Thread: No religion, Looking to change that.

Originally Posted by Reality_is_a_Dream

1: I guess something to make me better and expand me.

sounds like you are looking for self transcendence. there is not one religion/spirituality/philosophy, but many.

I think for now, you should study and learn about as many different philosophies as you can. Even if you don't agree with them, finding things you don't agree with will help you understand yourself. So just enjoy reading about them all regardless. Keep up with science as well. The greet thing about TODAY is, you don't have to join religion. You can learn about them all, and apply things into your life from various sources.

things of interest

Tibetan Dream Yoga
http://www.scribd.com/word/full/2535...fpe6yedljw267h

The dream yoga isn't just about having a lucid dream, thats just a fun side affect. The dream yoga is a lifestyle, where by you view all of reality as a dream. Not so much to lose sense of reality, but to recognize what is really real. Just as in a lucid dream where we recognize the only thing that is really real, that will last, is ourselves. Our own consciousness. So to, in the waking dream do you 'wake up' and realize the only thing that is really real, is your own consciousness, and the consciousness of others.

It's a very strange philosophy, their views of reality that is. Their aim is to free themselves from suffering, reach enlightenment and help others do the same. As other Buddhist philosophies. But the dream yogis feel, you can spend your whole life meditating and waste your time. Never reaching some spiritual break through. Instead they carry on their work in dreams. Here in dreams is where they really achieve enlightenment. And have some crazy dream adventures.

They feel life and dreams are not separate. If you are more lucid in one, you are more lucid in the other. So while they aim to view life as a dream, as unreal, they also aim to be more lucid in life. Being more aware of everything, living a little more in the moment.

Ultimately it is Buddhist. Escape suffering. See the illusions of the world. Conquer your fear of death. Fun side. They have lots of lucid dreams and rival the experiences of this forum.


Tantra
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tantra

Tantra in itself is not a specific religion. It is a body of beliefs. Generally in Tantra there is a Godhead, who's divine energy maintains the entire universe. The human body is a vessel of this divine energy. The tantrics aim to pull more of this energy into their being for various personal reasons. We already have on tantric practice in the west that is widely popular, yoga. The practice of this divine energy is both mental, through visualizations, physical, like yoga, and even emotional, through prayer and song.

Tantra should make you feel good. While we use yoga mostly as exercise, tantra remains very spiritual. It also attests that the world is very dream like, with Maya. And that at the heart of it all, reality remains pure consciousness, being and bliss. For the process of evolution, reality is split into opposites. Or, dualism. The dualism existing so that we individuals can recognize it for what it is. Thus it is a self transcendence practice.

But tantra is probably, most known for its sex rites. Which have been called the most orgasmic spiritual and physical experience around. Tantric practices seem very involved, accepting of natural processes rather than rejection of it, which is appealing to westerners.

Chakras!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chakras

Sure we all know about chakras thanks to movies and cartoons. But at the heart of the belief of chakra is the union of mind and body. Or even the union of spirit and body. That if the spirit is suffering, the body will suffer. Even going so far as to say, if the spirit has a problem, it can manifest as a disease in the body. Working with the chakras, you work with whats been called the energy body. This energy system affects you on all levels. Even whether or not, you can remember a spiritual experience. Even whether or not, you are conscious enough to have a lucid dream. Not only does the energy body affect your spiritual experiences, but your immune system, digestion and so on.

energy work alone will not help self transcend you. but in the belief of the energy body, you have blockages. which can make you lazy, create poor habits, depression and so on. Ultimately, with a poor energy body, you'll sit on your arse and do nothing. Astral projectors work with the energy body for example, to have the mental energy to remain aware in their travels.

Related to tantra. Though tantric beliefs have many pre-established deities. The belief of the energy body is a little more removed if you don't believe in those gods.

Mix the belief of chakras with meditation
http://www.learningmeditation.com/chakras.htm

New Age

New Age, is a very large group of diverse beliefs unified with two common goals. Attaining a higher consciousness, and manifesting the new age. Some new agers believe in God, others don't. But God in New Age is very different. Every human being is divine and is already apart of God. And attaining a higher consciousness is really becomming one with the mind of God. Or for others who don't believe in God, oneness with the universe, or oneness with the self.

New Age quickly goes into the craziest of the craziest. Into channeling. The channeling of ascended beings, Buddha and Jesus alike. But you don't have to be apart of that scene. There are many new agers who go about their business avoiding channeling all together.

New Age quickly becomes very buddhist. A path you walk alone. Thus it is not about church or some outer organization. What makes it so different then, from a mere buddhist practitioner? The biggest difference is the end goal. While buddhism is to escape suffering, this is not necessarily the end goal of the new ager. New Age gets its name from the underlining message of a new age on earth. That we are entering a new cycle, that actually starts on dec 2012. And humanity has the potential in this new cycle to live in a golden age free from dualism. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer? That is dualism.

New Age has called the higher consciousness they aim to become one with, Christ Consciousness, among other names.

New Agers are generally criticized for being overly optimistic and loony hippies, always envisioning a happy future. But part of the reason why New Age is so optimistic, is because it carries the belief that thoughts manifest. The Law of Attraction, The Secret, What the Bleep do We Know - all new age.

New Age definately has its crazier sides. From channeling to aliens. Remember though, it is not a specific religion, or group. But a group of individual people and ideas that generally believe in attaining a higher consciousness, but does not end with just escaping suffering. In off itself, it is more diverse than the many translations of the bible =b

When in Doubt

When in doubt, meditate! From new agers, to christians, to atheists, to buddhists. We can all meditate. Regardless of what ever path of self transcendence you follow, meditation is still important.


ps. I forgot to mention, all spiritual paths will help the individual become more compassionate. which also has the affect of helping us with our personal relationships. the same is not true of religion - which tends to cause hatred of certain groups

Originally Posted by juroara

New Age quickly becomes very buddhist. A path you walk alone. Thus it is not about church or some outer organization. What makes it so different then, from a mere buddhist practitioner? The biggest difference is the end goal. While buddhism is to escape suffering, this is not necessarily the end goal of the new ager. New Age gets its name from the underlining message of a new age on earth. That we are entering a new cycle, that actually starts on dec 2012. And humanity has the potential in this new cycle to live in a golden age free from dualism. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer? That is dualism.

I'm sorry, but this has been bothering me since I read it.

Original books on the New Age place the the new Age with The Age of Aquarius. Hence books like "The Aquarian Conspiracy". The Age of Aquarius is usually placed by astrology in the 27th century.

This new Age is, according to many New Agers, making its presence felt now with a coming world shift and the beginning of a new society, in much the same manner as you described.

There's this really interesting question of how to bring about the New Age. To that end you get meditators trying to speed it up, date-setters who are waiting for specific times (for instance the millennium, 2012, etc) and intentional communities like Findhorn who are attempting to spearhead the change by living the New Age now.

The idea of 2012 being the end is fairly new as far as I can see. I didn't find it at all in any of the older academic texts I've read on the topic. But it comes up very regularly in discussion with modern New Agers.

Its interesting, really. The end of the Mayan long count is the beginning of the thirteenth period of their calender. The twelth period began in September 1618 and did not herald any major spiritual changes.

I like the New Age. Its an umbrella group, and I spend a lot of time hanging out under that unbrella. But I come from weird Christian stock and have believed that date setting major world changes is dangerous ever since my parents were completely convinced that the rapture would happen in 1998.

Anyway, sorry. That was off-topic. Please don't take offense. I respect your beliefs but I feel better for correcting one tiny, slightly off, factual statement.

I think Buddhism is great.. I agree with what Semja says.

I think it's important to see what kinds of people belong to what religions. And I have never met a mean or close-minded Buddhist.

Originally Posted by apachama

I'm sorry, but this has been bothering me since I read it.

Original books on the New Age place the the new Age with The Age of Aquarius. Hence books like "The Aquarian Conspiracy". The Age of Aquarius is usually placed by astrology in the 27th century.

I understand what you mean. That the new age gets its origins from the belief in the age of aquarius. But I have read extensive new age writings on the net, and people might be surprised what new age is really all about. I guess you can say, modern new age has mingled with other schools of thought.

2012 just means the ending of a cycle and the beginning of a new one. this is not to be confused with the rapture. most new agers I know of will tell you, more than likely nothing specific or out of the ordinary will even happen on that day. That only people with some sort of spiritual attainment will notice any vibrational difference. To the rest of the world, it will just be any other day.

so new agers, real ones, don't begin or end with 2012. they really do adopt thought manifestation, and being the change you want to see in the world, so rather than waiting for some magical future - they are acting/being now. They even go so far as believing, that unless a number of people act/be now, that the new future will not manifest. Rather if we don't change, we will just spiral down in the new age, ultimately destroying ourselves.

btw, what on earth made your parents think the rapture would happen in 1998? christians looking for second coming are always screaming out dates, which amazes me because the bible clearly says o_O no one will know when it is supposed to happen. not even the angels.

I guess people are really desperate for change, so much that they would actually look forward to the destruction of the world, and embrace it singing praises to God. Kindy nutty huh?

It's funny Christianity has not been suggested once, but put down multiple times.

This is what you need to know about Christianity.



It is not about what you do that gets you to heaven. You can be the best or person in the world and not go to heaven. All you need to do is accept God as your savior and accept that he sent his Son to die for your sins. It's about trust. If you follow Him you will be saved. No matter what you have done in your life. It is just that simple.

There are people who want religion, and people who want God.

People who want religion are looking for rigidity and structure to conform to as a form of self-improvement.

People who want God are looking for redemption and a savior.

If you are looking for religion, there are the mysterious lures of various organizations and beliefs. If you are looking for God you will find Him through Christ.


Christianity has been given a really bad reputation because of people who start adding on to it and twisting it and seperating it into denominations. But this is all you need to know:

Go to a bookstore and pick up a Bible. That is all you need. Follow that word for word and you are a true Christian. You will sin, you will mess up, you will stumble, but God will forgive you.

It is as simple as can be. Don't go looking for your specific denomination, or go sorting through Bibles with any other name than HOLY BIBLE.


Good luck in your endeavors!

If you're gonna follow the bible literally, you had better get a good lawyer...

Originally Posted by Vance

Go to a bookstore and pick up a Bible. That is all you need. Follow that word for word and you are a true Christian.

actually, I did mention christianity. Christ Consciousness.

I am against the form of christianity that you speak of. I AM AGAINST YOUR CHRISTIANITY. it has mislead christians for 2000 years.

Christ did not come down to do all the magical work for you so that you can sit on your arse, call him savior and be saved. Christ is telling you, that only those who accept the Christ Consciousness can come onto God. If you don't accept the Christ Consciousness, you can never come onto God.

The Christ Consciousness is a state of being where you are one with God. Where you know, that you and your 'father' are one. Stop placing Christ on a pedestal where you can not reach him and allow Christ to be in you.

I am going to ask you a few things. . .please dear Christian, answer them.

If God is so loving, why does God send people to hell for not believing in something they have no evidence to believe in?

If God is so loving, why does God need to murder his only son to forgive us for our sins? Why couldn't he just..forgive us?

If God is so loving, why did God create Jesus as perfect, but us as sinners? Why did God create us as sinners, only to threaten us with hell, unless we worship his only son, of which he had to murder to forgive us our sins, of which we would not have committed, if God also created us perfect?

What is the sacrifice that Jesus made for us? If he came down from heaven, if his mortal life as a human was nothing compared to his life in heaven. What is his sacrifice if he is actually happier to be seated on the right hand of God?

Where is the right hand of God?

If Jesus came to die for our sins, why did he come back three days later? What was the purpose of that? To show off his magical ju-ju powers?

Do you believe God is loving?

Does God answer your prayers?

Where is God?

Where is the Word? Do you know where the Word is right now? Is the Word alive?

Where is the Holy Spirit? Do you know where it is, or where it blows?

What does Jesus mean, heaven is within you?

I agree with you! We need to actively CREATE the Kingdom of God around us because we are the working hands of God.

Originally Posted by juroara

actually, I did mention christianity. Christ Consciousness.

I am against the form of christianity that you speak of. I AM AGAINST YOUR CHRISTIANITY. it has mislead christians for 2000 years.

Christ did not come down to do all the magical work for you so that you can sit on your arse, call him savior and be saved. Christ is telling you, that only those who accept the Christ Consciousness can come onto God. If you don't accept the Christ Consciousness, you can never come onto God.

The Christ Consciousness is a state of being where you are one with God. Where you know, that you and your 'father' are one. Stop placing Christ on a pedestal where you can not reach him and allow Christ to be in you.

I am going to ask you a few things. . .please dear Christian, answer them.

If God is so loving, why does God send people to hell for not believing in something they have no evidence to believe in?

If God is so loving, why does God need to murder his only son to forgive us for our sins? Why couldn't he just..forgive us?

If God is so loving, why did God create Jesus as perfect, but us as sinners? Why did God create us as sinners, only to threaten us with hell, unless we worship his only son, of which he had to murder to forgive us our sins, of which we would not have committed, if God also created us perfect?

What is the sacrifice that Jesus made for us? If he came down from heaven, if his mortal life as a human was nothing compared to his life in heaven. What is his sacrifice if he is actually happier to be seated on the right hand of God?

Where is the right hand of God?

If Jesus came to die for our sins, why did he come back three days later? What was the purpose of that? To show off his magical ju-ju powers?

Do you believe God is loving?

Does God answer your prayers?

Where is God?

Where is the Word? Do you know where the Word is right now? Is the Word alive?

Where is the Holy Spirit? Do you know where it is, or where it blows?

What does Jesus mean, heaven is within you?

Please note that I cannot give you the exact passages, so take this with a large grain of salt, but this is the basic idea echoed in Christianity. Like I said, if you want the answers to these questions, they are IN the Bible. I am not about to look up all this for you, that would be something you should do yourself if you are really interested.


If God is so loving, why does God send people to hell for not believing in something they have no evidence to believe in? It really comes down to this: The perfect judge will always make the just decision. If He gave everyone evidence to believe, everyone would believe. There is no more evidence to any other faith. Faith is what he wants people to learn. Faith is trust. God sees the big picture, he sees all the circumstances, and gives people a chance at redemption from their sins.

If God is so loving, why does God need to murder his only son to forgive us for our sins? Why couldn't he just..forgive us? It shows he loves us.

If God is so loving, why did God create Jesus as perfect, but us as sinners? Why did God create us as sinners, only to threaten us with hell, unless we worship his only son, of which he had to murder to forgive us our sins, of which we would not have committed, if God also created us perfect? Hold on, let's get something straight. God did not create us as automatons. He gave us a choice. Adam and Eve took that choice and damned themselves. God had to give us that choice if we were to be truly willing. Now you may complain that it's unfair to suffer for what someone else did, but before you even knew the story you were sinning too. It is in our blood, because we humans are fallible. You were the one that took the apple. Even though we are seperate entities, we are the same race, and Adam and Eve represent our nature. God gave us a second chance. That is the concept of grace.

What is the sacrifice that Jesus made for us? If he came down from heaven, if his mortal life as a human was nothing compared to his life in heaven. What is his sacrifice if he is actually happier to be seated on the right hand of God? Jesus did not just die. He took all our sins upon himself, all the guilt, the shame and the darkness. And by The Law sinners are condemned to death. So he died, but with our sin on his back. From that moment on we were free from sin. He did forgive us. He did not murder his Son. He was resurrected, but he fulfilled the Law to give us another chance.

Where is the right hand of God? I don't pretend to know.

If Jesus came to die for our sins, why did he come back three days later? What was the purpose of that? To show off his magical ju-ju powers? You said: "Why could God not just snap his fingers and make us sin-free?" The Law that he wrote decrees all sinners must die. His pardon was to send his Son, take all the sin, and have him die. When he was resurrected, the Law was fulfilled. So, in a way, he did snap his fingers. But he sent his Son to show us that he really did care.

Do you believe God is loving? Yes. God is also wrathful, a concept that people don't like to talk about, but he is God above all things, and as the ruler of Heaven and Earth, he is King and he has power that he will use.

Does God answer your prayers? The purpose of prayer is not to get what you want. The purpose of prayer is to thank God and ask Him to do what is right for you. He may not want you to get the car. He, in His infinite wisdom, could see you getting in a crash, or becoming spoiled, or whatever it is that He thinks it best to avoid. And he sees the big picture. It will all make sense in time. He rewards you for following Him with only what is good for you, not what you want. If he gave you what you wanted it could be harmful to you. You pray to show Him you are still there, you are not on autopilot, and you are still listening and grateful.

Where is God? Do you really have to ask where an omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent God is?

Where is the Word? Do you know where the Word is right now? Is the Word alive? Yes. What he speaks is the law. When we speak, our words fade into dust over centuries and eons. But what He speaks is written upon every stone, every star and every fiber of the Universe.

Where is the Holy Spirit? Do you know where it is, or where it blows? There are three aspects to God. God, the ruler of all creation, Jesus, the mortal form, and The Holy Spirit, which is God living in you. The Holy Spirit is what you feel. When you accept Christ, the Holy Spirit fills you with joy and faith. You have taken the leap of faith, and now you are on fire with truth and joy.

What does Jesus mean, heaven is within you? If you could give me the passage where that is said, maybe I could try to clarify. The number one mistake you can make with the Bible is taking it out of context.


As to Christ Consciousness, please give me that passage too. Until you do, it will serve as an example of what people do without the Bible. They want to explain it all, and invent something more befitting to us, with no basis other than it appeals.

I hope Men take comfort in the fact that God is a King above all kings and does not need to explain himself to anyone, ever. God is loving, but it would be a horrible mistake to think that he has no true power. He is not afraid to intervene directly with this world. And all the crashing of the waves, the thunder of the sky and howling of the wind is not one miniscule, tiny pinprick of His supreme power.

Remember, as I often, do, being a Christian does not mean being a 40 year old conservative golfer that has a Bible group and goes to Church every Sunday. Maybe people could stop looking for God in a building and contemplate what it is like to be in the midst of a beautiful world, and despite being tiny, incompetent and sinful, loved by the Creator and forgiven, and taken for what you are. It is very hard to describe the pride you have for your God in his wisdom and power and glory.





I hope this clarified your questions. Remember, I don't pretend to know everything about God, and I certainly do not have experience answering these questions, but being around Christians all my life, this is what I feel they would most likely say.

Originally Posted by Vance

As to Christ Consciousness, please give me that passage too. Until you do, it will serve as an example of what people do without the Bible. They want to explain it all, and invent something more befitting to us, with no basis other than it appeals.

There really is no biblical basis for this, but I think it might be mentioned in the Urantia Bible and a few other channelled texts.

Like the Bible, these books also claim to be divinely inspired. So to an outsider like me the difference between them is that the New Age texts are more relevent to now, while the Bible has the weight of tradtion. There are some very interesting doctrines surrounding their transmission. I haven't read many of the books yet. But some have very nice ideas.

Originally Posted by Vance

It's funny Christianity has not been suggested once, but put down multiple times.

This is what you need to know about Christianity.



It is not about what you do that gets you to heaven. You can be the best or person in the world and not go to heaven. All you need to do is accept God as your savior and accept that he sent his Son to die for your sins. It's about trust. If you follow Him you will be saved. No matter what you have done in your life. It is just that simple.

There are people who want religion, and people who want God.

People who want religion are looking for rigidity and structure to conform to as a form of self-improvement.

People who want God are looking for redemption and a savior.

If you are looking for religion, there are the mysterious lures of various organizations and beliefs. If you are looking for God you will find Him through Christ.


Christianity has been given a really bad reputation because of people who start adding on to it and twisting it and seperating it into denominations. But this is all you need to know:

Go to a bookstore and pick up a Bible. That is all you need. Follow that word for word and you are a true Christian. You will sin, you will mess up, you will stumble, but God will forgive you.

It is as simple as can be. Don't go looking for your specific denomination, or go sorting through Bibles with any other name than HOLY BIBLE.


Good luck in your endeavors!

That's actually very well put as I am a Christian and I can agree that this sums it up.

As stated before, ask yourself what you're looking for exactly and what presumptions your desire founds itself upon.

Buddhism and AccessToInsight's already been mentioned. If you like wearing lots of black and have a mind for the overly theatrical, there's LaVeyan Satanism, too.

Eastern (quasi-)religions/philosophies hold my interest. Taoism and Buddhism in particular. I don't speak nor read any of the original languages these were spread through, but I at least like the way English translations roll off the tounge. If something doesn't appeal to your sense of aesthetics, it isn't worth your time.

Personally I'd stay away from any belief that talks about the need for "salvation", "redemption", etc. or the neccessity of some external saviour outside of your own self and natural capabilities; but that's just me.

Originally Posted by juroara

I understand what you mean. That the new age gets its origins from the belief in the age of aquarius. But I have read extensive new age writings on the net, and people might be surprised what new age is really all about. I guess you can say, modern new age has mingled with other schools of thought.

Thats what makes the New Age so beautiful, no? How hard it is to pin down, how much it shifts and grows.

When I was a Pagan, I hated the New Age because it was so wishy washy. But when I read about it I started to understand that it gives the possibility of hope, equality and beauty.

No one should set out in search of religion. You should set out in search of the truth and follow that pursuit religiously.

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

No one should set out in search of religion. You should set out in search of the truth and follow that pursuit religiously.

I like it.

Buddhism is quite similar to Christianty in some ways. I view Christianity as about having complete faith in and surrendering completing to Christ/God. In some branches of Buddhism, particularly Tibetan, the instruction of a teacher and practising Guru Yoga is regarded as very important. Guru Yoga, when practised correctly, apparently merges the mind with the enlightened mind of the teacher/Buddha/any enlightened master, and some say perfecting Guru Yoga is all that is needed for enlightenment, no more. To me this is exactly what Christians' faith in God is designed to accomplish, and pretty much in the same way.