Thread: Split Marijuana Discussion

I'm agreeing with UM on this one. Legalizing pot would eliminate so many problems.

I'm adding to Chomsky's class-based argument for illegal cannabis.

Prohibition is extremely racist, moreso than it seems obvious. The New Jim Crow: How the War on Drugs Gave Birth to a Permanent American Undercaste gives us a better picture of exactly how racist the system is. I'm posting an editorial taken from NORML that summarizes it.

Spoiler for The New Jim Crow:--- NORML Comment:

I work this issue every day and am well aware of the racist nature of the War on (Certain American Citizens Using Non-Pharmaceutical, Non-Alcoholic, Tobacco-Free) Drugs. But even I wasn’t aware of the outrageous statistics comparing the Drug War to Jim Crow era. Michelle Alexander lays it all out in her new book, The New Jim Crow: How the War on Drugs Gave Birth to a Permanent American Undercaste:

There are more African Americans under correctional control today — in prison or jail, on probation or parole — than were enslaved in 1850, a decade before the Civil War began.
As of 2004, more African American men were disenfranchised (due to felon disenfranchisement laws) than in 1870, the year the Fifteenth Amendment was ratified, prohibiting laws that explicitly deny the right to vote on the basis of race.
A black child born today is less likely to be raised by both parents than a black child born during slavery. The recent disintegration of the African American family is due in large part to the mass imprisonment of black fathers.
If you take into account prisoners, a large majority of African American men in some urban areas have been labeled felons for life. (In the Chicago area, the figure is nearly 80%.) These men are part of a growing undercaste — not class, caste — permanently relegated, by law, to a second-class status. They can be denied the right to vote, automatically excluded from juries, and legally discriminated against in employment, housing, access to education, and public benefits, much as their grandparents and great-grandparents were during the Jim Crow era.
The uncomfortable truth, however, is that crime rates do not explain the sudden and dramatic mass incarceration of African Americans during the past 30 years. Crime rates have fluctuated over the last few decades — they are currently are at historical lows — but imprisonment rates have consistently soared. Quintupled, in fact. And the vast majority of that increase is due to the War on Drugs. Drug offenses alone account for about two-thirds of the increase in the federal inmate population, and more than half of the increase in the state prison population.

The drug war has been brutal — complete with SWAT teams, tanks, bazookas, grenade launchers, and sweeps of entire neighborhoods — but those who live in white communities have little clue to the devastation wrought. This war has been waged almost exclusively in poor communities of color, even though studies consistently show that people of all colors use and sell illegal drugs at remarkably similar rates. In fact, some studies indicate that white youth are significantly more likely to engage in illegal drug dealing than black youth. Any notion that drug use among African Americans is more severe or dangerous is belied by the data. White youth, for example, have about three times the number of drug-related visits to the emergency room as their African American counterparts.

That is not what you would guess, though, when entering our nation’s prisons and jails, overflowing as they are with black and brown drug offenders. In some states, African Americans comprise 80%-90% of all drug offenders sent to prison.

The only thing more shocking to me than the new Jim Crow of the drug war is how few African-Americans are involved in ending it.

The board of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML) is composed of 14 white men, 1 white woman, and 1 Latina (Full disclosure: this board is my employer)
Marijuana Policy Project (MPP) has no African-Americans or Latinos on their board as far as I’m aware (MPP does not publish this information on their website, as far as I can tell)
Drug Policy Alliance (DPA) boasts three African-American men on their board of directors
Americans for Safe Access (to medical marijuana, or ASA) has no African-Americans or Latinos on their board
Law Enforcement Against Prohibition (LEAP) has one African-American on their board

Medical Marijuana march in Madison, Wisconsin (I know Madison, Seattle, and Albuquerque aren't exactly Atlanta, Detroit, and Chicago, but there has to be SOME black people there, right?)
This sort of racial homogeneity is also found at the grassroots activist level as well. I coordinate NORML’s 95 active state, local, and college chapters and off the top of my head I can think of only one chapter not run by a white person (Oregon NORML’s Madeline Martinez, who, coincidentally, is that sole Latina on the National NORML Board).

When I speak at conferences and festivals to crowds ranging from 50 to 50,000, it is always a nearly unbroken sea of white faces looking back at me. When I participate in the marches and protests against the drug war, I rarely see black or Latino people carrying a sign.


My view from the stage before speaking at last year's Seattle Hempfest, the largest marijuana reform rally in the world.
The War on Drugs is primarily a War on Marijuana, which makes up 49.8% of all drug war arrests, 89% of those arrests for simple possession. In New York City, a black man is nine times more likely to be busted for pot than a white man and three times more likely to get a custodial sentence out of that arrest. Yet when we look at the cannabis community, the only place we find many African-American faces is in rap videos extolling the virtues of “the chronic”.

Where is the Martin Luther King Jr. of the movement to end the War on Drugs? Why is he or she not responding to the efforts to end the single greatest cause of racial inequality in this nation?

Is he or she dissuaded by the culture of the black church, which demonizes drugs and drug use to the point where those who support sensible drug policies are shamed into silence?


Drug Policy Alliance's Int'l Reform Conference in Albuquerque, 2009
Is he or she turned away by looking at the leadership of drug law reform and seeing no faces like theirs?

Is he or she already feeling like they wear a target for law enforcement on their back already based on skin color and don’t feel like exacerbating that by publicly standing for drug law reform?

Whatever it is, this white man who’s used cannabis for twenty years and never once had an interaction with police is urgently calling out to my black and Latino brothers and sisters to get involved with your own liberation!

Basically, statistics show that today's drug prohibition imprisons more African Americans than the so-called "Jim Crow" era, when racism was institutionalized in law.

Prohibition has also been considered a war against youth for the fact that almost three quarters of drug arrests are for those under age 30.

Spoiler for Why Students Hold The Key To Ending Marijuana Prohibition:

The following speech was given by NORML’s Deputy Director before nearly 500 attendees on Saturday, March 13, at the opening plenary of Students for Sensible Drug Policy’s 11th International Conference, at the Fort Mason Center in San Francisco. To read full coverage of the conference, please see DRCNet’s report here.

My name is Paul Armentano and I’m the Deputy Director of NORML, the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws, and I’m the co-author of the book Marijuana Is Safer: So Why Are We Driving People to Drink? Max, Amber, Stacia and the many good folks at SSDP invited me to come here today to talk to you about how and why students have a vital role to play in ending marijuana prohibition.

First let’s talk about the “why”: self-preservation. The federal government has declared war on you.

Since 1965 law enforcement in this country have arrested over 20 million people for marijuana offenses. But when you take a closer look at who is actually arrested you find that, for the most part, it isn’t the folks sitting on this panel; it’s all of you sitting out there – it’s young people.

In short – the so-called ‘war’ on marijuana is really a war on youth.

According to a 2005 study commissioned by the NORML Foundation, 74 percent of the 800,000 or so Americans busted for pot each year are under age 30, and one out of four are age 18 or younger. That’s nearly half a million young people at risk of losing their school loans, or being saddled with a lifelong criminal record at a time when they are just entering the workforce. We’re talking about an entire generation – and that’s you out there – that has been alienated to believe that the police and their civic leaders are instruments of their oppression rather than their protection.

And the sad fact is: you’re right!

The question is: What are you going to do about it?

If we’re going to finally end this 70+ year failed public policy known as marijuana prohibition, then we need students to play a lead role. Obviously those of you in this room have already taken a critical first step in leading this charge by joining SSDP and attending this conference. But there’s a lot more to be done and there’s a lot more that you can do.

I believe that it was Ghandi who demanded that those who are oppressed be a part of there own liberation, and marijuana prohibition is no different. I want you to look around you because it’s you all who will ultimately bring about an end to prohibition.

And here’s how you start, and it’s really, really simple suggestion. Start talking to others about the need to end marijuana prohibition. Start talking about how this policy disproportionately and adversely impacts youth. Start discussing about how this policy limits young people’s opportunities at economic and academic success, and has repercussions that adversely affect people for the rest of their lives.

Start talking about how the war on weed endangers young people’s health and safety because it enables teens to have easier access to pot than to legal, age-restricted intoxicants like alcohol and tobacco. Talk about how prohibition forces young people to interact and befriend pushers of other illegal, more dangerous drugs. Talk about how prohibition compels young people dismiss the educational messages they receive pertaining to the potential health risks posed by the use of ‘hard drugs’ and prescription pharmaceuticals because they say: “If they lied to me about pot, why wouldn’t they be lying to me about everything else too.”

Most importantly, talk about how criminal prohibition is far more likely to result in having all of you sitting in this room struggling to get over a lifelong criminal conviction than it is in any way going to discourage you or your friends from trying pot.

And when I say ‘talk about it,’ that’s exactly what I mean – TALK. But talk to those who know you – your family, your friends, your parents, your neighbors, your professors, your faculty advisers. These are the people who you have built in credibility with. These are the people who are most likely to share and act upon your concerns because they care about you. They care about what you think, and they actually care about what happens to you.

(You know it’s funny, so often I hear activists talk about how they want to spread the word by going out on some street-corner and handing out leaflets to strangers. Or they want to engage in debates with some paid prohibitionist, as if by providing he or she with the facts about marijuana will somehow change his or her position. Or they want to post messages on some anti-drug website. Big deal. Talking to strangers is easy; it’s talking to people you know that’s hard. But it’s talking to people you know that is ultimately going to make a difference.)

So after you’re done talking about the evils of the drug war with your friends, family, and faculty – and encouraging them to begin engaging in this conversation as well – then it’s time to move the discussion to those who can shape public opinion and policy: the editors at your school paper, the leaders in your student government, your city council, your mayor, you state elected officials. Talk to these folks, and keep talking to these folks. And if they won’t listen to you then become one of them. Join the school paper; run for student government; run for city council. If not you, then who?

Here’s something else I want you to do to help bring about an end to marijuana prohibition. There’s something I want you all to say when you are engaging in your outreach efforts, and that is this: NOT IN MY NAME.

You know, when those who support marijuana prohibition are forced to defend it, they do so by saying that it’s all about you: it’s all about protecting and providing for the best interest of young people. You know, sort of like “we have to destroy the village in order to to save it.”

It’s time for all of you in this room to stop being the scapegoats for the abuses and the excesses of drug war. It’s time to say: enough! We don’t want your criminal policies; we never asked for your criminal policies; and we’re tired of having our good names be used to support your failed drug war. The war on marijuana isn’t saving us; it’s harming us, and we demand that it comes to end before it destroys another generations the same way it has destroyed ours.

Okay, so that’s the easy part – here’s the hard part. If students – and I’m talking about you guys here, and I’m also talking about all of your friends and colleagues who aren’t here – really are going to be the game-changers in this battle, this fight that all of us sitting up here have been waging for far too long already, then we need for you guys to take a pledge:

Don’t let your activism be a phase in your life; make it a part of your life.

When I graduated college in 1994 there was no SSDP; there was no ASA. There barely was an MPP. There was the DPA – with one office a handful of employees. There was no LEAP, no SAFER; no frankly there was no professional movement. Since then the landscape has changed monumentally.

Today, there are now dozens of organizations working on drug policy reform, and with that, dozens of job opportunities for you to get involved and stay involved in marijuana policy after you graduate college. So I give you a challenge: You really want to end the drug war? Consider making drug policy your career choice. You can start right now by applying for an internship at NORML or a fellowship at SSDP. Many of this movement’s current leaders started out this way, Kris Krane, Mason Tvert, Tom Angel, Stacia Cosner, Micah Daigle, and many others. They did it, and you can too.

Finally, even if you don’t wish to pursue marijuana law reform as a career, I encourage you to stay active in the movement. Between the Internet, podcasts, list-servs, social networking sites like Facebook, you now have access to unparalleled quantities of drug-law reform information in real time. Just this past week NORML launched its own Iphone app.

In other words, it is now easier than ever to stay plugged in to your networks and continue to educate yourself and your friends about drug policy reform. Check out NORML’s daily podcast, the Audio Stash, for the latest breaking news, or check out NORML’s capwiz page to instantly learn about upcoming state and federal votes in legislation that affects us all. And use what you learn to continue to move this conversation forward.

The bottom line: all of you in this room have the power to change these laws, and today you have an unprecedented opportunity to do so. So get out there and do it!

Originally Posted by Majestic

not only that universal mind, but even smoking that amount won't kill you, because you will pass out way before then.

I was talking about the amount of marijuana it would take over the course of somebody's life. There are no reports of anybody ever dying from marijuana even that way. The amount of marijuana it would take to kill somebody in one sitting is so outrageous that dying that way physically cannot be done. It never has and never will. What baffles me so much about people who argue for the illegality of marijuana is that they overlook the fact that it is not lethal. I know it has certain problems like causing some people to be lazy and hindering short term memory even during sobriety for a while in people who do it all the time, but it does not kill people. That is a very important piece of information in this debate.

Alcohol is an absolute monster when it comes to human death, though. When you question marijuana illegality advocates on the difference, they make the point that alcohol can be done in moderation. I don't understand the relevance of that. Sean Hannity says it all the time when talking about drugs in general. He says stuff like, "There is a difference between getting wacked out and drinking a beer." It completely overlooks the fact that people by the hundreds of millions drink a lot more than a beer. It also overlooks the fact that some people smoke just one hit of marijuana every few months. The idea that alcohol should be legal while marijuana should be illegal is not logical from any angle or crafty wording.

Originally Posted by Loaf

Low doses of alcohol are fine. I'm sure low doses of marijuana at first would be okay, except for the fact you'd probably develop an addiction and start to use more than you should. I'm opposed to people getting extremely drunk - personally, I'd hate to not be in control of my actions.

Marijuana being illegal? I wouldn't know. But I can say that seeing people trying to justify its use is terribly annoying. If you really think that serious health problems (ones that are more instant and severe than those caused by drinking, and bad foods) are worth the risk just so you can be off your face, then your priorities are odd.

Stop treating marijuana like it's just another thing to get addicted to, because you clearly don't know what addiction is. There is MENTAL addiction, and PHYSICAL addiction. Video games are an example of mental addiction, and nicotene, cocaine, and alcohol are physically addicting drugs, some faster than others. Marijuana is a fine example of MENTAL addiction, because it is fun and people want to do it strictly because of that.

And 'be off your face' is the most ignorant generalization of being stoned I've ever heard. The only time I'm ever close to 'off my face' is when I'm drunk as hell.

Sony, you have to excuse loaf. He is only 13 years old and he doesn't know. He still buys into the propaganda. He believes the story where the guy blows off his head with a shotgun from being high off weed, or the story about the girl on LSD that put a baby in the oven and tried to cook it as food.

Originally Posted by Loaf

Its not about lack of freedom, its about breaking the chain now so future generations aren't exposed to harm. If you take away cigarettes now, nobody will care about it once all the past users have passed away. Why should I have to inhale second hand smoke just because some bozo can't kick his useless addiction. I for one won't stand and watch perfectly good human beings die, just so they can get a "buzz".

You can't compare eating fatty foods to smoking marijuana. Thats like comparing taking a bicycle ride to taking a train.

Sorry to butt in, but I wanted to. (Okay, so maybe I'm not THAT sorry.)
You know, making things illegal does invade someone's personal freedom of choice. If you take away ciggies, people will still smoke. Drugs & marijuana are illegal, yet here, in Mexico, the most violent war is the drug war. Why? Because it's illegal! It's not fair for someone else to decide whether you should do something or not, it simply isn't.

Fatty foods are even more toxic and dangerous than marijuana. At least marijuana is natural and free from chemicals.

Originally Posted by Alexander1656

Ok, but, Lucid dreaming is something that should be axssesable by everyone. It is not ment to be something assoated with drugs. Also, I really would nver break the law(Besudes downloading a few iligle music

Lucid dreaming isn't meant to be anything, its a function of life, and one of the most amazing ones I've come across.

I've also read in a few places that smoking pot and using psychedelic drugs increases a persons chances of discovering/having lucid dreams. This being because smoking pot opens up some kinds of neuro-somatic pathways and makes a person used to higher states of consciousness. I honestly don't understand the science behind it, but it makes sense at least insofar as smoking pot produces similar effects to meditation and breathing exercises. I'll try to clear this post up tomorrow if I have time, but it's late.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Lucid dreaming isn't meant to be anything, its a function of life, and one of the most amazing ones I've come across.

I've also read in a few places that smoking pot and using psychedelic drugs increases a persons chances of discovering/having lucid dreams. This being because smoking pot opens up some kinds of neuro-somatic pathways and makes a person used to higher states of consciousness. I honestly don't understand the science behind it, but it makes sense at least insofar as smoking pot produces similar effects to meditation and breathing exercises. I'll try to clear this post up tomorrow if I have time, but it's late.

Hell yeah man I completely agree with you and I know exactly what you're talking about. It totally does put you in a higher state of consciousness.

I think it is absolutely hilarious that the original poster left due to lack of argument. Face it, pot is acceptable now.

Originally Posted by Alexander1656

Read the heath risks again. You can get hurt. Also, alcohol isNOT addictive if you have a little bit of it. Some wine here and there, will not hurt you. Some whiskey everywhere will hurt you! As for pot, it hurts the people around you through second hand smoke. I have Asthma thanks to smokers! They are careless and not only causing them self harm but the people around them!

Alcohol can be addictive if you have a little bit. You are 12, stop arguing about stuff you have no knowledge about. You are OBVIOUSLY still under the influence of propaganda.

Oh.. and you can't get "second hand smoke" from inhaling used pot. You would only get high. And it's called a Contact High, not second hand smoke ahahaha...

Originally Posted by Motumz

I think it is absolutely hilarious that the original poster left due to lack of argument. Face it, pot is acceptable now.




Alcohol can be addictive if you have a little bit. You are 12, stop arguing about stuff you have no knowledge about. You are OBVIOUSLY still under the influence of propaganda.

Oh.. and you can't get "second hand smoke" from inhaling used pot. You would only get high. And it's called a Contact High, not second hand smoke ahahaha...

I know, right? It's so evident that some people have no idea what they're talking about and it's all too ironic.

Originally Posted by Sony86

I know, right? It's so evident that some people have no idea what they're talking about and it's all too ironic.

Exactly. It's just sad that these lost, and lied to people can still make a shitty difference. So, marijuana is still illegal.

But not for long..

Once again the elusive and very temporary nature for the argument supporting the current legal status of marijuana is revealed. I challenge any of the posters who have previously posted arguments against the use of cannabis and supporting its current illegality to return to this thread and make a comprehensive post of individual reasons why cannabis should be illegal and be open minded enough to read the responses.

Originally Posted by Motumz

Exactly. It's just sad that these lost, and lied to people can still make a shitty difference. So, marijuana is still illegal.

But not for long..

At this point I don't mind if it becomes legal or not because I'm a medical marijuana patient

But considering that if it were to be legalized for recreational use, then the hemp plant itself will be legal and that threatens too many industries to count - Alcohol, tobacco, paper, clothing, and oil industry (to name a few) would suffer. Hemp produces 2,900 different products (something like that) including hemp clothing that is better and more durable than cotton clothing, gasoline that is more efficient than traditional fossil fuel/corn oils, and it produces paper that is far better than paper made from wood.

Now you see why it's such a threat, too many fat-ass owned corporations would suffer in the event of legalization so I don't see it happening (at least wide scale) any time soon though I would love to see it happen eventually.

Originally Posted by imran_p

Once again the elusive and very temporary nature for the argument supporting the current legal status of marijuana is revealed. I challenge any of the posters who have previously posted arguments against the use of cannabis and supporting its current illegality to return to this thread and make a comprehensive post of individual reasons why cannabis should be illegal and be open minded enough to read the responses.

Impossible. Anyone stupid enough to make allegations against pot is automatically not intelligent/wise enough to support them. It's a very ironic thing.

Originally Posted by Sony86

At this point I don't mind if it becomes legal or not because I'm a medical marijuana patient

But considering that if it were to be legalized for recreational use, then the hemp plant itself will be legal and that threatens too many industries to count - Alcohol, tobacco, paper, clothing, and oil industry (to name a few) would suffer. Hemp produces 2,900 different products (something like that) including hemp clothing that is better and more durable than cotton clothing, gasoline that is more efficient than traditional fossil fuel/corn oils, and it produces paper that is far better than paper made from wood.

Now you see why it's such a threat, too many fat-ass owned corporations would suffer in the event of legalization so I don't see it happening (at least wide scale) any time soon though I would love to see it happen eventually.

Is extracting usable oil from hemp easier than getting it from the underground?

By easier I mean cheaper and more efficiently.

Originally Posted by Marvo

Is extracting usable oil from hemp easier than getting it from the underground?

By easier I mean cheaper and more efficiently.

I don't have facts to back it up, but I would think it would be alot cheaper. You grow weed, send it to a processing plant that extracts the oils. On the other hand, you use heavy machinery (drills, rigs, etc) extract the oil from underground, then process it. I'm sure an oil rig itself blows the expenses out of the water (puns are awesome, lol).
As for efficiency...I'm not entirely sure there.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

I don't have facts to back it up, but I would think it would be alot cheaper. You grow weed, send it to a processing plant that extracts the oils. On the other hand, you use heavy machinery (drills, rigs, etc) extract the oil from underground, then process it. I'm sure an oil rig itself blows the expenses out of the water (puns are awesome, lol).
As for efficiency...I'm not entirely sure there.

I'm positive that the production of hemp over oil would be more efficient, there's no way it wouldn't be, but I'm not sure if the fuel itself is more efficient than traditional fuels. I wonder if the production efficiency of hemp gasoline would outweigh the actual efficiency of fossil fuel.. That's a good question.

Originally Posted by Loaf

Low doses of alcohol are fine. I'm sure low doses of marijuana at first would be okay, except for the fact you'd probably develop an addiction and start to use more than you should. I'm opposed to people getting extremely drunk - personally, I'd hate to not be in control of my actions.

Marijuana being illegal? I wouldn't know. But I can say that seeing people trying to justify its use is terribly annoying. If you really think that serious health problems (ones that are more instant and severe than those caused by drinking, and bad foods) are worth the risk just so you can be off your face, then your priorities are odd.

Something I missed...
I don't know how others here feel about this; I can only speak for myself.
I do not ever smoke to be "off my face", if you smoke just to get fucked up then you are using it for the wrong reasons. And that's because it's good for so much more! With alchohol the most you're going to do is get hammered. Pot is a mind-opening substance, in many ways.

UM, back me up on this one.

Originally Posted by Supernova

Something I missed...
I don't know how others here feel about this; I can only speak for myself.
I do not ever smoke to be "off my face", if you smoke just to get fucked up then you are using it for the wrong reasons. And that's because it's good for so much more! With alchohol the most you're going to do is get hammered. Pot is a mind-opening substance, in many ways.

UM, back me up on this one.

Dude read my posts above I've backed you to holy hell and back

Originally Posted by Supernova

Something I missed...
I don't know how others here feel about this; I can only speak for myself.
I do not ever smoke to be "off my face", if you smoke just to get fucked up then you are using it for the wrong reasons. And that's because it's good for so much more! With alchohol the most you're going to do is get hammered. Pot is a mind-opening substance, in many ways.

UM, back me up on this one.

Eh, the amount of weed I smoke would leave most people unable to function. The reason I smoke is because I want to. I like the way it makes me feel and I am more comfortable high than not. I'm laid back anyway and it makes me even more so. I like weed's f***ed up feeling alot and I stay that way. I guess I smoke for the "wrong reasons", but f*** it, lol.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

Eh, the amount of weed I smoke would leave most people unable to function. The reason I smoke is because I want to. I like the way it makes me feel and I am more comfortable high than not. I'm laid back anyway and it makes me even more so. I like weed's f***ed up feeling alot and I stay that way. I guess I smoke for the "wrong reasons", but f*** it, lol.

Haha I feel you there, man. I started smoking it like that, but then I realized the effects were extremely beneficial for me physically and mentally. (Have stomach disorder (gastritis), weed cures %100), so that's why I have my medical license, and the stuff just makes me feel better mentally so I never stopped.

And hey, you're a stoner like me, and you can lucid dream just fine! I wish I had that type of recall.

Ok, I am thinking more of the type of person who will get drunk then smoke some pot just to be "fucked up", and never see past that. Getting high just to get high is fine, I do that often myself, but it does more than just make you feel different, unlike alchohol, that was my point. Things like enhancing creativity or allowing more deep/philosophical thoughts to develop (my personal favorite of it's effects)

Just a misunderstanding. That post was a bit rushed.

Originally Posted by Supernova

Ok, I am thinking more of the type of person who will get drunk then smoke some pot just to be "fucked up", and never see past that. Getting high just to get high is fine, I do that often myself, but it does more than just make you feel different, unlike alchohol, that was my point. Things like enhancing creativity or allowing more deep/philosophical thoughts to develop (my personal favorite of it's effects)

Just a misunderstanding. That post was a bit rushed.

Very true. The creativity and philosophical thought are definately awesome effects. I do my best thinking when I'm high. I will literally smoke and just think for hours at a time (when I'm alone). I also always smoke right before going to bed because it makes my lucid dreams creative and downright crazy (which I love). So many random/crazy things are going on in my dreams (mostly in the background) all the time that I couldn't possibly remember all of it. I do pretty well with recall though (took me alot of practice to get to where I am ). Another cool thing about being a stoner (well kind of cool I guess )...you can create a smoking device out of anything, literally .

Not to mention it is a automatic hangover cure, stress cure, settles the nerves, erases embaressment entirely (I haven't felt embaressed in years...I'm just like "f*** it...what can ya do", lol.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

Very true. The creativity and philosophical thought are definately awesome effects. I do my best thinking when I'm high. I will literally smoke and just think for hours at a time (when I'm alone). I also always smoke right before going to bed because it makes my lucid dreams creative and downright crazy (which I love). So many random/crazy things are going on in my dreams (mostly in the background) all the time that I couldn't possibly remember all of it. I do pretty well with recall though (took me alot of practice to get to where I am ). Another cool thing about being a stoner (well kind of cool I guess )...you can create a smoking device out of anything, literally .

Not to mention it is a automatic hangover cure, stress cure, settles the nerves, erases embaressment entirely (I haven't felt embaressed in years...I'm just like "f*** it...what can ya do", lol.

Yea, I love getting high with someone else who likes to think deeply about things like I do, and just talking about stuff...did that with my cousin the other day while driving around, we both had some pretty interesting things to say.

I remember at one point, I saw one of those crosswalk markers that they put in the middle of the street, but it still has the walking stick guy symbol on it, and the most random thought came into my mind...I asked my cousin what he would do if the stick guy just started moving around on the sign

I also love listening to a song and just really analyzing it, various aspects of the song, the meaning, etc. Writing music is great too.

[/ramble]But yea it also usually gives me some pretty crazy dreams, really strange stuff going on, often I find also that it's the kind of dream that would be difficult to decribe the experience to someone once awake.