Homosexuality (Yes, Again)

[ExoByte]

But this time, its interesting. An article from Dec. 10th 2007. I can see this quickly becoming a part of R&S with the question: "Homosexuality: Choice or Not?" pretty much with a now definite answer. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...1210094541.htm In Fruit Flies, Homosexuality Is Biological But Not Hard-wired, Study Shows ScienceDaily (Dec. 10, 2007) — While the biological basis for homosexuality remains a mystery, a team of neurobiologists reports they may have closed in on an answer -- by a nose. The team led by University of Illinois at Chicago researcher David Featherstone has discovered that sexual orientation in fruit flies is controlled by a previously unknown regulator of synapse strength. Armed with this knowledge, the researchers found they were able to use either genetic manipulation or drugs to turn the flies' homosexual behavior on and off within hours. Featherstone, associate professor of biological sciences at UIC, and his coworkers discovered a gene in fruit flies they called "genderblind," or GB. A mutation in GB turns flies bisexual. Featherstone found the gene interesting initially because it has the unusual ability to transport the neurotransmitter glutamate out of glial cells -- cells that support and nourish nerve cells but do not fire like neurons do. Previous work from his laboratory showed that changing the amount of glutamate outside cells can change the strength of nerve cell junctions, or synapses, which play a key role in human and animal behavior. But the GB gene became even more interesting when post-doctoral researcher Yael Grosjean noticed that all the GB mutant male flies were courting other males. "It was very dramatic," said Featherstone. "The GB mutant males treated other males exactly the same way normal male flies would treat a female. They even attempted copulation." Other genes that alter sexual orientation have been described, but most just control whether the brain develops as genetically male or female. It's still unknown why a male brain chooses to do male things and a female brain does female things. The discovery of GB provided an opportunity to understand why males choose to mate with females. "Based on our previous work, we reasoned that GB mutants might show homosexual behavior because their glutamatergic synapses were altered in some way," said Featherstone. Specifically, the GB mutant synapses might be stronger. "Homosexual courtship might be sort of an 'overreaction' to sexual stimuli," he explained. To test this, he and his colleagues genetically altered synapse strength independent of GB, and also fed the flies drugs that can alter synapse strength. As predicted, they were able to turn fly homosexuality on and off -- and within hours. "It was amazing. I never thought we'd be able to do that sort of thing, because sexual orientation is supposed to be hard-wired," he said. "This fundamentally changes how we think about this behavior." Featherstone and his colleagues reasoned that adult fly brains have dual-track sensory circuits, one that triggers heterosexual behavior, the other homosexual. When GB suppresses glutamatergic synapses, the homosexual circuit is blocked. Further work showed precisely how this happens -- without GB to suppress synapse strength, the flies no longer interpreted smells the same way. "Pheromones are powerful sexual stimuli," Featherstone said. "As it turns out, the GB mutant flies were perceiving pheromones differently. Specifically, the GB mutant males were no longer recognizing male pheromones as a repulsive stimulus." Featherstone says it may someday be possible to domesticate insects such as fruit flies and manipulate their sense of smell to turn them into useful pollinators rather than costly pests. The research appeared on line December 10 in Nature Neuroscience, and is scheduled for print in the January issue. Grosjean, now with the Center of Integrative Genomics in Lausanne, Switzerland, is the paper's first author. Along with Featherstone, authors include Hrvoje Augustin of UIC and Micheline Grillet and Jean-Francois Ferveur of the Université de Bourgogne in Dijon, France.

[Spartiate]

The thing that bothers me about homosexuality being a genetic anomaly is that typical gene mutations are a very rare occurence, whereas a relatively huge percentage of people are homosexual. Plus, I don't think there's any evidence of homosexuality being hereditary?

[thegnome54]

The problem is that they're fruit flies, and not humans. There are animals more similar to us than fruit flies that can switch gender on a whim. It's kind of a stretch to try to imply any conclusions about human sexuality based on tiny-little-bug research. They only have four chromosomes, don't they?

[ExoByte]

However, the point is its a more direct look at a natural occurrence. While they may be able to change gender and there are other species that have been known to change gender, homosexuality in other animals and creatures is a known and witnessed fact. Its not only limited to humans. While they're only fruit flies, its scratching the surface of a subject that has been subject to intense debate, and shedding light that there is a strong possibility of homosexuality being biologically related in other species and other creatures on this planet, including humans.

[dragonoverlord]

I think its going to be hard to duplicate these results in humans were you just block homosexaul circut or whatever. Flies are much simpler then humans and pose unique differences.

[Universal Mind]

I think those fruit flies made a choice to be a bunch of damn queers. It's an abomination.

[Moonbeam]

Who cares if it's a choice or not? I really don't see why that matters. It's a freedom issue. All speech is a matter of choice, yet we have freedom of speech. It is interesting to think about the biological aspects of things like that. I just get sick of people thinking that whether or not it is a choice or not means anything as far as people's rights are concerned.

[ninja9578]

Hey, we got UM to discuss homosexuality, maybe I can get a straight answer. How does homosexuality threaten the american family?

[tkdyo]

lol, you do realize that he was answering sarcastically and probably will not post a serious position in this thread, right?

[ChrissyMaria]

The problem is that they're fruit flies, and not humans. There are animals more similar to us than fruit flies that can switch gender on a whim. It's kind of a stretch to try to imply any conclusions about human sexuality based on tiny-little-bug research. They only have four chromosomes, don't they? thank you for that, thats like comparing ameoba's to dolphins OMG AMEOBAS CHANGE SEX SO DOLPHINS DO TOO! (exaggerating) but yea, some miniscule little fly being treated with drugs isn't gonna knock my socks off and tell me that my orientation was a choice or a chemical reaction to pheromones or something, theres GOT TO BE MORE to it. And no, homosexuals and bisexuals don't pose any threat to the american family in fact, the average american family is a threat to themselves by thinking in such terms, you see that youtube video someone posted saying homosexuals are a GREATER DANGER THEN TERRORISTS........ whoever posted that video IS A TERRORIST, spreading TERROR by scaring people away from people like me or whoever else isnt straight.

[ninja9578]

I assumed that this: I think those fruit flies made a choice to be a bunch of damn queers. It's an abomination. was sarcastic. But he's on the extreme right and they're the ones that keep telling me that but can't give a reason. I want one.

[Replicon]

While I'm interested in the research, I worry that the Vatican is going to use it next time it makes up new cardinal sins that god had made up long ago, but were only revealed last week.

[ChrissyMaria]

While I'm interested in the research, I worry that the Vatican is going to use it next time it makes up new cardinal sins that god had made up long ago, but were only revealed last week. huh? I bet there are homosexuals IN the vatican hiding it. we need to all come out, international come out day lol, then the world will finnaly STFU about homosexuality, im SOOOOOOOOO annoyed over the whole 'debate' wether is moral or immoral, ITS MORAL DAMMIT sorry but these subjects get me angry cause of the ignorance and stupidity of society STILL to this damned day. Does it really matter who i fall in love with? to me nope, male or female i LOVE human beings for who they are not what they are. although i still don't believe that its a choice i KNOW there has to be something else to it these are my theories: Genes Development/Puberty Hormonal imbalance Chemical imbalance In my case, i haven't got a clue what made me Bisexual but, i dont care, i love it! I mean i would want to know what made me this way but im happy with it and one day we will know but for now, might as well just live and be happy

[Universal Mind]

How does homosexuality threaten the american family? I was about to rag you big time about taking me seriously, but then you recanted after tkdyo pointed out the absurdity of your comment. I am not on the extreme right. I am conservative on economics and foreign policy. On pretty much everything else, I am about as liberal as it gets. If you think I don't give straight answers, you are delusional. Homosexuality does not threaten the American family. I am all for having legal same sex marriages in every state and in every country. I am not against homosexuality. Plus, I think lesbian porn rocks.

[Mes Tarrant]

Who cares if it's a choice or not? I really don't see why that matters. It's a freedom issue. All speech is a matter of choice, yet we have freedom of speech. It is interesting to think about the biological aspects of things like that. I just get sick of people thinking that whether or not it is a choice or not means anything as far as people's rights are concerned. Christ. I totally agree with this. This reminds me of something a professor of mine pointed out in regard to the issue of what kinds of differences there are in size of male vs female brains and whether or not it has anything to do with intelligence (it of course doesn't), and she pointed out that although that is interesting on some level, it's painfully clear that any sort of sex differences are social. It's the social aspects that we need to be focusing on, and not trying to find something that might not even exist. OMG AMEOBAS CHANGE SEX SO DOLPHINS DO TOO! (exaggerating)

[ninja9578]

I was about to rag you big time about taking me seriously, but then you recanted after tkdyo pointed out the absurdity of your comment. I am not on the extreme right. I am conservative on economics and foreign policy. On pretty much everything else, I am about as liberal as it gets. If you think I don't give straight answers, you are delusional. Homosexuality does not threaten the American family. I am all for having legal same sex marriages in every state and in every country. I am not against homosexuality. Plus, I think lesbian porn rocks. Sounds good. Where are the other conservatives that have told me that gay marriage was bad, but danced around the why? Now, when you say conservative economically... I'm not sure what that means. The "conservatives" are for liberal spending and the "liberals" are for conservative spending. Those are where the names of the sides came from too Ah the ways time change.

[Universal Mind]

Sounds good. Where are the other conservatives that have told me that gay marriage was bad, but danced around the why? In church. Now, when you say conservative economically... I'm not sure what that means. The "conservatives" are for liberal spending and the "liberals" are for conservative spending. Those are where the names of the sides came from too Ah the ways time change. Yeah, don't judge true economic conservatives based on what Republicans do.

[ninja9578]

Ah church So your liberal economically because you believe in conservative economy

[Replicon]

huh? If there is ANY scientific evidence, be it fruitflies or wallflowers, that it's a choice, they'll use it as ammunition. I mean, it wouldn't change anything, other than maybe increase the annoyance level. Personally, I think "hard-wired vs. nurture" and "moral vs. immoral" have absolutely NOTHING to do with each other. I bet there are homosexuals IN the vatican hiding it. we need to all come out, international come out day lol, then the world will finnaly STFU about homosexuality, im SOOOOOOOOO annoyed over the whole Totally agree. International come out day is actually a really really great idea!

[Universal Mind]

So your liberal economically because you believe in conservative economy If by "your" you mean "one is", I guess things can be looked at that way, with "conservative" meaning "conservative on most issues". The people who call themselves full blown conservatives these days are so much more liberal than they ever imagine. Conservatives call me a liberal for being against the war on drugs, and they don't realize that supporting a war on drugs is what once would have been considered extremely liberal. Conservatives used to want the government out of the people's hair. It seems like we are getting close to a point where the terms "liberal" and "conservative" might completely lose their meanings since everything is getting so confused.

[ChrissyMaria]

Totally agree. International come out day is actually a really really great idea! Lets name a day, April 15th? on tax day

[Replicon]

As a homeowner, I kinda like tax day But there's no reason not to overlap! Let's put it on easter Sunday!

[ChrissyMaria]

As a homeowner, I kinda like tax day But there's no reason not to overlap! Let's put it on easter Sunday! lol a religious holiday + gays and bi's coming out = bad I know i wouldnt come out on a holiday

[Scatterbrain]

If a way to make such quick changes of sexual orientation in humans was discovered, it would just prove the religious opposition of homosexuality wrong. I mean, if you have to take drugs or something to change your orientation, then certainly god desired/didn't care that some people were gay, otherwise every homo living in previous eras was fated to go hell from the moment of birth. I for one would start slipping in the drug into other men's drinks, less competition that way.

[ChrissyMaria]

I for one would start slipping in the drug into other men's drinks, less competition that way. and i'll hug you for converting them