Thread: Centroid's Workbook

Originally Posted by fogelbise

Very nice Centroid!! You are finding your own path which is something all consistent lucid dreamers seem to have in common! Good job!!

It would've a much longer time if you guys weren't here! Thanks so much for all the help!

Thank you for the kind words I somehow missed that last response but it seems like a good time to check in with you and see how you are doing Centroid.

LD this morning! I recall realizing it was a dream, because everything had started fading, but a few seconds later I woke up, no FA though. So that's 3!!!

Progress update:
-incubating dream goals before bed and at every awakening
-I notice I'm paying less attention to day work, doing less 'presence checks' as I like to call them. Writing this down will motivate me to do more I hope.
-dream recall going good, 1-2 full dreams every night

I am doing an internship at a place really into VR, so I had lots of time to try out the HTC Vive and the Hololens. Both completely blew me away, and the immersion they were able to provide was actually quite scary. I've been thinking about the implications on lucid dreaming, positive and negative.

Originally Posted by Centroid

LD this morning! I recall realizing it was a dream, because everything had started fading, but a few seconds later I woke up, no FA though. So that's 3!!!

Awesome! Congratulations on #3, You should be proud!!

If you can lock in this next idea early in your lucid dreaming practice, you will be able to advance faster than I was able to. I discuss it here: http://www.dreamviews.com/general-lu...-read-imo.html The part I am referring to basically comes down to what you should aim to expect when dreams are fading. One method that works for people is spinning which can sometimes revive the scene or bring up a new one. If you decide to try this or any other stabilization method, just know that even if the scene completely fades, your lucid dream doesn't have to end. It may not work every time but, you will find that many times you can either spin and keep going or spend some time in the void - typically black or gray emptiness where you can remind yourself that you are still dreaming, rub your hands, keep moving in inventive ways and either wait for a scene to form or start seeding a scene of your choice by imagining ocean sounds and/or visuals in order to create an ocean scene as just one example.

Progress update:
-incubating dream goals before bed and at every awakening
-I notice I'm paying less attention to day work, doing less 'presence checks' as I like to call them. Writing this down will motivate me to do more I hope.
-dream recall going good, 1-2 full dreams every night

Good! I find the night work carries the most weight for triggering lucidity, but the day work is very important for increasing my level of lucidity.

I am doing an internship at a place really into VR, so I had lots of time to try out the HTC Vive and the Hololens. Both completely blew me away, and the immersion they were able to provide was actually quite scary. I've been thinking about the implications on lucid dreaming, positive and negative.

Awesome! I have been dying to try out the Vive. I didn't know the Hololens was as promising, but glad to hear that you like them both.

May-day, may-day, motivation going down! I see myself thinking less about lucid dreaming in general, and have failed to do ANY presence checks (self awareness reflection) in the last three days! Same with dream recall, even if currently it's pretty good and I still recall a few dreams, I have found other things to do rather than writing them down when I wake up! I hope with Daniel Love's project I'll get back in line. Will try, try, try to make an effort, but I always say this, and at the end of every day, I tell myself: 'oops, didn't do anything to lucid dream today, will try harder tomorrow'. However, still practicing LD incubation (MILD visualisations) and find myself often dreaming about what thought before falling asleep, however I missed lucidity I could've gotten with more consistent day work. Anyway, going to bed now. Good night!

You can try to start rather than end the day with forming intention to practice throughout the day . Not "tomorrow, I will practice," but "today I will practice".

You can always scale back your goals for specific #s of checks, etc., but try not to let it go to zero. Set a goal for one, two, etc. serious RCs per day. The satisfaction of meeting your goals can help you build to higher and higher ones over time.

It's not a race, but you do need to practice if you want to improve. Only you can decide if it's something you want in your life.

Hi Centroid, how's the day work and recall doing?

As for motivation, I find reading through peoples DJs can be really motivating. All those crazy/fun/weird dreaming experiences are so amazing to wake up to every day!

I think we all go through ups and downs in our motivation. Try this and tell me if it triggers any response for you: Ask yourself "Will I lucid dream tonight?"

Originally Posted by Centroid

However, still practicing LD incubation (MILD visualisations) and find myself often dreaming about what thought before falling asleep...

This could be very useful. Have you tried to use this to your advantage?

Hey!

And another one! LD count #4!!!
I was talking to my friend, and tried to check the time, but I wasn't able to distinguish whether it was 14:08 or 18:08 on my watch. This instantly sparked lucidity, the same dream sign as one of my earlier FA LDs. Suddenly everything went dark grey, and I found myself actually seeing me, not through my dream eyes (it switched from 1st person to 3rd person). I tried jumping back into my head, but everything was extremely unstable/ foggy, so I couldn't visualize anything, and I woke up a couple of seconds earlier.

I'm sorry I couldn't post anything earlier, my access to the internet being limited abroad, and I found no working wifi hotspot until today.

About progress, I've been doing 1+ RCs (usually 2-3) every day, spending some time on each. Dream journaling still going well, though I have seen longer entries. I know keeping a DJ is essential for LDs, so I will work harder on that, maybe looking through other people's DJs, as suggested by FryingMan.

I have found that checking the time can makes me lucid, so I'll try incubating that during my MILD visualizations.

Awesome! Congrats again!! You may have found something that you can use to get lucid very regularly, especially if you incubate it like you suggested. You might also want to think of other ways to integrate time checks into your day and night practices, like checking the time during your RC's and during awakenings, always checking it at least 2 or 3 times. I may have some other ideas for you but the best ones are likely the ones that you come to through your own individual way of thinking.

Hey! Been a few weeks since I posted here, sorry about that...

Anyway, another LD a couple of days ago!!! I was in an airport, and working very hard to be able to give my family and me business seats on a long flight. I managed to succeed, somehow, and got very excited! On my way to these seats, I was greeted by many people offering things to eat etc., and then I get comfortable on my seat. Then my brother comes to me and says 'this is a dream!!!', and I do a nose-plug RC to confirm. My first thought was that I wouldn't be able to enjoy the seats, but then when seeing my brother flying, I really understand the implications of having a lucid dream, but immediately wake up...

Daily RCs going ok, I have tried incubating myself checking the time, but nothing showed up in my dreams... I'll give SSILD a try tonight, been MILDing for a while with only some success in the beginning.

Dream recall - at least one full dream every night, generally one dream + fragments.

Also, I'm really sad I missed the competition!!! Been away from DV only 2 weeks, and missed something which could have been so awesome... I think I'll still count my points etc. the same as in the comp, and try using this as motivation.

Also, fogelbise, you said you had some other ideas, please share them, I don't have a clue what they could be!

Thanks!

^I think it was some more ideas about time checks and incubation but I apologize my brain is too tired right now and need to head off to bed. Please do reply so I don't forget to answer your question. I try to respond to the workbooks in the order that the posts came in and your's was the most recent, so I unfortunately find myself a bit too sleepy.

A big congrats by the way!! You are on a nice trend!

Hello fogelbise!

It's okay, nevermind. Wow, you've got quite a few active workbooks now, thanks and good luck!

Dream recall pretty good this morning, woke up twice so two long dreams recalled.

I remembered at least one of the ideas. Since it seems like your mind is connecting with the time checks, what do you think about having one clock or watch that you will see several times a day set about 6 hours off. In other words the real time is 12 noon but it says 6am or 6pm and you try to feel as much astonishment as possible and do your RC and think about what you want to do while lucid. Just an idea, but if it doesn't feel right for you, no worries. Hope to see you around more and I am sure you will be reporting more LD's soon!

DOUBLE LUCID!!!

I take my phone out and see a cracked screen, then I think, 'that's not mine' (my brother cracked his phone screen yesterday), nose-plug, lucid! I wander around, exploring, but I have trouble seeing everything around me. Dream collapses, and I don't remember anything anymore. I do recall I rubbed my hands and tried shouting "clarity!", but it didn't work. I believe I lost lucidity after everything went foggy.

At school, fire alarm but there was nobody outside, BAM! Double lucid, I immediately thought. Nose-plug, running around exploring everything and rubbing my hands. Dream clarity started off good but got worse very quickly, so I became desperate to 'see' better. I was in the countryside, it was a rather nice place, but everything became blurry/black and white very quickly, I felt like my field of vision decreased too, and then I woke up.

I had done MILD from 6:40 to about 7:10, and woke up from the second lucid at 7:45.

Woo-hoo! Make it 7.

PS: I had given up on LDing for the last 2 weeks, I was very frustrated that I did so much work during the day and nothing happened during my dreams. I was mostly doing self-awareness work, and some SSILD at night (not much night work though). Even without a DJ, I still recalled my dreams quite well. This little break was very much needed, and I started off fresh re-reading ETWOLD. I took a liking for Tholey's combined technique (did some research, Tholey started with only his reflection technique, and then added intention and auto-suggestion at night to create the combined technique. Auto-suggestion for me is just MILD, and that leaves me with his Reflection-Intention Technique, which I started practicing. I did RIT during the day and MILD at WBTB, for one day, and was rewarded with a double lucid! Maybe just enthusiasm, but I'll keep going with RIT + MILD (and DJing, of course).

Also, these lucids were VERY unstable and I couldn't see much in them, while my other 5 were okay. Any tips for clarity? I tried rubbing my hands and shouting. Or is it just cause I'm still a beginner LDer?

Is it common to have 2 lucids in quick succession like I did? Maybe one lucid makes it more likely to have another the same night?

Originally Posted by Centroid

DOUBLE LUCID!!!

I take my phone out and see a cracked screen, then I think, 'that's not mine' (my brother cracked his phone screen yesterday), nose-plug, lucid! I wander around, exploring, but I have trouble seeing everything around me. Dream collapses, and I don't remember anything anymore. I do recall I rubbed my hands and tried shouting "clarity!", but it didn't work. I believe I lost lucidity after everything went foggy.

At school, fire alarm but there was nobody outside, BAM! Double lucid, I immediately thought. Nose-plug, running around exploring everything and rubbing my hands. Dream clarity started off good but got worse very quickly, so I became desperate to 'see' better. I was in the countryside, it was a rather nice place, but everything became blurry/black and white very quickly, I felt like my field of vision decreased too, and then I woke up.

I had done MILD from 6:40 to about 7:10, and woke up from the second lucid at 7:45.

Woo-hoo! Make it 7.

PS: I had given up on LDing for the last 2 weeks, I was very frustrated that I did so much work during the day and nothing happened during my dreams. I was mostly doing self-awareness work, and some SSILD at night (not much night work though). Even without a DJ, I still recalled my dreams quite well. This little break was very much needed, and I started off fresh re-reading ETWOLD. I took a liking for Tholey's combined technique (did some research, Tholey started with only his reflection technique, and then added intention and auto-suggestion at night to create the combined technique. Auto-suggestion for me is just MILD, and that leaves me with his Reflection-Intention Technique, which I started practicing. I did RIT during the day and MILD at WBTB, for one day, and was rewarded with a double lucid! Maybe just enthusiasm, but I'll keep going with RIT + MILD (and DJing, of course).

Also, these lucids were VERY unstable and I couldn't see much in them, while my other 5 were okay. Any tips for clarity? I tried rubbing my hands and shouting. Or is it just cause I'm still a beginner LDer?

Is it common to have 2 lucids in quick succession like I did? Maybe one lucid makes it more likely to have another the same night?

First on all, congrats! Woohoo getting lucid is awesome! I would like to suggest that several things came together here:
+ The accumulated effect of all the day awareness work (it takes time to build up)
+ A relaxed mindset free from the build-up of frustration
+ Reading about LDing. There is something magical about this process that I believe installs very strong subconscious intent and goals, in addition to the conscious renewal of excitement
+ WBTB: you had mentioned previously that you didn't do much night work. Re-setting your intent to LD after several hours of sleep is highly effective, as is the increased wakefulness (brain chemistry changes towards waking configuration).

Having a rigorous day practice can be a two-edged sword: 1) you build up a lot of awareness; but 2) you think "I'm working so hard, I MUST get lucid, why don't I get lucid more!?", leading to frustration, which leads away from good dreaming and lucidity. Keeping a positive mindset of joy, excitement, fun, and wonder in the LDing practice I think is key for more lucidity. Your brain will avoid things and states that you (subconsciously perhaps) think are not good for you. If you had unknowingly established some "lucidity is stressful", that perhaps could have been inhibiting your progress.

Something you mentioned also is not doing much in the way of DJing: I would recommend returning to the DJ, as much as you can fit it into your schedule. I think there's an effect similar to reading about LDing: you're really fully engrossed in the idea of dreaming and in the content of your dreams when you write your DJ. Try to really enjoy the process, if it feels like "work" you'll be less likely to do it.

As for stability: it just takes time. I had a mixture of early LDs: some where very stable, but a couple went to the void (lost visuals) right away. It happens sometimes. Early LDs also tend to happen close to your waking-up time, as this is when your brain is waking up for the day. Don't worry too much about these cases. Instead, just take this as positive proof that you CAN and you DO get lucid!

As for multiple LDs per night: yes, sometimes! Generally once all the stars align and you get lucid the first time, they remain aligned and you can get lucid again and again!

Congrats, and keep it up! Think back to the last couple of weeks and try to recapture and continue that new enthusiasm, and let your confidence build from this success! Consider any night that you have recall as a success and be thankful for all of your dreaming experiences. Let us know what happens next!

Congratulations!! I like your plan to continue with RIT + MILD (with WBTB, WBTB is very powerful).

It won't be like that every time but perhaps you were getting ready to wake up for the day?..or perhaps your mind thought you were. That sometimes affects the clarity for me, but not always. It sounded like you took the right steps and those steps are likely to work the next time you try them!

I wouldn't say 2 in quick succession is common for a beginner, so great job!!

(I see FM and I posted at almost the same exact time!)

Hah, yes, fogelbise and I posted at the same time! I'm dreaming! RC RC RC

edit: probably the thing that prevented multiple LDs for me in the first several dozen LDs was just being so excited by the LD and DJing it immediately in detail. That and of course the fact that they mostly happened late in the morning.

Thanks for the replies! This thread helps a lot with enthusiasm!

I agree with everything you have said, and I'll do my best to make everything more enjoyable and interesting. I'll also make an effort concerning dream journaling.

Also, something I forgot to mention: when I was rubbing my hands, it didn't feel like they were my hands. It was like, I imagined myself rubbing my hands and they appeared in front of me. Maybe because of the low dream clarity.

Also, FM, what book doesTYoDaS stand for in your signature? Just curious...

Originally Posted by Centroid

Also, FM, what book doesTYoDaS stand for in your signature? Just curious...

the Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep -- highly recommended.
I also highly recommend Andrew Holecek's new book on Dream Yoga (I like it even more than TYoDaS, but still TYoDaS should be read as it has its own essential observations).

Originally Posted by FryingMan

the Tibetan Yogas of Dream and Sleep -- highly recommended.
I also highly recommend Andrew Holecek's new book on Dream Yoga (I like it even more than TYoDaS, but still TYoDaS should be read as it has its own essential observations).

Thanks, I'll check'em out!

Hey! And yet another LD! Hurray!

I did a one-hour WBTB, reading ETWOLD and then doing MILD. I woke up a bit later with no lucids. I then do a short MILD. In that MILD I ask myself: what would I most like to do in a LD? I think super-sonic flying would be amazing (my flying so far felt like I was a falling leaf). I have another sly thought: sex would be good too. But I really don't want to, because I know that if I start, it's going to be the only thing I ever do in a LD. So I forget this and carry on visualizing myself soaring over cities. I then fall asleep shortly afterwards. In the dream, well, uh, you can guess what happens... But then I stop for a second and think 'I'm dreaming!' I notice that I'm still doing that. I have a decision to make: keeping at it or flying away. Somehow, I was lazy (in a dream hahaha I laughed so much when I woke up!) and thought it would be too much effort to fly. So I carried on with my previous activity, and woke up very shortly afterwards. I'm kinda disappointed in my LD self, really. Weak scumbag! Lol

Interesting thought: in MILD, I visualized this:
LD --> Goal
But in the dream it was:
Goal --> LD
So it's very important to associate my goal with LDing to not do the goal non-lucidly.

Anyway, it was an LD, and I've had plenty recently, so I'm happy about that. The content has time to change (I hope). Next MILD, I'm gonna be like 'Don't think about pink elephants!'

About my practice:
-DJing is okay (maybe one dream a night, been better but still good)
-RCs during the day (2-5 times, where I really question everything for about 10 min), I'm starting to bring self-awareness in (I've done it a lot already)
-WBTB+MILD every other night, I feel this is the real deal, the thing that makes me lucid

I'm keeping everything this way for now, as long as it gets me LDs! I might try chaining MILD more (instead of one long WBTB + one long MILD, I'll do many short MILDs scattered throughout my sleep), like Sensei's micro-WBTB. I'll try this if I don't become lucid within the next 4 nights.

I'm really excited, and that's awesome! xD

I hope you guys' dreams are going great too!

Originally Posted by Centroid

Hey! And yet another LD! Hurray!
...
-WBTB+MILD every other night, I feel this is the real deal, the thing that makes me lucid

Congratulations Centroid!! Keep it going, you are doing great!

Yes, WBTB+MILD can do wonders. I would say that if I was only allowed to hold onto one practice, it would be WBTB, no doubt! Of course, by keeping up various day and night practices it supplements the power, effectiveness and level of the LD's…so the other practices are important too.

Hi guys!

No LDs yet, minor dry spell (how can I even say this, it's only been a week since my last LD, haha), HOWEVER, some really awesome dreams, and I'm really happy to have them in my DJ!

A dream I couldn't stop smiling about:
I dreamed that an amazing video game just went out, and so I texted a friend about it. I woke up and texted him back: never mind, it was just a dream. Then I woke up for real!

Anyway, I was reading Sageous stuff, and while going through the 'The WILD According to Sageous Q&A' posts I had a revelation: I was doing the RRC all wrong! During my practice, which lasted maybe a few weeks, I was spending some time thinking it all out etc, when I should have been looking for the sense of 'wonder' at my interactions, and my RRC should have been much shorter. Sageous also suggested to do the RRC after a normal RC, and this makes a lot of sense, because in waking life, the RRC grounds you in reality, while in a dream, the RRC is perfect for increasing lucidity (after it was confirmed by an RC), because you understand that everything is YOU, and it probably helps a lot with dream control too.

I'll do this then! RC + RRC at least once every hour. Also, I need to stop only reading the original post of every thread, and skim the rest of the posts of the thread, as the OP often says really important stuff he missed in his first post. This is what caused me to misunderstand a really good technique.

Other things to note:
Dream recall is good.
MILDed a few times, although I haven't WBTBed much because of a ten-hour jet lag.