which can still offer a sense of wonder in the many oddities of Quantum Cognition & pseudo sciences. Excuse my spelling.

I think the problem in a lot of these sorts of little misunderstandings over silly semantics rise from not decoupling the "spiritual" (personal relationship with deity/ies, etc.) aspect from the "dogmatic" aspect (rituals, rules, bible-thumping, and inexplicably associating religion with politics). Most passionate religious debates happen over the dogmatic level, and on THAT level, agnostics will typically side with the atheists. This is especially true when some young-earth creationist tries to use faux-science to justify the great flood, or any other such stupidity. Did you know there are still geocentrists alive in this day and age? REAL geo-centrists! When debating with someone who is made of 100% pure facepalm, then an atheist is indistinguishable from an agnostic, because really, they are all arguing the same point.

On a purely spiritual and personal level, the two are still very different. It's just that it never really comes up in arguments, because there is less passion there. It's just a personal thing, so it's not like we're trying to force views on each other at that level.

Originally Posted by Mario92

Simply not having a commitment for believing in a god does not mean you commit to believing there isn't one.

Granted, atheism isn't most accurately described as a being a religion--in the conventional sense--but I'm just wondering, how does it not imply the "active commitment" you mentioned?

I'm sorry, this sentence really just threw me.

Originally Posted by acatalephobic

Granted, atheism isn't most accurately described as a being a religion--in the conventional sense--but I'm just wondering, how does it not imply the "active commitment" you mentioned?

I'm sorry, this sentence really just threw me.

See pure agnostic, a.k.a. we don't and can't know. In that sense, the person in question doesn't choose to be atheist, but is de facto atheist. It's not that they believe there isn't a god, but rather that their philosophy makes it so they can't believe.

Right, but that doesn't cover the whole gambit, I mean. Right?

I've known a few people that claim to be atheists, but refuse to accept that the kind of assumptions they make are anything like the religious ones they oppose. Two systems of thought, two methods of arriving.

Aren't they two halves of the same coin?

Originally Posted by acatalephobic

Right, but that doesn't cover the whole gambit, I mean. Right?

I've known a few people that claim to be atheists, but refuse to accept that the kind of assumptions they make are anything like the religious ones they oppose. Two systems of thought, two methods of arriving.

Aren't they two halves of the same coin?

Oh, sure, you have aggressive atheists. Still doesn't mean atheism is a religion. Not even close. Religion is defined as "a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny." Atheism still doesn't fit the bill even remotely. Also, unlike many religions, it isn't organized.

To take a page from standard debate, the burden of proof rests with the person making the claim of incredulity, which would be the religious. Until this claim is proven, there is no reason why the opposite party should believe it. In many ways, atheism is less a leap of faith and more a null position.

Originally Posted by acatalephobic

Right, but that doesn't cover the whole gambit, I mean. Right?

I've known a few people that claim to be atheists, but refuse to accept that the kind of assumptions they make are anything like the religious ones they oppose. Two systems of thought, two methods of arriving.

Aren't they two halves of the same coin?

nope

If I told you there was an international crime syndicate consipring to steal your socks, you'd probably think I was insane and you would probably (rightly) be offended if I told you your assumption that there was not such a crime syndicate was as unfounded and insane as my claim.