Thread: Dale Graff interview about "Psi Dreams"

Dale Graff is a physicist and former Director of Project Star Gate, (the government program that investigated the remote viewing phenomenon). His personal experiences and life long explorations into intuition, remote viewing and precognitive dreaming guided him to a scientific career for research in parapsychology. It was also called "psi", incredible phenomena. Here's Dale Graff.

Dear reader

I will now jump from this the 14 minute part of this two and a half hour Youtube to the 23+ minute part and transcribe till the 60 minute part. After that people ring-up the radio station to ask Dale Graff questions.

I am on my phone and can't put the Youtube link in but if you put the title:

C2CAM - Psi Dreams - (Coast to Coast AM)

into the Youtube search bar you will find it.

Dale Graff gives instructions on how to regularly have precognative dreams.

23:40 to 25:06

Interviewer:

Dale, in your website presentations and writings you use the term " psi" for a variety of paranormal phenomenon, how come?

Dale Graff:

Ok, I like the term because it's neutral; it's actually the 23rd letter of the Greek alphabet. It's like the (x) as the unknown in mathermatics. It was a term used back in the 1930's and 40's in England by the psychic researcher's there.

And

They coined the term because they wanted a general term to get away from some of the meanings being attributed to "psychic" or "clairvoyance" or whatever.

So "psi" was meant to be a neutral term so we didn't have to make a judgment of what was causing the phenomenon. (...)

Interviewer:

I like it a little better than "paranormal" as a matter of fact.

Dale Graff:

I use it a lot. In fact, I see a lot of media work using "psi" right now, which I'm quite pleased with. So they are getting away from the very specific names. It can be almost too broad but then again I'd rather have a label like this, and then branch-down into it, to specify certain features of that phenomenon, of psi phenomenon.

(25:06)

Interviewer:

Dale, you're a scientist. You've got a degree in aeronautical engineering. You have a degree in physics.

Dale Graff:

Yes.

Interviewer:

Do you sometimes wrestle with yourself? Some of the things we're goingbto talk about tonight are far-out-there.

Dale Graff:

Well initally I did. But you know there's something that really changes your mind when you have the experiences. Then you really have to move off dead-centre and say,

"Hey! Something's going on here. I have to take a stand. I have to accept it. There's a reality here.

It doesn't conform to traditional training or beliefs whether it be scientific or even in some cases religious or philosofical."

You have to say,

"It's what the data shows."

In a way I'm an experimentalist. I'm an impiricist. I like to look at the data and make decisions from that.

So

After maybe a couple.of years, or so, of wrestling with it philosophically and to some extent scientifically I really didn't have any problem, with wrestling, whatever. (...)

Interviewer:

But as a scientist you don't stand with a lot of other scientists who would believe that. I mean there is just a few of you out there who believe in ESP and remote viewing and precognitive dreams, and I'm talking about scientists.

Dale Graff:

Yeah right, well that's because I've had the experiences myself and I was able to actually test them. You know, "are these real or not?" There's nothing like you're own personal experiences to be validated using scientific methodology.

Is it recorded?
Is there any way of queing?
Is there any way of misleading yourself?

So

When you go through that rigorous scientific kind of approach you end up saying:

"Hey! This result cannot be explained by any other means than paranormal"

What can you do? Any scientist out there that's willing to take a look at the phenomenon him or herself should end up where I am.

(27:11)

Interviewer:

You talk about a special aproach to psi and you have talked about two different methods,two modes. You call it conscious stage psi or dream stage psi. Explain the difference.

Dale Graff:

Well, what I have done over the years is look at in which most people experience their psi nature, their ESP, psi nature. And these are experiences that happen when we're basically awake although you might question whether or not there's some slight altered state going on, they're basically awake.

On the other hand most people spontaneously have their first psi, paranormal experiences in a dream state.

Interviewer:

Sure.

Dale Graff:

So it's a very valuable part of our experiences.

Interviewer:

Right.

Dale Graff:

In fact we spend 20 or 30 percent of our lives asleep and dreaming so why ignore that part of our life?

Interviewer:

They might not be aware of it in their dream state.

Dale Graff:

That happens a lot.

Interviewer:

Yeah.

Dale Graff:

People wake-up with a hunch. It may be a dream they forgot. And it was a precognitive dream.

I think this is where some deja vu* experiences come from.

You walk around the corner and see an unusual sight, you say, "I saw that before", "I've been here before" but when?

You may have been pre-empting the visit in a precognitive dream but didn't remember it when you woke-up.

*{Deja vu is French and literally means "already seen"}

Interviewer:

Do you think it's the brain that creates the dream or is it the consciousness?

Dale Graff:

Well that's an interesting question.

That's the one area which I've gone around and around for many years.

I think the mind is not all in the brain, if that makes sense to you. So that consciousness is more than the brain. It's something beyond the brain.

So, I think where we have dreams, or any kind of psi experience, that is paranormal, it could be a combination of something that is beyond our normal brain-mind that we are accessing.

And

If there is a consciouness field that we are immersed in, like many people suspected, and I think there is validity to that, then we are tapping into that larger field around us.

We certainly tap into a gravity field around us.

Interviewer:

What is it about the dream state that facinates you?

(29:50)

Dale Graff

Well partly, what facinates me, I'm facinated by both states, the conscious state and the dream state, both of them.

But I like the dream state personally because it's easier for most people to achieve. And we do it naturally all the time anyway. So to experience psi in the dream state is not that difficult. It's just a matter of practicing and staying with the routine of recording a journal.

And

I think in the dream state you actually get a lot of information.It's almost like a condenced movie. It's like a theatre of the mind.

So

With intentionality, practive and with work, and with just paying attention, you end-up with information presented to you in say five seconds. At night you wake-up and you had a five second dream packed full of information all intergrated together.

All you have to do is make notes and get-up in the morning and write it out. And it's an easier format for most people to work with.

30:56

Interviewer:

Some people will meditate and they will be very in intuitive in their awake-state. Yet a lot of people can do this in their dream-state.

Dale Graff:

Yes

Interviewer:

Is one particularly better than the other?

Dale Graff:

I think it depends. I think if you do one, if you meditate and/or go through some practices that improve intuition, or some remote viewing procedures, it will actually improve other aspects of your psi nature, including intuition and also dream recall.

But

a lot of people that I know don't go that far. They just stop with the conscious-state.

On the other hand ....

On the other hand if you exercise and keep dream journaling and work with dreams it also flows into the conscious-state arena. And it's easier to do. It's easier to experience intuitions and " synchronicities" .

So

one actually helps the other, they are synergistic aspects.

And why shouldn't they be? Psi is one fundamental phenomenon. It doesn't really matter if we're asleep or awake.

And

I think that when we are asleep we are naturally concerned about our welfare, whether we realise it or not.

And our sleeping-mind starts scanning around, to see what's going on.

We are curious when we sleep.

(41:11)

Look at post #16 of this thread:

http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/powerf...3/#post1901977

Dale Graff is not talking through his hat.

(41:11 to 42;00)

Interviewer:

It's a very powerful way thouhh, of, I think, growing by using your dreams, very powerful.

Dale Graff:

O yes, yes it is.

In fact it's more than just the psi aspect that I'm interested in because the dream content itself can be very revealing in terms of life goals, and in terms of talents that maybe we're birying.

I think Arnold Palmer for example, at one time actually created the ability to Lucid Dream golf swings to improve his natural talent ...

Interviewer:

(HaHa) It worked for him!

Dale Graff:

Ya! It worked.

So, and I know of swimmers who have practiced.

In fact years ago when I played a lot of tennis I would actually hope to have dreams of playing tennis.

Whether or not it improved my coordination or not I can't be sure but it sure improved mt confidence. ...

(42:00)

Originally Posted by debrajane

(41:11 to 42;00)

Interviewer:

It's a very powerful way thouhh, of, I think, growing by using your dreams, very powerful.

Dale Graff:

O yes, yes it is.

In fact it's more than just the psi aspect that I'm interested in because the dream content itself can be very revealing in terms of life goals, and in terms of talents that maybe we're birying.

I think Arnold Palmer for example, at one time actually created the ability to Lucid Dream golf swings to improve his natural talent ...

Interviewer:

(HaHa) It worked for him!

Dale Graff:

Ya! It worked.

So, and I know of swimmers who have practiced.

In fact years ago when I played a lot of tennis I would actually hope to have dreams of playing tennis.

Whether or not it improved my coordination or not I can't be sure but it sure improved mt confidence. ...

(42:00)

42 to mins

My old phone bookmark is now up to 49 views but right now I am at an Internet Café computer and I put C2AM – Psi Dreams – (Coast to Coast AM) into the Google search bar and got this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmSUEN5sIEw
(2:36:37) 6 views[/SIZE]
upload has more of the non interview stuff edited out so my time thingy’s are out by 11 minutes with this upload. So on this upload we’er up to:

(33:40)

Interviewer:

Now, how do you explain this one?

I had a dream where I was in a plane and I knew it was a small plane because I was looking out the window, a front window, the pilot’s window, even though I wasn’t flying it, so I was behind it. And it was coming down, not at a crash-way but it was coming down, there was no doubt about it. It was coming down, there was no runway, and it was coming into a residential area. I could see it getting closer to the roofs of homes.

Ok

Dale Graff:

Um uh

Interviewer:

I wake up.

And Dale, I go to the Internet cos I do every morning, and I’m perusing for news stories and there’s a story about 3 people dead in a small plane that crashed in a residential area.

Now, how do you explain that?

(34:25)

(34:25)

Dale Graff:

I think it’s pretty straight forward.

I do have a question. What time of the night did this occur, this dream?

Interviewer:

Well I don’t know. Oh, you mean in the dream?

Dale Graff:

No. When did you have a dream, early, late?

Interviewer:

I don’t know (hahaha) I was asleep.

Dale graff:

All right, fine, well I think what’s going on here is you were anticipating this discussion so you had the idea of precognition on your mind. And it’s almost like (…) the term that dream workers use, and I’m a member of the International Association for the Study of Dreams we like to use the term incubate a dream.

Interviewer:

Right.

(35:00)

Dale Graff:

So it’s like setting an intention to have a certain type of dream. In your case you had an interest in talking about precognitive dreams and your subconscious mind obliged you by presenting you with one. And I think that’s what led to your dream.

Now the other aspect to it is, because I am an aeronautical engineer from way back (even though I switched to physics later) and I built model airplanes, I have a tendency to have many precognitive dreams about airplanes. I have a lot of them.

Interviewer:

Yeah, no

I normally don’t. this was just really weird.

(35:40) (…) (36:07) so here’s the question. (36:43) I’m wondering if the moment I dreamt that was the moment they were going down?

(36:44)

(36:44)

Well this is why; this is why I asked the question (“I do have a question. What time of the night did this occur, this dream?”). It sounds like you did more than access the news account because I doubt if the news account would go into that count of detail.

Interviewer:

What if I was looking through the eyes of somebody in that plain?

Dale Graff:

Well I don’t know if you were doing that but you were certainly transposed into a position as if you were there. Where ever that incident, where ever that reality is and allows for precognition to occur, I think you just tapped-in to that reality. And actually became part of the scene in the dream state.

I’ve had lucid dreams like that where I seem to become actually part of the scene as an independent observer.

It may be the word “telepathy” fits, that could be another possibility, but I think you just tapped into that information space and presented in scenario as if you were a passenger.

(37:45)

Interviewer:

Tell me a little bit about the IASD The (International Association of the Study of Dreams)

(37:50)

Interviewer:

Tell me a little about the IASD the (International Association for the Study of Dreams).

Dale Graff:

Oh yeah, that’s a big organization. It was initiated about 1982/83. It began with the study of nightmares but it expanded to include all kinds of dreams. Creator dreams, we have a lot of artists, physicians, not only clinical people and psychologists and psychiatrists involved.

But we also have people that are artists. And we have a lot of people like myself who are from a different background, (physics).

And we have people that are good lucid dreamers, really top-notch and also people that are good precognitive dreamers. So we’re just a mixed bunch that gets along real well both the practitioners and the scientists.

Were having a big conference in Ashville North Carolina at the end of June and I’ll be giving two papers there. One on precognitive dreaming and my paper will be looking at how we can tell the difference between ordinary psi dreams and precognitive dreams.

Then I’m also going to be leading a panel that’s talking about another aspect of dreams that are very energetic. The term that’s sometimes used in the literature is the Kundilini phenomenon. Which is a very energetic experience that people can have in the awake state but it can also occur in the dream state.

So I’m going to be looking at both these aspects the energetic phenomenon as well as precognitive dreams. Because I think there’s a relationship between the two.

(39:30) commercial break. \

Dear Reader

I think Dale was referring to the Carolina Dream Gathering held at Asheville, North Carolina. It was the 2010 IASD International Conference. (27th-June to 1st-July)

Interviewer:

What can people do to train themselves for precognitive dreams?

Dale Graff:

Ok

Actually it's not that difficult.

The first thing, I would say is, "the attitude". You have to accept the possibility that it's possible.

It's not dissimilar to how we train for remote viewing.

You accept the reality of the phenomenon and say, "Yeah it's real", you don't have to be a believer, just accept the possibility.

Then

In terms of dreams the best aproach is

To begin a "dream journal"

and

"intend" each night to remember something.

It doesn't have to be a specific kind of dream. It's just whatever it is your dreaming about.

"Start recording" a dream or two. You don't have to do every one. We dream about 10 or more times a night anyway. You don't remember all that.

Interviewer:

So like, with that plane dream I would woken-up, wrote it down, explained what I saw and just put it in a journal.

Dale Graff:

Yeah, just jot down a few notes. You don’t have to write the whole thing out because you might not be finished with your dream cycle for the night.

Interviewer:

Mm mm.

Dale Graff:
The best thing to do is have a little note pad at your bedside and just jot down a few words. Then when you do wake-up in the morning, looking at those few words will trigger the entire thing. It will bring back the memory of the entire dream.

41:41

And it’s usually quite effective. But in terms of dreams, after you have experienced remembering dreams and recording them in your journal, writing them out, that is like sending a signal to your subconscious mind that you really are serious about this. And it helps reinforce your intention.

Then after a while, after maybe a few days, a few weeks of practice like this, then set aside a specific objective, like:

“I desire to remember a dream, (a psychic dream or a precognitive dream) about something that I will be encountering in the next day or something unique that will catch my attention". Whatever it is.

And hope that the dream, intend for the dream to be the last dream (or one of the last dreams) of the night and that it be as brief as possible.

With these strategies, with these intentionality’s it will help reduce all the static, all the noise that people normally have in a dream. And so the psi-dream or the precognitive dream is very brief, it’s very much to the point, it’s easy to remember, and it’s very clear.

So

With that kind of intentionality, it’s part strategy, you just simply practice at it until you have it down to the point of an art.

Interviewer:

Now when you do this does it invigorate you in your physical state? When you start dreaming and learning how to do this does it make you physically feel better?

(43:10)
(14:158)

Dale Graff is Presenting at the 2012 on-line confrrence. I just checked Bobbie Anne's blog and saw that.

I am delighted.
:yumdumdoodledum::yumdumdoodledum::yumdumdoodledum :

Can't register yet but here's the link to Bobbie Anne's blog and its up the top:

Notes From a Dreamer ... on Dreaming

in "Call for Dream Art"

(43:10 – 45:05)

Interviewer:

Now when you do this does it invigorate you in your physical state? When you start dreaming and learning how to do this does it make you physically feel better?

Dale graff:

Some dreams do that. In fact that’s why I’ll be talking about the energetic dreams at the IASD conference in Ashville (2010). Some dreams will energise you. You wake-up feeling far more empowered than you normally would have after a so called restful night. There is something that’s going on during in the dreaming state that I believe helps invigorate, helps energies your neural circuits, or whatever it does.

There are many times I wake-up in the morning really ready to go, charging, normally I wouldn’t do that. So there is something in the dream state, not all of them but there is something in the dream state that does help energises you.

(44:09)

Interviewer:

I hear you can use your dream state, Dale, to do incredible do incredible things too. To maybe get a better job, develop a relationship, concentrate on somebody…

We’ll get to lucid dreaming with you in just a moment, but for some reason, and I’ve always called this the wireless Internet, I think in your dream state, correct me, or at least give me your views, when you’re in the dream state these wireless connections, to each other, are everywhere. (…) I don’t know how it finds the other person (44:44) or the other thing but it seems to.

When you go to bed and concentrate and you concentrate on something like “Gosh, I want a better job” and sure enough somebody calls and makes you an offer for something. Something gets it to that other person, They pick-up on you, you pick-up on them. I don’t know how that works but it seems to happen that way, doesn’t it?

(45:05)

Psi Dreams - (Coast To Coast AM) C2CAM - YouTube

Dale Graff:


Oh yeah, absolutely.

In fact there is another related phenomenon that comes along with this that’s called synchronicity, when we have these unusual coincidences that happen and many times it’s because we had the thought (…) and the next day, there you are, you bump into that individual or you go to the library and there’s that book. So actually something kind of guided you to that spot. And I think it was energised as you thought about it and perhaps as you dreamt about it that actually helped facilitated the connections like you point out, to help bring these paths together.
(45:51)

There’s definitely interconnections going on really clear when you look at dreams and particular this issue of shared dreams too.

If more people kept records of their dreams they’d be surprised at how often that their friends or their spouses or loved ones would have the identical dreams. And I don’t mean just simply deducing patterns that are normal but very unique things that happen and you dream about the same things. And there’s no known natural basis for doing this other than the connectivity through the subconscious mind through this psi-phenomenon.

Interviewer:

Dale, tell me a little bit about your lucid dreaming investigations.

(46:40)

Originally Posted by debrajane

Dale Graff
There’s definitely interconnections going on really clear when you look at dreams and particular this issue ofshared dreams too.

If more people kept records of their dreams they’d be surprised at how often that their friends or their spouses or loved ones would have the identical dreams. And I don’t mean just simply deducing patterns that are normal but very unique things that happen and you dream about the same things. And there’s no known natural basis for doing this other than the connectivity through the subconscious mind through this psi-phenomenon.

Interviewer:

Dale, tell me a little bit about your lucid dreaming investigations.
(46:40)

Psi Dreams - (Coast To Coast AM) C2CAM - YouTube
2hr:36min:37sec (31views)
Published on June 22, 2012 by ConspiracyRadioShows
17-Feb-2010 interview with Dale Graff

(46:40)

Dale Graff:

Oh yeah, well that comes along with the dream investigations. In time you will find that the dream, even if you don’t intend them to be, they will become lucid. And by that I mean that you will be dreaming and you will be absolutely aware that you are dreaming. You’ll say to yourself in the dream, “Hey, I’m dreaming” (ha)

Interviewer:

So nothing can happen to me, right.

Dale Graff:

Yeah, right. In fact some of my colleagues in the IASD use the lucid dreaming approach to correct issues, like health. Healing can be facilitated in a lucid dream by imagining. In the lucid dream imagine the afflicted part to become rosy, healthy, receive energy, whatever the model is that you choose. And you become sort of your own self healer; activate your own immune system.

I have also heard of people who have Brocken habits like smoking in lucid dreams. By confronting the image of the smoking habit (.?.) perceive it as some kind of demon or devil or fire-breathing dragon. You confront that in the lucid dream, defeat it, in a way, or at least “intent” it to go away and some way or another you wake up not having the craving for the cigarette. (48:09)

You confront that in the lucid dream, defeat it, in a way, or at least “intent” it to go away and some way or another you wake up not having the craving for the cigarette. (48:09) So something has happened in the neuro-circuits to either bypass those circuits that made you addicted or you became more intentional in the waking state and more fixed on your goal.

So somehow doing it in the lucid dream helps energise and helps facilitate the intent.

Psi Dreams - (Coast To Coast AM) C2CAM - YouTube

2hr:36min:37sec (31views) 38 NOW
Published on June 22, 2012 by ConspiracyRadioShows
17-Feb-2010 interview with Dale Graff

Interviewer:

It truly is remarkable isn’t it?

Dale Graff:

Oh yeah, it’s something that makes us realise that the mind whether we are awake or asleep there’s really a lot of potential. There was a book many years ago and I liked the title of it:

Mind as Healer Mind as Slayer

You know we can heal ourselves or we can get ourselves in a state of mind where we actually kill ourselves through mental negativity. So the mind and the consciousness part of it is really a powerful thing to consider and the resource we have with our mind whether we are awake or asleep is incredible.
(49:19)

Interviewer:

Can you die in your dream state?

Dale Graff:

Can you die?

Interviewer:

Yeah, remember the old thing if you’re falling. If you hit the ground you’re gunna die.

Dale Graff:

Noo!

Interviewer:

So you wake up before you hit.

Dale Graff:

I don’t know where that came from but in the lucid dreaming … in the IASD community you just simply go along and see where you go. You free-fall and… the purpose of those dreams is, I believe, in fact and I’m pretty much convinced of it now is to help us overcome fear.

If we have a fear of heights or a fear of anything, we may have a dream where we’re falling and we panic and want to get out of it, well, that’s the wrong thing to do. You want to just continue it and see where it goes to overcome the fear because you know that you’re indestructible in the dream state. (50:04)

And there are other things that happen in the dream state to help us overcome fear. Sometimes people are afraid of, let’s say snakes. And if you have a really unhealthy fear of reptile’s chances you’ll have many dreams about them chasing you. The thing to do then is confront them, whether it’s lucid or not, in the dream, to help overcome this unhealthy fear.

Interviewer:

And it works

Dale Graff:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s not to say you through caution to the wind but there are many instances where we can overcome these fears. Whether it be in a relationship, or whether it be in something else that we’re doing where we’re afraid to venture forward in a new direction or whatever.

We can actually create a scenario that we’re hoping to have and practice it in advance so we can overcome stage fright or whatever the jitters are that are keeping us down. So it’s a good place where we can strengthen your own will and belief system. (51:15)

Interviewer:

Let’s go back to the Star Gate Program for a minute to see how this ties in Dale

Dale:

OK

Interviewer:

Did they ever instruct you or anybody else to go into a dream state to try to harm somebody? I’m not trying to be rude here for you but, I mean if this was a military or government program who knows what was happening.

Dale:

No, absolutely no. I realise that there are some people out there making claims otherwise but the issues we had in the group, we had to get (?) approval every year through the Department of Defence. We had very strict protocol to follow and procedures we had to adhere to make sure that not only the people in the group not put under any kind of harm position but that what was done would in no way, ever, endanger anyone else.

So it was strictly an information gathering activity there was no intent to do anything like influence.

Interviewer:

Could that have been going on and you didn’t know about it?

(54:44)

Dale:

If it was going on if it was something that was done on, on the side by someone who thought they could do it, but it had nothing to do with the official Star Gate Program.

The other thing I would question and I’ve heard people talk about this and I will challenge them to their face because I don’t believe it, but the other thing I would like to comment on here about that is, I don’t think it’s possible to actually harm anybody, psychically. I think what happens is we have our own inner self defence systems. At most we might have a dream about somebody having evil thoughts towards us and I’ve had a number of those.

Interviewer:

Oh, right, right.

Dale:

And they’ve been very successful in the sense of avoiding personal issues later on. So here was a case where somebody intended to do some evil act toward me and I had a heads-up.

Interviewer:

You might be able to repel it, right.

Dale:

Repel it either by having information and acting accordingly or subconsciously by having it thwarted in some way through your subconscious defence mechanism. And I believe we all have that.

(55:55)

Originally Posted by havago

Interviewer:

Let’s go back to the Star Gate Program for a minute to see how this ties in Dale

Dale:

OK

Interviewer:

Did they ever instruct you or anybody else to go into a dream state to try to harm somebody? I’m not trying to be rude here for you but, I mean if this was a military or government program who knows what was happening.

Dale:

No, absolutely no. I realise that there are some people out there making claims otherwise but the issues we had in the group, we had to get (?) approval every year through the Department of Defence. We had very strict protocol to follow and procedures we had to adhere to make sure that not only the people in the group not put under any kind of harm position but that what was done would in no way, ever, endanger anyone else.

So it was strictly an information gathering activity there was no intent to do anything like influence.

Was... but now... is?

Interviewer:

Could that have been going on and you didn’t know about it?

(54:44)

Dale:

If it was going on if it was something that was done on, on the side by someone who thought they could do it, but it had nothing to do with the official Star Gate Program.

So, in other words, yes? Of course not. They are called the Dream Corps, the elite of the Stargate RV'ers.

The other thing I would question and I’ve heard people talk about this and I will challenge them to their face because I don’t believe it, but the other thing I would like to comment on here about that is, I don’t think it’s possible to actually harm anybody, psychically. I think what happens is we have our own inner self defence systems. At most we might have a dream about somebody having evil thoughts towards us and I’ve had a number of those.

Bullshit.

Interviewer:

Oh, right, right.

Dale:

And they’ve been very successful in the sense of avoiding personal issues later on. So here was a case where somebody intended to do some evil act toward me and I had a heads-up.

Interviewer:

You might be able to repel it, right.

Dale:

Repel it either by having information and acting accordingly or subconsciously by having it thwarted in some way through your subconscious defence mechanism. And I believe we all have that.

(55:55)

Never Trust a Templar. 5 is a demon.

55:55
I got a yen to transcribe more of this Dale Graff interview YouTube but it has gone. Folks ask me when I waste so much time and energy transcribing stuff I like off Youtube. Now you know. I wish, wish I had transcribed the whole interview when I had the chance.