Thread: Got me fooled again

So I was on the hunt for answers. The place was crowded and I looked for an entity that was aside which I could lead somewhere to apply a bit more pressure. And there I found one, appearing like a girl, but she seemed to expect me. Why? I didn't have to convince her at all, she came with me without hesitation. Did she know what I was up to? We walked along a nearby brook and crossed a bridge. The perfect spot, no one else was around. I wanted answers about the nature of the dream, about the beings that constantly fooled around with me, about their motivations... and I would accept no evasion. I realized something strange about her arm, like an open wound. Round white parts and blood that was much too pale and thick ran out of it, or so it seemed. I got worried and lost lucidity. A few more moments later I woke up realizing she tricked me. The situation was set up, they found out I was lucid and she was the bait to get me back on the hook. They're playing smart, but I'm learning their ways. Yet how can I avoid being tracked as lucid? Not all of them can tell the difference, but some can and when they do, they know exactly what triggers to pull.

How about this. This is YOUR dream. They can't do shit about it. The only reason something happens is because you expect it to, you let it happen.

Sorry, no. I have a different opinion about that. It's also my life (it seems), but that does not mean others have no influence on it. And second, DCs don't give information freely. Try talking to your DCs and tell them that it's all just a dream (which is pretty silly comparing it to someone walking around telling people it's all just life) and see for yourself how they react. I guess you'll be surprised.

Actually, I can make them tell me whatever I want. In the small amount of lucids I had, I influenced my dream characters, not the other way around. They are just objects. Figments of your imagination. Whatever you want them to do, they will.

Edit: If you keep believing that they have their own will then you'll never get control.

Doesn't convince me.

i agree, i can make a DC do whatever i want. if you are aware than you will stay lucid no matter what "tricks" they play. just be aware. what i do is try to pay attention to my waking life, and pretend that if i lost focus on what i'm doing then i will cease to exist lol. that usually keeps me aware for a few minutes until something distracts me or i get lost in my thoughts. that's why meditation is beneficial too.

btw, that was funny picturing some guy yelling excitedly "i'm awake! this is reality! you people are real!". LMAO, that made my day.

Originally Posted by ForgottenDream

i agree, i can make a DC do whatever i want.

I know that this is possible, but I have no interest in playing puppeteer. Getting superficial or probably false information from DCs does not require any effort and making them do things requires a little, but what's the use. I can see when they become uncomfortable answering certain questions and more than once I observed them becoming increasingly uncomfortable the more (pre)lucid I became. I'm not taking things for granted just because someone tells me. Experiencing is believing. They're quick giving false answers and when you believe they're just objects anyway, you may just take their response and be satisfied with it. I'm not, they know more than they're usually willing to tell.

Apart from that, in my experience you can't have every DC do what you want and you also cannot shape every dream situation just like you want it to be. This often works (within limits) and if it doesn't you can switch the whole scenery, but that's not the same. Some DCs/situations are more powerful and consistant than others. Besides, what can you learn controlling and manipulating things? It's only your own reflection you'd face that way.

Of course I expect them to behave in the way I described, but that is because it's what I learned from observation. I had no expectations of that kind when I first began to ask them what they are and what they know about me and the world they exist in or about the waking world.

P.S. Please don't use terms like "autosuggestion" and "subconscious" arguing with me. Those are no scientific facts but old-fashioned hypotheses that made it into common knowledge with the usual 50+ years delay. Thinking models that for some reason became more popular (but not more correct) than other models. You can't take the mind and dissect it like a frog to recognize and name it's parts. I simply don't believe in the freudian model. In my opinion it's incomplete and inadequate. It was a very raw tool at its time and does not even reflect today's status. In school it is still taught for historical reasons, though that is often not made clear enough. Using it to argue with me is like telling an atheist something is true because it's written in the bible. I keep to what I can oberve and am open for the observations of others to indirectly learn from them. That is a more productive basis of discussion.

For once forget everything you think is granted or others have taught you and observe, not looking through the tinted spectactles of your culture. It's hard to learn things, but it's a lot harder to unlearn them and see with open eyes.

Well, just clear whatever makes them aware (autosugestion), after all your in control of the whole world your in (unless it were a post in BD), then again canceling your own control is another way of control lol

Your hunger for knowledge seems to be tampered by your feelings and emotions. The exact reason you lost lucidity when you saw the open wound on the girl's arm.

"Have you ever experienced (unlikely) or read about experiences people made with DMT? (recommended literature: "DMT - The Spirit Molecule") There is more than one dimension of reality and the physical body is neither you nor the cause of your existence. Sleep is one of the closest things to death that we can experience without permanently giving up the physical body. Use it to learn and expand your horizon or go on believing the narrow view of a culture that worships physical matter. You decide."

Note: Some people who have been doing drugs all of their lives were not ready for a DMT experience and would not recommend anyone trying to purchase it online (if possible).

The God Molecule may enhance one's perception past comprehensible proportion but I do believe for the rest of us, that training the physical body is necessary to train one's spirit. Through one's spirit, may we perceive what we are, in the present moment.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

Your hunger for knowledge seems to be tampered by your feelings and emotions. The exact reason you lost lucidity when you saw the open wound on the girl's arm.

What would I be without? Failure is learning to not fail again.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

Note: Some people who have been doing drugs all of their lives were not ready for a DMT experience and would not recommend anyone trying to purchase it online (if possible).

The Spice is very destructive. But one can't built a stable house on a rotten base anyway.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

The God Molecule may enhance one's perception past comprehensible proportion but I do believe for the rest of us, that training the physical body is necessary to train one's spirit. Through one's spirit, may we perceive what we are, in the present moment.

A valuable tool should always be kept in good shape.

Originally Posted by gigaschatten

What would I be without? Failure is learning to not fail again.

What would I be without? You could learn be more open.

To experience something with thoughts and emotions is to experience something biased. From an experience, you must separate the experience, the thought, and the emotion. The experience is natural; The thought and emotions connected to it are human.

The next time you have an experience and have a thought about the experience, quickly stop your thought process (everyone should be able to do this for at least one or two seconds) and concentrate on where the emotion is located in your body. Then connect the location to your previous thought.

After doing this a few dozen times, you will start to recognize patterns. In which, case you will start to break down the need to experience something emotionally (every time) and be able to experience day to day happenings more openly(raw).

So the next time the girl shows you (or you happen to see) her arm, you can see it as a more open experience and perhaps look back up to her face and ask her "What is wrong with your arm?"

EDIT: Failure is learning to not fail again? I didn't quite understand this. Did you mean the same as 'Success is learning from failure the first time?' or 'Failure is not learning from failure.' I have never heard the saying you used.

EDIT 2: I screwed up the quote.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

The experience is natural; The thought and emotions connected to it are human.

I disagree. All experience a human being can have is human by nature, simply because the one experiencing is human.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

The next time you have an experience and have a thought about the experience, quickly stop your thought process (everyone should be able to do this for at least one or two seconds) and concentrate on where the emotion is located in your body. Then connect the location to your previous thought.

After doing this a few dozen times, you will start to recognize patterns. In which, case you will start to break down the need to experience something emotionally (every time) and be able to experience day to day happenings more openly(raw).

I know that exercise but I don't agree on the result. It helps you to become aware of emotions, which is not equivalent to being more open.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

So the next time the girl shows you (or you happen to see) her arm, you can see it as a more open experience and perhaps look back up to her face and ask her "What is wrong with your arm?"

There are alarm situations where one relies on unreflected action to protect oneself or others. This was one of such and there was no time for things like locating emotional feedback centers. I'm sure you wouldn't analyze your emotions first when evading a truck heading for you at full speed. Whatever she had on her arm (noodle/tomato soup?), it triggered alarm.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

EDIT: Failure is learning to not fail again? I didn't quite understand this. Did you mean the same as 'Success is learning from failure the first time?' or 'Failure is not learning from failure.' I have never heard the saying you used.

It means exactly what it says. Next time I'll be prepared because I failed this time and learned from it. When something like that happens again, I'll remember the result and act differently or evade such a situation alltogether. But they don't try things twice anyway, at least not as far as I can recall.

Originally Posted by tranquilitybytrey

EDIT 2: I screwed up the quote.

Originally Posted by gigaschatten

There are alarm situations where one relies on unreflected action to protect oneself or others. This was one of such and there was no time for things like locating emotional feedback centers. I'm sure you wouldn't analyze your emotions first when evading a truck heading for you at full speed. Whatever she had on her arm (noodle/tomato soup?), it triggered alarm.

The technique that I was trying to explain to you was not supposed to be done while lucid. The technique, when done over a period of time in waking life, can help you to detach yourself from emotional stimulus, while still being completely emotionally aware. (And will be reflected so, while lucid.) Its like being able to change your behavior, if the one now gets you into trouble.

This can help one not jump to conclusions when an emotional up rival comes from unforeseen stimulus. You said the noodle soup enabled panic mode and you had to fall out of lucidity, even if its something else to that extreme, emotional attachment will pull you every time. (Most people, it seems, have no problem controlling their dreaming. If you would like not to, then you must be able to control yourself.)

I have had DCs try to pull me out of lucidity with illusions. Once, I asked a DC named Heather Nonconnor what I was doing dreaming in 'this current location'. Next thing I know, I'm climbing a mountain. After making it to the top I found myself in front of a door. I stopped to become more aware of my surroundings, turning around, I find myself back in the room with her.

After I tried to further ask her questions, she started talking very softly, to the point that I couldn't hear her. Now, please tell me how to have DCs talk louder, even after you ask them to do so. Hah.

Is it possible that some DCs can't tell you anything?
It may simply be one locked door after another.

Ask yourself, what have you done for the DC to earn their knowledge?

It sounds as if you do not want lucid control to be one way, then why should it be?

Good Luck.