# Lucid Dreaming > General Lucid Discussion >  >  I need an army of lucid dreamers...

## DanielLove

Hi Dreamviews, 

I should introduce myself first - I'm Daniel Love, some of you may already know of me as the author of _Are You Dreaming?_. I'm also a reasonably well known lucid dream researcher and educator.
I've been a user and lurker of DreamViews for an embarrassingly long time, certainly long enough to make me feel my age! However, I've decided it's time to use my "official" account (which has been dormant far too long) as it'll give me a little more of a chance to get to know you all and also because I'd like to share with you an exciting new project I've got lined up; one I'd love you all to be involved in.

I can't give away too much at this point (sorry!), other than I'm planning something rather ambitious. I'm around two/three weeks away from launching but I'd like to give all a chance to sign up to be the first in the know.

What I'm looking for is an *army of enthusiastic lucid dreamers*, who are passionate about really pushing lucid dreaming far beyond its current boundaries. If this sounds like you - then you can use the link below to sign up to a mailing list, which I'll use to inform you all of the details as soon as things are ready. In return, I'll just ask for your help in spreading the project when it's released. Don't worry, I hate spam as much as you do, so you're safe to sign up.

*You can sign up here:*
*Sign up - Play your part in the future of lucid dreaming...*

Also, my deadline means I'm spending a Friday night stuck in my office - so, I'll be here a while to answer any questions, or just chat and get to know you all. Please feel free to ask me anything.

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## gab

Signed up! But clicking on "continue to our website" takes me back to sign up page.

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## DanielLove

Great, glad to have you on the team gab!  :smiley: 

Don't worry - that's exactly what should happen after the sign up, at the moment it's just a means for people to show interest, I'll be e-mailing details once the project is ready to be released into the wild; which will be in about two to three weeks.

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## Saizaphod

I'm in. Sounds super interesting!  :smiley:

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## DanielLove

Thanks Saizaphod! 
Great to have you on board! 

I'm very excited about this project and it's wonderful to have other dedicated dreamers along for the journey!

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## Raipat

Sounds very interesting. I sincerely hope it will be something as groundbreaking as the teaser suggests to be and not something very commercial like many other try these times...  :smiley:

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## DanielLove

Hi Raipat, 

I can completely understand your concerns. I'm not sure if you're familiar with my previous work but I've always tried to be as blunt and honest as possible, and it's my personal battle to try and "clean up" the subject of lucid dreaming - to make it more realistic and human. There's a lot of regurgitated material out there and a lot of hype for things that don't live up to expectations - so believe me, I'm on the same page as you with this. 

So I'll say this, I'm a lucid dreamer and a human being just like you. I can't work miracles (other than in the dream world). The project will only be as commercial as anything realistically needs to be to come into existence. I've dedicated my life to lucid dreaming and I can guarantee you that what I do is from the heart and fuelled by a passion for lucid dreaming. I've always found the most wonder and joy come from the free things in life (lucid dreaming, nature, knowledge etc.) so I've never been motivated by commercialism. 

So, this isn't going to be another "magic pill/machine/course" that ends in disappointment - I don't even believe such things are necessarily possible or even very desirable.

What I'm offering will be is a genuine attempt to expand the field of lucid dreaming and to push things forward.

That's a bit of a ramble but I think your concerns deserved a thoughtful response. Basically, temper excitement with realism and I'll do my best to make something worthwhile!

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## Oneirin

All signed up. I loved your book, and glad to be a part of the project!

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## gab

> ...
> 
> What I'm offering will be is a genuine attempt to expand the field of lucid dreaming and to push things forward.



This is so incredibly exciting. I feel like 5 years ago when I just discovered lucid dreaming.  ::D:

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## DanielLove

Thanks Oneirin (great name by the way), 

I'm really pleased you enjoyed the book, I hope it helped with your own adventures? 
The project is going to be quite vast and so there will be several stages to get involved with. The first and most important will be helping spread the word, as everything else will rely on that. You'll receive an email in about two weeks with more info. I'll also be checking into this thread as often as my schedule permits - so I'll share more when the time is right.  :smiley:

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## Raipat

Thank you for your open response. I never did question your motives, especially not knowing your well-written book!
Like you put it, as LD-ing is getting more mainstream, nowadays there are so many "magic pill/machine/course" products, that are either useless/unfinished or expensive or both, and many self-proclaimed instructors repeat the same old stuff again and again on youtube trying to sell to an audience of people who want to consume LD as just another form of entertainment. So more than ever I'm hoping for a real effort to try some new aproaches and explore new possibilities.
I myself value LD as a mental and spiritual practice I'm following for many years. If there is anything I can contribute, I'm glad and honored to be a "soldier" in your "army"...

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## DanielLove

I agree completely Raipat, 

Certainly there is a danger that as lucid dreaming becomes mainstream that it risks being swallowed by a fast-food style mentality - making it essentially insubstantial, unsatisfying and lacking its true potential. This is actually a part of what I aim to address, as lucid dreaming is such a valuable skill, with potentials that remain, still, very much untapped. Like you, I see it as an aspect of our universe that should be approached with the awe and respect it deserves. When I look into the constellations of my dreams, I am filled with the same sense of wonder that the stars in a clear night sky would instil. At the same time, realism and honesty are vital components that are often lacking from much of the material on the subject (hype seems far more popular)- again, this is something I'd like to continue to address.

Basically, we're all adventurers in a very exciting and mysterious universe. If nothing else, it's that passion for dreams, life and everything in between that I want to share. 

I'd certainly value your help in any way. Thank you!

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## Ginsan

I won't sign up, but I just want to say I'm looking forward to your work. I'm curious  :smiley:   Good luck to you and to everyone who's signing up!

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## Sageous

Please forgive me for not fawning, Mr. Love, but why are you being so secretive?  I for one would really like to know for what specifically you need an army of LD'ers.

Respectfully, it seems that your thoughtful response to Raipat above actually said nothing at all about the project for which you wish to recruit us.  Why not just tell us what you want us to do, and in as much detail as this format allows?  You must know to some degree what you wish to do, right? Are you concerned that someone might steal your idea?  This seems odd, if you have no commercial interests.

I'm sure that whatever project you have in mind is a fine one, but if your name weren't attached to it, it would appear as presented here like little more than an attempt to put together a mailing list.

I hope you'll excuse my cynicism, but it would have been nice if you had presented your project up front, and let us decide whether to sign up based on its merits rather than simply trust (or be impressed by) your celebrity in the LD'ing community.  To hide its content from us and bank instead on your name recognition seems a bit disingenuous to me.

I'm sure this post will raise some ire from other members, and perhaps a stern warning from Gab, but I really felt this quetion needed to be asked; I hope you understand.

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## DanielLove

> Please forgive me for not fawning, Mr. Love, but why are you being so secretive?  I for one would really like to know for what specifically you need an army of LD'ers.
> 
> Respectfully, it seems that your thoughtful response to Raipat above actually said nothing at all about the project for which you wish to recruit us.  Why not just tell us what you want us to do, and in as much detail as this format allows?  You must know in general what you wish to do, right? Are you concerned that someone might steal your idea?  This seems odd, if you have no commercial interests.
> 
> I'm sure that whatever project you have in mind is a fine one, but if your name weren't attached to it, it would appear as presented like little more than an attempt to put together a mailing list.
> 
> I hope you'll excuse my cynicism, but it would have been nice if you had presented your project up front, and let us decide whether to sign up based on its merits rather than simply trust (or be impressed by) your celebrity in the LD'ing community.  To hide its content from us and bank instead on your name recognition seems a bit disingenuous to me.
> 
> I'm sure this post will raise some ire from other members, and perhaps a stern warning from Gab, but I really felt this quetion needed to be asked; I hope you understand.



Hi Sageous, 

No problem at all, you're asking exactly the same questions I would in your position. I respect forthrightness and critical thinking. 
To answer your questions... (please understand that it's long gone midnight here, so I'm not quite as clear minded as I'd like to be, I'll try and just stick to the points, as I really do need to sleep very soon)

Yes I'm very clear in my plan as I've been working on little besides it for quite some time now. But, I'm sure you can understand that when one is preparing something like this that there is a schedule that helps keep things running smoothly. It's not unlike cooking a surprise meal for friends, you'd not sit everyone at the table before you'd purchased the ingredients or cooked the meal, nor would you serve all the courses at once. So forgive my secretiveness, I'd really love to just spell it all out right now (I really would) but it wouldn't do any of us any favours - you'd all just hear an unpolished "plan" without the means to move forward with it. Essentially you'd be reading the menu two weeks before you get to eat. 

I'm also reliant on a few external entities that require me to work with their schedule. I'm champing at the bit wanting to move forward, which is why I'm running this pre-promotion to gather interest. In keeping with the meal analogy, I'm laying the table in preparation for the meal. 

I'm also making a video to explain the project clearly, the crew are booked for Monday and it will likely take at least a week of post production. 

The point of asking people to sign up to the list is to do exactly what you're asking, I'll lay the entire plan out once it is ready to go live and when people can actually see a finished concept, and then you will all have the chance to make your own minds up. I'm sure some people will like it, others won't - but I'd prefer to present it in the best possible way I can, and that takes a bit of preparation. 

I'm certainly not asking anyone to trust me, nor (god forbid) assume I have any status with which to impress. I'm a passionate lucid dreamer just like you, and consider myself no more. I'm just saying "hey, I've got something interesting lined up, can't share it yet because I still need to do some work, but if you want to be the first to know about it, here's a way to find out". 

The simple truth is, I could tell you exactly what the plan is right now - but we'd all still have to wait two to three weeks before anything could be done about it. The alternative was that I didn't mention anything until everything was ready, but then, I'd be playing catch up with trying to get peoples attention.  It seems to me that the best option is to always do a task earlier rather than later if it's possible - this way I'll have more time to invest elsewhere when things are live. 

You've made perfectly good points and I absolutely take no offence whatsoever, I hope this goes some way to answering why I'm doing things the way I am - and the apparent secrecy. I know it's frustrating and I can understand why your cynicism would kick in, I'd be the same in your shoes. However, I'd just ask you to understand that the creation of anything requires a lot of work and planning. 

I'm a perfectionist and lucid dreaming is my life's passion. I want to do this to the best of my abilities and that, unfortunately, is going to take just a little more time. I certainly appreciate everyone's patience and understanding. :smiley:

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## DoubleHelix

Sign-up page not working ATM?  Seems frozen and/or non responsive.

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## DanielLove

> Sign-up page not working ATM?  Seems frozen and/or non responsive.



How are you accessing it? Seems to be working at my end.
Maybe refresh the page or try a different browser?

If you can't get it to work, send me a private message with your email address and I can add you manually  :smiley:

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## dolphin

> I'd really love to just spell it all out right now (I really would) but it wouldn't do any of us any favours - you'd all just hear an unpolished "plan" without the means to move forward with it.



 In my opinion, this would do us favors. We would benefit from knowing what was going on, and you would benefit from the trust, feedback, and interest gained from the disclosure.





> The simple truth is, I could tell you exactly what the plan is right now - but we'd all still have to wait two to three weeks before anything could be done about it.



I don't think we would mind waiting a few weeks if we knew what the plan was and knew it was a work in progress. If the project is interesting, then our interest would not go down in a few weeks time.

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## DanielLove

Hey Dolphin, 

You and Sageous have made some good points. I'd actually appreciate prior feedback from you all. Perhaps if Gab or a forum admin is able to create a non-public section of the forum, then I'd be able to share the full concept with you all and we could work together on a few of the details. 

Like I've already said though, I'm still refining things and what you'll see will be unpolished. It will be lacking the video and a few key components that are quite vital. So, as you can imagine, in its current state I'd prefer not to be sharing it in a public forum - but I'm more than happy for the DreamViews community to help me polish things.  I'm certainly not being secretive out of choice, I'd more than appreciate a little help. I'd just rather do things right, than be impatient and rush things.

I'll message Gab tomorrow and see if there's any way to do something like that. 
It really will have to wait until tomorrow though as it's 2am here and I've got to be up at 7 - which I'm pretty sure isn't what the DreamViews "Staying up all night" catchphrase was meant to encapsulate.  :;-): 

For the time being, *signing up* will still guarantee those who are interested will be the first to know when everything is live and complete. So here's that link again: *Sign up here*

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## BlairBros

I found this out first from the lucid dreaming day facebook page, so already signed up  :smiley: .

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## gab

I have been thinking how to make some kind of a private space. And I’m sorry to say that under these circumstances, I don’t think it can be done.

There is no way to make a single thread visible to only certain people (like registered members), or to password protect it. It would have to be the whole “General Lucid Dreaming” forum. But I’m sure you will all agree that would not be a right thing to do.


Guys, I understand your concerns. We had our share of newbie “researchers” that come to pick our brains but they don’t offer anything in return.  All we ask from them in return is to post results from the study on the forum, so all our members can benefit. And to mention Dreamviews as a resource, which I think it’s only fair to you all. But most of those posts you guys don’t even get to see, because they are filtered out after unsuccessful requests for cooperation. 

Well, Daniel Love joined in 2014 and he promoted DreamViews in his book “Are you Dreaming?” and placed a link to DreamViews on his Lucid Dreaming Day website. All without being asked to and without receiving any favors from us.

I personally trust that this project will be exciting. Maybe we even help with some breakthrough, or with wider acceptance of LDs and dreams in general.  Isn’t that what we all want, why we are all here? Isn’t that why we post our experiences and ask questions? To learn, to teach, to get better at this wonderful thing called lucid dreaming.

Signing up only guarantees information when it becomes ready. After that we can decide if we want to participate, or not. I don’t see any harm in waiting few weeks to receive the info.

I dunno, it’s like Christmas. You know you will have presents under the tree. But do you really wanna know what they gonna be?

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## MadzAssassin

I would sign up but I haven't had a LD in ages and I am struggling with induction xD Plus it's exam period so I doubt I'll have the time.

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## Patience108

Thanks Daniel  :smiley:  Yours was the first LD book I read and I loved it - nice that you will be around more at DV too possibly

I signed up  ::wizard::

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## Sensei

Hey Daniel, haven't read your book. haha. I keep checking to see if it is at my bookstores, and I am too lazy to just order it offline.  :tongue2:  I have heard some good things about it though.

I am fine with being in the dark as it is. Of course if it ends up being something I find boring, I just won't participate. There are very few "research" ideas for LDing that enough people get behind to get anything done. I imagine if you are running it we should have enough. I just hope it isn't something metaphysical. That bores me. 

I signed up.

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## DanielLove

@Gab @Dolphin @Sageous - Thanks for trying Gab! I'm sure this may disappoint Dolphin and Sageous. I'll try and meet you guys half way and pop onto chat sometime after the weekend to share more details and get feedback from those who are interested.

@MadzAssassin - No problem, the project isn't aimed solely at accomplished lucid dreamers, so you'd be more than welcome. However, focusing on your exams may be more sensible!

@Patience108 - Thanks for the kind words, really glad you enjoyed the book. I hope this new project is to your liking as well!

@Sensei - Haha! I'd have assumed it's more effort to visit the bookstore!  ::tongue::  Of course, I'm not asking for anyone to commit to anything. It's just a chance for you guys to be the first in the know... if you find it doesn't interest you at that point, you're more than welcome to walk away, throw tomatoes at me, or enslave my first born. As for metaphysical, once you read my book you'll understand that's definitely not my style. Philosophical at times perhaps, but I prefer to not meddle in the personal and hugely varied nature of other peoples beliefs. Oh, and it's not a research project, there may be research involved in the longer term, but it's more of an ecosystem for furthering the subject, which will include research amongst many other factors.

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## Sageous

> Guys, I understand your concerns. We had our share of newbie “researchers” that come to pick our brains but they don’t offer anything in return.  All we ask from them in return is to post results from the study on the forum, so all our members can benefit. And to mention Dreamviews as a resource, which I think it’s only fair to you all. But most of those posts you guys don’t even get to see, because they are filtered out after unsuccessful requests for cooperation. 
> 
> Well, Daniel Love joined in 2014 and he promoted DreamViews in his book “Are you Dreaming?” and placed a link to DreamViews on his Lucid Dreaming Day website. All without being asked to and without receiving any favors from us.
> 
> I personally trust that this project will be exciting. Maybe we even help with some breakthrough, or with wider acceptance of LDs and dreams in general.  Isn’t that what we all want, why we are all here? Isn’t that why we post our experiences and ask questions? To learn, to teach, to get better at this wonderful thing called lucid dreaming.
> 
> Signing up only guarantees information when it becomes ready. After that we can decide if we want to participate, or not. I don’t see any harm in waiting few weeks to receive the info.
> 
> I dunno, it’s like Christmas. You know you will have presents under the tree. But do you really wanna know what they gonna be?



That's all well and good, Gab, and I do appreciate (even if I do not generally agree with) Mr Love's responses above... but it would still be nice to know for what war Mr. Love needs an army before I enlist.

There is a reason I am making this fuss, other than just to make a fuss.  With no offense whatsoever to Mr. Love, who I am surely not placing in this category: Many very high profile gurus in the LD'ing community seem to lean more toward  converting their status into personal profits rather than toward furthering the cause of lucid dreaming, and in the process are capitalizing directly on the goodwill and soft adoration of their fans to generate these profits... often leaving nothing to their generous supporters but empty pocketbooks and disappointment.   I still think it would be nice if the soldiers enlisting in Mr. Love's army could at least be permitted a general idea of the nature of the battles they will be fighting before taking up arms (sorry, Mr. Love, you did pick the analogy!  :wink2: ).  Requesting personal information (albeit info as innocuous as an email) and then promising to provide information in trade when it's ready sometime in the future really ought to be a warning signal to more people than just me.

And yes, if opening those presents on Christmas resulted in disappointment, some sort of loss, or commitment to a program that I would never have signed up for in the first place, I would definitely want to know what was in them ahead of time.  Sometimes the wrapping is far more impressive than the gift.

Also, I hope that, since I've actively been with DV for 5 years and made what I assume are real contributions to it, you would give me the same leeway in presenting a similar bargain were I to come up with a project that required an army of uninformed soldiers... but in truth I would never do so.  To me, holding back information that you already have in some form just to build a mailing list ahead of the project's initiation seems, well, not quite right... I would have the information ready _before_ I asked people to join my army.   

Sorry again for my skepticism, Gab; I'll stop now.  One or two skeptical (or cynical) posts is plenty in this context; more is simply disrespectful.  I do honestly wish you luck, Mr. Love, and hope that your project is a wonderful one that truly rewards your soldiers with a war of minimal casualties and a commensurate share of the dreaming spoils.

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## DanielLove

Ah Sageous, you're going to make me write a long rambling response again - you and I are cut from the same cloth and I've been in your position in forums many times in the past. I think we'd both enjoy a drink and horribly convoluted discussion about the universe - the kind that would make others want to bury themselves alive! 

I'll start with the simple stuff, as for capitalizing on lucid dreaming - I certainly know that some of the self appointed "gurus" out there are quite willing to do or say anything to bump up their bank balance and make it all a bit of an ego trip for themselves. The reason I decided to put myself "out-there" in the first place was, to be frank, because it bothered me just as deeply as it does you. I wanted to get up in their faces and stop them from ruining a subject that I've loved as long as I can remember. I'd name names, but that would only stir things up - I'd rather fight them with quality and honesty. I think in the long run this is the approach which wins. I also never want to become a "guru", the thought bothers me deeply. I'm a human being like anyone else. We're all born with no idea why we're here, and we die probably with more questions than answers. The best I can offer is my passion and dedication to a subject, which hopefully gives me a little more insight than a layman - and ideally it is useful to others. 

That said, I barely scrape by making a living as a writer and researcher. I'm not pushing for a sympathy vote at all, I'm just being honest. When I say lucid dreaming is my passion I mean it - I've adopted a very minimalistic lifestyle just so that I can survive doing what I love doing. I'd genuinely make more money flipping burgers. It's my choice though, and I love it and wouldn't change it for the world. 

My sole aim in life is to leave something behind that has left the world somewhat wiser and hopefully a little improved. I don't care for money or possessions - if I won the lottery, I'd use it to invest in projects and my life would barely change (other than the huge relief of not having to be concerned about if I'll cover the next months rent). 

With all that said, there is only so much you can achieve if you're focusing on survival. So of course my project is going to require funding to get off the ground. I'm not asking anyone here to agree to that, what I'm asking for is people to listen to what I'm going to offer, make their own minds up, and then if they like it either get on-board with it, or help spread the word. The latter is the most important actually.

I am going to be as blunt with you as you are with me, I think you're being a little too sensitive about me requesting an e-mail in order to let people know when something is launched. Most of us give our e-mails pretty readily - I expect my supermarket has mine. We basically have to do it for anything we wish to be involved with. There are strong anti-spam regulations and one of which requires me to share my home address with everyone who registers. So, I'm not asking for people to give me more than I'm willing to give in return. It's just the easiest means to share information directly. I trust that people won't abuse the information I share with them, and I'll certainly not abuse theirs. 

As I've said I'm more than willing for feedback on the project and I'll drop into chat next week (if anyone is interested) so I can be more forthright about it all.

What I will say,  is in it's simplest form going to be an ongoing resource and an ecosystem for lucid dreamers and those interested in our universe. It is also a means for me to create a self-fuelling system that will allow me to continue to invest time, energy and resources into expanding the subject. I have no intention of profiting, I do however need to survive in order to continue to invest all my time into doing this. I think that's fair and what is to be expected. With that in mind, the proof will be in the pudding - as the project itself will be launched as a crowd-funded campaign. So people can very easily decide if it's something they want in the world. So, this is why I am limited by time-scales and the need for a passionate group of lucid dreamers to help drive interest (if they like it) in the project.  

If we really want lucid dreaming to develop, then it is important to have those who dedicate their lives to improving the subject - not those who abuse the subject to improve their lives.  

I can understand that you fear I am the latter - but take a look at my history: I've released a book on the subject which I feel gives a balanced and honest introduction and I've instigated a worldwide celebration of lucid dreaming - which is funded out of my own pocket. But more importantly I have avoided advertising, selling endless junk e-books, useless on-line courses and I rarely if ever run workshops. I've also turned down numerous paying events that I felt were abusing the subject - why? Because I feel this is just people cashing in with regurgitated nonsense.  I refuse to abuse my standards for profit. It would be SO easy to do, and I've had plenty of time in which I could have done this. But, I hate that kind of behaviour and I dearly wish to do my part to put and end to it and shame those who are involved in it.

Lucid dreaming deserves better. I'm only one person but I'll do what I can to make it so. I wholeheartedly support your approach in making me stand my ground - continue to do this, too many people in this field are in it because it can be a cash-cow and are rarely pulled up on it. I'm not offended that you feared that I was one of them (okay, I was a little, but mostly because I've spent so long being the one criticising them myself). 

Hopefully you'll realise in this case that we're both on the same side and we both want to put an end to that nonsense once and for all.

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## DawnEye11

To push lucid dreaming far beyond its boundaries sounds like an interesting idea. Will you inform only those that sign up? I rather wait and see what happens than sign up for something I'm not going to commit to.This actually reminds me of something else I came across the internet before where someone needed a whole lot of lucid dreamers to test out something shared dreaming related in a different website. But than again this could be something different. Thinking about it I wonder if its even possible to push lucid dreaming beyond its boundaries. What does pushing it beyond its boundaries mean if you can already do plenty of stuff in a lucid dream? Did you mean pushing beyond someones expectation of what is possible with lucid dreaming? Is your project going to focus on something physically related to lucid dreaming,beyond dreaming related or is it going to go both ways?

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## Sageous

Well said, Daniel, and thank you; now I feel a little bad that I dragged all of that out of you... but just a little!

With the heartfelt assumption that we too are indeed navigating the world of LD'ing under the same sets of stars (how could we never have met?), I'll back off and assume that what you're planning will be a boon for the cause, first.

I don't use DV chat (for no real reason except that I can't get my brain to line up with its process), so I'll miss your comments there.  I guess I'll have to sign up for the emails...

Again, good luck, and thanks for your patience... I'm not on board as a soldier yet, but at least the looming war now looks more like a Good one, so my curiosity is finally aroused.  

Good luck!

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## DanielLove

@DreamCafe11 

I'll be aiming to inform as much of the world as possible, signing up is just the means to be the very first to know everything. Don't worry, I'm not asking anyone to commit, you'll just be on an e-mail list that will receive a handful of e-mails to be informed when  project is live. The point is so that you can choose if it's something that interests you or not at that point. I'm genuinely not expecting anything of anyone.

As for pushing boundaries, that's really hard to encapsulate in a short reply, and I've already written too much for Sageous today so my brain is a little fried!  :tongue2: 
In short, the boundaries of how it is used and experienced, how it intersects with our waking reality and how it is approached and taught as a subject. It won't be long until project is live, and I will explain things better their than I can muster in a quick forum reply.  :smiley:

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## Spock

It's amazing how much I've missed after being away from the forum for less than a week! Anyway, when I read the OP today I was going to write a long reply about being on the fence - on the one hand I'd like to participate in anything LD related I can relate to (i.e. everything other than metaphysical / spiritual interpretations), but on the other hand the secrecy raised several problems for me (like not being sure if it's a subject I can relate to, or how demanding it's going to be in terms of the commitment required, or the whole email requirement issue)... But than after reading the rest of the (long) posts in this thread, it's clear that there is literally nothing I can add to the discussion (though, to be clear, I have to agree with Sageous, Sensei, and others)... So to cut to the conclusion - 

DanielLove, I'll be interested to participate as long as the project is something I can relate to (i.e. none spiritual), and depending on the commitment required. For now, I'll wait for further info that will resolve these two questions... But from your replies I'm now convinced that it's not an advertisement or publicity thing - so at least this issue seems to be cleared!  ::tongue:: 

Feel free to PM me (which is referred to my email, btw) and I'm also present on the chat occasionally. I'll keep an eye for further info in this thread. If you need a summery of my current LDing "practice" - I keep a log in this thread:
Spock's lucid journey
or take a look at my DJ on the site.

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## DawnEye11

> @DreamCafe11 
> 
> I'll be aiming to inform as much of the world as possible, signing up is just the means to be the very first to know everything. Don't worry, I'm not asking anyone to commit, you'll just be on an e-mail list that will receive a handful of e-mails to be informed when  project is live. The point is so that you can choose if it's something that interests you or not at that point. I'm genuinely not expecting anything of anyone.
> 
> As for pushing boundaries, that's really hard to encapsulate in a short reply, and I've already written too much for Sageous today so my brain is a little fried! 
> In short, the boundaries of how it is used and experienced, how it intersects with our waking reality and how it is approached and taught as a subject. It won't be long until project is live, and I will explain things better their than I can muster in a quick forum reply.



: D Ohhh. I see now. Thanks for replying and clearing up my confusion.It sounds like it will be better than what I thought it would be at first. I think I'll be patient and wait till you release the info to everybody but still looking forward to hearing more about it. ^^I'll probably check out the chat when you talk about it more with the others.

----------


## BruceLee

Am in !

----------


## Sivason

Hi DanielLove, I have one way you can post more information on your project and have it visible to only some of us, and not visible to anyone who has not been either a key member of DV, or at least had an account for 3 years. What you can do is post a thread in the Talk To Staff area. That is only view-able by current staff. I can then re-post it in our Community section. Only members who have been teachers or staff, or have 3 years here could view that. It is an imperfect answer, as you are not part of that group, but it will allow Sageous, and I think Dolphin (past staff?) plus dozens of potential participants to read what ever you can share at this time. Anyone with ideas to share could then send you a PM.

----------


## gab

I didn't think of that. But I don't think that would work. Members that have access to Community are not part of this thread and have no interest in it, and some that have interest are not part of "Community". 

Those that are interested in talking to Daniel are welcomed to come to the chat. Daniel, maybe you can post here some of the time slots when you would be coming to chat so we can join you. For those that can't attend, I will post a chat log in here.

----------


## DawnEye11

> had an account for 3 years



〣( º - -º )〣.......

----------


## Sivason

Sorry, just a random idea.

----------


## DreamLord1

Daniel, really love your book. Most to-the-point thing I've ever read, and the section on history was fantastic. Real excited to join your project!

----------


## DanielLove

Hi everyone,

I just thought I'd let you all know that I'm absolutely snowed under for the next two days, there's a lot of work to be done in a very short period of time. So, this is just to let you know that I've not vanished - I'm just overworked. I'll be back and in a better position chat with you all either Tuesday night or Wednesday. I'll look forward to the welcome rest and your thoughts and ideas.  :smiley:

----------


## Mismagius

Awesome!  Signed up!  Love having exciting stuff like this happening in the lucid dreaming world, it's well, exciting  ::mrgreen:: 

Personally for me, I like the mystery of it, will give me something to look forward to.  Some mystery and surprise makes life more interesting  :smiley:

----------


## Mzzkc

No idea who you are tbh, but anyone who can have a meaningful discourse when Sageous does his Sageous thing has got my attention.

----------


## VirtualReality

Hi Daniel,
During my university studies I have often had a bad habit of coming up with excuses for not keeping my dream journal and practicing my induction techniques. As a result I have had a year long dry spell up until a few weeks ago and I have had way too many comatose nights without a single remembered dream (it is such a sad thing to awaken from marvelous adventures only to forget them). Over the next  month I'm going to get back into shape and then I'll focus on pushing my dreaming beyond what I have been able to do before. Whatever you are planning Daniel it couldn't have come at a better timing. I've signed up and I'm excitedly waiting to learn more. I'll spend the next few weeks getting my recall back to top-notch.
Best regards Morten

----------


## Venryx

Hey DanielLove, I thought I'd just mention that you showed up in a lucid of mine from ~1 hour ago.

I don't believe in shared-dreaming, but my dreaming mind likes to fantasize about it anyway, and I thought it's only fair to let you see it since you "were there" (and we'd made an agreement and all).




> am in world, and see it's night in urban environment. some people are flying with jetpacks.
> 
> as i go around, i see it's illegal to use jetpacks in certain ages, areas, conditions or something, so people are trying to evade police-like people with guns that are patrolling [e.g. one person gets blown up with huge orb-explosion weapon, and a group of two were flying dangerously close and loud in park area where i saw police person]
> 
> we walk into area with crowd, and walk alongside someone. he seems like some sort of popular person or something. i start asking him about the jetpack restrictions, and he says something about it being from past incidents, but he gives the impression that he's a visitor like me, and i notice he looks kinda familiar.
> 
> "do I know you?" i ask.
> 
> he says, "no, I don't think so"
> ...



[One... very important mistake in my memory while in-dream, of course, was that I had not in fact posted in your/this thread, before now...]

----------


## DanielLove

@VirtualReality - It's great to hear you're looking to get fully back into your dream explorations. Although, I do think that dry-spells are a perfectly natural part of a life; it's very difficult to keep up the levels of motivation required all the time, sometimes we just need a break and to come back to it with a fresh mind! I'd be very happy for your help with the project.

@Venryx - Ha fantastic! I'm not a believer in shared dreaming either. I've had a few experiences that _seemed_ interestingly close, but nothing that couldn't be easily explained through a combination of familiarity with those involved, similar interests and lifestyles, and the natural human tendency to look for connections. It's a fun concept to daydream about though - although I think I prefer living in a world where our minds are our own and our thoughts are private.

It seems like a fun dream, with all the usual quirks and peculiar logic/memory issues that plague them. Curiously and coincidentally, it reminds me a lot of a dream from about a year ago, which involved flying around a futuristic cityscape with a jetpack.


So, here's an update for everyone: The attempt at making a video was a day of frustration and not much of value was achieved. It is frustrating as a writer that to pitch an idea on-line requires one to be a high calibre film-maker as well. It's a shame we don't live in a world where ideas can be assessed on their own merit and not the flashiness of a video. Still, it's a challenge and a good chance to learn a few new skills. I'll keep you all update when this hurdle has been overcome (wish me luck!).

Anyhow, video or not, I'm at a point where I'd be more than happy to get a little help and feedback from you all, but I'm not 100% sure of the best way to go about it.

EDIT: It seems a little quiet here tonight, so I'll pop back another time with more information.

----------


## spellbee2

Just signed up. I'm not entirely sure I'll be able to give 100% once it starts though, as I'm transitioning into a new job now that I'm out of college, so I don't know how much time I'll have to dedicate once that starts up, but I'm willing to give it a shot.

----------


## DanielLove

Hey spellbee2 - Thanks for the interest!  :smiley:  Don't worry, the initial stages will just require those who like the idea to help share the news. Deeper involvement is still quite a bit further down the road.

----------


## fogelbise

I quite enjoyed your book and I look forward to anything that truly advances lucid dreaming in the minds of more peopleI feel rather alone trying to discuss it with most people in person.





> So, here's an update for everyone: The attempt at making a video was a day of frustration and not much of value was achieved. It is frustrating as a writer that to pitch an idea on-line requires one to be a high calibre film-maker as well. It's a shame we don't live in a world where ideas can be assessed on their own merit and not the flashiness of a video. Still, it's a challenge and a good chance to learn a few new skills. I'll keep you all update when this hurdle has been overcome (wish me luck!).



I don't know how feasible this is (hey it worked for a fictional tv character, Saul Goodman, after all  :wink2:  ) but perhaps you can find a few film or video editing students that will help you out.

Please post potential chat times if you can.  :smiley:

----------


## cooleymd

Well I never read your book but then I never read LaBerge's either.  However, certainly I have to say that one of the most important things in my success (aside from supplements, napping, and trying to be stress free) is stuff related to Cycle Adjustment Technique.  I don't really use the technique per se, but some variation on it has been critical to most of my success for intentional lucid dreaming.  (I suppose LaBerge deserves some credit for MILD too  :smiley:  )

So you haven't said what you need the army for, but what kind of recruits are you looking for then?  As in what kind of lucid dreamers, what skills etc.  If you want supplement free WILD experts I'm not your kinda soldier. 

I'll try to hang out in chat a bit late nite Pacific time  :smiley: 
(WBTC)  Wake Back To Chat style!

----------


## Narratick

So, I am guessing we are talking about a new kickstarter project of some kind here. Are we not ?

***Link Removed***

----------


## DanielLove

@cooleymd The kind of recruits I'm looking for are just average, passionate lucid dreamers. Initially I just need people to help spread the word, after that I'll be wanting lucid dreamers of all levels of skill and interest to be more involved in sharing their thoughts, techniques, skills, creativity and who knows what else. I've got ambitious plans but we'll have to take small steps first, after all, I have no idea if anyone even wants something like this. 

@Narratick Yes exactly, like I mentioned in my post to Sageous earlier, it'll be a project that will be crowd-funded initially. I'm not primarily asking Dreamviews members to be funders (although of course that would be helpful), I need people to help spread the word and also be involved directly in the project itself.  It's nothing like that earlier Kickstarter link you shared - although, the good news on that front is that off the back of the interest that campaign generated, the Saint-Denys book has now been fully translated into English. 

@Fogelbeis - I had trouble logging into the chat, so I'm not quite sure what I'm doing wrong there. I'm going to be working late again tonight, so I'll be popping back to the forum on my breaks.

----------


## splodeymissile

Just signed up. Really curious as to how you can push the limits of something which is effectively limitless. Glad to hear its not some metaphysical or spiritual stuff, as well. One question, though. Will I be expected to travel at all for this initiative? Or can everything be done more or less from the comfort of my home? Sort of bogged down by uni work at the mo, you see.

----------


## DanielLove

> Just signed up. Really curious as to how you can push the limits of something which is effectively limitless. Glad to hear its not some metaphysical or spiritual stuff, as well. One question, though. Will I be expected to travel at all for this initiative? Or can everything be done more or less from the comfort of my home? Sort of bogged down by uni work at the mo, you see.



Don't worry, it's nothing that involves travel. Once/if the project really gets into full swing, then there will be events, but that's far in the future. Small steps to start with!

----------


## IAmCoder

Hit me up if you need help with any code.

----------


## DanielLove

> Hit me up if you need help with any code.




Thanks IAmCoder, I may well do that! What's your speciality?

----------


## DanielLove

*UPDATE: Chat session tonight. 22:30 BST* (that's pretty much a few minutes from the time of making this post). I'll be in the chat room for about an hour - possibly longer, to share ideas and receive feedback from those who want a preview.
I've previously been unable to log into the DreamViews chat, so to avoid risking that I've created a temporary chat room here: *CHAT FINISHED FOR TONIGHT*
It's password protected so please use the password: dreamviews2016

EDIT: The chat session is finished for tonight, thanks to those who took part in the chat, was lovely to get to know you better! I'll host another chat in the near future for those who missed it.

----------


## IAmCoder

Mobile, biometrics and security. And open source lucidity stuff when I'm not hacking for government agencies.

You might remember seeing some of my work when Bill Murphy was using my code for DreamNet.

----------


## Rothgar

I own the book...if you are who you say you are, I'm game. I signed up.

----------


## DanielLove

@Rothgar - Thanks for signing up! I can assure you I am who I say I am. 

Just a quick update for everyone. I finally managed to put together a video for the project, not without a lot of sweat, tears and swearing - but it's done, so that means things can move forward finally.
I think I'm probably about a week away from releasing the project now. Now I just need to work on a press release and drumming up interest to the wider world - if any of you have media contacts or journalist friends, I'd very much appreciate your help in getting the word out to them. Drop me a message either here or via PM if you do.

----------


## Sensei

One week...

----------


## Sharpshoey

Wow I haven't been on dreamviews in such a long time! I've been so busy for the lat several months...it feels a little weird to be posting here again.

Anyways, my schedule has been freed up considerably and I've decided what better way to fill up that time than with getting back into LDing. And this project couldn't have come with better timing! It's the exact thing I need to get the motivation to get back full swing into LDing again. 

Hopefully beginning LDers are accepted into this project because that's what my skills will be...I haven't tried to LD in a very long time, but I signed up anyway. I hope this proves to be very interesting

----------


## Ginsan

> One week...



haha nice reference  ::D:

----------


## OneMoreDreamer

Signed up and excited about whatever this will be!

----------


## DoubleHelix

I'm cautiously optimistic about this "whatever it is."  I didn't get to participate in the chat, so I feel a bit un-informed.  Well...whatever.  I'm taking a wait and see attitude.

----------


## Hilary

This sounds interesting. Looking forward to hearing more about it.  ::goodjob2::

----------


## shadowwolf6tail

Hopefully this will be something interesting. Signed up.

----------


## DanielLove

Hi all, 

Some good news, things have so far been going to plan, so my contingency schedule is unlikely to be required. So, what this means is that the project will _hopefully_ be released this weekend rather than the week after.

So, with that in mind if any of you have any media contacts - bloggers, journalists, youtube content creators etc., no matter how local or small scale they are, and you think you'd be able to drop them an e-mail about the project, send me an private message and I can send you the press release to share with them. Or, if it's easier for you, PM me their details and I can do the sending myself. 

Thanks again to everyone for your support and help so far!

----------


## Michaelcx

Signed up.  Look forward to reading more.  Good luck.  

Cognitive Restructuring and Lucid Dreaming allow us to access powerful, mostly untapped, resources.
Hopefully awareness and understanding will reach a critical mass to where these skills are common sense and common knowledge, and everyone will enjoy their benefits.
Sounds like your contributions will help us reach that critical point.

Thank you for your work.

----------


## MadMonkey

> Hi Daniel,
> During my university studies I have often had a bad habit of coming up with excuses for not keeping my dream journal and practicing my induction techniques.



I'm in the same exact position VirtualReality. I took a long break from Dreamviews and I really miss it. I used to be really passionate about lucid dreaming and helping others learn. Now I have to start over but I think that's okay. I would be happy to contribute if this turns into something productive.  :smiley:

----------


## DanielLove

Hi everyone, 

Thanks to all of you who've signed up and shared positive messages. I'll be frank, it has been a great source of inspiration on while staying up far too late and losing sleep putting all this together. I know it sounds a bit naff, but you helped remind me that lucid dreaming is really something very special - and not necessarily in the obvious ways. When you think about it, it's this uniquely private experience, perhaps the most private of all, yet it brings this vast group of diverse people together; all  trying to unravel its secrets. It'll be nice to finally launch, which is happening this weekend, and get the ball rolling towards (hopefully) getting more real voices out there and undoing some of the less positive aspects that have invaded subject. 

I'll be back tomorrow evening or Saturday morning, and I'll finally be able to stop being so vague, which will be a huge relief!  :smiley: .

----------


## McElroy2000

I signed up but I can't promise to be a great help or to always be there because my exams are starting and I haven't had a lucid dream in a while now

----------


## DanielLove

Hey all, great news... the project is live! 

You can find out all about it here: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...-to-the-cosmos

Initially I need your help to spread the word, so if you can share on facebook, twitter etc. that would be wonderful.

Once we've reached the goal... then we can all work on the more interesting side of things!

I'll be glued to the laptop this evening, so I'll be popping in to chat as and when I take a break  :smiley:

----------


## gab

Project looks great, Daniel!

Thank you for listing Dreamviews as a supporter and for linking to our forum! Good luck with the project : D

----------


## DanielLove

Hey all, 

Thanks to everyone who is getting behind this project so far.

The most important thing any of you can do at this point is spread the news! 

So if you could take the time to shout out on your social media sites, that would be a huge help.

This is the short link to the campaign: http://kck.st/1NSjUJN

To make life really easy, you can...

*CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON FACEBOOK*

or 
*
CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON TWITTER*

Visibility is the absolutely most important thing right now, so the more people seeing the project the better. Once we get to the goal, then we can all get our teeth into the fun stuff. I really want this to be a project that Dreamviews members are a big part of. There is so much creativity, intelligence and passion here, that it deserves to be heard.

Right I'm about to collapse, so it's off to bed for me.
Thanks in advance for everyone's help!

----------


## DoubleHelix

Hmmmpf.  [Donning asbestos undies].  Sorry if I'm raining on your parade, but it seems to me what you're doing here amounts to little more than exploiting this forum's membership.  Your "project" appears to me to be nothing but bald self-promotion to a captive, targeted audience.  IMHO...not cool.   ::wtf:: 

Oh...and by the way, the plain AP of the chest at 1:27 is on the viewbox reversed.  I'm a retired cardiac surgeon.  If you are going to hawk your wares using pseudomedical popcockery you might want to have someone with knowledge look at it first.

----------


## MadMonkey

I understand that you need to make a living in order to make this happen but it Is always good to be skeptical when money is involved.  I think what would help is if we understood how it is we will be contributing other than through kickstarter and facebook. I am thinking something more along the lines of sharing our experience and research to confirm the methods in your books.

----------


## DanielLove

@doublehelix - I'm sorry you feel that way. I think that you may have just not quite understood what I'm asking for. The project, at heart,  is going to be a series of books co-created by myself and any members of dreamviews who wish to get involved, along with those from other communities. Any funds generated from the project will then be funnelled straight back into it, so it can then also expand into furthering dream research and putting on events etc. - this will also involve members of the community and will reflect what they feel is needed. 

I know that it's easy to get really cynical when people are trying to raise funds to start a project (although what I came here asking for is help sharing the idea - and only then if people like it), but I'm sure you understand that sometimes that's the only option; if I were to take an idea like this to a publishers, they'd laugh me out of the office and say "Oh, Mr Love, you've such a sense of humour, now go write a nice how-to book, and throw some vague and palatable spiritual elements in to really make it sell".  I don't want that, I'm sick of the same old material again and again. 

What I want is to produce new material, start new research and new events. And I want to do all of that in direct collaboration with dreamers, reflecting what is needed and wanted. If I can't come to dreamviews or talk to the lucid community to ask in help doing that, I really have no idea where I am supposed to turn; how are new things ever supposed to come to life or ever get off the ground?  

Thanks for pointing out the reversal of the image though, I'd have never known. I suppose that's the nature of using stock footage, you're reliant on the producers to get it right - I'm a writer not a film maker, the idea was to get a basic idea across in a visual way - with the very limited means available to me. I'm pretty sure the stars in the milk-way animation probably aren't a perfect representation either, and that's produced by ESA!  :tongue2:  You see, this is exactly why it's useful to work with others, the more heads and knowledge the better things can be! When eventually we get to the book on the human body, it'd be people like yourself that I'll be wanting to work with!

With the greatest respect, I understand where you're coming from, but all I can say is this: none of us choose that the world operates in the way it does. I'd love to be in the financial position to achieve all the things this project aims to achieve. The problem is, I expect even if I was, I'd then have someone accuse me of being a wealthy-egotist trying to push his ideas on the world! I guess you really can't please all of the people all of the time. Still, I know that my intentions for this project have absolutely nothing but improving lucid dreaming at their core, so I respect your reaction but I genuinely think you've grasped an entirely different stick to the one I'm presenting. I believe what I'm attempting to do is a meaningful and worthwhile pursuit, so I'll continue to try my very hardest to make it happen. Also, it's completely democratic, it'll only happen if people want it and are willing to get behind it.  No captive audiences at all!  :smiley: 

@MadMonkey Hopefully what I've just written to DoubleHelix will explain a little of that  :smiley: . What I'll want is basically any help and input I can get from you guys. Artists, event organisers, scientists, retired-cardiac surgeons with a proof-readers eye, writers - you name it! Also, getting involved in research and any other more practical things will also be on the cards. Obviously, none of that will happen if the project isn't able fund itself; making a living from it isn't even on the radar, it needs to just be able to be self-sustaining.


It's 6:15 am here - so I apologise for this rambling and poorly constructed reply, but I felt that your concerns needed addressing!  :smiley:  I'll try to write more later, when I'm not so bleary eyed.

----------


## Highlander

Great project, but I'm a tad confused with the rules?  ::whyme::

----------


## DanielLove

> Great project, but I'm a tad confused with the rules



I can't speak for Dreamviews staff, but this project has been discussed with the site owners and moderators, and as it's working in conjunction with Dreamviews members - to bring their views out into the wider world, and as it's also promoting the site, I think they felt it was a suitable project to be shared. 

I'm sure Gab will be in a better position to explain Dreamviews position.

----------


## DoubleHelix

*No...I understand completely.*  What I was hoping to read was something MUCH, much different.  Something more akin to this:

"A group of 10,000 volunteers solicited from a popular lucid dreaming website were randomized and divided into four separate groups. These individuals were divided into four separate study groups randomized for age, sex, and physical location on the globe based upon data submitted in advance of the study. Male participants outnumbered female participants by 2:1.  13 months of weekly questionnaire data were collected and compared against objective data created by an android and iPhone compatible application distributed to the participants and collected at the center.

Each group was provided with one of four separate techniques thought to be advantageous at inducing lucid dreams. None of the participants had knowledge of what technique was being employed by other participants. The Lucid dreaming induction techniques were rotated through the fours cohorts quarterly.  Investigators were likewise unaware of which of the four techniques were being employed by which participants until the 13 month study period ended, yielding a double-blind study.

Of the 10,000 participants, two died during the study. 940 failed to complete the weekly data's submission rate criteria and were eliminated from the study. Of those who did complete all phases of the study, a total of 900,000 periods of REM sleep were analyzed. Results for each of the four techniques are summarized in figure 1." Seasonal variations across the globe are summarized in figure 2.  Age and sex were found to have no influence on either the incidence or length of self-reported lucid dreams in techniques 2 and 4. [Figure 3]. 

Etcetera.  Now _that_ would have been something of value I would have participated in...THEN you could write your book. What you have asked my help in ACTUALLY doing...not so much!

----------


## DanielLove

@doublehelix

No problem, I know not everything appeals to everyone - I'd be foolish to think otherwise. I'm sorry my project didn't match your expectations. So, I respect your choice to not be involved. Once the campaign is a success and there is funding with which to work with, then at some point in the future perhaps you'd like to get involved - when exactly the kind of thing you've mentioned will happen. Sadly, like I've already mentioned, things of value in the world take time to establish and require funding and foundations, so I've got to get to that point before I can make bigger waves. Still, the world has room for lots of different projects, if you're really passionate about your idea, you should really jump on it and make it happen! I'll do whatever I can to support it. With your medical background you'd have a great mind for it!

----------


## Wisher

Hey dreamers I hope this doesn't come off the wrong way

It's kinda disappointing that u never really were part of the community until you needed funding. Even if this were to fail would you be active on DV? We like your efforts and work it's just if the mods were informed in advance this could have been rolled out more smoothly. It seems like it was a spur of the moment introduction. 

The funding link should be removed unless you are paying for advert. Other than that there's nothing illegal here. People do group research threads a lot

Still, interesting thread

----------


## DanielLove

Hey Wisher, I've actually used the forums regularly for many, many years (since around 2007). My old account eventually died (lost the e-mail address and couldn't reactivate it), and I felt I'd prefer to sign up without a pseudonym after I discovered I could no longer use it (back in 2014). During that time I've been, sadly, too busy working to be able to be a regular contributor - and lurking seemed more suitable, as people would think I was trying to "use my name" or something.

I'll obviously be as active on DV as I can be, but I do have limits on my time - actually it's nice to have a good reason to come here, which I can justify as not simply self indulgent pleasure seeking! (for the same reasons, I also don't use social media sites... I've terrible self control and they're such an easy distraction from more pressing work)

The link works both ways, there's also a link to dreamviews on the kickstarter page, and I've also mentioned dreamviews in my previous book. Obviously, I'd never dream of asking for advertising funds from dreamviews for doing that, as I've always loved the community and felt it's, in some ways, the successor to the old Lucidity Institute forums (which were also great). I think it's fair, and the managers and moderators here seemed to agree with that also.

----------


## Wisher

Well you've been here long enough to know then

Hey, good luck

----------


## DanielLove

Hey all,

As I don't consider myself as some kind of know-it-all, I thought it would be wise to ask you guys how you think we can best go about promoting this project?
Do any of you have experience with such things, Journalist contacts or have a natural aptitude for getting news out into the world?

As this is a project that is trying to side-step the limitations and restraints of publishers, the normal channels for promoting this kind of thing are less accessible - and making things visible is the currency of the world these days. It'd be really nice to show the world a bit of "people power", that things can be achieved from passion and not only a huge bank balance, or an investment from a company looking for a return. 

I'd really love and appreciate any thoughts or ideas you have.

With this in mind, and just to ask for the simplest steps again, here are the details you can use to share the project... 

This is the short link to the campaign: http://kck.st/1NSjUJN

Also, the super easy option, just one click... 

*CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON FACEBOOK* 
or 
*CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON TWITTER*

Thanks again, and I really look forward to your ideas. 

Now if this were a dream, it'd be a whole lot easier!

----------


## Raipat

Given the hype and intended tension that was build up here and DV's "generous exception" to promote commercial stuff on DV, I'm disappointed in what was presented.
I was expecting nothing less than an interactive path to guaranteed enlightenment in order to muster an enlightened army to save and free the world  ::D:   :tongue2: 

I backed the first book, anyways - I would also buy it without hesitation if I saw in the local bookstore. I also shared the campaign link.
I hope that the campaign goal is reached soon and Mr. Love can get to what he can do best (writing) and can stop capaigning. Having to "defend" this project all the time wastes resources.

BUT this case will be a leveling rule on how DV staff has to act on commercial projects and links.
It is no longer understandable in any way that links to useful information like manuals or (technical) documentation gets removed and posters warned, just because the product the technical information was about, is buyable for-money and on the other hand DV partners up with for-money campaigns. Well, DV staff can of course continue this practise. But not without gaming away the notion of being neutral.

----------


## gab

Ok guys, let me see if I can answer some of your questions here.

Yes, it is in the rules that we don't allow soliciting for info or linking to certain places. Unless permission is given. 
As you can tell from staff participating in this thread and from my answers to previous posts, permission was given to both. 

Every person who asks us for permission to gather information on the forum is allowed to do so if they promise to share results with us, so all our members and not only those participating can benefit. And if they promise to mention Dreamviews and to link us from their project.
We don't allow links to commercial sites, kickstarters and such, because we (staff) don't have the capacity to judge what is for real and what is a scam, what is worthy and what is just some spammer linking his product.

Some may think that these rules are too harsh and strict. Do you guys remember that kickstarter lucid dreaming gizmo thing we allowed recently, because we are lucid dreaming site, right? Well it turned out to be a scam. If we didn't filter links and posts for stuff like that, this forum would be innundated with spam. 

That above was an explanation of our rules, which btw, were put in place by owners, not staff.

Now some explanation about why was this project allowed.

Every request is judged on case by case basis. We basically go by above mentioned and other selection rules. Daniel Love is an established Lucid Dreaming author, so we ruled out this being a scam. He wrote to me in his PM that he mentioned DreamViews in his book "Are you dreaming" and he also linked to us from his site Lucid Dreaming Day where DV is listed under Resources. So yes, this is beneficial to Dreamviews, as publicity from a well known LDing author is a very good thing.

So please, no more attacks on OP and assumptions that there was no communication or permission. If there is anything else about this matter, please post in Talk to Staff.

----------


## DanielLove

Thanks for that clear explanation Gab - it's not my place to get involved in these things, still, I do understand why some members had concerns. Good to have it cleared up!  :smiley: 

Anyway, perhaps now we can get back to discussing the project, how to promote it, and more importantly - who would like to be involved in the long term side of things!

Perhaps a good place to start would be if people could share what they feel are their skills, strengths, knowledge set etc. This can really be anything at all.
No need to by shy or hold back, I'm not just looking for expert artists, video makers or knowledgeable scientists - the voices of regular lucid dreamers are just as important. It may even be easier, if you feel there is a member of the forum who you are particularly impressed with, to nominate them. Not that this commits anyone to anything, it may just help get past some natural modesty. 

Also, feel free to share ideas for what you'd like to see in the series, and what kind of research, events or anything else you'd like to be part of the bigger picture.

For those of you who have just stumbled on this thread, here's the kickstarter page that outlines the initial stages of the project: http://kck.st/1NSjUJN

----------


## DoubleHelix

@ gab:  I for one never questioned the appropriateness of the granting of access to this forums membership by the DV staff.  My position is that this forum is yours to do with as you please.  I think I've been quite clear about the source of my personal disappointment - which is mine and mine alone and has nothing to do with how this site is administered.

As has been properly (if not repeatedly) stated, Mr. Love is an author and noted celebrity in the field of field of lucid dreaming.  I was simply hoping to participate in something scientific, not commercial.  That's where >>MY<< mind went when  this thread was posted with the blessings of the administrators, especially since I was aware of the rules as they are _ordinarily_ enforced.  I doubt I was alone in that regard...and it's too bad I was wrong.  There's been some seriously EXCELLENT studies of late involving nMRA testing of lucid dreamers that have helped map, through blood perfusion and oxygen uptake, the precise regions of the brain that need to cooperate to produce lucidity.  I have the paper kicking around here somewhere....I was hoping this announcement was seeking volunteers for an expansion of that study to include additional parameters.

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## DanielLove

@DoubleHelix, you're right, there have been some truly amazing pieces of research in recent years which certainly deserve more funding, more work and to also be widely publicised. These are just some of the things I want to share in the books. I'm a writer/educator primarily, so I see it as my duty to use my platform to help promote the findings of those who are working in the areas you mention. Ideally, in the long run, once the project is a success, the funds generated will be funnelled directly into helping support that kind of research. It would also be wonderful if those who worked towards this, the community, were then also able to be involved in that research if they wished. Little, if any, of what I've done has ever been with a commercial mindset (I can think of much easier ways to go about making a living!), but occasionally one does have to use these channels and strategies in order fund or further more important causes. My goal, if anything, is to develop a passion and love for science, dreaming and our universe in the wider mindset of lucid dreamers. Not everyone shares our enthusiasm for these subjects, and I think it's important to remember that half the battle is showing people why it is so very wonderful and important in the first place. There is also the matter of a tsunami of misinformation to push back against as well. So these are my primary aims and I really hope that I can find the support to play my part.

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## gab

Not everybody likes kickstarters, and that's fine. Just remember folks, that the latest lucid dreaming book you read wasn't for free, nor was the laptop or the phone that you are using to access DreamViews, or the sleep mask your are using for your lucid naps. Look around you, everything costs money. We are all making huge corporations richer by buying things we need. They are lucky to have funds to make new products. I could go online and buy Daniellove's book when it comes out, or I can support his project now and "lend" him some money to make the project possible. I will get my investment back in form of a book when it comes out. It's a win-win.

Asking questions is fine, but I think Daniellove presented his case and explained everything already as well as humanly possible. 

Can we please get back on topic?




> Anyway, perhaps now we can get back to discussing the project, how to promote it, and more importantly - who would like to be involved in the long term side of things!
> 
> Perhaps a good place to start would be if people could share what they feel are their skills, strengths, knowledge set etc. This can really be anything at all.
> No need to by shy or hold back, I'm not just looking for expert artists, video makers or knowledgeable scientists - the voices of regular lucid dreamers are just as important. It may even be easier, if you feel there is a member of the forum who you are particularly impressed with, to nominate them. Not that this commits anyone to anything, it may just help get past some natural modesty.
> 
> Also, feel free to share ideas for what you'd like to see in the series, and what kind of research, events or anything else you'd like to be part of the bigger picture.

----------


## Mismagius

Hey DanielLove, very well produced video!  Near the end you say you're a writer not a video presenter, but you could've fooled me with that video  ::mrgreen:: 

I've gotta say, I absolutely love the cover designs for the books.  They're gorgeous and totally the kind of cover that makes you want to display them on a shelf or around the house.  I've shared the link on my social media areas and will do what I can to help and spread the word.  

I'm excited for this project and what it'll bring down the road, will be fun to follow  :smiley:

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## dolphin

The title of the series is "Lucid Dreamer's Guide to the Cosmos". I imagine if somebody wasn't a lucid dreamer, they would think the series is for exclusively lucid dreamers, which they aren't. Therefore, they would think the series isn't for them.

Authors produce simple how-to books because more people want simple how-to books. How will producing something other than what the majority want be successful?

Why are bigger and more powerful dreams needed to make lucid dreaming more useful and meaningful? 

It says "Lucid dreaming, also known as 'conscious dreaming', is the ability to become aware within your dream, to fully understand that you are dreaming while dreaming." This is not true. Whenever one recalls a non-lucid dream, he or she is remembering a time they were aware within their dream. After all, how can one remember anything without having been aware of it while it was happening? 

To fully understand that one is dreaming, they have to associate their awareness of the dream as being a dream rather what it's representing in the dream. For example, to gain lucidity during a non-lucid dream, if one sees a dog in their dream, he or she has to see the dog as part of a dream, not as a dog. Seeing more dogs won't help, unless they associate many dogs as being part of a dream rather than many dogs. Association and awareness are different fundamentals of lucid dreaming.

----------


## DanielLove

@Mismagius - Thanks! You have no idea how incredibly difficult and frustrating making that video was, so I really appreciate you saying it turned out well! Thanks for doing your bit to help spread the word, I think it's going to be an ongoing battle to keep the campaign visible as the internet is such a fickle place with an incredibly short attention span. So, if you can keep occasionally doing a shout out over the life of the campaign, that would be really helpful! Thanks for being a positive voice, it's sometimes hard to stay upbeat on a campaign like this, because it's often a battle against the odds. So, every little bit of encouragement is really refreshing and very much needed! 

@dolphin Thanks for your thoughts. You may be right on the first point, but the series is indeed primarily for lucid dreamers and those curious about the subject. The series will still be accessible and useful for those who aren't, but as the title suggests, it will all be seen through the eyes of a lucid dreamer. In the sense that when a lucid dreamer looks at the world, they not only see the world but the inherent possibilities for dream exploration - the "what would I do if this were a dream?" moments. A non-lucid dreamer may look down a microscope and find what they see fascinating, but a lucid dreamer can also think "I'll visit that world tonight". That's an oversimplification of the concept, but you get the idea.

For your second point, my answer is: that depends on how you define success. If it is defined by how much money is made in the short term, then you're absolutely right, I'd be heading down the wrong path entirely. McDonald's is a huge success both financially and in its popularity, but I don't think anyone would consider them as successful in advancing gastronomy.  I think I'd rather define success as being able to produce something of quality and depth with longevity. Perhaps that's naive of me - but I'd quickly grow to dislike myself if I only pandered to the popular, rather than improve a field I love. 

In answer to your third question, the simple response would be "knowledge is power". If we consider our mind as a biological virtual reality system, then programming it with more detailed information gives it more to work with, and the chance to build dreams of a higher calibre. For a personal example: I'm an astronomer, as a child I had _many_ dreams about exploring the solar system, they were all very enjoyable but not even close to a real simulation of the experience. As I grew and my knowledge of astronomy grew, so did the nature and quality of my dreams. Nowadays my space themed dreams are considerably closer to emulating what those real experiences would truly be like. The same is true of any experience that one wishes to simulate. I'd also say, that more accurate simulations have wider practical applications.  

I agree with your next point, but you need to realise that the Kickstarter page as been through about 60 drafts, the first of which was several pages longer and suffered terribly from TL;DR issues. Sometimes you just need to simplify an idea into a short, manageable sentence - even if that means having to over-simplify. It's not the function of the Kickstarter page to educate the reader on the subtle semantic differences between awareness, consciousness etc. - the point of it is to advertise the basics of an idea. The books themselves are the place to flesh out all of these concepts in the detail they deserve. I'm with you 100% on this, and if you read the first draft you'd have been far happier - the problem is, it would have been utterly ineffective as a Kickstarter page. Dumbing things down goes against my entire nature, but sometimes it's the right thing to do in order to be able to get to the point where you can expand upon the ideas.

----------


## dolphin

I see your point for my first three points. Thanks for clearing that up!

But, in the sentence describing lucid dreaming, if you simply added an "and" before "to fully understand", then the sentence would be accurate. I don't think adding one word would make the sentence too complex. This sentence underscores the biggest problem I see with lucid dreaming guides: equating awareness with lucidity. For example, reality checks are used to associate the dream with dreaming in order to acquire lucidity, yet many lucid dreaming guides equate reality checks with awareness. They'll say that if you aren't doing reality checks during dreams it because you're not aware enough and to gain awareness you have to do more or better reality checks during the day. But, reality checks have nothing to do with awareness, so dreamers take this advice and are confused why it doesn't work. I think clearing up common misconceptions like this is the best thing you can do for lucid dreaming.

----------


## Rothgar

Daniel, I believe you are truly sincere in your enthusiasm for lucid dreaming, and advancing the art, and anyone on this site who is a lucid dreamer should share in that.... I'd expect more support and understanding as it were. As one who has tried to get others motivated toward lucid dreaming (even my own family - and largely failed), I know the barriers you are up against outside of the lucid dreaming community.... if nothing else I would hope for moral support inside (and maybe like me the silent majority is indeed with you).  C'mon guys! We're on the same team!  If these books help get the word out, and lend some credibility to the lucid dreaming community, I'm all for it.  I made a pledge and really hope you reach your goal.  Heck, if it gives visibility to Dreamviews, it is worth it.  This is my "home" site and I am so grateful this community is in place... I consider it my giveback to Dreamviews.

----------


## RickM

Hi Daniel,

I admire your enthusiasm and empathize with your plight.  Anthony Peake, who writes in related fields and currently working on his eighth book, complains publicly about his inability to quit his day job for lack of profit as a writer. Unfortunately, you both have chosen subject matter that appeals to a very limited audience. My niece is a NY Times Best Selling author that inked a deal last year for close to double digit millions ($US), because she chose to follow her passion five years ago. Her specialty is romance and I would suggest your name gives you a great segue into a similar opportunity. ::alien::

----------


## MadMonkey

I am an artist, animator and video editor so I can give guidance as far as that stuff goes. Your art and video work looks pretty good so far.  :smiley: 

Something I would like to see included in the book is the gravity reality check just like earlier books discussed why the nose plug rc works. I was talking in another thread about how the user Hukif uses it to great success. It works by feeling the subtle differences in how the body feels while dreaming. I would love to see research confirming his hypothesis that it is caused by interference from your sleep paralyzed body and confirming that it works consistently between dreamers. This would work well with your book because it would be included along side discussion on how gravity works in real physics.

----------


## gab

> Daniel, I believe you are truly sincere in your enthusiasm for lucid dreaming, ...
> ...  This is my "home" site and I am so grateful this community is in place... I consider it my giveback to Dreamviews.



What a wonderful post, *Rothgar*! You said exactly what I'm thinking and feeling. Thank you  :For Xox: 

Also, thank you *RickM* and *MadMonkey*.

----------


## DanielLove

*@Dolphin* - Thanks for the suggestion, I've done just as you've asked and added the "and". To be perfectly honest, putting the KS page together, and the endless revisions, became a little like when you repeat a word over-and-over, until it stops having any meaning. So little details like that were very easy to overlook. I appreciate your help, a fresh pair of eyes are hugely useful!

*@Rothgar* - Thank you so much! I'm not quite sure how to respond to such a lovely post, other than to tell you it means a lot and has helped make me feel considerably more positive. As you say, it can be disheartening trying to spread a passion and to have it fall on deaf ears. I think all lucid dreamers are used to this, but that doesn't stop it being frustrating. Thank you also for your pledge, we've made some great progress over the past few days - with help from people like yourself! Let's hope the momentum keeps going and grows! Also, I think you've picked a great place to call home, Dreamviews really is a very unique, important and special place!

*@RickM* - Yes you're right, it's certainly not an area one should enter to get wealthy. Luckily I'm a man of simple tastes and I've always found my personal idea of wealth isn't material, instead comes from working on something important, or the free things in life - such as lucid dreaming!  You're not the first person to suggest I should write romance, or something with a bit more sauce - I'm not quite sure it's my style - but who knows what the future holds  :tongue2: . Still, congratulations to your Niece for doing so very well for herself! 
*
@MadMonkey* - I'll make a note of your ideas, research them more when it comes to that point, and then do my best to include them in the relevant places. Perhaps we can do a little bit of casual Dreamviews based research into that area? When the campaign is over, remind me to get onto that! I'd also certainly appreciate your input or skills with art and animation. I'd like to develop additional material in the form of videos to supplement the books and your input would be appreciated.


*@Everyone else* - Good news: we're at 16% of funding after a very generous pledge today! It's good to have a boost so early in the campaign, but we really need to build the momentum. I've spoken with a few different organisations and media outlets that have agreed to help promote things, so that should help. If you can all keep spreading the word in any way you can, I'd really appreciate it. I think grass-roots is the best approach and can really help things go viral. Also, those of you who are thinking of making a pledge - there's still a few discounted "early bird" options, but they're limited, so I'd suggest snapping them up before they're gone - I'd prefer the discounts to go to members of the community.  With that in mind, and to be true to my own ideals of spreading the word, here's the link to the page once again: *http://kck.st/1NSjUJN*

----------


## DanielLove

I've also updated my signature - so it should show where the campaign stands, and how much we need in pledges per day to reach the goal. Hopefully it'll give you a better idea of how things are progressing and the kinds of charts I'm seeing on the Kickstarter dashboard. Which will hopefully go some way towards explaining why I may be relaxed on some days and freaking out on others!  :tongue2:

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## Highlander

@Daniel - I have written an article on your behalf on the net.

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## DanielLove

That's really kind of you, thanks Highlander! Can you drop me a link to the article?

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## Hukif

Damn, am I too late for this?

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## DanielLove

> Damn, am I too late for this?



No not at all! We're only making the first tentative steps on a long journey.
At this point, I'm still looking to secure funding for the project. You can help in two ways:

You can back the project directly here: *http://kck.st/1NSjUJN*

Or help by getting the word out, which is a very simple matter of click the links below:
*
CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON FACEBOOK* 

*CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON TWITTER*

Once the campaign is complete - then we move onto the far more exciting aspects, but we can't do it without these first steps. So anything you can do to help would be really appreciated.

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## gab

Yeey, Hukif!

I think Daniel you wanted us to nominate great lucid dreamers? I can start with *Hukif*, *Sageous, Sivason, OpheliaBlue*. No obligations to anybody ofc, just a name to consider.

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## Hukif

> No not at all! We're only making the first tentative steps on a long journey.
> At this point, I'm still looking to secure funding for the project. You can help in two ways:
> 
> You can back the project directly here: *http://kck.st/1NSjUJN*
> 
> Or help by getting the word out, which is a very simple matter of click the links below:
> *
> CLICK HERE TO SHARE ON FACEBOOK* 
> 
> ...



Oh wonderful then! Alright will do then, sounds awesome.

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## DanielLove

Hey everyone, 

Had a bit of a quiet day on the pledge front, so we're not quite on track to make this project happen unless we can spread the word and get some pledges happening! 
With that in mind, I've created this teaser trailer which perhaps you guys can share. It may not be to everyone's tastes, but perhaps it will spark the interest of some...

https://youtu.be/54tstpTWq9Y

If you share, please remember to include the link to the campaign page: http://www.luciddreamersguide.com

Also, how on earth is everyone?

----------


## Patience108

> https://youtu.be/54tstpTWq9Y?



 ::D:  Nice space visuals etc Daniel - and are those really aliens I hear in the background? You have some contacts out there ::alien:: 

Don't worry it's still coming in isn't it  ::goodjob2::

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## DanielLove

> Nice space visuals etc Daniel - and are those really aliens I hear in the background? You have some contacts out there
> 
> Don't worry it's still coming in isn't it



Ha, thanks Patience! 
A little intergalactic help would certainly be of value  ::alien:: 

Yeah, it's tricky with these things, as it's impossible to know what is around the corner. I've a few websites that have agreed to promote the idea in the near future (hopefully), so that should help.

The best way for people to know if we're on track is my signature. The colour of the number (the pledge amount) above the text saying *"Today's Pledge Total"* is the best indicator.

*It can be understood this way:*

*Green = We're all good*

*Amber = Doing okay*

*Red = Panic, promote and make a pledge!*

So today is a red day, so it would be really helpful if everyone can please spread the word so we can get some pledges rolling in  :smiley:

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## gab

Daniel-san, campaign is like dream recall. It may fluctuate. But at the end, we all end up with some awesome dreams and the days of lull are all but forgotten.

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## Rothgar

Hope I'm not violating any protocol here, but what about our friends down under at "World of Lucid Dreaming"? Would they promote? Have they been contacted?

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## DanielLove

> Hope I'm not violating any protocol here, but what about our friends down under at "World of Lucid Dreaming"? Would they promote? Have they been contacted?



Hey Rothgar, Rebecca who runs _World of Lucid Dreaming_ has been very supportive, I've submitted an article to her that is based around the campaign and she should be sharing that in the very near future. I'll drop a link to it here once it is live. She's also agreed to pledge and to also promote the campaign in any way she can. She's a lovely woman who is always very kind and helpful, with a nice down-to-earth approach and a love of science.

@Gab - thanks for the sage and calming advice  :smiley: , I get so immersed and passionate about projects that I need a calming influence occasionall!

@Everyone else... I'll be releasing an exciting update (free stuff for you guys), within the hour. I'll drop a post here with details ASAP.

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## DanielLove

*IMPORTANT UPDATE: Back and share the campaign before June 19th and you'll receive a FREE e-book copy of 'Are You Dreaming?'*

So, I thought I'd do something to say thanks to everyone who has already backed and shared the campaign, and to offer a little extra motivation to those who haven't taken the plunge yet.

Essentially, anyone who both *backs and shares* the campaign before *June 19th* will get a free ebook of my first book, "Are You Dreaming?".

It doesn't matter how much you back, as long as you've backed and shared the project on social media, you're eligible. 
So as it doesn't bankrupt me, the offer requires the campaign to successfully reach its goal (kind of obvious that one) - but that's extra motivation to do your bit to help make this a reality!

All the details are listed in the latest campaign update:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects.../posts/1591175

_Are You Dreaming?_ is kind of a prequel to the series, so it makes sense that those of you who haven't read it yet can have a copy for your help!  :smiley:

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## Dreamwalkwr

Sooooo, how long agonwere these posts? Not that I want to be a part of any dream army lol, I'm happy remaining reclusive and unknown. I just signed up for the firat time today out of curiosity as I've been a natural lucid dreamer since my childhood. Shape shift, fly, become apart of the elements. I don't know how aignificant or real any of it is but I do it all by will and rather enjoy the experience. I've recently been using the experience like a sort of hypnotheripy session. Hypnotherpy can supposedly alter our subconcouse thoughts and therefore alter our behaviour and beliefs so I thought, what the hell? What's more subliminal than this? Not that I know anything or even if it works, I'm just messing around and experimenting now because I can. Anyway, if this aite has any actual activity maybe I can learn something. Forgive all spelling errors  :wink2:  
Have fun.

----------


## Sensei

I like the idea for the free ayd ebook, and the new book sounds awesome if it has relevant info. I like the hitchhiker's guide them. That being said, I do have some questions. 
What was your old account?
Where is my money going? 

I like to know a little background before putting my money somewhere, as well as some more info as to what my money will accomplish.

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## DanielLove

@Dreamwalkwr - Not old at all, these have all been made in the last few days. If you look at the blue bar above each post, it tells you when it was made. 

@Sensei - Thanks for the questions and thoughts. The first one I'll not answer (sorry!), the reason being that when one writes under a pseudonym it not only give you a level of anonymity, but also everyone else in your personal life that you may mention; friends, family, etc. As I have no access that old account, and even if I somehow could, I wouldn't have the time to trail through it deleting any private or personal information regarding people I know. This is the same for more personal or private details of your own life, it's much easier to discuss these behind a username, with the freedom that provides. If you or I write "My sister is being a complete idiot today" under a pseudonym, that tells us everything we need to know for a conversation, but no-one, including your sister, would ever know who "my sister" is referring to. Written under our given name changes all of that. On-line privacy extends beyond oneself. So, I'm sure you can understand that DreamViews acted somewhat like a diary, and I'd rather protect the privacy of friends and family. 

However, there's plenty of background information about me on-line. I can drop you some links later if that's any use to you?

To answer your second question, if you take a look near the bottom of the Kickstarter page, I've given a detailed breakdown of how funds will be used, including a graphic representation. If you have any specific details you'd like to know, I'd be more than happy to answer. The simple answer is that your money will be going towards all the costs involved in producing a book (printing, proof reader fees etc.) and running a website (hosting, artwork etc.).

In short, the initial aim of this campaign is to get the first book produced, which should then start the ball rolling towards generating the funds for research, events and anything else we collectively agree are needed in the field.

I'd certainly appreciate your help!  :smiley:

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## Mismagius

Free digital copy of "Are You Dreaming?" you say?  That's quite awesome!  Don't see how one could pass that up  ::mrgreen:: 

I posted about it on some Google+ communities and contacted some people in the LD community that have a pretty decent following on Twitter/Youtube to see if they could help spread the word.  Hopefully they do and it creates a ripple effect, and gets some more backers for it  :smiley: 

Also, have you tried posting about it on some kickstarter/crowdfunding communities?  Such as r/kickstarter on reddit?  r/kickstarter looks like they don't allow asking for backers, but sharing the campaign on there and similar communities could help get the word out more.

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## DanielLove

> Free digital copy of "Are You Dreaming?" you say?  That's quite awesome!  Don't see how one could pass that up 
> 
> I posted about it on some Google+ communities and contacted some people in the LD community that have a pretty decent following on Twitter/Youtube to see if they could help spread the word.  Hopefully they do and it creates a ripple effect, and gets some more backers for it 
> 
> Also, have you tried posting about it on some kickstarter/crowdfunding communities?  Such as r/kickstarter on reddit?  r/kickstarter looks like they don't allow asking for backers, but sharing the campaign on there and similar communities could help get the word out more.



@Mismagius - Brilliant, thanks ever so much! I think the word being spread by others is even more important than it coming from the creator of a campaign, after all people expect me to be positive, so when it comes from you guys it is all the more valuable. I really appreciate your help! Let's hope it gains traction and starts to spread of its own accord - as it's quite the relentless task having to constantly spread the word (and the line between enthusiasm and spammy starts to blur after a while - and I _really_ don't want to be spammy!) 

The crowdfunding communities idea is great, I've not tried that yet, I'll put it next on my to-do list. Thanks for the suggestion, It's something I'd considered before launching, but with so much to do, it's easy to forget a few things. I'll get onto it!!  :smiley:

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## ThreeRainbows

I like that you include a trance MP3 in your reward options. That's a bit different and creative.

Also, to be completely honest, I wasn't going to back the project. Not your fault, I just have so many lucid dreaming books, they are becoming dull compared to the waking dream (heresy, right?). But... that's just it.

You have a real dream here, and you seem very passionate about it. So I'll back for that reason alone. Good luck.  :smiley:

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## gab

I believe. So I tweeted. Also posted your project in a closed lucid dreaming/OBE Facebook group with over 2600 members. 





> ...Not that I want to be a part of any dream army lol



Too late, I'm affraid  ::chuckle::  ONE OF US

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## DanielLove

*@ThreeRainbows* You're amazing, thank you! I also completely understand where you're coming from, I believe I have almost every book published on the topic (if not all!). That's one of the reasons I wanted to write something completely new - as these aren't books _just_ about dreaming at all, they should (I hope) have a much wider scope and appeal  :smiley: 

I really appreciate you backing based on my passion for this project, it has been a long day and you've put a smile on my face. Thank you!

*@Gab* "oooonee ooof usss, ooooneeee oooof uuuuus", haha I like it!  :tongue2: 

Thanks so much for helping with spreading the word! Yours and everyone's involvement is certainly helping to get eyeballs on the page, which is so important! Using Google Analytics I'm definitely noticing the page views going up  :smiley:  Please keep up the good work everyone, it's starting to have an effect!

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## Patience108

> Too late, I'm affraid  ONE OF US



Nice one gab✨  ::wizard::      And         :Hug it out:  to all!

----------


## DanielLove

*People Power
*

You guys have all been absolutely awesome so far, and whatever the future holds, I certainly consider you all wonderful friends and allies in our goal to make the world more lucid!  :smiley: 

I've been busy sharing press releases far and wide. It's the kind of process where you need to send out thousands just to get noticed once - it's like a really rubbish fishing trip, only for journalists not fish - and you're not even allowed to eat journalists! 

So here's an idea I hope some of you will get behind: let's throw away the fishing rods and go dynamite fishing!

The way I see it, the collective power of us all targeting the media, journalists, YouTube celebrities etc. should have far more sway than me going alone. Also they tend to respond differently when an idea is coming from someone other than its source.

Also, being an ancient fossil compared to many of you wrinkle free, fashionable and disturbingly energetic lot, I'm far more out-of-touch with some of the more popular media figures and outlets. You'll probably think of people and places I don't even know exist!

*So here's the idea:*

Do whatever you can to share the project with big media types. Even, if we can get only one of them to give us a tweet, we'll reach a BIG audience. 

Perhaps, if any of you think it's a good idea, we could also compile a list of certain, relevant figures or websites that we can all contact on mass?

Here are the links to share again:

Short link:http://kck.st/1NSjUJN
Long link: www.luciddreamersguide.com

Let me know what you think, and if you do think it's a good idea - go be awesome and get started  :smiley:

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## Sensei

> @Sensei - Thanks for the questions and thoughts. The first one I'll not answer (sorry!), the reason being that when one writes under a pseudonym it not only give you a level of anonymity, but also everyone else in your personal life that you may mention; friends, family, etc. As I have no access that old account, and even if I somehow could, I wouldn't have the time to trail through it deleting any private or personal information regarding people I know. This is the same for more personal or private details of your own life, it's much easier to discuss these behind a username, with the freedom that provides. If you or I write "My sister is being a complete idiot today" under a pseudonym, that tells us everything we need to know for a conversation, but no-one, including your sister, would ever know who "my sister" is referring to. Written under our given name changes all of that. On-line privacy extends beyond oneself. So, I'm sure you can understand that DreamViews acted somewhat like a diary, and I'd rather protect the privacy of friends and family. 
> 
> However, there's plenty of background information about me on-line. I can drop you some links later if that's any use to you?
> 
> To answer your second question, if you take a look near the bottom of the Kickstarter page, I've given a detailed breakdown of how funds will be used, including a graphic representation. If you have any specific details you'd like to know, I'd be more than happy to answer. The simple answer is that your money will be going towards all the costs involved in producing a book (printing, proof reader fees etc.) and running a website (hosting, artwork etc.).
> 
> In short, the initial aim of this campaign is to get the first book produced, which should then start the ball rolling towards generating the funds for research, events and anything else we collectively agree are needed in the field.
> 
> I'd certainly appreciate your help!



1) I see, this is interesting, since Sensei is a pseudonym for me, and I do not like my "family or friends" knowing about my LDing things. Most people I know are actually quite against the concept, so I am not able to share it. I will see if I can get into my old twitter account, since it is not connected to my actual name, friends, or family.

2) ah, I see the breakdown at the bottom. I guess I am a little confused as to why you aren't talking to publishers instead of communities? 

I am not trying to be mr. negative over here, I am just more interested. I am also interested in you as a lucid dreamer, things like "how long have you been LDing" "How often do you LD" "what does an average night of LDing work, and day of LDing work look like to you", but this isn't the time and place to discuss this.  :tongue2:

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## DanielLove

*
@Sensei* - Don't worry, you can ask absolutely anything you like! 
To answer your first question "Why communities rather than publishers?" - Well, I want genuine freedom. Publishers have a very set criteria for projects they'll accept and they maintain a high level of editorial control. There's a good reason why the overwhelming majority of books on the subject are the same old boring "how to" books - because those are a safe bet for publishers. I genuinely want to discuss difficult or "dangerous" (in the eyes of publishers) topics in these books. I am also open to the option of working with a publisher for this project in the future, but only if I maintain complete artistic freedom. This will be a far easier deal to establish if they see that the project is popular and can exist without their input. So, in a nut shell, I want the freedom to express and explore without limits.

I'd be happy to discuss your other questions, I'm looking towards doing some kind of Q&A thread in the near future so that may be a better environment to answer those in depth. I tend to ramble and I'll fill half this thread with answers to your questions if I'm not careful! The first one is easy though, I've been lucid dreaming my entire life. It developed because I suffered from parasomnias, mostly nightmares and sleep walking as a young child. I developed lucid dreaming as a defence mechanism, which cured these issues. From there on a long and deep relationship has been a continuous thread running through my life. 

I have been able to lucid dream at will for a very long time, but it still requires me to choose to put in the effort initiate one (although there are, of course, regular unplanned DILDs thrown into the mix). So technically I could lucid dream several times each night. In reality I tend to put this into practice two to three times a week, sometimes more or sometimes less; it depends on what is happening in my life and how much I require nights to completely "shut down". I see lucid dreaming as a little like opening a heavy stone door: you develop the skills required to unlock the door (the key), and then you acquaint yourself with what is behind that door (the dream world) - both of these are skills and knowledge which once mastered stay with you for life. However, each time you want to open the door, you'll still need to exert the strength to push that door open. Not a perfect metaphor, but hopefully you get the idea.

I'll try and answer your other questions when the Q&A thread comes into existence  :smiley:

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## shadowwolf6tail

You have my kick starter backing and support on social media. Unfortunately I don't have a very big scope for social media... but every bit counts!

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## DanielLove

*@shadowwolf6tail* - That's brilliant! Thank you ever so much!  :smiley:  You're quite right, absolutely every little bit of promotion helps and you never know what will come of it. For example, I asked a friend of mine to do her bit to spread the word, she casually mentioned the project to her landlady, who, several hours later, backed the project by a very generous sum and e-mailed something like 1000 contacts! I guess this is part of the wonderfully unpredictable nature of this world, we really can't predict the consequences of any particular actions. It's exciting and just goes to show that as you say, every bit really does count - sometime's in quite unexpected ways!

@Everybody - We should have an article over at the World of Lucid Dreaming early next week, so that should help raise awareness among a different crowd. There are a few other exciting bits and pieces being worked on as we speak, I'll let you all know as soon as theirs something more tangible to share! 

On a side note, if any of you take part in other lucid dream communities or forums, if you could let them know about the project, that would be fantastic.  :smiley:

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## Mismagius

That's amazing!  It can be easy to forget sometimes that something you do can help in big ways.  I've always loved the idea of the ripple/domino effect and it's interesting to see how it plays out with word of mouth.





> *So here's the idea:*
> 
> Do whatever you can to share the project with big media types. Even, if we can get only one of them to give us a tweet, we'll reach a BIG audience. 
> 
> Perhaps, if any of you think it's a good idea, we could also compile a list of certain, relevant figures or websites that we can all contact on mass?
> 
> Here are the links to share again:
> 
> Short link:http://kck.st/1NSjUJN
> ...



I'm definitely up for that!  

I know there are some news sites and journalists that have published a lot of stories on lucid dreaming, Vice and the Huffington Post are ones that come to mind immediately.  Contacting news sites or journalists that have written on the topic before might have higher chances they'll write on it again.

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## BlairBros

A while ago a journalist contacted me on Dreamviews about some of my dreams involving American political figures (eg. Trump) for something he was writing, so I emailed him about this campaign as I thought he might be interested and could spread the word around  :smiley: .

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## oneian

I've signed up and thank you Daniel. Loved your book.

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## DanielLove

*@mismagius* - Fantastic, whatever you can do to get the word out to media outlets would be great. Keep me up to date with your progress and I'll do the same from my end. If everyone else who does this can also share what they've been doing here, we'll be able to coordinate our efforts.

*@BlairBros* - That's really great of you - I hope he bites and shares the campaign. Do keep up the good work  :smiley: 

*@Oneian* - Thanks so much for supporting the project. It's so exciting to have other dreamers involved and enthusiastic about it. Thank you!

*@Everyone* - I've just posted a project update, with a few new suggestions to help give the campaign a boost. I've also mentioned dreamviews!  :smiley:  You can read it here: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects.../posts/1594399

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## Dunno

Wow this is great, I'll definitely spread the word  :smiley:

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## DanielLove

*IMPORTANT UPDATE: NEW THREAD*

Hey guys. 

To keep things tidy - I've created a new thread, with all the important information listed in the first post. 

*You can find it here: http://www.dreamviews.com/general-lu...ml#post2196090*

It'll help me out immensely if you could use that new thread to continue the discussion. As it will keep things all in one place, but also give a better introduction to those who don't know about it yet.
At this point let's focus on the campaign stage of the project - but after that, the thread will be used to develop ideas, submit content, share skills and knowledge etc.

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## gab

Hey everybody!

Thank you all for nice conversation here. Please continue in the above listed new thread. http://www.dreamviews.com/general-lu...ml#post2196090

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## Mismagius

Bumping this to let the people that are subscribed to this thread know.  Only *9 hours* left, it's currently 88% funded with 133 backers, it just needs £1,313 ($1,1742) more to be successfully funded.  Anything you can do to help would be greatly appreciated, whether that's backing it or sharing on social media.  Here's a link to the kickstarter and the discussion thread on DV below:

*https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...to-the-cosmos/ or www.luciddreamersguide.com

http://www.dreamviews.com/general-lu...unded-%2A.html*


Also, if you back the project at *any amount* (even $1) and share the project you'll receive an ebook copy of Daniel Love's book "Are You Dreaming?" for *free*!  Checkout some of the rewards on the kickstarter too, there's a bunch of different ones.  Some being receiving an ebook, paperback, or hardback of the first book in The Lucid Dreamer's Guide to the Cosmos series when it comes out.

This is a truly great project for the entire lucid dreaming field and community, something that will benefit it for years to come.  The books will help to support dream research, events, etc.  And they'll help to spread awareness and knowledge of the subject.  So in a way by supporting this project, you're supporting lucid dreaming itself  :smiley:

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