I'm mostly atheist but i was wondering about the concept of god and accept for a minute
that Jesus was a real person.
I wondered how he died but i don't know anything about jesus so i need ur take on what you believe is how he died.
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I'm mostly atheist but i was wondering about the concept of god and accept for a minute
that Jesus was a real person.
I wondered how he died but i don't know anything about jesus so i need ur take on what you believe is how he died.
Oh basically this other dude said he was Brian but you know those Romans, can't take a bloody joke.
Though individuals accepted Jesus as Christ, as a nation the Jews had Jesus put to death.
Matthew 27:15-26:
"15*Now from festival to festival it was the custom of the governor to release a prisoner to the crowd, the one they wanted. 16*Just at that time they were holding a notorious prisoner called Bar‧ab′bas. 17*Hence when they were gathered together Pilate said to them: “Which one do YOU want me to release to YOU, Bar‧ab′bas or Jesus the so-called Christ?” 18*For he was aware that out of envy they had handed him over. 19*Moreover, while he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent out to him, saying: “Have nothing to do with that righteous man, for I suffered a lot today in a dream because of him.” 20*But the chief priests and the older men persuaded the crowds to ask for Bar‧ab′bas, but to have Jesus destroyed. 21*Now in responding the governor said to them: “Which of the two do YOU want me to release to YOU?” They said: “Bar‧ab′bas.” 22*Pilate said to them: “What, then, shall I do with Jesus the so-called Christ?” They all said: “Let him be impaled!” 23*He said: “Why, what bad thing did he do?” Still they kept crying out all the more: “Let him be impaled!”
24*Seeing that it did no good but, rather, an uproar was arising, Pilate took water and washed his hands before the crowd, saying: “I am innocent of the blood of this [man]. YOU yourselves must see to it.” 25*At that all the people said in answer: “His blood come upon us and upon our children.” 26*Then he released Bar‧ab′bas to them, but he had Jesus whipped and handed him over to be impaled."
Which is why I find it so humorous that so many today still think of Israel as "God's chosen nation/people". Scripture also clearly says:
Matthew 23:27-29:
"37*“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the killer of the prophets and stoner of those sent forth to her,—how often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks together under her wings! But YOU people did not want it. 38*Look! YOUR house is abandoned to YOU. 39*For I say to YOU, YOU will by no means see me from henceforth until YOU say, ‘Blessed is he that comes in Jehovah’s name!’”"
[Bold added by me]
I'm sure most Christians agree that Jesus was executed by the Jews, however, the Christians I know do not blame today's Jews for the death or Jesus.
That would be like blaming today's women for Eve's sins. Oh wait...
Technically, it was the Romans.
I just find it strange to say that someone who claimed eternal life has somehow managed to die.
Actually Eve did not sin. Eve saved mankind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartiate
Original sin depends upon the belief that there are two stories of creation, the first a blessing and the second a curse.
However, this contradiction can only be supported if one does not know judgment. The text itself tells you that the curse shall be turned into a blessing. Here is one example, brought about by using a single eye, that is one standard of judgment.
Gen 3:
1) The Serpent spoke in the name of the Lord.
2) His words came to pass,
3) God confirmed his words.
This means, by so called Mosaic Law, that the Serpent was a prophet sent by God.
The Plan of God was fulfilled, man learned judgment.
The heart of man would be tested, heart is a metaphor for the human mind, The mind is tested for judgment, as was written, this is how the scripture is sealed, not by magic, but because the principles of judgment, language, are not functional in man.
The Law and Prophet Prophesized until John. Prophecy is given in metaphor--it exercises the similie in multis, the one idea using many examples. The Book tells the same story of the evolution of human judgment over and over again, using different metaphors to construct the same story repeating. The text stammers over and over, the same story--from front to back.
Technically Jesus was murdered by Romans like already sad.
Some people tend to equalize Judas (the guy who betrayed good old Jesus by telling the romans where to find him for 30 pieces of silver) with the the jewish kin itself, seeing him as a metaphor for the jews actually causing Jesus death...
There are Historians pointing this out as one of the main roots of modern Antisemitism.
I recently read a very interesting article about the general misunderstanding of the world that Jesus and his best mates were actually preaching in.
It's simply a fact that they were all embedded in the jewish society around them, not trying to establish a new religion but to bring change to the people being suppressed by the roman conquerors.
Various people studying the old Testament already showed that Jesus style of preaching was typical for a Rabbi in that time.
Claiming that he was killed by "the Jews" means that you separate Jesus from them (which is wrong since he was one of them) and bring up two fronts, a way of thinking that was often abused over 2000 years leading to various brutal crimes against jewish people, especially the holocaust.
I reckon this is a highly sensitive subject since it can easily lead to wrong and dangerous conclusions.
Or, one can take it all with a grain of salt, and understand what Christ said, man has no power. History, until man is capable of thought, is controlled by this "God" ---good and bad--but all to the same conclusion--the evolution of man.
In any event, man has a long way to go.
why won't folks just let this man die in peace
I don't think there is anyone who could change history one way or the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhavoc
I think humanity killed jesus.
I was quite surprised at that bit in the Bible actually, when I read it. The Roman guy is all like, "myehh, this Jesus guy seems pretty cool to me. Why don't you let him go?". And the Jews are all like, "no, free the criminal!". And the Roman guy is like, "okay fine, have your criminal back, but seriously, this Jesus guy hasn't done anybody much harm, if I just whip him a couple of times will you be cool with that?". And the Jews are all like, "no, fucking kill him or we'll kick off!". And the Roman guy says, "Christ on a bike you guys, fine, I'll fucking kill him if you're that passionate about your entertainment, but seriously, don't fucking pin this shit on me".
Seems kinda glossed over these days.
Of course, it's all bullshit and that bit was probably put in by early Christians who were by this time bitterly fighting with the Jews for not accepting the Messiah as real. And neither of these groups had any fucking evidence at all other than hearsay. But still, if you're going to join in with the 'Bible is obviously true crowd', you have to go the whole hog.
Even more lolwat is the bit where it says that Mary only slept with Joseph after she gave birth to Jesus, and her kids are mentioned later on. Entire Catholic faith fail? It's unbelievable really.