If your child ended up in church, continued to go and ended up finding God, would you be supportive of their decision? Why or why not?
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If your child ended up in church, continued to go and ended up finding God, would you be supportive of their decision? Why or why not?
How old is the child?
well i didn't think about that. how about old enough to decide for themself, to think for themself.
I wouldn't agree but I wouldn't berate them or anything. As long as they don't try to push it on me.
Of course I'd be supportive of their decision. If he/she was old enough to think for him/herself, of course I would. Just wondering, dave, why do you ask?
Just wondering, dave, why do you ask?
The other day my friend (who is an athiest) and I were talking and that question popped up. He said he wouldn't allow her to go to church. I was just wondering what you guys thought
That's the kind of atheist I dislike. That militant, possessive kind of atheist who will get in an uproar about how the Christians are forcing things on people, and then force their daughter to not go to church.
Note that's not an attack on your friend, dave, just an observation about some atheists.
Then it's fine with me. I would explain my view to the child, but it would be up to him/her to go to church or not go.Quote:
Originally Posted by davej
Depends on the age. If the child was < 15, then they're easily brainwashed by fantastic stories that never happened. If they're older than that, they're free to make up their own mine.
Well I'd talk to them about it and what their reasons are for doing so because I think religion is ridiculous. But at an age of 16 or so they can make up their own mind.
It depends which God s/he finds. If it's the sadomasochistic bogoted piece of shit that they call the mainstream Judeo-Christian fucktard then I would probably shoot my child before s/he fucks any more people up in the head.
I think by the time my child reached the age of reason, I would have equipped him/her with what they need to muster a defense against a concept like religion. Things like basic reasoning. It should be noted I mean institutionalized religion.
Same question could be asked this way:
Regardless of if you're an atheist or not, would you be happy with your child (who is old enough to think for themselves) joining a religious cult?
I think the difference between an Atheist and the Religious, is just that Atheism considers all religions to be equally false and misleading.
Whilst most religous people consider -every religion but there own- to be false and misleading.
So be it a small cult, or a more popular cult, like say Christianity.
It still requires the person stop asking questions and using critical thinking.
Everyone is an Atheist to some degree. A christian is an Atheist to all religions other than Christianity. Atheism just takes it one step further and considers all religions to be false.
So,
Would I be bothered with my child adopting a lifestyle based on misinformation and the control of their behaviour based on someone elses rules?
Yes I'd be bothered.
If my child found god, I would no doubt be very proud. However I ponder this about as much as I ponder what would happen if the moon were a giant ball of cheese.
...
Seriously though, I wouldn't support their decision. That would be like having a child that became a Neo-Nazi or KKK member to me.
If they got involved in their community and made a lot of friends, it would probably be a good thing for them. Regardless of if you agree with their belief or not, being involved in a community(such as a church), is normally a good thing.
thanks for the responses.... I am surprised that this question wasn't turned around on me... If my child grew up and decided to follow another religion other then Christianity or became an athiest, would I support them? Sense it wasn't asked and all of you except for maybe one respectfully answered my question, I will answer as well. I think I would have to sit down and talk with him or her about their decision. Find out why they chose a different route. I would have a very open and loving discussion about their beliefs and I believe I would have to support them. I would obviously pray for them but if that is what they really believed in then I would do my best to be supportive. The only outcome i can see of not being supportive would be driving them away. I didn't realize how difficult this question would be until I answered it.
I don't know. It's a good question. I'm aware of what the "right" answer might be, but... I would definitely try to persuade my child not to do this. But then again I suppose it could be useful for him/her to have this experience. We all go through phases of sorts and (hopefully) end up learning from them.
i would probably start crying and saying "Why couldnt you just be gay!?"
I'm not going to punish my kid for wanting to believe what he/she wants to believe, I don't see myself challenging their beliefs either, unless they confront me on my non-theism of sorts in an evangelical attempt. I'm sure I'd be very open with my non-belief.Quote:
Originally Posted by davej
Honestly, I wouldn't have a problem with my kid being a theist at all as long as they were socially liberal to an extent (cool with homosexuality mainly), I wouldn't want my kid to be intolerant.
I'm agnostic but if i was an athiest and my kid was a church person i would not care really. If i forced the child to not go, i am no different then a church goer forcing the child to the church. Besides, i don't judge people or force people to stop drinking pepsi because i drink coke, or people who like basketball to switch to hockey because i like hockey. You're a terrible person if you must force beliefs onto someone. We are able to think for ourselves, make our own choices, understand things that make us the best of intelligence in the world, why strip away the freedom for a "choice". It's called a choice because you can choose to accept, or not accept it. We have evolved enough to understand these things, therefore we know of our own freedom.Quote:
Originally Posted by davej
Besides, there are much more and better choices then "where am i going when i die", we live in the "now" the "moment", and death is in the future which is not known because there is no future, there are only events that are happening this exact second that lead up to a "future" as we call it.
I would make my stance very, very clear, but in the end I'd let my child do as he pleases. Like Catbus said, so long as they are socially liberal concerning other religions, homosexuals, and atheists, I'd be fine with it.
That probably wouldn't happen though. I would have discussed religion with my child quite a bit so he gets the facts straight: That there is no reason to believe in God, only irrational faith.
I wouldnt mind per se, I might point and laugh a little
I'd support them in the sense of allowing them to do so, but I wouldn't support the actual decision, though I'd only give them my opinion on the subject if it was asked for.
But I wouldn't tolerate anything like "Homosexuals are fags" or any other religiously-justified bigotry.
Not that I plan on having children, but I'd also doubt this would happen, given I'd teach my child how to think not what to think.
I think I'd be very disappointed if a child of mine took to religion, but I'd do my best to hide it. Not sure what you mean by "support it", though.
I would do everything I could to save them from the time-wasting delusion that is Christianity. I would sit them down and have a heart-to-heart with them and give them some books on evolution etc. To be honest though this would never happen. No child of mine would be stupid enough to fall for it especially since they would have been taught why it is all BS right from birth and why some people believe it, so would be able to see both arguments clearly instead of just one biased view in favour of magic.
Interesting question.
My parents were agnostic. When I was about 7 years old, we were living on a Navy Base in Puerto Rico and I joined a Bible study with some of the other kids in my neighborhood.
After awhile, I started attending a non-denominational church and eventually, my parents joined. My [step] father was baptized the same day I was.
They stopped drinking and smoking and fighting as much for those 3 years.
When we moved to Pensacola, FL they kept trying to find a church like the one in Puerto Rico, but every one they found seemed most interested in Members dues.
They quickly became agnostic again and the fighting has lasted to this day lol, but they never drank or smoked again (except for my mom a few times).
I studied countless religions but they HATED spiritism/Wicca/anything not Christianty.
I eventually became one of Jehovah's Witnesses.
Would I let my children go to another "church". No. I've studied practically all of them and to my line of thinking, only Jehovah's Witnesses have gotten it 100% right.
Their religious education is my responsibility, but when they grow up, they can be whatever they want and I'd accept it and, no doubt, we'll have many interesting discussion based on whatever they decide.
Two of my kids will probably grow up and accept my religion. One will most likely be Wiccan and the other will be agnostic or atheist. But I doubt any of them will take to any religion right away. They'll probably float around for awhile, do what their friends are doing and/or study on their own.
You should not assume that taking to religion means the same as refusing to believe scientific explanations. Though if i had children and they started refusing science, then I'd do my best to convince them they were wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamQueen
Those two answers are sort of conflicting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhaylin
How so?
While they are in my home, under my guidance, I have a religious obligation set upon me by the Bible itself to teach my children what I accept to be religious truths.
They don't have to like it, but they do have to accept and respect it.
But we still have sometimes deep and sometimes more relaxed about other beliefs.
My life is an open book for anyone to read. I tell my kids about my past experiences with all walks of beliefs and how I came to be where I am now and where I hope to be in the future. But I realize that's not the same as experiencing it for themselves.
So, being free moral agents in this society, my kids can choose whatever they please once they leave my home and I am no longer responsible for their education.
And because I have, at one time or another, been practically anything a person can reasonably imagine, I have extremely few problems with acceptance of a persons choice. (I have my own personal quarks and hangups, but all people do)
As the parent of adult children, I wont have to like what they choose, but I will have to accept it and respect it.
Yeah, all right. It's just that you didn't specify when you'd not accept them going to their own church and when you would. Though surely children are able to make such a decision for themselves before they live the house? Beyond, say 16 or such, you would really have had the time to teach them most of what they need to know about the religion. Wouldn't forcing them to go to church or such only make them dislike the religion after that?
I still remember the day I asked my mother the magic question.
"Mum - do we believe in God?"
She responded by saying that while other people believe in many different gods, we as a family don't believe collectively like sheep. Everyone has to make up their own minds. She then explained that she and my father chose to raise my brother and I without any bias so that when we're older we could figure it out for ourselves and make our own decisions.
And that is effectively what I'll do for my kids one day. To this day Im an atheist, but I have over my last 24 years tried or researched extensively Christianity and Buddhism. My parents were worried for the 2 months that I was going to an Assembly of God church that I would be 'brain washed', but they were supportive that I was trying to figure it out for myself. Eventually I found my own way to rock solid atheism and it's never been an issue since.
Would I stop my kids from going to church? Yes and no. I'd stop them from going before the age of 15/16, and I'd teach them how to think critically and logically. I'd also arm them with refutations to the numerous assaults on their lack of faith that they would have to deal with from the vocally pious as they find their own way. If they eventually settled on a religion I'd be disappointed in myself as a teacher and a parent, but I wouldnt reject them.
It depends entirely on age really. I'm of the opinion that kids below the age of 15 are very naive, and will pretty much buy into anything their parents, or any other person of authority, tells them. In my mind, the logical way of raising children, is to simply tell the Bible as a fairytale, which is probably a great idea, since it's got some great stories with some good morals, to an extent.
They (children) will probably confront me at some point or another, because somebody in school mentions religion. I'm not quite sure how I would answer it. I would probably just tell them how it is.
It's a fairytale, and for some odd reason, people believe it is true.
From what i have read earlier, some of you say that religion is brainwashing... well if you tell your child about your beliefs, no matter how old he or she is and you do not let them go to church, wouldn't you be brain washing as well?
I don't think so, if you tell them up until a certain age to make up their own mind. There's no belief to indoctrinate, you're simply giving them time to look at alternatives.Quote:
well if you tell your child about your beliefs, no matter how old he or she is and you do not let them go to church, wouldn't you be brain washing as well?
It's like not letting your child drink at a young age. You're not brainwashing them in to not drinking, you're just saying they're not mature enough to handle alcohol yet.
This completely ignores the fact that your children are likely to be indoctrinated. There is a massive correlation between a parent's and their child's religion. But no, it's your religious obligation, so it's okay!Quote:
So, being free moral agents in this society, my kids can choose whatever they please once they leave my home
Forcing your children to listen to your "religious belief of the day" is bad parenting. Especially given how fickle your beliefs are, and the arbitrary denomination of Christianity you decided was right.
Would you allow your child to have a blood transfusion by the way, if they needed it?
Respect is earned, not given. Religion does not deserve automatic respect, just like any other belief does not deserve automatic respect.Quote:
They don't have to like it, but they do have to accept and respect it.
By the time they leave your home and "choose whatever they please", you will already have completely indocrinated them into your way of thinking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zhaylin
So Photo, you are saying it ISN'T alright for Zhaylin to teach her children about God and her beliefs BUT IT IS ALRIGHT for you to teach your children about you beliefs.... What is the difference. There isn't any.
You are not allowing your children to learn anything about God while she is teaching her children about God. There is no difference. If one is brain washing so is the other.
But I never said I'd force my beliefs down their throats. I'd tell then what I thought if they asked me, but I would also tell them they need to make up their own minds.Quote:
So Photo, you are saying it ISN'T alright for Zhaylin to teach her children about God and her beliefs BUT IT IS ALRIGHT for you to teach your children about you beliefs.... What is the difference. There isn't any.
If I were to insist from their birth that Agnostic Atheism is the only rational stance, and forced them to listen to it, then it would be as bad. Indoctrination is still indoctrination.
Zhaylin conversely feels obliged to force her beliefs on her children when they are most impressionable, and demands unconditional respect for her beliefs from her children. There's a world of difference between the two.
Certainly I wouldn't demand respect for my beliefs unconditionally. I'd welcome being challenged on them, and to have to earn that respect for my beliefs.
EDIT: I'm also not saying it's wrong to teach her children about her beliefs if they ask about it. But forcing it on them is completely unacceptable for me.
I look at religious education the same way as secular education: You build a basic foundation but the kid adds onto it through their own life experiences and knowledge and whims.
If I waited for my kids to "ask me about" say geography or math, they'd know absolutely nothing about those subjects.
My kids, typically, don't care to learn about anything. They don't hunger for knowledge or spirituality.
But I still have to send them to school. Is that wrong?
As for blood transfusions, they know my stance. I would refuse one for myself because I *understand* the reason for doing so. I would ask them, and as I stated before, most of my 4 probably would have one. They are NOT Jehovah's Witnesses, just the children of one. Until they make the religion their own, they're not bound by certain rules.
But it is still my responsibility to lay that foundation.
To say my children are indoctrinated is completely absurd, and you'd understand why I say that if you knew my bull-headed children :D What can I say, they take after their mom. And I've accepted that they'll float around in the worlds religions and only 2 are likely to embrace my beliefs as their own.
A parents influence is off-set greatly by what the children pick up from school, the media, their friends and other relatives.
And why was only a portion of my words highlighted. I made a point to repeat myself at the end of the last post:
"While they are in my home, under my guidance, I have a religious obligation set upon me by the Bible itself to teach my children what I accept to be religious truths.
They don't have to like it, but they do have to accept and respect it.
...
As the parent of adult children, I wont have to like what they choose, but I will have to accept it and respect it."