Thread: I have come to appreciate the Christians here

Originally Posted by Merlock

I started doing this actively literally just a day or two ago because of the huge amounts of R/S threads that suddenly arose. Apparently more than usual or perhaps I just incidentally ran across them (but they're still flooding the "Today's Posts" search consistently as far as I can see).

Yeah, there do seem to be an unusually high amount of them.

Originally Posted by Merlock

The fact that someone makes decisions that affect the world based on religion is that person's fault, not the religion's. People follow beliefs, beliefs don't force themselves upon people by themselves.

I don't get what your point is. If we find the belief is wrong, and the person holds this belief, what is the problem with criticizing that belief? Isn't saying the person is wrong for holding that belief essentially just the same as saying the belief itself is wrong? Wording aside, what's the difference? I agree that we should hold people responsible for their actions. But if those actions are influenced by the beliefs in question, why should we not care? If we know these beliefs to be unfounded, but others remain unaware and actually support these decisions based on those beliefs (which they themselves may not hold, but may still support), it seems our very responsibility to expose them. If you can't be bothered, fine, but don't tell me I shouldn't bother either.

I got banned just for posting in that thread and joining that day.

Then my other account got banned!

Assholes!

They banned my first 2 accounts and then banned an account I made with a proxy and I hadn't even posted yet. It's inconceivable!

Perhaps the Operation should move to bibleforums.com. They don't seem as ban-happy.

Perhaps the Operation should move to bibleforums.com. They don't seem as ban-happy.

What?

Hehe. Their image has sunk even lower. I thought it was impossible.

What would happen if a bunch of Christians posed as atheists in an atheist forum? I will tell you. Absolutely nothing. Atheists don't bury their heads in the sand at the first sign of challenge.

(And before psychology student or anyone else gets pissed off, I'm only saying bad things about the people on that forum, not all Christians. Okay? Have a cookie.)

Originally Posted by Mark75

I don't get what your point is. If we find the belief is wrong, and the person holds this belief, what is the problem with criticizing that belief? Isn't saying the person is wrong for holding that belief essentially just the same as saying the belief itself is wrong? Wording aside, what's the difference? I agree that we should hold people responsible for their actions. But if those actions are influenced by the beliefs in question, why should we not care? If we know these beliefs to be unfounded, but others remain unaware and actually support these decisions based on those beliefs (which they themselves may not hold, but may still support), it seems our very responsibility to expose them. If you can't be bothered, fine, but don't tell me I shouldn't bother either.

Don't you see how that's a stalemate?

Atheists follow the same example as the theists provide, by taking an absolute position on the matter of a god, but apparently just because they aren't happy with the people and what they do because of their beliefs? Not because you actually care about the existence/non-existence of God?

I guess it's easier to explain my position to an atheist: since you "don't believe" in a god, why would you care about disproving one? You are the pinnacle of consciousness yourself, just like any human being. And you "know" there is no magic man in the sky who is ultimately more powerful than you (while I say that even if there is one, he still isn't ultimately more powerful) both because no one can be ultimately more powerful (ultimate injustice can't exist since it would mean ultimate disbalance in existence, which can't be) and because you are in yourself infinitely powerful, have infinite potential for achieving any knowledge and thus any power. The foundation behind this position: knowledge is power because anything requires knowledge to be achieved.

As for those who are religious, well, it's not a matter of disproving God to them but rather of showing the insignificance of a god to their lives along with showing the lack of wisdom in "believing" anything. So to explain my position to someone who believes in God, I would say: you are a conscious self-aware being. You are all-powerful and have infinite potential yourself. Why do you take comfort in being ultimately less than someone else? God can exist but it matters not if he does because he is no threat nor any use to us in our lives (no imminent threat) and no ultimate threat either because ultimately we are no less in any way than any god, we just have less knowledge and power at the moment, that's all.

Edit: Hm, well, it seems I've gotten a number of replies from vague ones due to lack of understanding to utter denial, in a number of topics here, so I guess my curiosity is fed, as it were. I'll go contemplate this more and leave the R/S forum behind once more. This place can be exhausting.