during an OBE is it possible to move items the in physical world. if so to what extent and how can this be mastered? if its possible could people use this power for money/helping people?
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during an OBE is it possible to move items the in physical world. if so to what extent and how can this be mastered? if its possible could people use this power for money/helping people?
^^ To date is is not possible (as far as I know, anyway), but this sure seems like something you could try to make possible...
From my perspective, lucid dreaming can be used to create change in the world the same way that spells and ritual can in Wicca and other pagan practices. I use ritual (or induce a dream) to focus my intent and willpower on the action that I want to take, and that's "step one" of creating the change I want to see in the world.
Say I wanted to keep my house clean. I might use one of these tools to emulate the refreshing feeling of having a clean house, which would help to motivate me to do the work to keep it clean on a continual basis. By doing this, lucid dreaming (or magic) might actually be able to move objects in the physical world... by motivating me to do the work of moving the objects in the physical world.
Given your question, I have to ask something first. If one is having a true OBE, is it not true that they are without any kind of physical body? If so, what means would somebody having an OBE have to cause direct translocation/displacement of a physical material object?
Now, having asked all that, is this really more or less what you are trying to ask with this topic? That is how I interpret it, anyway (it's really the same, just more specific). Then, in order for something like this to work, wouldn't someone have to have a means of utilizing some form of energy to cause this change in physical reality? How would something like that even begin to work, especially considering we still aren't sure that OBEs are really what they seem to be? At the moment there is no empirical evidence supporting the theory that OBEs are truly experiences in which one leaves his or her body and sees the true physical world in the reality everyone shares and inhabits. It is just as easy to make the statement that all OBEs are exceptionally vivid dreams that sometimes have similar or nearly identical events take place and be witnessed during the course of the dream. I'm not trying to say OBE is one way or the other because that isn't the topic of discussion, but assuming OBEs are what people who experience them believe them to be, by what method could a person without a body possibly move objects in physical reality?
lol, obviously possible. What you're asking is how to do it. The fun part is figuring that out.
"From here any way is the right way."
-Robert Waggoner's Lucid Dreaming: Gateway to the Inner Self
It is said that "ghosts" or disincarnate spirits have been known to directly affect the physical plane by moving objects and such. If this is truly possible, then perhaps it is just as possible for an individual in the out-of-body state to do so, assuming that they are operating in the same level of nonphysical reality as these poltergeists. It seems unlikely from a theoretical standpoint according to my understanding of things, but perhaps my worldview is inadequate.
No that's accurate. The reason they call it extra-sensory perception (ESP) is because sometimes you need to deny logic and your senses to achieve what you want
I tried this a few times... It goes like this- I concentrate on the thing I want to move to really have the feel of it, and then I try to move it to new place. Sometimes I really feel that thing and I feel it like unmovable object... then it gives up and I'm able to move it. But that is OBE. When I check it in physical dimension, then nothing changes. I spoke with one guy about this and he told me that I don't have enough energy :) That at first I hold it for real, then it slips and my subconscious mind imagines its relocation. There is nothing bad about trying, we can do it indefinitely... training our spiritual muscles??? :)
I'm skeptic about this, but why not to experiment?
Since you are so confident, could you try explaining things for those of us more skeptical? How this is possible really eludes me and I sincerely would like a serious reply that explains the mechanics of how one can learn to do this, and how it is supposed to work in reality. Perhaps even ways to check that what you experience happening is indeed happening in reality, and it isn't simply a hallucination or the result of a dreamlike experience? Ways that employ methods of making detailed logs of an object's location in the physical dimensions, and even possibly outlining the resting place of what you are trying to move, and then logging what happens after you return to your body. It's possible to fabricate, but some videos, multiple people performing the experiment, and a group of interested peers making sure that the tests are valid would be a good first step.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wisher
But, let's not get ahead of ourselves. I still am interested in how I can do this, how anybody could do this, or how it is supposed to work. I mean neither disrespect nor project disbelief with these requests, but am legitimately interested in knowing more.
edit: All that being said, please offer more than simple statements of factuality, such as "lol, obviously possible". Again, I'm not trying to offend you or anything, but broad statements like that in regards to the topic, as I see it now, are impossible to seriously make. How is it that it is possible, can you provide an explanation rather than a statement of fact?
I can imagine a way to move things in the real world from a dream: put electrodes on your head, connect a BCI machine to control a robot with your dreaming brainwaves. That robot then lets you move things while you dream :D
I want one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raipat
In my own experience I've had very odd encounters with clouds. I'm not saying I can move or shape clouds but I've had lots and lots and lots of coincidences happen with things as such that I'm not comfortable speaking about publicly.lol maybe it's somthing else around me or that allows it. there's something to think about. I can say a couple of times other then like calling a higher source I'm not going to get into. like doing a rain dance so to speak but tottaly different. That's a different story. But I had a big coincidence like, you know when your in a lucid dream and you look to the sky and by expectations and belief you can will the clouds or sky to do things or anything in the dream realm for that matter, (I just think the clouds would are easer cuz there ever changing in reality too.). Or if its so cloudy you want to wipe away some clouds with a hand gesture to see some blue sky, well I kind of seen such happenings in real life. Very weird stuff I've seen. Or just coincidence right.lol ya right. There's how maybe I'm not the only one try it and get back to me ide love to meet others. And yes I think it's quite possible.:) try it out Ihope this helps and pls help me find others that can co this too. The sun and the moon helps too tthat's a hint sometimes all I have to do is be outside in the sun or moonlight and the clouds start braking up around me with out me doin anything this mainly happens every time I first wake up I go out side its over cast but it starts to break away. Coincidence I think not. And prayer to god or higher source which is in all of us. and to have good in your heart but not that and or faith alone is key. But that's more complex conversation.
I think you might be on to somthing in the ghost level. I have an open mined.
Haha I won't be so reserved. There is a thing called "cloud busting" where you focus on a particular cloud in the sky, place the intent for the cloud to dissolve, and then concentrate on that one cloud with your intent in mind. I probably have a 90% success rate of the cloud of my choice dissolving after maybe 3-5 minutes of intense focus, while the other clouds in the same vicinity remain, although sometimes the dissolution spreads slightly beyond my target cloud, particularly when a lot of clouds are close together or connected, although it is always concentrated in the area of my focus. I stopped cloud busting once I did it enough times to be sure of the validity of the phenomenon. One of my friends that I told about this who showed enough interest to try it himself had success with it as well. Of course, this has little to do with OBE, so it is fairly off topic, but since you brought up clouds, why not.Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamenaider
YESSS..Quote:
Originally Posted by VinceField
ORGASM ACHJIEVED..
This is what Danon taught me back in the Old DV days.. It works 90% of the time. Sometimes I can move entire weathers. Or rather, my mind moves with the weather.. I don't know, the strangest thing is when the sun or moon comes through the clouds at extraordinary times. Or aliens.
It doesn't work so well since the air pollution has increased here.
Well put. Informative description. I guess I know vaguely what you mean with having good in your heart. And dancing with gods.Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamenaider
Also with the sun and moon sometimes all I have to do is be outside in the sun or moonlight and the clouds start braking up around me with out me doin anything this mainly happens every time I first wake up I go out side its over cast but it starts to break away. I have also not just busted clouds but shaped them as well. I think I have even seen other beings take form in the clouds and tried to punch the sun out. But they were not successful. Ya that's not all I've seen ether. Sorry if I did go off topic but the clouds are something you can move around in reall life. I think it is easier with the sky cuz its ever changing like how dreams are. But if you look at it so is the earth after longer time. Thank you all you made my day now I know I'm not crazy.lol
Hi everyone!
Well, I stumbled upon this phenomenon just a while ago - there is a guy out there doing all this stuff with clouds, wind, sun etch and I think that his videos are quite convincing (impressive and most likely unedited) - he made me really consider whether moving things in real life with mind alone might in fact be possible...:wizard:
Accurate cloud targeting - dissolving
Moving the wind and starting rain...
I might make a new thread on this stuff I am feeling a bit more comfortable talking about it with open minded people like you all. I might even share some of my experiences. Thank you for that resource of videos I've been looking for ever for stuff like that after what I've seen.
I think it is possible for an astral body to move physical matter. I think to start, you need to be able to OBE at will. I wish I could. Telekinesis while awake seems easier.Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk1sr
I have a relative that is electrokinetic. I've also done cloudbusting, and it's a lot easier than I thought it would be. I've tried to make street lamps go bright like my cousin, but I have never been able to do it. I think I can make them go out sometimes, but I'm not sure.
Right on more people who has tried that kind of stuff at least I know there are others out there and the possibility is growing in others eyes as well. Keep trying if you dedicate your self enough on somthing I believe almost anything is possible. Shoot for the stars the sky may be the limit but I like to go above and beyond. Lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-l87gbcgRs
real electrokinesis I know this is not bullshit, because I know the person doing it. She's a distant cousin.
I think this is not electrokinesis. I played this way too. Some types of lamp need to cool down to start to shine again after stopping working... They stop to shine if, for example, something shines on light sensor. One need only to wait a short time for lamp to cool down and restart.Quote:
Originally Posted by WakingNomad
What's your theory on how she's making the first lamp bright?Quote:
Originally Posted by Psionik
What's your theory on how she makes the first lamp dimmer?
What's your theory on how she turns the second one on?
What's your theory on how she turns the second one off?
If I were to put in a skeptical hypothesis, it would be that she either knows or subconsciously is aware of the timing of the lights as they overheat or switch back on. I don't actually have any skin in this game, though, so I'm not actively disputing your point. ;)
still doesn't explain her making them brighter/dimmer. street lamps have no dimmer switches.Quote:
Originally Posted by Samael
^^ actually, they sort of do have dimmer switches.
By design, modern streetlights take time to power up to full brightness when they come on, and do the reverse when they shut off. These powering up and down periods can take some time, so it might indeed appear that they are being dimmed.
just sayin'...
That sounds a lot like a conspiracy theory... Pretty far out accusations. lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Samael
Haha except there is in no way a conspiracy involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthoughts
It must be. I think it's leprauchans. They're always up to no good!Quote:
Originally Posted by VinceField
Illuminati leprechauns to be exact.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthoughts
http://s18.postimg.org/60iae9kx5/bi_...ye_pyramid.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by VinceField
that mother....
I did make a thread on this for waking like its call I want to talk about eelemental bending. I think this thread is for doing it in your dreams. But no one else is saying anything so oh well my bad I started it.lol
I looked on that video more carefully. This was not the wrong light sensor... those were bad arc discharge lamps.Quote:
Originally Posted by WakingNomad
It was not her making. It was automatic. Why do you think the lamp was off first? It was cooling down. When it was cooled enough starter managed to make sustainable discharge. Then lamp went brighter and brighter because it was ramping to the working temperature. As lamps go to the working temperature discharge is generally going brighter. But that lamp was probably broken and it overheated and went dark again. If that video was longer then we would see cycle of switch on, brightening and again shutting down.
For the second lamp it would be the same.
I know this is not what you mean but to the question "Is it possible to move items in the physical world," I have found out that the answer is yes. I have for all my life been curious and have desired magical powers because of some "paranormal" stuff I saw as a child. This has been in vain but in the end, there was a mystical feeling with the realisation that I already can do magic. I do have the power to move items in the physical world. I can use my hands. I can use my body.
It's obvious but with the right perspective, it does feel magic.
As a kid I used to believe I could use telekenesis. I think it was because I watched Mathilda :P
If we can not move physical items. That means our mind is not infinite. I just realize this
Is that the first time you realized that? :cackle:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthoughts
It could mean that our mind is not from this world. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthoughts
You need to do more research on how light bulbs work. Street lights are just lights with a light sensor on the top that makes them switch on when it gets dark, and turn off when it's light out. There is NO danger of them overheating, so there is no heat sensor turning off hot lights. There is no "working temperature". LOL! They just turn on like all electric lights. Arc lamps have been replaced by incandescent bulbs decades ago. Maybe you're getting combustion engines and electric lights mixed up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psionik
^^ Actually...
Streetlights tend to have extremely efficient metal-hallide or similar elements that do indeed take a moment to "warm up," and do require a few seconds (or minutes, if they are old) to reach full brightness or to shut down. They really are not like the incandescent bulbs we use at home. So Psionik's description seems accurate (he actually seems to have a better technical grasp on this than I do, so I guess I should have let him respond...).
This has nothing to do with your friend's actual ability, Nomad; I just wanted to be sure that this bit of info was clear so we can move on.
[EDIT: I forgot to mention that streetlight elements probably can overheat, given that they seem constructed with a lot of safeguards against it,.. I use the bulbs in my art, so I'm very familiar with all the parts, and many seem to be present for safety or control of heat.]
Sageous: Well I was thinking about technical university, before I took chemistry head on :)
Walking Nomad, please, incandescent bulbs are very inefficient. They have very short lifetime, about 1000h... it would be inconvenient for street use. You mixed them with mercury arc discharge lamps(or named gas discharge lamps) whose are in use from 1930 when their mass production begun.
Mercury and amalgam based arc lamps are 10x as efficient as incandescent bulbs and have also better operational life. They are replaced because of toxic mercury by natrium arc lamps and metal halide lamps with similar or higher efficiency but it is short process and mercury based arc lamps are in shops because of their lower cost... and I also saw LED based street lights... But they are rare at this time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury-vapor_lamp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal-halide_lamp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium...essure_.2F_HPS
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LED_street_light
From wiki:
Operation
File:Mercury vapour lamp.ogg
Warm-up of a color corrected 80 W high-pressure mercury vapor lamp to half brightness
When a mercury vapor lamp is first turned on, it will produce a dark blue glow because only a small amount of the mercury is ionized and the gas pressure in the arc tube is very low, so much of the light is produced in the ultraviolet mercury bands. As the main arc strikes and the gas heats up and increases in pressure, the light shifts into the visible range and the high gas pressure causes the mercury emission bands to broaden somewhat, producing a light that appears more nearly white to the human eye, although it is still not a continuous spectrum. Even at full intensity, the light from a mercury vapor lamp with no phosphors is distinctly bluish in color. The pressure in the quartz arc-tube rises to approximately one atmosphere once the bulb has reached its working temperature. If the discharge should be interrupted (e.g. by interruption of the electric supply), it is not possible for the lamp to restrike until the bulb cools enough for the pressure to fall considerably. The reason for a prolonged period of time before the lamp restrikes is because mercury vapor ballasts along with other HID lamp ballasts send relatively low voltage to the lamp upon start up, but as pressure increases inside the arc-tube, higher voltage is required to keep the lamp lit so the ballast sends higher voltage to the lamp. Once the ballast is shut off and turned on again, it starts over at a low voltage but if the lamp is still hot, then high pressure inside the arc-tube prevents the lamp from striking an arc and turning on.[
Their other advantages are a long bulb lifetime in the range of 24,000 hours and a high intensity, clear white light output.[1] For these reasons, they are used for large area overhead lighting, such as in factories, warehouses, and sports arenas as well as for streetlights. Clear mercury lamps produce white light with a bluish-green tint due to mercury's combination of spectral lines.[1]
the streetlamps in the video give off yellow light.
Anyway, back on topic. This thread is about moving stuff in the physical world from your dreams. I met someone who claimed to do it from the astral plane, in an OBE. I'll tell you the story if you're interested.
The light spectra depends on fluorescent used on glass. It may change very dramatically. And take in consideration, that broken mercury gas discharge lamp has different light characteristics.
Natrium(sodium) lamps give yellowish spectra.
You can use mercury gas discharge lamp as UV lamp for sunbathing- the only thing you has to do is to remove outer part of lamp with luminofor. I wouldn't recommend it nevertheless, the UV rays produced by this lamp are not of right part of spectra.
I didn't manage to move anything in physical world while I was lucid dreaming or out of body. But I heard a tales... One friend here from slovakia told me that he knew woman who was visible outside of her house, while she was having OBE. I can't say whether it is truth or not. I didn't see that on my own eyes. I also read some poltergeist looking events made by people while OBEing... You know how it is... There is Randi Prize. Lets win a million dollars :D
Please, do tell. Did you get to see them do this, did they explain how they did it and were they able to back it up? Did they explain how you could do it yourself given enough practice? I'm always interested in hearing how people can do it, even if I don't necessarily believe it. It's one more chance to see if it really is possible. If it's actually possible, at least one of the times somebody shows it or explains it, it will work and actually be possible. If you dismiss everything you hear about it right away, how would you ever know if it's actually possible, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by WakingNomad
Reading this, I have to ask: what made you think your mind was infinite in the first place? I don't mean to be condescending or anything, please don't take it that way. If I had to guess, it was due to a line of thinking similar to the idea that "because the universe is infinite there are infinite possibilities". However, there are problems making that assumption too. There's plenty of evidence that, if interpreted a certain way, seems to indicate that the universe is finite. If that were the case, it follows that there is a limited number of possibilities, no? If we assume the universe is infinite, and there are "infinite possibilities", does this mean that any scenario you can think of must be? I don't think that's inherently true. Despite the fact that there are an infinite number of possibilities, logically it does not follow that everything that can happen, will happen. To prove this, it's as simple as making a few observations. There is a consensus among all sane humans that there is indeed a cause, and an effect. It does not work in the opposite fashion, the arrow of time seems to point only in one general direction, even if matter and particles experience their own relative, "local" time clock. We move forward in time, not backwards. The "infinite" in infinite number of possibilities stems from the "infinite" in the assumption that our universe is infinite. Just because we can count numbers ad infinitum up and down, positive and negative, it is never possible for 4 to be equal in value to 13. So, while the universe is infinite, it means that cause and effect will continue happen, that new things will always keep happening. It also proves that the universe must follow its laws/rules. It does not mean you can break the laws of physics, it doesn't mean you can have effect preceding cause. It does not mean that your favorite anime is taking place in reality somewhere in the universe, at some point in time. It doesn't mean that at some point you will come back from the dead and find a way to evolve beyond our limitations in 4 dimensions and find a way to make the universe be made up of a bunch of infinitely small you's forming chains and forming the particles that we are composed of. It doesn't necessarily mean anything. Despite that there are an infinite amount of possibilities, there is only one possible outcome when cause winds up leading to effect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dthoughts
Again, the infinite in the phrase comes from the assumed fact that the universe itself is infinite, and initial commonsense saying that that means everything will happen, but what it really means is that anything could happen. The infinite possibilities only have a finite outcome in the present. However, there are an infinite amount of finite outcomes that the universe can have (again, making the assumption the universe is infinite), but the outcomes cannot defy the natural laws of physics. I think this is a very important concept to stress to people. Most use the commonsense understanding of what "infinite universe, therefore infinite possibilities" means as proof of their idea's validity, rather than it's possible and maybe even unlikely validity.
Snoop- infinite possibilities have infinite outcomes in the multiverse, but only one outcome in universe. That only outcome makes our timeline. Any other outcome leads to creation of different timeline(universe). This is theory... it is not provable. Even if I saw this in OBE it doesn't mean this is the real thing. After all, OBE can be only type of dream where I feel that it is not dream and at the same time that it is also not this world(waking reality).
There's something i've read about quantum mechanics your words reminded me of;
I've read from Reliable source that Light when it travels to the 'destination' in the plant. In some plants the light income is very low so they have to make efficient use of Light. And they do this using aspects of quantum superposition. which about says that a single photon travels in every possible direction that it can go to. But it chooses only one. Therefore, we can't really measure it's path. logically speaking, it can be at every single possible option. Yet, in plants, the photon travels through a 'sort of maze in the cell' using only the most efficient route. And choose the exact most efficient way to the chloroplasts. Even though it could have gone a million other ways. Edit; I believe physicists actually argue that all positions are used in a parallel dimension. The interesting continuation of this theory is that there is a most efficient path that light prefers to travel in this dimension.
Moral of the story? QM adds a lot of weirdness to the physical world. And makes it a lot more interesting. I think non-locality even exerts it's effect across time.
Either way, to answer ur quastion :P I never believed the universe really is infinite. I'm not a proponent of that theory. In fact, I would argue against it. I've played with the idea that theres's maybe infinite possibilities, but within the law of the universe. Perhaps we're in a multiverse with an infinite amount of choices therefore outcomes. I consider that this literally happens. With possibly very strange unpredictable happenings. Perhaps this is why the universe is expanding. But to expand on ur excellent point, what is not happening is that I am going into the past and destroying the earth before it made humans. Infinity would state that this can happen. I do not believe it can happen because then we would not be having this conversation. Therefore, it's easy to conclude that it's not literally infinite. But it's weird. I woulden't be suprised if I could create a universe that is made of a chain of little me's, then it becomes not a matter of infinity or eternity. It becomes a matter of how much I and my Little I' consciousnesss can endure in creating novelty through time.
There's also like emotions and time. Some things just aren't happening due to sheer willpower. (given, say that things are dreamlike) .. this post iss probbly as senseless as my previous post.