Thread: Religion and Civilization

Religion and Civilization

I have often referred to Arnold Toynbee’s master work “A Study in History”, which is the most important general work ever done on trends and dynamics in Human History. He refers often to Religion, and has pointed out a few specifics, for instance, where there have been 3 Generations of Civilizations, only the 2nd Generation Civilizations developed what he called Universal Higher Religions. These Universal Higher Religions were able to survive the decline of their Parent Civilizations, and then formed the institutional nuclei and enabled the propitious social climates for the 3rd Generation of Civilizations. And then when the 3rd Generation of Civilization declined and collapsed, the Universal Religions were able to survive and remain. Not a single one of the 3rd Generation Civilizations were able to generate a new and distinct Universal Religion.

Then Toynbee took a close look at Western Civilization and did not altogether rule out the possibility that, as a One World Civilization, the dialogues and interchanges between the Four Higher Universal Religions might foster a melding of a Common New Universal Religion that will survive Western Civilization and be chrysalis to the Next Civilization, just as the original Universal Religions formed out of the competing parochial sects of their Second Generation Civilizations.

What prevents a One World Religion? Toynbee suggested that the Religions sourcing out from Judaic Tradition were inherently bigoted. Historically that is not altogether a negative, as a Religion that insists upon winning may often times win. A happy and homogonous Posterity does not remember the Ghosts of contending minorities that were swept off the Field by the institutions of applied bigotry, and we must appreciate the Logic that tells us that the elimination of enemies does indeed bring Peace. However, it may be easier to win if the Religion itself is in the right, or at least not morally reprehensible to the Other Religions and the Interests of Civilization. No Religion can be inherently Barbaric – it presents a contradiction. The Ends and Goals that a Religion proposes in guiding a Society forward must actually coincide with the Society’s real spiritual and material interests.

Christianity, through the influence of Paul, had become a Mystery Religion that rejected Righteousness and Law and accepted a Magical Initiation which would automatically ‘save’ it adherents no matter how anti-social their morals. That almost defines Barbarism, doesn’t it? It was Pauline Christianity, as Protestantism, that caused the collapse of Catholic Civilization – its insistence upon selfish individualism could only lead to social disintegration, which is what that has indeed transpired. No Civilization can foster and grow without a Viable Moral System –exactly the thing that Pauline Christianity had eschewed.

But if Christianity returned to simply the Teachings of Christ, then the Mahayana and the Hindu Religions would have no reason to see it other than a Divine Sibling. Islam, also being of Judaic Origin, has its own problems.

Makes sense.

Ill look into the book..

Originally Posted by Carôusoul

Makes sense.

Ill look into the book..

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Originally Posted by Carôusoul

Makes sense.

Ill look into the book..

Thx Carôusoul for finding this
sounds intriguing.

It does sound interesting

Yes, it does.

Originally Posted by Leo Volont

Religion and Civilization

I have often referred to Arnold Toynbee’s master work “A Study in History”, which is the most important general work ever done on trends and dynamics in Human History. He refers often to Religion, and has pointed out a few specifics, for instance, where there have been 3 Generations of Civilizations, only the 2nd Generation Civilizations developed what he called Universal Higher Religions. These Universal Higher Religions were able to survive the decline of their Parent Civilizations, and then formed the institutional nuclei and enabled the propitious social climates for the 3rd Generation of Civilizations. And then when the 3rd Generation of Civilization declined and collapsed, the Universal Religions were able to survive and remain. Not a single one of the 3rd Generation Civilizations were able to generate a new and distinct Universal Religion.

Then Toynbee took a close look at Western Civilization and did not altogether rule out the possibility that, as a One World Civilization, the dialogues and interchanges between the Four Higher Universal Religions might foster a melding of a Common New Universal Religion that will survive Western Civilization and be chrysalis to the Next Civilization, just as the original Universal Religions formed out of the competing parochial sects of their Second Generation Civilizations.

What prevents a One World Religion? Toynbee suggested that the Religions sourcing out from Judaic Tradition were inherently bigoted. Historically that is not altogether a negative, as a Religion that insists upon winning may often times win. A happy and homogonous Posterity does not remember the Ghosts of contending minorities that were swept off the Field by the institutions of applied bigotry, and we must appreciate the Logic that tells us that the elimination of enemies does indeed bring Peace. However, it may be easier to win if the Religion itself is in the right, or at least not morally reprehensible to the Other Religions and the Interests of Civilization. No Religion can be inherently Barbaric – it presents a contradiction. The Ends and Goals that a Religion proposes in guiding a Society forward must actually coincide with the Society’s real spiritual and material interests.

Christianity, through the influence of Paul, had become a Mystery Religion that rejected Righteousness and Law and accepted a Magical Initiation which would automatically ‘save’ it adherents no matter how anti-social their morals. That almost defines Barbarism, doesn’t it? It was Pauline Christianity, as Protestantism, that caused the collapse of Catholic Civilization – its insistence upon selfish individualism could only lead to social disintegration, which is what that has indeed transpired. No Civilization can foster and grow without a Viable Moral System –exactly the thing that Pauline Christianity had eschewed.

But if Christianity returned to simply the Teachings of Christ, then the Mahayana and the Hindu Religions would have no reason to see it other than a Divine Sibling. Islam, also being of Judaic Origin, has its own problems.

I realize I am ignoring half your post here but unless we saw the collapse of christianity as a whole a one world religion couldn't exist. Lots of christians see one world religion as being a sign of the end times predicted in Revelation.