Quote Originally Posted by Universal View Post

My question in this thread is not whether these states can exist or whether they can exist in lucid dreams. I am only questioning whether lucid dreams can be used to create these experiences in waking life. I did describe what certain supposed lucid dreaming gurus have claimed, which is that the state they reached 100% defies description. I have not experienced that, and not all higher states of consciousness are like that, but I can see where it could be the case. It is not a concept that contradicts itself.
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I believe it can. Lucid dreaming has been practiced as Dream Yoga by dream yogis. Its goal is Enlightenment, which is linked to or are these higher states of consciousness.

If you haven't done so already, you might want to check out the 6 Yogas of Naropa. It is profound stuff.



I would be interested to hear more about your experience about seeing the ultimate nature of reality though, not having had that experience myself:

Quote from you:"I have experienced that higher state of consciousness as well as a vision of the ultimate significance of life, which I saw in a lucid dream. That is completely mental, but the mental experience is real. I have also had higher states of consciousness where I have seen life's ultimate insignificance. There is an expanded awareness, or appearance of awareness, accompanied by a hightened ability to feel emotions, that takes place in these states."