# Lucid Dreaming > DV Academy > Current Courses > Intro Class >  >  BlueKat's Workbook (Intro Class)

## BlueKat

Reality Checks:  Finger extension, check hands, what about the last/next five minutes, more awareness of present time. 

Dream signs:  My husband, my sisters, water, cats in that order.

Short-term Goals:  Fly around my neighborhood, Go to the beach, Heal callous on foot. 

Long-term Goals:  See my parents again, meet my grandparents, meditate, higher awareness (consciousness) and many more.

Lucid Dream Recall History:  One very vivid when I did a reality check.  Non-lucid dreams I've recorded about 160 from September, 2015 to present.  

Current Techniques being practiced:  MILD, WBTB, WILD.

Sleep pattern:  I sleep about 9 hours per night so last night I went to bed a little early, did my meditation, then my mantra.  Practiced (I'm using practiced instead of tried!) three WBTBs.

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## NyxCC

Welcome to Intro class, BlueKat!  :smiley: 

Looking forward to reading your updates. Don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.

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## BlueKat

Thank you so much NyxCC.  I am so excited you offer help!  I have no one to talk to and it looks like DV is my outlet.  Thanks again.

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## NyxCC

You're welcome.  :smiley:  Yes, it's really awesome we have a place where we can discuss all of this with similar minded people. Great to have you here.

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## BlueKat

Today I changed my RCs after reading a lot of information on DVs.  I took time out to be as aware as I can (at this point anyway) with the details around me and who/what I'm impacting and what/who is impacting me, etc.  I feel like I took more time for fewer RCs but they were more meaningful.  Feeling hopeful about those and will continue.

My nighttime routine (also from reading, thanks to all who have provided lots of info.) is going to be get ready for bed, meditate, then do the hands bit every night for the rest of March.

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## BlueKat

Just updating.  The past two nights I've gotten only a few hours sleep due to a cold and stress at home.  I have, however, still done meditation and then my hands mantra and will continue to do so.  I'm so jealous  and impressed of those of you who have already completed the task of the month!  You go kids!  I'll get there.

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## NyxCC

Hope you feel better soon! 

I'm sure you'll catch up with the tasks. Looking forward to reading about those.  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

I think I had an epiphany this morning.  Within my dreams, there seems to be no background which I can use for a RC.  I see only the things I'm dealing with - not that I look around, but still, there doesn't seem to be anything in the periphery.  I attempted a WBTB at 5:33 am and I fell asleep fast and I don't remember any HI.  I attempted again at 8:08 am and lay there until 8:50 with no HI and then got up.  At night, I'm doing my meditation, then my hand mantra and intending for a dream where I have two goals.  I wrote down five dreams from last night; I'm not sure but they don't seem connected so I wrote them as separate dreams in my dream journal.

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## BlueKat

Friday, 3-13-2015 - 9:50 pm, said mantra while looking at my hands, then went to sleep.  Up at 1:14 am, recorded a dream, back to sleep.  Up at 5:20 am, recorded four dreams, attempted a WBTB at 5:33, quickly fell asleep.  Up at 8:08 am, recorded one dream, attempted a WBTB at 8:15 am, nothing happened, up at 8:50 am.

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## BlueKat

Hi NyxCC,

Just wondering do you want me to post in my workbook everyday even if nothing is new?  I'm recording bedtime, wake time and dreams I remember but I'm not yet lucid and feel like I'd be wasting both our time but happy to do it if you think it will help.  This whole past week has been strange but I've still tried to meditate and do my hand mantra every night.  Due to a cold and lack of sleep, I've barely managed to recall dreams.  I am determined to continue until I learn how to have LDs.  Let me know about daily postings please.  Thanks.

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## NyxCC

Hi Bluekat! Don't forget that the workbook is your own personal workspace, so you can write in it whatever you feel is relevant and what you feel is helpful. If you feel it still helps keep your mind on dreaming and be more organized by posting often, then do post!  :smiley: 

If you have questions in particular regarding your practices let me know. I hope you are able to recover from your cold quickly and catch up on sleep.

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## BlueKat

Thanks NyxCC, I'm hoping tonight I can get back to an earlier bedtime and I'm feeling well.  I so desperately want to LD and I have so many things I want to do and I am so excited, I can hardly wait!!  I'm open to any advice.  This week has been lost with not enough sleep, etc. but tonight, I'll meditate for 20 minutes, then say my mantra as I look at my hands, "I see my hands and I'm aware I'm dreaming" (present tense).  I've been doing several reality checks through the day, really looking at the entire environment, my hands, words, time, what I've done the past 15 minutes and what I'll do the next 15 minutes.  The past several nights, I've not recorded any dreams because I haven't remembered any... :Sad:    I did see last night on DV about the buddy system so I will definitely sign up for that as I have NO ONE to talk to and it happens to be the ONLY thing I want to talk about!  I didn't realize it was so esoteric but it is in my world unfortunately.  Any thoughts?  Thanks again.  I appreciate your time.

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## BlueKat

I'm happy that I got enough sleep last night to record four dreams.  I'm going to add visualization to my nightly routine.  Today I practiced awareness in much more depth than ever before after reading the ADA here on DV.  I should have become lucid in a dream with my (deceased) mother in one and certainly another where buildings came up from the ground!  Will keep practicing.

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## NyxCC

> This week has been lost with not enough sleep, etc. but tonight, I'll meditate for 20 minutes, then say my mantra as I look at my hands, "I see my hands and I'm aware I'm dreaming" (present tense).  I've been doing several reality checks through the day, really looking at the entire environment, my hands, words, time, what I've done the past 15 minutes and what I'll do the next 15 minutes.  The past several nights, I've not recorded any dreams because I haven't remembered any...   I did see last night on DV about the buddy system so I will definitely sign up for that as I have NO ONE to talk to and it happens to be the ONLY thing I want to talk about!  I didn't realize it was so esoteric but it is in my world unfortunately.  Any thoughts?  Thanks again.  I appreciate your time.



That's good. Keep up the day work! It's important to make it a habit so that you can build a strong foundation. It takes a while but sooner or later these checks and critical thinking will start showing up in dreams. You can later (after you catch up on sleep) combine the daywork with night work - wbtb and any technique of your choice for even better results. Also, you can add MILD before bed time with minimal sleep disruption - think how you will realize that you are dreaming! If you're interested for more ideas like this let me know. You can also try to come up with your own techs - experiment and see if anything makes a difference. 

Visualization is a great tech also, refering to your second post.  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

This morning, I recalled and recorded my dreams, got up, fed cats then did a WBTB.  I practiced visualization and I saw purple, increased the area of purple but didn't ever completely cover the area with purple; it was just blobs but after it went away for a while, I intentionally brought it back and was pleased with that.  On the WBTB, I laid there for an hour and 10 minutes and during that time, I felt my body and limbs get heavy (SP?), then had tingling pretty much all over and then...boredom and got up.  I did think about the last dream I had before I awoke this morning but I am not able to visualize well yet so just thinking about it evidently didn't do the trick.

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## NyxCC

Did you do your visualization while in bed?

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## BlueKat

Yes.

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## NyxCC

I see. Well, it seems like you were about to fall asleep towards the end. Perhaps all the focus on waiting for something to happen prevented you from doing so. Even if you are trying to wild, you still need to fall asleep. I'd say even if no wild results, if you were focused on having an ld and fall asleep after that, you may get a dild from all the work you've done.

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## BlueKat

I kind of feel like I should be having LDs by now.  I'm going to continue to do awareness, RCs, my hand mantra, record dreams but I'm a little frustrated b/c I so much want to have LDs.  I'd be happy with a DILD.  Truly, I don't care how I get there; I just want to learn to LD (on command would be fantastic) but I'll take anything.  I'm sticking to the mantra, "Tonight in my dreams when I see my hands I'll realize I'm dreaming."  One thing I have to be honest about is that some nights when I wake up, I don't record my dreams; sometimes I forget to wait a couple of minutes to let them come to mind and other nights, I immediately get up to use the bathroom.  I wonder if I should somehow focus on trying to not get up but I do it before I even think about it.  I still record a minimum of one dream per night (except on Tuesdays after working 12 hours, I just don't have enough time I need to sleep) but otherwise, one dream and sometimes many chapters (I'm not sure if they're separate dreams or all links in a chain).  Any thoughts/suggestions?  Again, I am so grateful to have DV!

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## NyxCC

It's ok if you just remember fragments instead of entire blocks of events/dreams. Try not to rush out of bed so fast and see if you can remember any details. When you do, focus on them and try working backwards when events begin to unfold in your memory. That way you will recover more of your dreams. Also, if you already have a list of common dream signs, try going through them if you don't remember anything at all and ask yourself, is it possible that I dreamt about Dream sign 1? Then it might turn out that you did. 

Keep up the day and night work. It may take a while for the practices to reach the subconscious mind, but eventually they will and you will find yourself lucid.  ::goodjob2::

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## BlueKat

I am so happy to report I had an LD last night.  I'm doing the happy LD dance!!  I was walking behind two ladies through a doorway and the second one told me another group from our group was out there in the waiting room and as I asked if it was Tina, the girl's face starts to disappear and I immediately said, "Hey, we're dreaming." And if I'm dreaming I need to see Jackson Galaxy (one of my LD goals!!!).  And I start to see triangles and shapes and everything just disappears before my eyes and I awoke.  BUT SO HAPPY to have had a lucid dream.  I'm guessing the disappearing trick was when I should have "stabilized" the dream.

When I went to bed last night I told myself I NEED to LD (because I have hopes of doing the beginner's TOTM) and I did!  YAY.  The power of intention is alive and well.  I also recorded four dreams from last night b/c I laid there for a minute before I got up.  THANK YOU for your help.  I can hardly stand the excitement.  :bliss

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## NyxCC

Awww! This is fantastic!!! Congrats, BlueKat, you did it!  ::goodjob:: 

I'm so happy for you!  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

I realized something interesting.  When I was later describing how the people disappeared in my last LD (as if I have many  :smiley: ) it was like they were being erased out of the scene and then I read in someone else's post where they'd used the word "eraser".  I am guessing I had the same experience and am fascinated that collectively, we have many of the same happenings. 

I used the, "tonight in my dreams when I see my hands I'll realize I'm dreaming" mantra for the month of March...I never noticed my hands so do I change the mantra?  I've seen suggestions where they recommend you use the same mantra for 90 days before changing it.  Thoughts please.

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## NyxCC

Yes, there are many similarities and at the same time there are some things that are unique for each person. It's really amazing!  :smiley: 

About the mantra, have you considered making it a bit shorter? It may be more effective - "when I see my hands I'll realize I'm dreaming" or even  "I see my hands I realize I'm dreaming". Mine is super short actually, it depends what sounds good to you and your subcon. You can repeat it on any occasion too, throughout the day as well as before bed and wbtb.

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## BlueKat

Thanks NyxCC.  I'll shorten it and use I more frequently.

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## BlueKat

Just checking in.  Thanks NyxCC for the recommendation to shorten my mantra.  So for April, I'm practicing awareness several times during the day as thorough as I can, meditating, continue my dream journal, when I awake in the night, try a WBTB with my mantra, and practice not moving when I awake (not doing so hot at this - I move and then remember I wasn't supposed to - LOL) AND talk to my DV buddy Naiya!

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## NyxCC

You're welcome!  :smiley: 

Good program you've set for this month.

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## BlueKat

Last night I remembered quite a few dreams and am happy with that.  So grateful to have a buddy (thanks Naiya!) to talk with and share this journey.

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## BlueKat

I haven't written in here in a while. I've been utilizing the buddy system with Naiya.  She's helped me so much.  It's nice to have someone to talk to on a regular basis.  I've also been in the chat room just a little.

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## NyxCC

So happy to hear the program has been helpful to you and your buddy.  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

This morning's LD for a second:

4:38 am Dream:  I had gotten my hair done because it was New Year's Eve and I was going out with a friend.  I walked into the ballroom and saw Betty White and my aunt, Laura (she's 86 and lives in NY) - she's been on my mind b/c I haven't seen her in a couple of years and I'm going to go this summer at the very latest - I went to Laura, hugged her and asked her what she was doing there.  Then, I saw Mom, started to cry fairly hard as I was walking to her because I knew I was dreaming b/c I've been RCing with my parents (deceased) and my sisters (live in another state).  I woke up before I got to her...and was so disappointed b/c I want to see my parents in my LDs, I tried to lie still and go back into the dream but I moved and couldn't go back to sleep right away.  All three ladies were in floor length gowns and all three looked very pretty.  In WL, my mother died three years ago and she died from cancer and was frail and in pain when she died so I have these horrible memories and I can't hardly remember all the good years - I totally enjoyed my parents.  So, even if it was for just a short second, she looked beautiful and healthy and I'm grateful to have seen that.

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## NyxCC

Congrats on the ld! Sorry you didn't have more time in this one. I am sure you will have more opportunities to see your loved ones in future lds.

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## BlueKat

Thanks NyxCC.  I am looking forward to seeing them again.  I know it will happen.  I've been keeping up with the RCs and I'm happy each time I've gotten lucid, if only for a short second.  Seeing my mother brought out strong emotions so I'm guessing that's why I woke up so fast.  My hope is that next time I'm lucid, I'm just going to try to look around, look at my hands, dream body, etc. and that will BE the goal, try to feel what it feels like rather than try to do something.  I have a long list of goals but clearly I need to work on attaining lucidity and then stabilizing the dream first.

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## BlueKat

Help.   I loved PMing with Naiya for the buddy program in April but I'm still not getting lucid.  I've had seven, short LDs but I feel like I'm doing the work but not receiving the reward.  I don't mean to complain but give me the password!   LOL.  I'm doing RCs, I'm trying to be more self-aware, asking what I've done the past five minutes,what I'm going to do the next five, MILD, I did the hands one for four months, now I'm doing,  when I dream, I remember I'm dreaming, WILD attempts but no success yet and I record my dreams.  I have learned that I need to be in bed at least nine hours to get some good recall.  B6 seems to help with that.   I don't really want to try Galantamine or things like that but...I'm getting frustrated.  I will KEEP TRYING!  The next time I have an LD I'm going to try to just look around and feel how it feels rather than try to accomplish anything.  My goal list is growing but it's going to have to wait until I get some experience.

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## NyxCC

7 Lds, that's not bad at all! Keep up the good work!  :smiley: 

Don't forget that lucid dreaming is a skill like any other and the more you train (i.e. more lds you have), the better you will become at things like induction, dream control and ld lenght. So keep it up! Do you do wbtbs? Try to pick up a day (possibly during the weekend if that's a quiet time with sleep opportunities) and experiment with the lenght of wbtbs - say from the 5 to 30 mins range and note if that makes any differences for lucidity and dream lenght. Also, don't forget to be as involved as possible in the dream - going for tasks is actually best (as it keeps you focused on the dream environment and items).

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## BlueKat

Yesterday after whining in my workbook I decided to get out my dream journal and see if I could find anything that helped me get lucid those seven times.  What's interesting is that in the five months of being a newbie I really can't complain about seven!  The more I read on DV, the more details I get which is helpful.  I
I do want to know, though, if I'm supposed to be combining my RCs with DSs?  I know my DSs but I'm not sure what to do with them during WL.  Do I combine anything with my mantra?  I feel like I'm doing RCs, Mantras, and focused awareness but maybe I'm not tying together things that need to be tied together.  Just some thoughts.

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## BlueKat

> 7 Lds, that's not bad at all! Keep up the good work! 
> 
> Don't forget that lucid dreaming is a skill like any other and the more you train (i.e. more lds you have), the better you will become at things like induction, dream control and ld lenght. So keep it up! Do you do wbtbs? Try to pick up a day (possibly during the weekend if that's a quiet time with sleep opportunities) and experiment with the lenght of wbtbs - say from the 5 to 30 mins range and note if that makes any differences for lucidity and dream lenght. Also, don't forget to be as involved as possible in the dream - going for tasks is actually best (as it keeps you focused on the dream environment and items).



Thanks.  I do attempt WBTB and I have dreams but not LDs. I will try different times though.  I am also incorporating SAT during the day now. The last WBTB I did yesterday morning and I laid there for 75 minutes.  My body felt really heavy (sp?) and started to tingle a little bit, I had some HI in some shapes but it never formed into anything and then, I always get up.  How long do I lie there?  That was mid morning; after 7 hours sleep.

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## NyxCC

> I do want to know, though, if I'm supposed to be combining my RCs with DSs? I know my DSs but I'm not sure what to do with them during WL. Do I combine anything with my mantra? I feel like I'm doing RCs, Mantras, and focused awareness but maybe I'm not tying together things that need to be tied together. Just some thoughts.



I do a number of different combinations, sometimes all of them during the same day, at other times I switch from one combo to another. For example, I might repeat my general dreaming mantra during the day at any occasion I remember, including when looking at items. I could also include repeating while looking at DS though I don't have too many that actually appear in the flesh. Looking at the sky for instance could be a combination of mantra and DS for me. The other thing I do is to list DS and mantra on them again whenever I think about this. I.e. I see DS1, I realize I'm dreaming, I see DS2 I realize I'm dreaming. Kind of like a poem. I also have them on audio so I can play this whenever I remember too. You can also do this pre bed and during wbtbs and natural wakes. 





> Thanks. I do attempt WBTB and I have dreams but not LDs. I will try different times though. I am also incorporating SAT during the day now. The last WBTB I did yesterday morning and I laid there for 75 minutes. My body felt really heavy (sp?) and started to tingle a little bit, I had some HI in some shapes but it never formed into anything and then, I always get up. How long do I lie there? That was mid morning; after 7 hours sleep.



That's ok. If it drags for too long with no effect, just say your mantra for a min or so and try to fall asleep as usual. It may yield a DILD later on so not all is lost.

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## BlueKat

Just checking in.  I was on vacation  which took about two weeks out of getting a lot of sleep and remembering dreams.  I'm working on self-awareness using an hourly chime for the moment until I do it more consistently.  I'll add reality checks at that time also.  I'm using dogs as a dream sign because I frequently dream about them and in the dream the dog/dogs are mine and I don't have one!  I have 3 cats whom I also dream about and when I retire I'd like to have a dog also.  I'm also trying to add any change of situation as a dream sign hoping that helps.   My mantra is now, "I'm dreaming and I'll have a lucid dream tonight".  I'm still recording dreams and drinking apple juice and taking a B6 vitamin at night.  I figure none of that will hurt and hopefully it all helps.  Haven't had a lucid dream in a while but I know they will come.

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## BlueKat

So...I was sort of driving myself a little crazy with an hourly alarm, self-awareness, etc. and no LDs.  I took a break for a week (but kept dream journaling) and this morning I did the happy LD dance!!  Yes, one of my goals is to see Jackson Galaxy (the Cat Daddy) and ask him about my cat challenges.  I don't know what made me lucid but I remembered immediately I wanted to see Jackson, so I said out loud, "When I turn around, Jackson Galaxy will be there" and he wasn't but he walked into the room through a doorway.  What's funny is that he was half Jackson Galaxy and half Professor Dumbledore from Harry Potter (I was talking about Harry Potter this weekend).  I kind of laughed and woke up shortly thereafter.  Yay.  Another goal is to just feel the environment and look around and try to know the difference between dreaming and waking so I can be lucid more frequently.

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## BlueKat

Oh yea, to add, it was a WBTB after I was up for an hour playing solitaire on my phone, then used the mantra, "remember I'm dreaming".  I read on Dreamviews in someone's signature, "WBTB is king" and that has stuck with me.

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## CanisLucidus

Congratulations, BlueKat, great job!  I'm glad that not only were you successful, but that you remembered _and succeeded_ at your goals.

I don't know whose signature you saw, but I agree... WBTB is amazing!  It's the piece of the lucid dreaming puzzle that I resisted as hard as I could because it just sounded so inconvenient.  But fairly early on in my lucid dreaming practices, an accidental WBTB brought me a high-quality lucid dream after I'd struggled for a couple of months to achieve one.  That sold me!

It sounds to me like you're doing everything right!  Keep up the great work!   ::goodjob2::

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## NyxCC

That's fanstastic, Bluekat, congrats!  ::goodjob::  

Also, taking a short break can sometimes be invigorating if one feels burned out from lding or real life. Now you're ready for more lds.  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

I know it's been a while since I posted...not for lack of thinking about LDing.  I bought Galantamine and took 8 mg this morning and then promptly puked my guts out...but then after 2 1/2 hours I went back to sleep - i thought I'm certainly not going to waste this crappy experience and NOT try to have a lucid dream if at all possible!  LOL.  And I did have an LD...my goal for the last several months in which I haven't had an LD was to see my deceased parents.  My current goal with the Galantamine was to feel how it felt, look at my hands and dream body and try to remember and notice the dreaming state so I could have an LD more easily and hopefully more frequently in the future.  Well, that was my thought anyway.

So, I go back to bed and I see HI, a white blank then it would transform into a family room, similar to my own, then back to white and back and forth quite a few times.  Then I couldn't feel my WL body but I knew it was there, it's hard to explain, then I was in a family room and I heard my mother.  I'm not sure what went on between the HI and being in a family room with my family.  When I heard my mother's voice and turned to her, I got all choked up b/c I knew I was dreaming but happy to see her.  I hugged her and told her I love her and miss her and she was sweet but not 100% looking like my mother - in NL dreams, she's always looked like her healthier self (before she passed away from cancer) but in this LD she was bloated, strange but my father was there (who has also passed away) and looked normal and I didn't skip a beat.  I acted like he was still living just like my sisters who were in the dream also.  Then Mom faded or disappeared and I was looking out a sliding glass door and knowing I was dreaming I tried to kick it in (why I have no idea) and it took me a couple of tries and it just sort of bowed out.  I laughed and moved on.  Can't remember much else.

Then, I could hear my husband in WL and still couldn't really feel my body and could see some HI shapes.  I tried to go back into the dream to no avail.

Now, I feel like I cheated and can't count this as an LD.  And it was pretty horrible getting so sick.  I won't be doing that again but I WILL get back to self awareness and be committed to meditating more frequently.  My husband thinks I'm insane to have tried "drugs" but I truly felt that desperate.  Now, I'll try the old fashioned way, back to MILDs and awareness.  Thanks for listening.  And if anyone ever gets together in the US, I want in!!  Still grateful for DV.

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## NyxCC

Hey Bluekat, thanks for dropping by and sharing your experience. You know, I can actually relate to some of the things you are going through.

I don't think any of us is immune to feeling disappointed when the lds don't come as expected. However, we only have two choices - reorganize ourselves and our practices or abandon the quest for lucid dreaming altogether. And if one really needs dreams for one reason or another, then we just have to pull through and try to come up with innovative techniques to induce them (I don't mean drugs but induction techs  :tongue2: ). 

I think it will help for you to make some sort of monthly target of practices that you want to do each month and then try to meet that target. As the month goes by, you will see which of these practices give you results - make note not just of lds you have but dreams where one talks about lding, RCs and things like that. This will help you determine the way to go. Then the following month analyze the results and set new targets. 

Looking forward to any ideas you have. You can do this Bluekat!  :smiley:

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## BlueKat

Thanks NyxCC.  I will take your suggestion and identify some practice goals.  I've been recording most of my dreams and know my dream signs but I think I would feel more productive if I track meditations, self awareness, LD stuff in dreams, MILD, WBTB, etc.  I'll come up with some goals.  I definitely like the idea though.  Thanks again.  Will keep you posted.  I am going to do this!   :smiley:

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## BlueKat

Oh my gosh!!  I totally forgot about the LD I had 6/30!!   That was only 6 weeks ago and I'm complaining about not having LDs.  One of my cats unexpectedly passed away 3 weeks ago and I guess I'm still out of sorts.  How could I forget about half Jackson Galaxy and half Professor Dumbledore?  WBTB is king!!  Thanks CanisLucidus and NyxCC.

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## CanisLucidus

Congratulations on the lucids, BlueKat!!   ::D: 

I'm sorry to hear about the negative experience that you had with galantamine!  It sounds like you're not interested in trying it again, but in case the interest does return at some point, I'd definitely suggest starting with a much smaller dose and only gradually working your way up.  That lets you find the perfect dose _for you_ that helps give you results without experiencing side effects (such as nausea, yikes!)

Anyhow, you should be very proud of both of your LDs!  Don't believe for a second you didn't earn them!  All lucid aids (and even the undisputed champ, WBTB) can do is help you.  Ultimately, it's your skills, determination, and hard work that will make everything fall into place.   ::goodjob2:: 

Good luck and keep us posted!

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## BlueKat

It's funny you suggest a much smaller dose.  I think I was in the lucid aids forum and I mentioned I  was going to start with 2 mg and someone recommended more. And the more I read, it seemed like 8 mg is what most people were taking. But you are right, I should've started smaller. And though I'm a little embarrassed, I did get it back out of my garbage can. I appreciate the support.

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## CanisLucidus

> It's funny you suggest a much smaller dose.  I think I was in the lucid aids forum and I mentioned I  was going to start with 2 mg and someone recommended more. And the more I read, it seemed like 8 mg is what most people were taking. But you are right, I should've started smaller. And though I'm a little embarrassed, I did get it back out of my garbage can. I appreciate the support.



Cool!   :smiley:   There's nothing to be embarrassed about -- it's all part of the learning experience!  And surely you don't think I've never fished something useful back out of the trash before.   :Cheeky: 

Good luck and keep up the good work.   :smiley:

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