Thread: After 6 months of dedicated work, I still have yet to have a LD. Any help?

Of course you can LD. You're getting close!

When you're in the hypnogogic state, imagine anything happening that isn't at the moment. When that something you're imagining happens, you're dreaming.

You can dream of being in the hypnogogic state, so it's important to take an active role of the creation of the dream at this stage, otherwise nothing else might happen that signals you're dreaming.

Yep, I agree with Dolphin, you're getting very close! Another thing, try not to stress over how long it takes to achieve lucidity. Relax and try to enjoy the journey :-)

Also try WILD in afternoon nap! The point is actually not to think too much. Practice, practice, practice, and you'll achieve your goal.

Well I say you ve been working too hard. Do ur RC n DJ n then sleep. Ull get ur lucid dream when u take it easy . I had the same issue for around a month n when everything seemed impossible for me I stopped it n had my first ld. Guys here told me about it n again after reading their posts I had another lucid dream.
I'm going to try techniques now.
Hope this helped.

Well I say you ve been working too hard. Do ur RC n DJ n then sleep. Ull get ur lucid dream when u take it easy . I had the same issue for around a month n when everything seemed impossible for me I stopped it n had my first ld. Guys here told me about it n again after reading their posts I had another lucid dream.
I'm going to try techniques now.
Hope this helped.

Well, still have yet to have had a LD. But at least I can narrow down to the part that's not working me.

I can seem to get that sweet spot of hypnagogic sensations, sleep paralysis, etc almost every single night with very little effort. It's the transitioning that into a dream where I get stuck.

Almost every technique at this point boils down to "imagine really hard your in the dream and visualize". But that doesn't seem to do anything for me. I can visualize and imagine scenes at this point for a long time but I'm not actually LDing. When I a do a RC it always comes back I'm awake. And if I stop visualizing for even a second the whole thing dissolves instantly.

I guess I just really need a technique or tips for the transition. Something to help me cross the line. I can get to the point of an LD almost effortlessly now, but just can't seem to make the last step.

To me it sounds like you might be a little too tense to slip into the dream state fully. "Imagine really hard" doesn't really imply trying really hard. You have to be very relaxed, essentially relaxing into the conscious sleep. I would also suggest maybe to try to only focus on your awareness and visualizations. Don't pay any attention at all to the sensations you get from sleep paralysis and the transitioning. That may be exciting you just enough to keep you from relaxing enough.

Hey Rendar, maybe you need to forget about the visuals for a bit? It could be that you are getting to the dream state, but concentrating too hard on visuals? Try instead to imagine that you are in an LD, but have your eyes closed. See if you can do an RC to prove this. You don't need visuals to do the nose pinch RC, for instance. It's also possible to have an FA "in the blackness", so do an RC if you appear to have woken but it's dark. Once you find you are in an LD, but with no visuals, you can then work on getting the visuals to appear (try opening your dream eyes with your fingers).

Just an idea?

Also, are you sure you were in sleep paralysis? Sometimes it's possible to fool yourself that you are, but your not. I get that where I think I'm in SP, but don't want to move, because I know that breaks the spell, but the few times I've really been in SP you really can't move, and can really try to, without success.

Keep going Rendar1970 - your doing fine ...just mix it up now and then relaxing and taking moments of presence etc

So here's an interesting twist. Woke up naturally around 4am. Didn't get out of bed as I was more tired than usual. But I did SSILD. After a few cycles I kind snapped awake almost like when you get startled out of a day dream. But something felt off, like gravity was a bit heavier. So tried a nose pinch RC, and couldn't breathe. I needed to use the bathroom so I got up out of bed. Did a hand RC too just because and everything was normal. Got the bathroom and when I looked at the mirror it wasn't a reflection, it was more like a window. Went to do an RC again and woke up.

So yeah, had a false awakening that 2 different RC's didn't work on. This has happened in my dreams too. Something odd will happen, I will RC, and everything comes back fine...

When you looked into the mirror, did you realise that you were dreaming, if only for a second? If you did, you had an LD!

To make your RCs work (i.e. Show that you are dreaming), try having the intention that they will fail, rather than expecting them to work (because they always work when you are awake). I've had the same where the nose pinch RC doesn't work in a dream. Do it again with the expectation that you are dreaming and it works (can breathe).

I think I'm going to belatedly jump on the "you're trying too hard" bandwagon here, Rendar, but I do have a couple of additional suggestions:

* You might consider attempting your WILDs once a week instead of three. This way you can spend the week preparing for your WILD and building up expectations. FILD and SSILD are techniques for achieving WILD's BTW, which is not a technique but the name given to the form of transition to lucidity you are making (wake-to sleep-to-dream without losing waking-life self-awareness).

* Your WBTB's seem a bit short; it could be that you are not quite waking up enough, and are inclined to go back to sleep too quickly -- just before your WILD attempt can be completed, it seems. This might run counter to the problem you might have with trying too hard (which would wake you up too much), but it could be worth some experimentation.

* Let's assume for a second that your WILD's might just not be working for you, perhaps because your knowledge base in what makes it work is a bit too solid: like a surgeon operating on himself, you sort of get in your own way as you progress toward your WILD. So why not go back to DILD? Consider revisiting the MILD technique, and give its day work some extra attention. It could just be that your head is not in the right place for WILD, and doing MILD to induce DILD's might be the thing to get you to lucidity, because it does so without your intellectual interference (DILD is also not a technique, BTW). Also, two months of MILD, which I assume was how long you tried before giving up, is not as long a time as it sounds... maybe another month will do the trick.

Switching to DILD attempts might also solve your apparent (to me, anyway) problem of trying too hard. Since most MILD work occurs during the day (RC's, memory exercises, etc.), and the only bedtime work happens when you go to sleep at night (well before the dream occurs), you will be sidestepping all the thinking you're doing during your WILD attempts.

* You might do a quick search of Fryingman's threads, because his experience was very similar to yours, and he found a way through it, after much struggle.

* Finally, and less critical: it really isn't that important to write down every dream, every time you wake up during the night. If you enjoy doing this, then great; but if it is a nuisance or is somehow interfering with your night's sleep or the rest of your lucidity work (i.e., its making you dislike the process), then you might just record the dreams you remember upon waking in the morning, which is adequate, in my mind.

Good luck!

Thank you very much for your suggestions Sageous. I have taken all you said into consideration and will be following your advice.

For what it's worth the last few nights I have been extremely tired so have put off the night time practice for a few nights. Last night I had a false awakening on its own without having done any techniques that night.

I dreamed all the plants in my outdoor garden died overnight. When I was examining them I noticed their was some strange auto watering system in place that I had obviously not installed. I realized I must be dreaming and before I could do a RC I snapped awake. I rolled around in bed for about 10 minutes and couldn't get back to sleep. So I got up and decided to go check my garden just out of interest. When I went outside all my plants were dead and that weird watering system was there. I got really confused for a second and then thought "ohhh $%&*$ this is a false awakeni...." and woke up for real before is even finished the thought.

So... I had sort of a breakthrough last night.

I woke up naturally on my own (not attempting WBTB or anything) around 5am. It was already kind of bright in my room so I put on a sleep mask and tried to get back to sleep. I was looking at the fractals and shapes behind my closed eyes, more out of habit than trying to induce a LD.

And for the first time ever I think I saw real Hypnagogic Imagery. The random fractals started to solidify, they took on the shape of a sign with words on, but the words were hard to read, then I started to see the form of a street with hills in the background forming. Every time I tried to "enter the scene" I would end up waking myself up too much and lose it. But this process repeated about 3x before I feel asleep.

So its something I suppose.

Yes, that's definitely a good sign. I get the same when I try to WBTB, often the fractals will form into a very real face or object, and then immediately back to fractals again. Unfortunately for me I usually transition on to sleep without being able to hold the dream scene, but it is a sign of getting close.
Another suggestion from me is to read other people's dream journal entries on here where they are describing their lucid dreams. For me it's a great reminder of what it feels like, and it should give you some inspiration. Also it's more proof that if they can do it, so can you!

Hi, beginner here. Just an observation: reality checks are important but non the only way to get a DILD.
Are you collecting your dream signs when you wrote down your dreams? The mirror was a clear dream sign, you didn't need to perform any reality check because you knew it already that it was a dream!
If the gravity is different, that's a dream. If the mirror doesn't reflect you precisely, that's a dream. If people, objects or texts change by looking in other direction and looking there again, that's a dream, no doubt: there is no need for a reality check. Those are reality checks on their own.

Looks to me that you are incredibly diligent and progressing so much but you're too anxious to get results. You're so close!

I thought that I would just chip in as well.

I started trying to LD over a year ago, had a few breaks if I'm honest, I've had a few lucid dreams but nothing anywhere near like what some people on here describe, all very low lucidity and dream like and short lasting - nothing anywhere near real life. I don't think it comes naturally to some of us. Your false awakening sounds more realistic than anything I have had so far.

I'm still trying and determined that one day I will become fully lucid and see what people are talking about.

Good luck.

^^ This is a bit off topic, but, just to help you better measure your progress, Smudgefish:

Contrary to what you might be reading on these forums, lucidity has nothing to do with realism or vividness.

You can be fully lucid in the dullest of dreams (and have a great time in the process, believe it or not), just has you can have the most realistic dreams ever and not be lucid at all.

Lucidity is about the presence of your waking-life self-awareness in a dream, and that can happen regardless of the quality of the dream itself. Yes, once lucid (and with a little practice) you can potentially increase quality and make your dreams more clear or vivid, but that will be a result of your desire, and not be a bi-product of lucidity.

So you might work solely on simply knowing you are dreaming during the dream, and be happy with whatever you get when you are lucid. Explore your dream regardless of vividness, and you might just find some interesting stuff anyway... and don't be disappointed when you wake up if your dream wasn't vivid; if you were lucid, that is what matters. Later as you have more LD's under your belt, and have gotten used to being in the moment of a dream, you will have plenty of time to make the dreams as vivid as you desire. It's never a good idea to put hurdles like this in your path to successful LD'ing, I think.

Thanks Sageous.

My post was supposed to be supportive rather than negative in any way. Personally I'm very happy with my progress. I was really just trying to point out that it does take time and effort, and perhaps what we expect when we first start out having read all the wonderful stories about realms just as real as waking life where we can do absolutely anything our hearts desire is not quite what happens for most of us, at least not immediately (or maybe for years).

This is hard work requiring patience and dedication and you have to really want to succeed, unless you are one of the lucky few. At least that is my experience.

^^ I understood that...

I just have a perhaps annoying habit of pointing out whenever I can that the myth of lucidity equaling vividness/realism is not true, and believing it can slow down your lucid progress or lead to unnecessary disappointment. Sometimes my doing so runs off-topic and contrary to the spirit of a post (like this time), but I can't seem to hold myself back from fighting these internet-borne myths that have little to do with successful LD'ing.

Feel free to ignore my intrusion!