The link above was a nice 60 minute documentary I thought I'd share which stresses the importance of our modern culture to reenchant our reality and our innately spiritual nature and connection to all that is.
A nature which our modern cultural standard perspective of the perceptually detached objective observational model of the Cartestian Newtonian Materialist has essentially disenchanted the reality around them by assuming and observing themselves as detached and divided from it.
When in actuality, science should be celebrating and merging itself with spirituality since it has found that at the most basic level the essence of the building blocks of the material world is just quantum probabilistic foam which reacts according to your conscious expectations and observations of it. Concluding that Matter and Energy are, interdependant and interchangable concepts which ultimately depend on the conscious observation of which of the two you expect it to be.
Many of our seeming modern conveniences have become these archetypal symbols or patterns of our disenchantment from nature and reality.
In the standard model of reality, the average person moves from one over-simplified and under-glorified reality to another. Losing nature's fluidity while moving from box-like room, to box-like room, leaving the room only to get into their box-like vehicles to traverse linear lanes and wait in queues, only to return to their box-like room to stare at a box to help them relax.
Keeping their interaction with their actual environment to a minimum.
As food prices rise and our currencies crumble, we still conveniently have food arrive at our corner store without having to give so much as a conscious question of where, when, or how it's arrived there. It's availabilty becomes subconsciously misperceived as always being there, and since the same exotic foods like bananas, meat, or fish can be seen each day without an effort or thought as to how it was obtained or cultivated we grow distant and disconnected from the hand that feeds us-- Earth, and in the end our very spiritual essence.
It's that subconscious disconnect that allows us to not take note or be thankful for each meal, and not ever have to consciously toil over one of the most essential and basic needs-- hunger, which in turn creates a culture emotionally despondent and distant from their primal roots of spirit and essence of their being.
And so, our current cultural model's spiritual disconnect manifests itself physically with the biosphere reaching a critical breaking point with 25% of all species expected to go extinct in the next 30 years, and all our oceans having already been overfished and depleted of 90% of the fish within the past 40-50 years.
The thing that could solve many of the problems we are in is reaching inward for a broader perspective to help bring new solutions to the table.
Currently, we have drug stores on nearly every corner yet as a culture we demonize other perceptual and mind-expanding drugs which are essentially as old as humanity itself.
Why do we as a culture fear this mind expansion? This awakening of the divine within?
Why has this western model of reality continually created and pushed for disconnect from nature and interaction with our environment? Considering this connection or interaction is necessary for our survival as a planet and species, and necessary for us to have any of our observations, however deluded or detached we as a culture prefer them to be.
If you don't decide to make the time to watch the documentary at the very least please watch the 5 minute trailer and this 10 minute clip below which is along similar lines. Peace.
01-31-2009, 01:58 PM
Original Poster
Good find! I'd just like to highlight some points made
Self-realization comes before a merging of consciousness. Each person must work on themselves before they can hope to unite with others and transform the world. That's why self-examination is so important for every human being. Aldous Huxley once said something suggesting that people who search for evil in others will often manifest it themselves, and that usually people who search to improve themselves do much better at improving the world around them.
Psychedelic drugs do not enlighten someone all by themselves. They may give you a taste of this communion with the divine that is possible but as soon as one returns to our materialized culture they fall back into their old habits. That's why it's important to work in solitude and put oneself in nature on a regular basis in order to retain and share this state of mind. Hippies during the 60s disconnected themselves from the main community in order to enjoy a more mystical worldview without interruption, but this only promotes further disconnect between science and spirituality, between the subjective and objective experience. As hard as it is to relate to people who are proudly locked within the main, narrow worldview, we can't win by getting the "dominators on the run," we can only win by sharing our worldviews together and coming to an eventual shared mindset.
But there is something funny about how people with purely objective worldviews today are very anti-church, when their refusal to acknowledge the value of the subjective experience is a bargain made with the church. Science couldn't take the reigns of mankind altogether, so secularists had to separate life, Science would take place purely as the exploration of an objective universe. The scientific method is all about escaping human bias to find truth. They allowed religion to continue to have control of subjective life, of the other side of duality. Then, instead of re-exploring and trying to merge this other aspect of existence, they simply decried it doesn't exist at all. Instead of reconnecting the two sides of duality, they denied one side altogether. When people found psychedelics and reconnected with this other aspect of life, they became outcasts.
This video also mentions how ancient societies shared their dreams, not just for fun, but as an integral part to preparing themselves for the day ahead. They believed each other's dreams held key insights for their experiences as a group.
So I challenge others willing to watch this film, who claim there is some objective universe ruled purely by causation. Please explain what value the subjective experience has, or does not have, in our society.
01-31-2009, 02:33 PM
dajo
I enjoyed reading your post and share your view entirely.
Entheogens are what reconnects us to nature - it might just
be the eye-opener mankind needs to stop themselves from
self-destruction.
I'd like to recommend a couple of podcasts on that matter.
Very many interesting talks on the psychedelic realms, many also by
McKenner, Leary or Alex Grey. The Podcast already has 170 episodes, most of them longer than an hour -
so it has a very large portion of information covered and never fails to inspire thoughts.
A very friendly Irishman talking about various subjects. It is still a very new Podcasts with 9 episodes,
but already with an Interview and lecture of Rupert Sheldrake (evolutionary scientist). Easy and comfortable to listen to!
He also already interviewed the makers of Zeitgeist:Addendum (world without money) and did a 'critical' episode
on Richard Dawkins. As well as episodes on Peyote, Salvia and just random thoughts on the matter if psychedelics.
01-31-2009, 05:57 PM
DeathCell
These symptoms suggested that our evolution, i
suppose, from the animal kingdom
Into the human kingdom
itself was catalyzed, or triggered by our encounter with
These hallucinogenics, and
Yes,
we are an ape with a symbiotic relationship to a mushroom, and
that has
Given us self reflection, language, religion and
all the spectrum of effects
That flow from
these things.
And one can
only wonder how these hallucinogens might effect our future
Evolution as well...
They
have brought us to this point, and as we make our relationship
to them
Conscious, we may be able to take control of our
future evolutionary path.
02-15-2009, 12:02 PM
dajo
Any of you know Terrence McKenna?
He's good in blowing ones mind.
^That picture just broke my mind a little. In the best way possible.
I wish so badly that I didn't have dialup so I could watch this video.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclic13
...we grow distant and disconnected from the hand that feeds us...which in turn creates a culture emotionally despondent and distant from their primal roots of spirit and essence of their being.
Such truth...
Humans just take and take, without any thought to how this could effect the things that keep us alive...and therefore our own existence simultaenously. This is similar to the way humans are willing to injest just about anything, without a single thought to the consequences it would cause to their bodies.
The Earth and the body--in fact life itself--are temples; temples we are infinitely and miraculously lucky to have been blessed with. And the world is all-too-willing to desecrate and take for granted; intentionally or otherwise.
Perfect examples = embalming, abortion (regardless of your stance on it), drilling/mining/otherwise raping of precious minerals and resources, pollution, deforestation, overpopulation, hazardous waste, urbanization...the list goes on.
What is to be done?
How does one cross the rift caused by disenchantment/disillusion?
:?:
02-17-2009, 03:56 PM
DeathCell
Quote:
Originally Posted by dajo
:lol:
haha, I didn't even realize.
:bowdown: :bowdown:
Have you ever listened to Mudvayne?
Their old CD L.D. 50
Throughout the CD their are clips of Terrance and his brother speaking...
Quote:
Humans just take and take, without any thought to how this could effect the things that keep us alive...and therefore our own existence simultaenously. This is similar to the way humans are willing to injest just about anything, without a single thought to the consequences it would cause to their bodies.
To quote System Of A Down..
"Life is a waterfall,
We're one in the river,
And one again after the fall.
Swimming through the void
We hear the word,
We lost ourselves,
But we find it all?
Cause we are the ones that want to play,
Always want to go,
But you never want to stay,
And we are the ones that want to chose,
Always want to play,
But you never want to lose.
Aerials, in the sky,
When you lose small mind,
You free your life.
Life is a waterfall,
We drink from the river,
Then we turn around and put up our walls.
"
03-06-2009, 04:27 AM
Cyclic13
Quote:
Originally Posted by acatalephobic
What is to be done?
How does one cross the rift caused by disenchantment/disillusion?
:?:
One way to cross the rift is to realize the rift or division-based way of looking at reality is a false belief system. From there, one simply shifts the way in which they perceive this eternal moment of which they are interconnected and interdependent parts of the same whole-- holons.
How can one ever be separate from this moment they co-exist and co-create?
No one can tangibly distinguish between "You" or "I" apart from the ideas and assumptions they use to separate one another.
If you are one who believes in causality, then you undeniably believe "we" are both of the same source.
If you believe in an acausal universe like I do, then much like a hologram this reality exists inseparably from anything else, and only seems to exist as separate but in actuality exists more as a projection, tulpa, or thought-form from your "mind".
Even the terms; "mind", "You", or "I", exist simply as a projection from the same sorcerer who projects all sources swirling around you at each given moment.
you must be a fan of sacred geometry, know of any good reads?
03-07-2009, 11:21 PM
WakataDreamer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclic13
"Awake" to it...
No
03-24-2009, 02:01 AM
Cyclic13
03-24-2009, 05:27 AM
StonedApe
This movie looks great, I wish I had time to watch it right now.
03-27-2009, 01:37 AM
SpecialInterests
It's interesting that hallucinogens probably played a vital role in the development of religion, and in today's society I think the bias against and demonization of drugs stems from religion. I honestly think if it weren't for religion our society would probably embrace mind-altering substances, especially psychadelics, and use them for their own benefits. Is anyone else on the same page?
03-27-2009, 06:14 PM
DeathCell
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpecialInterests
It's interesting that hallucinogens probably played a vital role in the development of religion, and in today's society I think the bias against and demonization of drugs stems from religion. I honestly think if it weren't for religion our society would probably embrace mind-altering substances, especially psychadelics, and use them for their own benefits. Is anyone else on the same page?
Totally with you, but please replace religion with Christianity on that second mentioning of religion.
Because had the religions of Greecian times(please see Dithyramb), other native american tribes, etc survived on to be our main religion would probably still embrace mind expanding drugs as they did before their demise as a culture.
01-16-2010, 03:10 PM
Lseadragon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnis Dei
The scientific method is all about escaping human bias to find truth. They allowed religion to continue to have control of subjective life, of the other side of duality. Then, instead of re-exploring and trying to merge this other aspect of existence, they simply decried it doesn't exist at all. Instead of reconnecting the two sides of duality, they denied one side altogether.
This is something I have thought about before; and I feel it is part of the reason that spiritual matters or psychedelic experiences are outcast of the mainstream.
You have the two main streams
of Science
and Religion.
Religion will not take these matters because they encroach on their own subjectivity and individual meaning they impart to their followers, and take away their followers from the true path. This is obviously fallacious on my part as that does not apply in many situations but I feel it is the heart of the idea.
Science, on the other hand, will not take these things into the fold because of their gross subjectivity. If something changes for every person how could it be cataloged? You cannot research it except for yourself; and while that is useful for the human race it does not enrich it how many people originally envision, sharing the results in an objective manner.
So we come to the flaw.
Many things come into this subjectivity. Take sexuality as an example.
Religion rejects the subjectivity of sexuality that is not its own.
Science ignores the subjectivity of it towards the objective causes or issues.
(A quick digression: By Religions I do not always mean the spiritual. I define it here as holding one subjective experience over another. This may be thinking the o: smiley is better than the :o, or preferring vinyl over CDs. Perhaps there is a better word but bear with me.)
You thus have to make your own third path. The third path of the subjective spirit will then be rejected by both camps; you cannot share your subjectivity to the established Religions, or share any objectivity to the Sciences.
You are alone. And this is what makes finding yourself so hard.
Humans like to fit in with the Religions. Being alone and opposed to everything is unpleasant; constant pressures telling you that you are wrong, or at least inaccurate. That you are actually like this. This is were solitude helps
Sciences are to escape these pressures for certain things, like deciding which car to buy or what is the best medicine (on a low level example) but they cannot help you in the subjective realm. Obsessively wanting to grow wings is hard to define objectively; it would not be practical in many senses, and yet it feels right.
So where was I going with this? I'm not sure. I may edit in a conclusion.
01-16-2010, 04:09 PM
Kuhnada29
Quote:
It's that subconscious disconnect that allows us to not take note or be thankful for each meal, and not ever have to consciously toil over one of the most essential and basic needs-- hunger, which in turn creates a culture emotionally despondent and distant from their primal roots of spirit and essence of their being.
your right..we're not connected with our subconscious like we should.
I've been trying to reestablish that link from conscious mind to subconscious mind in waking life....."communicating directly with the subconscious during waking life" but it is difficult. We are so far apart. Everyone is.
I had a communication with the subconscious ONE time....a channeling from a "oversoul" or "higher self" if you like..and that was when I awoke from sleeping prematurely. It was brief, but it was also something i definitely needed to hear.
I don't know why it's so difficult to establish that link in waking life. They say you just have to listen, but maybe the logical/conscious mind is just rambling too much. Meditation does seem to help though.
There is definitely something more..if anyone here has ever meditated or even WILDed...you know that beneath conscious thoughts, is another layer. The subconscious thoughts. For me, they are really chaotic.
If there is going to be any evolution for the human race it will be that. Complete reconnection with the subconscious. Left brain and right brain fully united.
01-16-2010, 07:00 PM
MementoMori
I applaud everyone of you, yes even you Wakata Dreamer for just coming in here. Very nicely put HaRd_WiReD, i believe this too, but only if enough people start looking away from their cellphones, tv shows, societal peer pressures, and money as the only meaningful substance to life. Otherwise we're a doomed race. Meditation is a top priority in reconnecting with the subconscious mind. You must first quite it your conscious before you can hear that which lies beneath.
For a race that has two eyes when one is enough, we are very blind.
01-17-2010, 01:30 AM
CanceledCzech
Quote:
Originally Posted by MementoMori
For a race that has two eyes when one is enough, we are very blind.
I love it.
And this thread is amazing. I do not currently have anything to give back. I agree with all of it, and I have gained a lot from it.
01-17-2010, 04:24 AM
katielovestrees
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanceledCzech
I love it.
And this thread is amazing. I do not currently have anything to give back. I agree with all of it, and I have gained a lot from it.
Seconded. I'm about halfway through the film and I only wish that I could show this to the world.
01-17-2010, 06:14 AM
CanceledCzech
Quote:
Originally Posted by katielovestrees
Seconded. I'm about halfway through the film and I only wish that I could show this to the world.
lol I used to think like this too. Then I realized that most people are in a deep sleep and cannot be awaken unless they want to be. Meaning: half the world would just scoff this off as bullshit.
01-17-2010, 06:59 AM
MementoMori
yeah, what CC said, i would go to Every One's home and show them this if i knew it would open their eyes, but most people are blind to the points made in the OP, meaning even if you show them they wont see what you see, they'll see the "devils" and the "immoral" in the video and then blast you with stereotypes and criticism and hatred.
But i agree katie, i would love to be able to show this to everyone so that at least i hit the 2/20 people actually "awake" with it.
01-17-2010, 07:49 PM
katielovestrees
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanceledCzech
lol I used to think like this too. Then I realized that most people are in a deep sleep and cannot be awaken unless they want to be. Meaning: half the world would just scoff this off as bullshit.
Yeah, unfortunately most people are too fucking disenchanted (to use a word from the film) to actually give a shit.
I was talking to my friend last night and she asked what I was watching so I told her. Her response? "even i have to say that sounds gay lol" and "omg how u watching this its soooo fucking boring lmao."
