Thread: A proof for the non-existence of God

Option A:

Originally Posted by Scatterbrain

you still haven't admited, or understood (really hope that's not the case), that you CAN'T choose your beliefs.

This clearly implies option A is the only way to go.

But how can I choose to believe in option A, if you claim I can't choose what I believe in?!

Originally Posted by Sandform

Chayba I would like to ask you, when you were believing 2 + 2 = 5...
if someone came to you and put a gun to your head and gave you 4 coke cans and said make this equal five. Would you believe that you could do it? Would you believe that given the fact that if you could make two coke cans with another two coke cans = 5 your life would not be in jeopardy, you would be ok?
Now I know you say you could believe "whatever," but I have a hard time believing you wouldn't feel doomed.

Your not even accounting desirability as part of your mind.

You're not accounting desirability as a part of my mind. I never claimed that, you just assumed it. I was just explaining korikitten why he was having these tourette episodes and how to control them. Anyway, believe what you want to believe. But I think claiming any human is free of desire is total bullshit so I didn't take into account that you could actually believe that desirability wasn't a part of my mind.

How do you even come up with these crazy scenarios? Seriously, I told you, I can choose what I believe in. If someone put a gun up to my head, I would obviously choose to believe 2+2=4 to save my life.

You can make up this same scenario for 2+2=4. And make the crazy guy whos pointing a gun at your head believe 2+2=5. Then you're fucked. Because you can't choose your beliefs. Would you really be that stubborn and die for your believes? Just because you chose to think you can't choose them? Thats a pretty lame way to go tbh

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

This clearly implies option A is the only way to go.

But how can I choose to believe in option A, if you claim I can't choose what I believe in?!

lolwut

Originally Posted by Korittke

Well, that's a European power outlet...

I've waited my whole life to post this:

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

How do you even come up with these crazy scenarios? Seriously, I told you, I can choose what I believe in. If someone put a gun up to my head, I would obviously choose to believe 2+2=4 to save my life.

2 + 2 = 4 wouldn't save your life, 2 + 2 = 5 would save your life. Since you say you could believe that two coke cans and another two coke cans = five coke cans, you wouldn't feel worried because you believe that you can in fact make the coke cans = five.

You would obviously be killed, but none the less you would KNOW that two coke cans and another two coke cans does not equal 5 coke cans and thus you would have to fear your imminent death.

However if you believed that 2 and 2 = 5 then you wouldn't be scared at all

And you AREN"T counting desirability into belief. First you have to desire to believe something before believing it. I desire to know the truth, I can't change that this is what I desire, unless I desire to change it, which would mean that I didn't desire truth. I can't change my "desires" unless I "desire" to change them. Which nullifies the idea of changing your desire because you have a different desire.

>.< My head wants to explode.

Originally Posted by Sandform

2 + 2 = 4 wouldn't save your life, 2 + 2 = 5 would save your life. Since you say you could believe that two coke cans and another two coke cans = five coke cans, you wouldn't feel worried because you believe that you can in fact make the coke cans = five.

Yeah indeed, good point. But thats where memory kicks in. Chosing your believes doesn't erase your memory about previous believes. You can hold paradoxical believes in your mind. Just like you do know. You chose to believe you can't chose your believes. That's a paradox.

Originally Posted by Sandform

>.< My head wants to explode.

Wow what a glitch...I said this after your post of

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

Yeah indeed, good point. But thats where memory kicks in. Chosing your believes doesn't erase your memory about previous believes. You can hold paradoxical believes in your mind. Just like you do know. You chose to believe you can't chose your believes. That's a paradox.

lol

Lol sorry I deleted my post, but then I saw you already posted and I felt sorry for making it seem like you were talking to yourself so I reposted it.

Originally Posted by Sandform

>.< My head wants to explode.

Go for it, don't forget to put your cam on first :p

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

Go for it, don't forget to put your cam on first :p

Lol

How did you even manage to turn on the fucking computer?

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

That is an argument that people can make mistakes and that people can round down when talking about a number, but not an argument that a person can simply make a choice to believe that 2 + 2 = 5.

There is no difference. False beliefs are intrinsically mistakes. Besides, I just outlined basically how I could choose to believe in such ways.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

If you think you can, please do it right now and hold the belief for five minutes and then leave a post about what it was like to honestly believe that 2 + 2 = 5. Will you do that?

I already have done that. To make mistakes all you have to do is become ignorant

Originally Posted by Omicron

How is it an assumption when I'm quoting you the whole time.

Originally Posted by Omicron

SO we can safely assume unless you have anything new to tell us that you do not know an actual value of faith other than comfort.

Originally Posted by really

There is no difference. False beliefs are intrinsically mistakes. Besides, I just outlined basically how I could choose to believe in such ways.



I already have done that. To make mistakes all you have to do is become ignorant

AH SHIT.

YOU WIN.

Originally Posted by really

There is no difference. False beliefs are intrinsically mistakes. Besides, I just outlined basically how I could choose to believe in such ways.

I already have done that. To make mistakes all you have to do is become ignorant

Will you do it today? I want to have a conversation with you while you believe that 2 + 2 = 5. When can we have that conversation?

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Will you do it today? I want to have a conversation with you while you believe that 2 + 2 = 5. When can we have that conversation?

Never, because he is a liar.

Like that fag Ted Haggard. "I like boobies I promise." "Aw fuck you caught me."

Originally Posted by Sandform

Never, because he is a liar.

Like that fag Ted Haggard. "I like boobies I promise." "Aw fuck you caught me."

I first thought you meant fag as joking derogatory. I guess not...

Originally Posted by ClouD

I first thought you meant fag as joking derogatory. I guess not...

? Hmm. Dunno what you mean. Ted Haggard is a homosexual who spent his life's career demeaning homosexuals. If anyone were a bastard of a hypocrite he was hehe.

Did you mean you mean you thought I was just calling him a fag as an insult? lol. He isn't good enough to be called a fag. No way would I lump him into the same category as I.

Originally Posted by Sandform

Never, because he is a liar.

Maybe Chaybachayba will go into a state of 2 + 2 = 5 consciousness and have a conversation with me.

People may want to take a look at this image:

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/7...0618458qi7.gif

(too big to put in the forum without messing it up.

Originally Posted by phandentium

People may want to take a look at this image:

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/7...0618458qi7.gif

(too big to put in the forum without messing it up.

That is a very important page. Would you want to start a thread on it, or do you care if I do?

Ooooo I like printable brochures. Saving that one for posterity.

Originally Posted by phandentium

People may want to take a look at this image:

http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/7...0618458qi7.gif

(too big to put in the forum without messing it up.

This is so good and clear except the bit on design doesn't fully work, because any serious theist will pull a "outside of time" and be done with it. I know there is then the perfectly good argument of in that case it makes sense for the major properties of the universe to be outside of time rather than god, but.. its not on there

God is the great fractal Fairytale in a Fairytale in a Fairytale...>

Originally Posted by Seismosaur

God is the great fractal Fairytale in a Fairytale in a Fairytale...>

The fairy tale is outside of time, so God is the one and only exception to all of the intelligent design assertions.

Hence a fairy tale in a fairy tale.

It's like the kids in Hansel and Gretel reading Hansel and Gretel.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Will you do it today? I want to have a conversation with you while you believe that 2 + 2 = 5. When can we have that conversation?

We've had it already. You've chosen to believe otherwise. See what I mean?

Originally Posted by Sandform

Never, because he is a liar.

I have given up lying. I advise you to give up assuming (and lying, if you still do).

Originally Posted by Seismosaur

Hence a fairy tale in a fairy tale.

You have this backwards. Life without God is but a dream. There are no problems in this world, no goblins, no monsters, no trolls. Don't worry, friend (be Happy). There is no heros either, because nobody needs to be saved. God is only a fairy-tail to naive children.

A dream...

If only you/they knew what I was thinking:

I wish I could convince dream characters that they were dreaming; that they were not what they thought they were; that they were my imagination (But what kind of a process is that?). Do you know what that is like? I am drowning in amusement! What am I doing here on this forum? Am I here to help those "attain lucidity" in the waking life? (Here to speak of Enlightenment?) Here to speak how the lucid-dreaming "induce-lucid-dream" processes are little more than pseudo-revelations!? Ha! Ignorance must have been ignored. What? And I am here to tell all so bluntly and simply, that God is their true Self, and watch them fail miserably in overlooked attempt to understand; with their vast spasms of denial and precious frustration? (Is that what I really mean?)

Am I really just swimming under the stars? Aren't you people (and occasional spam bots) all just beautiful! This is bliss; I am flying effortlessly. Yet I am nearly crying, why can't I tell them? Tears of Joy; running down my face, like kisses. Why do I have to watch them suffer? How can the sun forget its brightness!? HOW!! I now know how; I am grateful! (Oh, where am I...)

Later, I feel, if they want to love you God, they would. As if any dream character needs to know their true selves, and as if they would suddenly believe it. Everyone here is just what they want to be, yet they must think they have no choice. They should go right ahead with their "lives", riding pink elephants and playing that big game of chess where all the pieces are decorated and none are ever taken off the board. I should let them all be, they're all Perfect, they think they're having fun anyway (well most of them) - nothing needs to be convinced of them; nothing needs changing. I shall leave them all be; I love them.
"Who is willing to walk back Home to the end of the Universe; where you all came from; where there is infinite Peace?" (Nobody answers me; I shouldn't have said anything.) Almost none I gather; most of you all are here fighting over a lost nothing. I am glad you think it's fun, at least. I (me) will go soon, and be forgotten, but I will always be here (You).

This would make a spectacular film, I add.

(Nothing needs to be said, Now)