Xhosa (Silene Capensis) African Dream Root - Log and Discussion

My order just arrived in the mail today. How exciting.
http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/...xels/xhosa.jpg


For those of you who don't know what this plant is, here's a summary via Wiki:
Silene capensis (Xhosa: undlela ziimhlophe — “white ways/paths”) (also known as African Dream Root) is a plant native to the Eastern Cape of South Africa, where it is regarded by the Xhosa people as a sacred plant. Its root is traditionally used to induce vivid (and according to the Xhosa, prophetic) lucid dreams during the initiation process of shamans, classifying it a naturally-occurring oneirogen similar to the more well-known dream herb Calea zacatechichi.

I see there are a few threads already that have talked about Silene Capensis, but I wanted to keep a log of my own experience with the oneirogen and would also like to bring it back up into discussion with anyone in the forum who has either had experience with it or is interested in doing so. I know there are mixed reviews on this plant, some stating it has only effects to increase vividness but no help with lucidity and others who claim it does in fact help them with lucid dreaming.

I will be starting my log tomorrow morning and will continue to do so on a daily basis, up until my supply runs out (and possibly longer if I enjoy its effects).

If you'd like to join me, have any questions, advice, or would like to share your own experiences, I'd greatly appreciate it and look forward to the discussions and experiences we may share together.

Warning: It is said that the effects of this plant can/will become permanent. Most people using it agree that after 3 months of taking this plant on a daily basis and under recommended dosage, the effects cannot be reversed, EVEN if you stop taking the root. You will continue to have anywhere up to 5 or more vivid dreams throughout the night, and enhanced dream recall. While all these things sound positive, this plant is connected to the Xhosa African tribe and brings the user into what is called the "White Paths", it is believed to be connected to spirits, and the plant is said to have a consciousness of it's own. If that's something you'd rather not permanently associate yourself with, then do not take this root. The only plant that is said to (momentarily) reverse its effects is cannabis, but after a few months the vivid dreams will return.

Lastly, as with any entheogen, plants, drugs, supplements etc, always do your own extensive research before trying it. Make sure your being safe and know what you're getting yourself into. Be careful out there.

How does it work? I assume you don't eat it?

Question: Why does it say "Not for human consumption?"

I believe as a general rule of thumb, they advise on all of their products to not consume them, for legal reasons.

There are several methods, but it can be chewed and eaten, brewed into a tea, or as traditionally done mashed into a powder and stirred in a container of water so that a foam builds up on top, which is then eaten until full. I'm going to begin doing the traditional method every morning, an hour before breakfast on an empty stomach (as advised). The effects may slightly alter waking perception, but barely at all from what I've read. It's main effect, as with other oneirogens, isn't felt until sleep. It is said to create very vivid (and sometimes lucid) dreams as well as improve dream recall.

I've heard with digesting the plant, sometimes it may take around 3 days before the effects begin to accumulate enough to show up in your dreams, so I've decided to take a more immediate approach for tonight which is done by smoking. I will still be taking the morning methods, such as chewing it or brewing it in tea, but I won't be able to use the frothing method as I lack the tools to grind it into a fine powder.

I've lit a small bowl up and the smoke is a bit harsh but the taste is almost sweet. A kind of licorice smoke. Very light high similar to a tobacco hookah high, hardly noticeable, but it's there. I'll report tonight's slumber first thing tomorrow morning. I've decided to meditate and focus on a question before bed, in hopes that it may be answered in one of my dreams.

Sweet dreams, everyone.

So having smoked the root last night had done no effect on my dreams. I did a bit more research and it's said that smoking Xhosa will not alter REM sleep, it is only done by some to get a slight head high or boost similar to caffeine. Oh well.

It should also be known that most people will not see an effect until about 3 days after taking the Xhosa root. It is best advised to take it in the morning on an empty stomach and wait a while before eating so that the chemicals have time to go throughout the body before being disturbed with food digestion. As I experienced last night, there was a bit of trouble sleeping, if you take too much Xhosa you may experience lack of sleep, so be sure to know what dosage you're taking.


Dreams from Last Night's Slumber: Fell asleep probably around 11pm. Dreams were no more vivid than usual, no visitation by Dream Guide or ancestors, no lucidity, and no noticeable effect on dream recall. Just a jumble of many blurry dream fragments. I seemed to sleep soundly through most of the night, but had trouble falling back to sleep from 5am+ onward. I suppose that's normal considering I had a good 6 hours of sleep. I'm curious as to whether or not this was effected by my smoking of the plant last night.

Today's Preperation Method: Chewing. It has a taste similar to the smoke, some what sweet and a bit like licorice. It has a slight bitterness to it but not that strong. I tried to chew it as long as I could way past the point that it turned to a mush. I will be waiting 1 hour before eating breakfast.
Today's Dose: I have no scale but I eyed it to be around 2-3mg, which I will continue to take for the next 6 days.

Notes: It seems digestion is the best way to take this plant and more so in the frothing method. Since I do not have the tools to make it into a powder, the first week I will be chewing, the second week I will be brewing tea, and hopefully by the third week (and onward) I will have obtained a way to grind it into a powder and try the frothing method.

Dreams from Last Night's Slumber: Slept around 11pm, woke up a few times during the night and recorded some dream fragments, and finally getting up around 8am, I had no trouble sleeping tonight. The dreams weren't any more vivid but the content seemed a bit different, I've no way to say if this is placebo or not. They felt more... story like? In fact some parts I wasn't even involved in the dream it felt like I was watching a movie (though in some parts I would take consciousness in form of a character). This is different for me as usually my dreams are very boring and hard to tell from reality because of the very "normal" context in them. Dream recall was perhaps a bit better, but not noticeably.

Today's Preparation Method: This morning along with last night, I began chewing the root. It's a bit bitter and it seems to make me burp a lot. I felt upon chewing before sleep that my hypnagogic imagery had a brighter aura to it. I'm assuming the beginning phases of the "white paths" are taking place.
Today's Dose: 2-3 mg, one set at night and the second before sleep.

Notes: I'm going to try this chewing method for another two days, but if I notice no effects I may begin the tea method, as this seems to work with most people. We'll see.

Ooh very interesting! I bet Waking Nomad would love to try this drug.

I dunno about that lolol, his dreams already seem pretty vivid and bizarre as it is! Would sure be interesting though :E

and how are you feeling now?

Im interested in trying the herb and am not concerned about altering my dreams into the future. I used to be a very advanced lder before I gave it up 6 years ago so will be interested to see how it feels to my old dreams

Hey Timeless, from what I hear it won't help too much with lucidity. It's mostly used to increase vividness and dream recall, but according to some, it does also have good effects on making you lucid. It's too early for me to tell because I've still got another day or two before I should be noticing the major effects, so stay tuned.

Dreams from Last Night's Slumber: I slept around 12am and woke up at 9am, feeling very well rested, easily slept through the night.The dreams felt no more vivid than usual but I can tell my dream recall is improving because I can easily remember the 3-4 dreams I had last night, which is odd for me because I rarely remember more than 2.

Today's Preparation Method: I had prepared a drink the night before in a water bottle and fell asleep. I woke up at around 7am and drank the root mixed with water, and went back to sleep for another 2 hours. It tasted like regular water.
Today's Dose: About 1/3 of a teaspoon of root that I powdered and mixed into a cup of water. According to someone I spoke with, although its hard to determine without a scale, this was about 2mg give or take.

Notes: I spoke with someone who's had lots of experience with the root and used it for 3 months, which it is said is when the permanent effects take place. He said that he stopped taking it after the 3 months, but the dreams continued to be vivid for a while longer before dropping just a bit and hitting a plateau where they dropped no further. His dreams at this plateau were way more vivid then before he took the plant and he is still able to recall 4-5 dreams a night with ease. He said that even cannabis, which is said to reduce the effects of xhosa root, will only temporarily do so because soon after the dreams return to that permanent increase that the root leaves behind on you. He also helped reassure me that even if the powdered root mixed with water doesn't foam (as this failed to happen with him as well), to just drink the water anyway as the effects will still take place, so I thank him a lot for his information. Technically because I've only been orally taking the root for 2 days, I've still got another two before I can see if any effects start to happen.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by astralpixels

Hey Timeless, from what I hear it won't help too much with lucidity. It's mostly used to increase vividness and dream recall, but according to some, it does also have good effects on making you lucid. It's too early for me to tell because I've still got another day or two before I should be noticing the major effects, so stay tuned.

Dreams from Last Night's Slumber: I slept around 12am and woke up at 9am, feeling very well rested, easily slept through the night.The dreams felt no more vivid than usual but I can tell my dream recall is improving because I can easily remember the 3-4 dreams I had last night, which is odd for me because I rarely remember more than 2.

Today's Preparation Method: I had prepared a drink the night before in a water bottle and fell asleep. I woke up at around 7am and drank the root mixed with water, and went back to sleep for another 2 hours. It tasted like regular water.
Today's Dose: About 1/3 of a teaspoon of root that I powdered and mixed into a cup of water. According to someone I spoke with, although its hard to determine without a scale, this was about 2mg give or take.

Notes: I spoke with someone who's had lots of experience with the root and used it for 3 months, which it is said is when the permanent effects take place. He said that he stopped taking it after the 3 months, but the dreams continued to be vivid for a while longer before dropping just a bit and hitting a plateau where they dropped no further. His dreams at this plateau were way more vivid then before he took the plant and he is still able to recall 4-5 dreams a night with ease. He said that even cannabis, which is said to reduce the effects of xhosa root, will only temporarily do so because soon after the dreams return to that permanent increase that the root leaves behind on you. He also helped reassure me that even if the powdered root mixed with water doesn't foam (as this failed to happen with him as well), to just drink the water anyway as the effects will still take place, so I thank him a lot for his information. Technically because I've only been orally taking the root for 2 days, I've still got another two before I can see if any effects start to happen.

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My best friend got that same effect from using DXM for a while.
Xhosa is probably safer... lol

I'm sure he had vivid dreams considering that stuff can make you hallucinate too, but the permanent effects from 3 months of cough syrup use and 3 months of xhosa root are completely different, I'm having trouble imagining how your friend had the "same effect". A quote from Erowid, "Many DXM-containing products (such as Coricidin Cough and Cold) also contain other active ingredients which can be dangerous or fatal in high doses." Definitely something I wouldn't mess with.

I meant "similar" :puppydogeyes:
His dreams are much more vivid than they used to be and his recall is much better
as well. But yeah, DXM is some dangerous shit.

That's pretty intense, I just prefer using plants because I'm a hippie, but to each his own I guess. :E

Are there any known side effects of the drug? It would be cool if they could make a suplament base of the chemicals in the root. :) I'm really interested in it but I don't know if I want to mess with it. I don't do drugs and never will for pleasure and stuff but this is pretty cool.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MadMonkey

Are there any known side effects of the drug? It would be cool if they could make a suplament base of the chemicals in the root. :) I'm really interested in it but I don't know if I want to mess with it. I don't do drugs and never will for pleasure and stuff but this is pretty cool.

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I agree.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MadMonkey

Are there any known side effects of the drug? It would be cool if they could make a suplament base of the chemicals in the root. :) I'm really interested in it but I don't know if I want to mess with it. I don't do drugs and never will for pleasure and stuff but this is pretty cool.

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I understand your concern, it is a pretty unknown plant. Personally I'd rather have something that's been grown out of the ground then in supplement form, just seems more natural.

The only side effects I've felt was a headache, though I can't attribute this to the plant, because no one else using it reported headaches, so it may have been any number of other things that I did during the day (and i've since then haven't had headaches). And the second thing was trouble sleeping, but I believe that is because I smoked it at night on the first day, which is not a common method of consuming the plant. The last effect would be its purgative effect, but that is only in very high doses, because it may irritate the stomach.

I think its a generally safe plant to use so long as you take it with caution and adhere to the recommended doses. (just like any plant, supplement, or drug)

Do you think it would be possible to overdose. Also would it be possible to take a nice big dose and start tripping whilst awake?

I haven't read a single report of tripping while being awake, though I think it may have little influence on hypnagogic imagery, if anything just making it a bit more vivid. I also haven't heard of any overdoses and I did a lot of research, but I'm sure its possible. The thing is, all you need is 1-3mg a day, and that's a fairly small amount, so ODing would probably require a lot of roots.

There's a plethora of other substances to trip out on whilst awake, I wouldn't bother trying with silene capensis.

hmm I have read that drinking the water itself can make you quite sick that is why they preferred to only take the foam until bloated. How did you find the water ?

I usualy don't see hypnogogic imagry so that might be interesting. :P

Quote:

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Warning: It is said that the effects of this plant can/will become permanent. Most people using it agree that after 3 months of taking this plant on a daily basis and under recommended dosage, the effects cannot be reversed, EVEN if you stop taking the root. You will continue to have anywhere up to 5 or more vivid dreams throughout the night, and enhanced dream recall. While all these things sound positive, this plant is connected to the Xhosa African tribe and brings the user into what is called the "White Paths", it is believed to be connected to spirits, and the plant is said to have a consciousness of it's own. If that's something you'd rather not permanently associate yourself with, then do not take this root. The only plant that is said to (momentarily) reverse its effects is cannabis, but after a few months the vivid dreams will return.

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Would you be able to direct me to where specifically you've heard these things? Since hearing about it here I've scoured the web about it, and have yet to come across any mention anywhere of a maintained effect after cease of use. In fact, I've yet to come across anyone who's said they've used it for more than a few weeks at a time at all...

Would be awesome if 'twere true though.

@Timeless: i found the drink to taste like regular water and it had no effects on me really. i believe it can make you feel a bit ill if you eat too soon after having had the drink. also i think i read someone mention eating meat doesn't go well with it (either it simply negates the effect of the plant or it may make you sick, i'm not sure). i'm vegetarian though, so i dont know what to say about that part.

@Lakona: perhaps my wording was a bit overstated, but I said "most people" because of the 2-3 people I read about, that used it for 3 months, they spoke of its permanency. And if I'm correct, the Xhosa tribe would give this root in a 3 month initiation to members of their tribe, which i'm assuming is why people cease to take it after 3 months, as it is no longer necessary.

The user Nobun mentions it twice in this thread, he seems to be very familiar with the root:
Silene capensis - The Corroboree

I browsed through most of these pages, but I believe someone here discusses the 3 month permanency as well :
https://www.dmt-nexus.com/forum/defa...osts&t=995&p=3


I didn't make this thread to encourage anyone to go out and use this root, because I know there isn't much information on it to begin with. I realize I may be taking a risk because the plant is mostly unknown (outside of the xhosa tribe), but I'm fine with that. This thread was meant to be a log of my experience in order to put some more data out there on it, and also to start discussion on it to see if other users were familiar with it. I strongly advise you guys to do your own research if you intend on taking this root.

Keep up the work. I'm interested in your research.