Thread: Okla. tea parties and lawmakers envision militia

Civil War 2 anyone?

If they were to take on the federal government they'd need to have a good majority of states in on it.

Thus far, the discussions have been exploratory. Even the proponents say they don't know how an armed force would be organized nor how a state-based militia could block federal mandates.

Lol, idiots with guns.

I would join if we had civil war weaponry, because the playing field would be pretty even. Nowadays it's impossible, IMPOSSIBLE, to fight back. They have so much technology, and so many different types of weapons to use on an unruly public it's not even funny. They're welcome to get microwaved if they want, i'm not a coward but i know a lost battle when i see one. Sure, i'd be willing to die for a cause, but there are such things as lost causes, and trying to create any type of change in today's world as done in the past is impossible, the military will kick assess like they're stepping on frogs.... Each revolution needs to be executed in a different manner because the enemy of the previous revolutions have prepared themselves for any repeat of the past.

I'm sorry but i really don't think this government gives a damn about it's people's likes and dislikes. There's no reason why they should listen to us anymore, we've given up our freedoms for "safety & protection" and we've allowed them to amass laws against rebelling against the governments commandments. Yeah sure, if the ENTIRE country (including the military, this is the crucial part) turned against the government it would work, but as long as it's just a percentage of the whole and the military remains in the governments control, the people of said government will remain in said control.

So sorry, but they need a reality check, there's nothing that can be done.
either jump ship or scrub the deck...

Hey! I'm from Oklahoma! You're saying that we don't have any chances...that's depressing for me, a little bit.

But it's true. If they could procure an outside source of weapons better than what's available to them here it would help, but as soon as the government got wind of this (which would not take long at all) they would bring the hammer down like it's nobody's business. Not to mention, the media would be makig the rebels out to be evil and horrible people.

Exactly, there's no chance in hell anyone would allow such thing as a rebellion or a revolution like this to happen. Especially other countries, we owe SOOOOOOOO much to other countries, there's no way they wouldn't step in and "help" our government with the "evil traitor rebels" that are trying to "overthrow" the government. It's just not gonna happen.

It boils down to what i said. It would take about 80% of the nations citizens, PLUS THE MILITARY'S SUPPORT of the movement for it to succeed. Because there's no way anything like this could work if the military remained under the control of the government we're trying to boot. The military is HIGHLY trained FOR A REASON, while the general public may try to replicate this training, they lack the land size or funding to do so.

So it would essentially be a fight of some house cats versus a group of Siberian tigers.... the house cats are screwed.

I don't mean to depress you, it's the truth

Although, the military isn't liking Obama's descisions...I smell a second civil war! Or just some bad BO!

I've just read the full article, and the commenter's cited in it say everything already.

ANY group opposed to the government will be viewed as radicals, and an unneeded danger BY THE GENERAL PUBLIC. They stated multiple times that they believe the NATIONAL GUARD to be the only NEEDED STATE MILITARY FORCE. So this militia in Ok. isn't going to be able to accomplish anything until they remove the power the Oklahoma National Guard holds over the state, either by force (ridiculous) or by convincing the military there that they serve the citizens of the state (which is how it's supposed to be) and that the citizens oppose this or that.

The second American Civil War is going to happen at the voting booths. I think the Democratic Party probably just committed suicide and the Republican Party will be erased from the system next unless they drastically change. You can smell it in the air. The American people think the government has gotten ridiculously powerful and needs to be majorly transformed. Ron Paul is in the lead right now for Republican candidates for president in 2012, which is great news and an excellent sign of a major change in public attitudes.

Yeah, you can definitely feel something coming. The american people are just pissed they're being ignored and trampled over. I hope they do act by instating a real president that knows what needs to be done (Ron Paul is the current ideal character i believe) and taking the "battle" to the ballots, because anything other than that will result in fruitless bloodshed.

I'm thankful to live in such a time, yes it may be shitty right now, but honestly if this follows through and the american people take the country back and create a proper government from what we've learned is wrong and right then i'll be the happiest man alive (metaphorically, because there will be others just as happy).

I mean, if you think about it, this shit has been dropped into this generations lap and we're expected to pick up the bill that our ancestors left and didn't care to pay. The wars, the food, energy, transportation, and all other problems this country has built up over the past 234 years have been left for us to deal with. I say we step up, accept the task of cleaning up this damn mess and declare this OUR country once again and run it in a way that's best FOR the people in this generation, but most importantly for those to come. Lets not be assess like those before us and hand down only problems and leave bills behind for our country's children to pay, but hand them a country from which they can honestly progress in and create something truly amazing from. We should always be improving and progressing in our ways of existing as united states, and quite frankly we're falling apart.

Originally Posted by MementoMori

I would join if we had civil war weaponry, because the playing field would be pretty even. Nowadays it's impossible, IMPOSSIBLE, to fight back. They have so much technology, and so many different types of weapons to use on an unruly public it's not even funny. They're welcome to get microwaved if they want, i'm not a coward but i know a lost battle when i see one. Sure, i'd be willing to die for a cause, but there are such things as lost causes, and trying to create any type of change in today's world as done in the past is impossible, the military will kick assess like they're stepping on frogs.... Each revolution needs to be executed in a different manner because the enemy of the previous revolutions have prepared themselves for any repeat of the past.

I'm sorry but i really don't think this government gives a damn about it's people's likes and dislikes. There's no reason why they should listen to us anymore, we've given up our freedoms for "safety & protection" and we've allowed them to amass laws against rebelling against the governments commandments. Yeah sure, if the ENTIRE country (including the military, this is the crucial part) turned against the government it would work, but as long as it's just a percentage of the whole and the military remains in the governments control, the people of said government will remain in said control.

So sorry, but they need a reality check, there's nothing that can be done.
either jump ship or scrub the deck...

I don't really agree with this position. A small band of rebels aren't going to accomplish anything, but a fair to medium size group of respected citizens exercising their rights in an organized and confident way sends a message. If these people are able to form an effective militia, and the government does something about it, it will only help their cause as long as they can keep from doing anything that looks 'wrong' to the public. Polygamists who may or may not be molesting children are not going to get any sympathy when the government tries to smack them down, but when its the boys from the volunteer fire department and members of the PTA and whatnot then the government cannot simply storm in and shut them down without some wide spread social consequences.

is a violent resistance necessary, though? aside from its likelihood of failure considering the immaculately trained and armed anti-riot police etc. etc., would a mass boycott kind of thing be more effective? by which i mean, can you foresee any kind of huge shift towards permaculture because so many people simply can't get a job or make enough money to line the pockets of the industries the lifeblood of basic american life is derived from? i think we need to use our brains a little more, and the teabaggers sure aren't helping with that.

I honestly think any violent/physical revolt wont work. We need to put a president in office that will stand by the people. I know J.F.K. was one of those presidents and ye he was assassinated but with todays technology it'd be a little harder, plus if those who stand behind that president truly standby him i don't think "they" would attempt anything.

If our government got far enough out of hand and the people violently revolted, the military would not necessarily take the side of the government. The French Revolution was a success because so many of the royal guards took the side of the revolutionaries and helped overthrow Louis XVI.

Oh, the irony!

lol, not irony, fate. Duh duh duh duh...

No but really the ad at the top chooses adds related to the pages content.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

If our government got far enough out of hand and the people violently revolted, the military would not necessarily take the side of the government. The French Revolution was a success because so many of the royal guards took the side of the revolutionaries and helped overthrow Louis XVI.

I don't think our military would turn against it's government.


At the very end the soldier sounds very sympathetic but when asked if he would shoot an american citizen he answers yes...

A VERY large amount of the military will take this standpoint on it. The ones that take the peoples side will just be dishonorably discharged and treated as traitors to their country. If you don't believe brainwashing happens in the military, your dead wrong. A militia or any violent physical force WILL NOT SUCCEED.

Our military is trained to fire on Enemies of The State. The government's enemy becomes the soldiers enemy....

What we would have to do is gain control of the military, and to do this we need to get someone in the presidential seat that fully and whole heartedly agrees with the people. Not some schmuck bought and paid for by companies and organizations that benefit from our debt.
Then if anything is tried against the people by any other part of the government that requires a militia, well, then any militia created by the people will hold the military as partners in cause and not a threat.

Originally Posted by MementoMori

lol, not irony, fate. Duh duh duh duh...

No but really the ad at the top chooses adds related to the pages content.

So the ads know we're talking about TEA party morons?

THE GOVERNMENT IS WATCHING US

EDIT:

Originally Posted by MementoMori

I don't think our military would turn against it's government.


At the very end the soldier sounds very sympathetic but when asked if he would shoot an american citizen he answers yes...

Not exactly, though he is sayig that he feels as if there is some possibility of being attacked by an american citizen, which is probably only what he was told.

My point exactly.

Example:
Militia ends up having to defend state because said state refuses to abide by new law or program backed by new law. National Guard is ordered to apprehend the members of said militia, and confiscate their weapons. The militia opens fire in defending themselves. What do you think the NG soldiers are going to do? Their going to open fire back to defend themselves and follow orders.

Not to mention that any group opening fire on our military in revolt against the governments rule will probably be listed as a terrorist group. So there's really no way to say that starting a militia to fight against the unruly government will succeed. Said militia will be labeled as terrorist's plotting to kill military soldiers, officers, and government officials and be taken down by the military. There was a survey given to marines about whether they would fire on american citizens, 1/4 answered yes, and of those 4/5 stated they would participate in operations of policing american soil. They don't actually have to 'shoot' you. There are tons of other ways of subduing someone....

violent revolt = FAIL


As i stated before, take the oval office to take the country...

Originally Posted by MementoMori

What we would have to do is gain control of the military, and to do this we need to get someone in the presidential seat that fully and whole heartedly agrees with the people.

HEY GUYS!

LMAO!

No Not Ms.Nailin Pailin lol


This Guy:







but really...


pick this book up and read it if you want to take your country back (to fellow americans). Ron Paul is the guy to get the revolution started. We've just gotta get him in office. The problem is he doesn't side with either Dems or Repubs, so those who "religiously" vote for their side wont vote for him because he's neither. We've gotta break people of voting for a "side" and start actually looking at what needs to be done and who will actually do it.

For the fun of it I clicked one of those mind-numbingly stupid google ads
about the tea party. And the survey was even worse.. Man,.. these people.

1) What is your opinion of the Tea Party movement?

Favorable
Unfavorable

2) If you had your choice, and the Tea Party was an official party, which
party would you identify with most?

Republican
Democrat
Tea Party
Libertarian
Other

3) Who should lead the Tea Party?

Sarah Palin
Newt Gingrich
Mike Huckabee
Someone new/else

4) In the 2008 election between McCain - Palin and Obama - Biden, who
did you vote for?

McCain - Palin
Obama - Biden
Other

... talk about a limited world view..

But I have a question:

Wasn't there like... a different tea party movement 1-2 years that stemmed
from the far left, as opposed to the far right?

also, what the hell is it with sarah palin?

Originally Posted by MementoMori

We've gotta break people of voting for a "side" and start actually looking at what needs to be done and who will actually do it.

That is the most important change that needs to happen in politics. Too many people in the U.S. think politics is just tribal/cult warfare where "Either you are with us or against us". They pick a side and cling to it unconditionally on every single damn issue. It's just a bunch of us versus them as far as most of the country is concerned. I wish I knew how to snap people out of that. We've got some major issues to deal with these days, and intellectual honesty is very much needed.

Originally Posted by MementoMori

I don't think our military would turn against it's government.


At the very end the soldier sounds very sympathetic but when asked if he would shoot an american citizen he answers yes...

A VERY large amount of the military will take this standpoint on it. The ones that take the peoples side will just be dishonorably discharged and treated as traitors to their country. If you don't believe brainwashing happens in the military, your dead wrong. A militia or any violent physical force WILL NOT SUCCEED.

Our military is trained to fire on Enemies of The State. The government's enemy becomes the soldiers enemy....

What we would have to do is gain control of the military, and to do this we need to get someone in the presidential seat that fully and whole heartedly agrees with the people. Not some schmuck bought and paid for by companies and organizations that benefit from our debt.
Then if anything is tried against the people by any other part of the government that requires a militia, well, then any militia created by the people will hold the military as partners in cause and not a threat.

Have you heard of the OathKeepers(.org)? They are a group of active military and veterans who have pledged to uphold the oath they took when they were sworn into the military; to protect the constitution against any enemy, foreign and domestic.