You sure? Because I found a back doorQuote:
Originally Posted by Noogah
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You sure? Because I found a back doorQuote:
Originally Posted by Noogah
It is hilarious that 99% of Christians don't even uderstand their own mythology.
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Originally Posted by Jeff777
Actually Jeff you've hit the nail on the coffin. That's exactly what's going on, they are merely just waiting around for final judgement to be ousted into the lake of fire, which is the 2nd and final death (A Death with no hopes of return) When we die we experience a 1st death. Every single person no matter what they've done wrong who has died, will have the opportunity to come back through the 1st and 2nd ressurrections as mentioned in Revelation. Judgement day is the real test. Fail Judgement day, and cease to exist for time indefinite. Also God never created a hell. The hell that's mentioned in the Bible is symbolic and most of the times it's interperted wrong. The original Hebrew word used to describe it is 'Sheol' Which translates into 'Grave'. The Lake of Fire and any mentions of Hell are two entirely different scenario's where one will exist and one has never existed.
How could you when everything seems to change over time?Quote:
Originally Posted by Robot_Butler
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Originally Posted by Ne-yo
You can live a life of giving and not recieving, like giving to charity or people in need and never asking anyone for anything in return except the stuff you need to stay alive of course and you would still go to hell all because you can still be a sinner in the words of the bible. That's pretty harsh!
Actually that's inaccurate, when your time runs out. You're simply just going to check out just like everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by LucidFlanders
uuummm he let his son die 4 u. 4 me 4 everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonsay
because it was neccessary so that we could join him when we died.
it is the beautiful thing of grace. all u have to do is accept it, and ask for forgiveness.
yeah we all make mistakes. i make huge ones. i mess up every day at least 20 times. i cuss, i lust, i treat others badly, i do it all. im human... so u can not believe in him, thats your choice...
personally though... i dont believe that there is necessarily a lake o' fire.... i think it is just symbolism of pain. my new thought courtesy of chase. revelations is all about symbolism, so that is my interpretation for it...
That's pretty interesting. Ask chase how does he explain the sensation of pain if your body is decomposed.Quote:
Originally Posted by aorozco
Vatican seems to think so, now! :banana: Not that the Vatican's opinion should matter, but there ya go!Quote:
Originally Posted by Noogah
:chuckle:Quote:
Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant
lol. I explain it this way, (i forget how he put it) pretty much, revelations contains a plethera of symbolic things. think about it, god is everything good, love, peace, like everything good. what if there was none of him. there would be no good, only bed. the simple act of god's non prescence is agony, evil... thus pain. just my opinion i gues...Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowNightWing
I just can't accept the fact an infinitely powerful being is limited. You don't need to make and kill your son for any reason if you're allpowerful. I will not ask for forgiveness for something I cannot be held responsible, especially from some being which actually is responsible. I didn't decide that I would exist. If god made me than he's responsible for my actions. Even if that means he decides to make me suffer eternally, then so be it, just don't make him look as if he is some beacon of goodness. And the same goes for anyone who eagerly awaits heaven while believing in hell.Quote:
Originally Posted by aorozco
If you lust, cuss, etc. I don't see it as some objective act of free will. There are a bunch of reasons for our actions like socialization, instincts, it's all natural as far as I'm concerned. I've got enough evidence to deduce we emerge from the processes in our brains. Therefore I cannot accept or even chose a belief like the Christian one. I am what I am and I can't be anything else. So it's just sad that other peoples' beliefs manage to spill into reality so we get things like religious violence, intolerance etc.
i completely understand where you are coming from. i was there and still am there in a way. i will always do things i shouldn't do. and alot of them are natural things so it is very hard to accept almost any religion, where you are told you have to give up those "sins"Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonsay
i will still keep trying because, heck ,it is something i believe in. and if i am wrong, then so be it, but i personally don't think i am. (not that i am all knowing...) *coughs lightly*
Ne-yo speaks true. "Hell" is simply the "common grave of all mankind". A fiery place of torment is against God's nature and it simply does not exist. New Testament writers used hyperbole when speaking of "hell" and the nashing of teeth etc.
"The wages sin pays is death". When we die, our debt is paid- period. It's the love God and Jesus have for us that brings us back in the resurrection. And it's the final judgement that determines if you have everlasting life or everlasting destruction.
I know it's somewhat blasphemous to think such ways, lol, but because of my background, I tend to think of God in "magickal" ways (and some scientific ways as well). Holy Spirit isn't a separate person or another part of a "godhead" but his active force (or "magick").
And like a super computer, he's able to store the DNA and personal information of everyone ever alive. In the resurrection, he recreates our body using that information.
God is also governed by certain qualities: wisdom, justice, love, power.
When Adam sacrificed his perfect life to sin, a similar (perfect) sacrifice was required to redeem his offspring. That's why Jesus had to die. Jesus was the first of God's creation and the things Jesus loved most was mankind. He lived for an unknown period of time with God in heaven before being born. He willing knew what he was getting into and accepted the role.
Well...to the bible you will be judged on how you did in life according to the bible, and if you sinned and did not follow the bible even if you did charity and wanted nothing in return you will get a belt to the ass and sent to the dark underworld where you will await your never ending punishment. You can live a life of selflessness but if it does not go with the bible you're screwed. If hell exists there has to be an infinite amount of souls, or hell does not work. You can;t die and be sent to hell forever, then after forever come back and redo life, then get sent to hell again if you did not follow the bible a 2nd time, or 3rd, or however many times you have lived. If there is no infinite souls, then there is no hell.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ne-yo
As for what really happens, who knows. It;s one of the biggest mysteries in the world and will probably always be a mystery untill it happens to you.
IF you believe in hell and in people having an immortal spirit within them...
But where in the creation account does it mention God creating such a place? And why did God tell Adam that if he sinned he would return to the dust from which he was made? God said nothing about such a Hell and neither did he say Adam and Eve would go to Heaven. Earth was meant for people. Adam and Eve weren't supposed to die.
When people are resurrected, they will be brought to perfection during a thousand years. They'll become as Adam and Eve had been before they sinned. After that 1,000 years, the Bible says that Satan and his demons would be freed from the abyss "for a time". Perfect mankind will have the chance to either side with God or Satan.
Those who fail that test will experience everlasting death. And at that time "hell will be swallowed up" and "death will be no more".
I agree- there is no fiery hell of torment. And from what I've read of Ne-yo's posts, neither does he.
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Originally Posted by Xei
if anyone is familiar with animistic belief systems there exists a sort of hell and heaven...upperworld and lowerworld...upperworld is where a person's 'essence' goes to the canopy of the tree of life to await rebirth, the lowerworld is where malevolance and "evil" exists...this is the popular destination for spirit healers as it is believed that when a person is sick part of their "soul" is stuck in the lower world and the shaman must journey there to find it in order to heal the person...I entertain these ideas though from a strictly metaphoric view point
satan/lucifer/devil/"evil" needs to exist to legitamize god/"good"
Satanism is a poke at christianity..there is no diety other than oneself in this belief system.