Thread: Intelligent Design of the Throat

I would like to know why people have penises and vagina's is sex is such a 'dirty thing' according to chuch. Why don't we have a less dirty (and less fun lol) way to reproduce.

If there is a god, he would have given us penises to USE THEM DAMMIT MUAHAHHA =D

Originally posted by Ex Nine
I would like to know how a throat that is constructed in such a way that requires food to pass over the airway to reach the stomach is either beautiful or intelligent, much less both.

Well you always have the example of deep throat.

Wow.

Two sexual posts in the row, out of the first replies!


I'm not going to let this go off-topic, though...

What's so intelligent about food moving through a position where it could kill you by obstructing the airway every single time you eat or drink. Do it about a hundred thousand times and tell me you don't have a life-threatning coughing fit eventually, just because someone nearby told a joke or something.

Originally posted by Ex Nine
I would like to know how a throat that is constructed in such a way that requires food to pass over the airway to reach the stomach is either beautiful or intelligent, much less both.

Sorry to stray off topic Ex Nine.

I really don't understand your concern. What is so bothersome about this function?
What about bowel movements and how we have to get id of this food that goes down our throat?

Diagram from patient.co.uk. [1]



The esophagus (where the food goes) is located behind the windpipe (where the air goes) from the perspective of the mouth (where food first goes). That means that food always has to travel over the opening of the path to the lungs first, before it goes to the stomach. When we swallow, a flap called the epiglottis moves over a little and covers the airway. Small bits of food or drink can move around it nonetheless and enter the windpipe, causing people to choke and even die.

It's especially dangerous to babies and infants. USA.Safekids.org reports, "airway obstruction injury is the leading cause of unintentional injury-related death among infants under age 1." On the same page it's reported that in 2001, "17,500 children were treated in hospital emergency departments for choking-related episodes." [2]

So I want to know why this arrangement is intelligent.

It would be a lot safer for young people especially if their breathing and eating did not converge so closely to one another. Babies airways are small, and that means their airways are much easier to obstruct. Their throat muscles are underdeveloped. And they put everything in their mouths.

I can't think of a biological arrangement that's more unintelligent.

Originally posted by Ex Nine
Diagram from patient.co.uk. [1]



.

I'm honestly fucking crying. Nice Power Point.

X9,

See this is the kind of stuff I'm talking about as typical of the Faithbusters.

With this line of argument you're busting the ball of the Intelligent Design crowd, but you are simultaneously crushing the testicle of the Evolutionist at the very same time (balls are usually found in 2's. The irony of my saying this is not lost on me because in the Egyptian is says Ptah-Sokar looses a testicle to Horus, so I guess I'm the "one-nut wonder").

While I agree that what you point out is correct, that this aspect is not of an elegant design, there are a bunch of constraints that need to be met in order to produce an organism that fulfill the purpose it was "created" (whether by evolution, an "Intelligent Designer", or the traditional concept of God).

The question here isn't "Gosh, isn't this stupid to do things this way" (a destructive argument) but rather "I wonder what higher-priority constraints are being satisfied here, at the expense of some weird plumbing."

While what I will say here has no basis in conventional science/medicine, I just merely forward it as a possibility.

The throat chakra, called the Vishuda by the Hindu's, is directly over the voicebox. Chakras, or spiritual organs, are part of the etheric web that runs lines of spiritual (or "prana" or life force) force over the surface of our body. Interestingly, the vast majority of the web and the chakras are only on the surface of the body occationally a line of force, or a "meridian", will pass through the physical body, but this is rarely the case. The chakras only penetrate an inch or so into the dense physical.

The vishuda is interesting in that one of its main purposes (like how the heart is a physical organ who's main purpose is pumping blood) is to modulate the speech, singing and other forms of oral communication in such a way as to induce a spiritual effect in another person. Sometimes this spiritual effect is negative. One of the greatest of all masters of vishudic communication was Adolf Hitler. Any one who has seen videos of his speeches can testify to the power of the vishudic communicator.

Another interesting case of vishudic use is by Ozzy Osborne.

In answer to your question, a reason (I'm not saying its THE reason) why the larnyx has to be next to the surface of the body is to allow the intersection of the vishua chakra with the voicebox. The default location for the esophagus is then inside the center of the throat.

What's facinating about this idea I've presented is that it provides a case for saying that, to the Intelligent Designer, that vishidic communication is more important for the completion of the human purpose than eating safely.

This form of communication is symbolized in scripture in the phrase "singing of angels". I am of the opinion that it is the natural stage of evolution of mankind to become angelic.

Originally posted by ptahsokar
X9,

See this is the kind of stuff I'm talking about as typical of the Faithbusters.

With this line of argument you're busting the ball of the Intelligent Design crowd, but you are simultaneously crushing the testicle of the Evolutionist at the very same time (balls are usually found in 2's. The irony of my saying this is not lost on me because in the Egyptian is says Ptah-Sokar looses a testicle to Horus, so I guess I'm the \"one-nut wonder\").

While I agree that what you point out is correct, that this aspect is not of an elegant design, there are a bunch of constraints that need to be met in order to produce an organism that fulfill the purpose it was \"created\" (whether by evolution, an \"Intelligent Designer\", or the traditional concept of God).

The question here isn't \"Gosh, isn't this stupid to do things this way\" (a destructive argument) but rather \"I wonder what higher-priority constraints are being satisfied here, at the expense of some weird plumbing.\"

While what I will say here has no basis in conventional science/medicine, I just merely forward it as a possibility.

The throat chakra, called the Vishuda by the Hindu's, is directly over the voicebox. Chakras, or spiritual organs, are part of the etheric web that runs lines of spiritual (or \"prana\" or life force) force over the surface of our body. Interestingly, the vast majority of the web and the chakras are only on the surface of the body occationally a line of force, or a \"meridian\", will pass through the physical body, but this is rarely the case. The chakras only penetrate an inch or so into the dense physical.

The vishuda is interesting in that one of its main purposes (like how the heart is a physical organ who's main purpose is pumping blood) is to modulate the speech, singing and other forms of oral communication in such a way as to induce a spiritual effect in another person. Sometimes this spiritual effect is negative. One of the greatest of all masters of vishudic communication was Adolf Hitler. Any one who has seen videos of his speeches can testify to the power of the vishudic communicator.

Another interesting case of vishudic use is by Ozzy Osborne.

In answer to your question, a reason (I'm not saying its THE reason) why the larnyx has to be next to the surface of the body is to allow the intersection of the vishua chakra with the voicebox. The default location for the esophagus is then inside the center of the throat.

What's facinating about this idea I've presented is that it provides a case for saying that, to the Intelligent Designer, that vishidic communication is more important for the completion of the human purpose than eating safely.

This form of communication is symbolized in scripture in the phrase \"singing of angels\". I am of the opinion that it is the natural stage of evolution of mankind to become angelic.

Wow, I'm impressed! :bravo:

You're like Nirvana squared.

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And the Stretch Armstrong Award goes to ptahsokar (aka Uni-nut).

So, what you're saying, Sokar, is that this needs to be considered intelligent only with the addition of a non-empirical construct, the chakras, and the contingency that we will some day become angels because of it.

The throat itself, without the addition of the "constructive" chakras, is then only half-intelligent?

Originally posted by Ex Nine
So, what you're saying, Sokar, is that this needs to be considered intelligent only with the addition of a non-empirical construct, the chakras, and the contingency that we will some day become angels because of it.

The throat itself, without the addition of the \"constructive\" chakras, is then only half-intelligent?

Well, obviously I'm not forwarding a "proof" here of only a personal conclution (the chakra/agel thing).

The only firm conclusion that I'm asserting here is that whether you beleive in creationism, intelligent design, or evolution, all 3 say that life exists because of some mechanism that comes to the best design possible.

Whether God made it that way, the smart Guy that He is, or there was some amorphous Intelligence at work, or all the choking people got wacked over the eons, the conclution is the same: for some reason, that has to be the best creation/design/output possible.

To say otherwise would require the questioner to forward some alternative theory of life. I'm open to any suggestions...

Originally posted by Sokar
Whether God made it that way, the smart Guy that He is, or there was some amorphous Intelligence at work, or all the choking people got wacked over the eons, the conclution is the same: for some reason, that has to be the best creation/design/output possible.

Sokar, you're wrong there. Evolution never, and I mean NEVER says that ANYTHING is the best design possible. Evolution says that the species MOST REACTIVE TO CHANGE will survive, NOT the strongest or furthest adapted. Further, we aren't completely evolved yet, because evolution is a never-ending process. Not to mention our understanding of evolution is still growing. The throat is something that probably never was given the chance to evolve differently in human beings. In short, other genes provided much better avenues in terms of survival. So the throat never evolved because the change didn't increase the survival or reproductive abilities of the species as much as another evolution did; giving the other trait dominance over the throat trait. And the chances of the throat evolving now are slim, at least in humans. Nowadays, the number of people who die from choking on food is minute compared to car accidents, violent crimes and natural disasters. Especially since the human race has developed things like the Heimlick (Excuse the spelling on that, it's German and I'm too lazy to look it up) Manuver and such, which means that we can get around choking. Most all people live long enough to reproduce without ever worrying about choking to death. Therefore the gene will probably never become important enough to human survival to cause a major evolution. Same thing with the appendix, we don't use it any more, and it can cause one hell of a lot of problems, but since modern medicine can treat appendix issues, it won't affect reproduction or survival in the case of the average human being.

What's in question in this thread is why God, if given the chance to change these things, didn't. God didn't have to give us appendices. God didn't have to put our throat in such a problematic configuration. So why the hell did he? As Ex said, your Chakra idea has no empirical backing, which is (as always) what we're looking for. And does the Chakra cover the appendix issue as well? Just curious.

Originally posted by Tsen
Sokar, you're wrong there. *Evolution never, and I mean NEVER says that ANYTHING is the best design possible...And does the Chakra cover the appendix issue as well? *Just curious.

Tsen, however you define it, its an OK design whether reactive, or otherwise. You have to remember to that the design of the human thoat is based on the designs of all the human's predecessors, monkey, dinosaur, simpler forms, so I think we've gotten a lot of time to get the bugs worked out. Nothing's perfect, but the throat is close enough. I can't remember the last time I choked on something.

I was just saying that evolution or God, we don't have our nutsacks strapped to our ankles, or our anus right under our noses. The layout is pretty good IMO.

Strangely, the chakra issue does come up with the appendix. I'm just posting this here for "isn't that interesting" information, nothing I can back up, but my beleif system holds that the human race is the result of 7 waves of "root race" each one headed by an Adam (and an Eve of course).

The Adam in the bible is the 4th Adam, most people come from him. Africans, blacks, are remnants of the 3rd, or Atlantean Root Race.

Anyways, a lot of these weird organs that we have, like the appendix, the spleen, the pituitary gland, the pineal gland, are either organs that were developed prior to our root race (and are now dormant), or are scheduled to be developed in a future root race. For example, the spleen has an important spiritual (ie. chakra or meridian) purpose that will be radically developed either in the next race or the one after. Also the pineal gland will be developed into a sensory organ (since you're Mormon, the organ is a direct correspondance to a Urim and Thummim) sometime in the future.

Nothing I can prove, just interesting reading, I think.

Tsen, however you define it, its an OK design whether reactive, or otherwise. You have to remember to that the design of the human thoat is based on the designs of all the human's predecessors, monkey, dinosaur, simpler forms, so I think we've gotten a lot of time to get the bugs worked out. Nothing's perfect, but the throat is close enough. I can't remember the last time I choked on something. [/b]

That's EXACTLY what I'm saying. The throat had all that time to change but didn't because it didn't represent an immense threat to survival or reproduction. All the kinks weren't worked out because some were too small to bother with. But God has all the time in the world (literally) to spend creating humans, so why not fix a simple problem like that? I agree that the layout is pretty good, but evolution says that it'll be pretty good. An omnipotent creator says that the layout oughta be perfect. The appendix falls into the same area: Why would God create this appendix, then forgo its use in today's strain of humans, but still leave it there with the potential to cause problems, some of which can cause death? It's like laying land mines in your front yard in case you get robbed. It's all well and good if you blow up a burglar sometime in the future, but what about you and your family that have to run through the minefield every day? It's just not practical.

(since you're Mormon, the organ is a direct correspondance to a Urim and Thummim) [/b]

Actually, I'm FORMERLY Mormon. I've mentioned leaving the church a while back quite a few times. But that's alright, I'm actually quite impressed that you know that much about Mormon doctrine, considering that you aren't Mormon yourself (Well, I'd assume you aren't Mormon, since your beliefs don't quite line up with Mormon ideals and such). The Urim and Thummim is quite obscure I'd think...Well, kudos for doing your research there.

So, if God is the all-perfect, omnipotent being, why the fuck are humans so imperfect? If there were an all-perfect divine being, I do not think he would have designed us in such a way that would make it difficult in the least for us to utilize one of our most needed bodily functions. Unless he/she/it wanted us to suffer.But that wouldn't make sense..Come on. If there were a God, I am sure he/she/it could have done a lot better than that.

Because we would not look as cool then.If God has made other begings then he might have made a creature that eats in a differnt way.Its cosmic art tis all.

. . .


I most certainly hope you're joking.

'Cuz the throat could easily have been designed so that the windpipe wasn't in front of the gullet, with no change in appearance. It's like the design flaw with several modern cars (The one that comes to mind was one of the 90's models of the Subaru Outback): The oil pan is positioned poorly, leading to possible engine fires. Moving the oil pan didn't change the look of the car at all, it only makes it safer to drive.