# Sleep and Dreams > Research >  >  Becoming a Natural Lucid Dreamer

## MindGames

*Notice: In regards to the title of the thread, I am aware that one cannot become a "natural" lucid dreamer in the literal sense. I use 'natural lucid dreamer' in the context of one who has acquired the underlying traits that cause traditional natural lucid dreamers to have regular lucid dreams. Although it does take initial conscious work to acquire these traits, the idea is that over time, these traits will become subconscious and cease to require much, if any conscious effort since, as is in traditional natural lucid dreamers, they are part of a passive mindset as opposed to being deliberate, consciously initiated actions.*

Furthermore, no discussion on the title of this thread is allowed due to the constant derailing that it causes.


Great, now that's settled we can move on to the actual research.  :smiley: 

*__________________________________________________*


This thread is for research into and individual development of the underlying traits of natural lucid dreamers that cause them to dream regularly and with little conscious effort to do so. From the research that has been done so far, I am led to believe that natural lucid dreamers have a naturally high level of awareness of their environments in their everyday lives. This requires one to shift their attention from their thoughts, and to instead always pay attention to the environment that they are in.

This is the general technique being used: (further adjustments will be described in follow-up posts)

1. Always be aware of your sensory input. Use it to be in constant determination of whether or not it feels like you're in a dream. As you progress, you will become more familiar with the feeling of being in a dream. You should do this passively over time. Use KingYoshi's ADA tutorial for tips on this.

2. Always know your location. If you regain awareness and don't know where you are after looking at your environment or don't know how you got there, you're probably dreaming. Maintain attention on your location, and pay attention to when you move from one location to another. Is your current location a usual one? Is the transition coherent? Over time, pay attention to more specific aspects of your environment in determining whether or not you're in a dream environment. Using this technique will activate higher level frontal lobe activity, the kind that you need to become lucid.


More importantly, don't try to do everything at once, at least not when you're starting out. I usually maintain sensory input awareness (#1) at all times in determining if it feels like a dream, and I use location awareness (#2) every time I'm moving from place to place, and periodically when I stay in the same place for a long time. It shouldn't be too hard to do both at once with a little bit of practice.

And don't forget to reality check once you realize you're dreaming. Use the nose plug RC to make sure you're in a dream before you do anything crazy (mostly to cover my ass  :tongue2: ).


Good luck in becoming a natural lucid dreamer! Make sure you regularly post your progress so we can learn from your experience.  :smiley:

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## MischiefManaged

My lucid dreaming goal is to eventually be able to recognize the dream every time it occurs. Well, I guess, it's the goal of majority people who learn to lucid dream. 

I started working on my awareness two weeks ago and after 6 days I became lucid, because I had some sort of awareness boost - I decided to look around in a dream the same way as I was training myself IRL. I immediately saw all the dream signs and gained lucidity.  

I consider my awareness level (before I started training) the worst ever possible, actually. I have annoying daydreaming habit, I often sort of became frozen and stare at one point, have awful short term memory in terms of "where I am" and "what was I just doing" and I almost never notice my surroundings, because actually, some time ago I decided to do so. Taking all of that into account - 6 days is a great success for me  ::D:

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## MindGames

> My lucid dreaming goal is to eventually be able to recognize the dream every time it occurs. Well, I guess, it's the goal of majority people who learn to lucid dream. 
> 
> I started working on my awareness two weeks ago and after 6 days I became lucid, because I had some sort of awareness boost - I decided to look around in a dream the same way as I was training myself IRL. I immediately saw all the dream signs and gained lucidity.  
> 
> I consider my awareness level (before I started training) the worst ever possible, actually. I have annoying daydreaming habit, I often sort of became frozen and stare at one point, have awful short term memory in terms of "where I am" and "what was I just doing" and I almost never notice my surroundings, because actually, some time ago I decided to do so. Taking all of that into account - 6 days is a great success for me



Good job!  :smiley:  I've known for a while now that reality checks weren't necessary to become lucid. I've been practicing my awareness for around four days and I just had a semi-lucid last night. I won't count mine as official progress, but you're definitely making good progress so far. I suggest you try to be aware at all possible times. This should increase the frequency of lucids and make it more of a subconscious habit.

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## rynkrt3

Go ask Hukif, Naiya, kingYoshi what they do for LD.  I have asked them all and they all said all day awareness, they also each have a LD every night. So yeah.. You can become a natural.  This is actually what I'm doing now.

Live in the moment and notice every detail in life that normally goes un-noticed.  After a few months of doing this, it becomes internalized and natural, in waking and dreaming.

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## MindGames

Thanks rynkrt3! That's exactly the type of validation I was looking for. I'm confident that anyone can become a natural at lucid dreaming if they learn to maintain constant awareness. Come back to this thread and post your results once you've maintained constant awareness for some time. I'm very interested in hearing your results.  :smiley: 

As for my attempts, I've been drifting in and out of awareness throughout the day for the most part. I am optimistic about making good progress on my baseline awareness. So far, only one semi-lucid using the technique.


Also on a side note, I've read (forgot where I read it from) that greater awareness gives you better memory. I for one am interested in any positive health effects in the brain, especially if they can be achieved in a healthy, surefire way.

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## MindGames

> Also I saw a thread around the forums of someone saying that during their LD they summoned their dream guide and told their dream guide "every time im dreaming give me this pill, this pill will make me lucid" and something along the lines of that and it helped him have regular LD's.



Yes, I thought of using that technique too. It's interesting to hear that it actually worked for someone. However I have yet to maintain a stable lucid dream long enough to get anything done. I will definitely try this if I get the chance.

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## MindGames

How many days have you been practicing awareness? Keep practicing, you should be making progress soon if you keep up with it. I'll be doing the same in the meantime.

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## rynkrt3

I've been practicing for 3 day's, but I don't even know what to do... like I'm not sure if I'm doing it correctly.  I'm just trying to notice things I normally wouldn't, but idk if this is right.

Like, peoples clothes, conversations, details of environment. Thats about it.

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## MindGames

Essentially the goal is to always know what the general environment is that you're in. I tend to only try to be aware of the visual aspects of my environment, since the most obvious aspects of dreaming are visual. I suggest you do this too, and once you've mastered being constantly aware of your environment to a high enough degree where it's likely you'll become lucid with that level of dream awareness (it's pretty hard to constantly be aware), then you should try increasing your awareness to an even higher degree, such as being aware of the smaller details of your environment. You're not only going to want to be aware of your environment, but be aware of your environment in regards to whether or not you're dreaming. In the end, it's about _noticing_ that you're dreaming, by passively analyzing the general aspects of your environment. Once you progress, it should be easier to be aware of the smaller aspects of your environment in addition to the bigger picture.  :smiley:

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## rynkrt3

> Essentially the goal is to always know what the general environment is that you're in. I tend to only try to be aware of the visual aspects of my environment, since the most obvious aspects of dreaming are visual. I suggest you do this too, and once you've mastered being constantly aware of your environment to a high enough degree where it's likely you'll become lucid with that level of dream awareness (it's pretty hard to constantly be aware), then you should try increasing your awareness to an even higher degree, such as being aware of the smaller details of your environment. You're not only going to want to be aware of your environment, but be aware of your environment in regards to whether or not you're dreaming. In the end, it's about _noticing_ that you're dreaming, by passively analyzing the general aspects of your environment. Once you progress, it should be easier to be aware of the smaller aspects in addition to the bigger picture.



Well, the thing about that is,  is that I'm always visually aware, but I don't get the LD's.  I think I need to work on other things.. idk

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## MindGames

You're constantly paying attention to where you are and what your environment is? Take it a step further and notice whether or not you're always in that environment. Like I'm in my living room right now in my laptop. I would question whether or not I would be on a laptop in my living room in waking life, and if my living room generally looks the same. But it's more of a passive type of noticing, such as whenever you move around. And if you're not moving around, keep your environment within your attention.

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## rynkrt3

Well, this is what I always do.  I scan environments, I make sure I know where I am, I get a general sense that everything is normal -- Doing these will not get you lucid, I do those naturally, we need to focus on something else.

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## MindGames

Are you aiming to recognize abnormal aspects of your environment? Because that's what I do every time I become aware in one of my dreams. I start paying attention to my surroundings and get the general feel that I am dreaming.

Let me ask you this, what goes through your mind whenever you become lucid without reality checking? Do you ever become lucid before doing a reality check? And also, your dreams might be more realistic than others' dreams are, so you might need to increase your awareness even more even if you already are aware.

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## rynkrt3

> Are you aiming to recognize abnormal aspects of your environment? Because that's what I do every time I become aware in one of my dreams. I start paying attention to my surroundings and get the general feel that I am dreaming.
> 
> Let me ask you this, what goes through your mind whenever you become lucid without reality checking? Do you ever become lucid before doing a reality check? And also, your dreams might be more realistic than others' dreams are, so you might need to increase your awareness even more even if you already are aware.



Yeah, my dreams are actually SO realistic and boring, thats a big reason I'm trying to LD, so I don't wake up bored  :tongue2: 
And yeah, I scan for any abnormality, or anything that could clue me to be dreaming.
Also, I never do a RC THEN become lucid, all my lucids have just been.. wow this is a dream then I RC to confirm.

I'm not sure what I need to be focusing on.  I read Yoshis DILD tutorial, and I gatta be honest, I don't understand it. lol

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## MindGames

What Yoshi tries to focus on is a very detailed awareness of your environment. This takes all of the senses into account, and being completely aware of every aspect of your environment at all times. It seems near impossible, but one could get up to that level if they tried.

Anyway, what I was wondering was that if you're always aware of your environment, then what thought or detail generates that realization that you're dreaming? Is it always just some random dreamlike aspect?

In your case, you might want to become more acutely aware and notice and question everything to a greater degree of intensity. If your dreams and waking life are exactly the same, then you might be limited to just using regular reality checks.

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## rynkrt3

Normally when I become lucid its just completely random, nothings weird normally happens.  (Walking down the road and all of a sudden, HEY I'M DREAMING.)

I'm about to post something on Yoshis tut, check it out.

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## MindGames

I read your post. I think that having a more acute perception across all five senses will help you. I also think that you should really pay attention to your general environment. I find that my dream environments are rarely alike my usual waking environments.

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## kookyinc

I'd love to help with this. Could you provide some techniques that help one to be aware at all times? I'm an extremely oblivious person, and thus I expect that I will face difficulty at first with regards to constantly being aware of my surroundings.

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## MindGames

One of the main goals is to not have to use techniques. When you're getting started, though, you should just become aware whenever you remember to do so throughout the day. Take a moment to become aware and judge the general reality your environment. Is this a waking environment? Try increasing your general awareness even more. Then, continue to be aware for the rest of the day. If you forget again, repeat.

Also, you want to become passively aware, so practice being aware while doing any activity that doesn't require all of your attention when you start out.

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## rynkrt3

What do you mean by general environment?

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## MindGames

By general environment, I mean your environment as a whole. You should pay attention to whether your environment is familiar or not. If it is not, this should prompt you to think about how you got there.

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## rynkrt3

Summer 2000 Newsletter - What is Awareness? How can I become more aware?   Check that link out, it's really helpful  :smiley:

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## Raphael

> One of the main goals is to not have to use techniques.



You are using a technique, ADA (all day awareness). When you become good at ADA you don't necessarily have to think about it, so it does become effortless; but that doesn't mean you're not still using the technique. Being aware in real life will help you become lucid in a DILD, that's the point. 

@rynkrt3 nice link, you might also want to check out Yoshi's new tut if you haven't already.

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## MindGames

Yes, Yoshi created the term 'ADA' and the tech after I made this tutorial. I think his tutorial is useful but we have yet to see any results (to my knowledge). However I am hopeful in seeing results in either thread and I am looking to advance the technique even further.


I had my first lucid dream last night in a while. It happened pretty spontaneously, and I can't say for sure that it was caused solely by waking constant awareness. I did have higher than normal awareness though, which I suspect might have been caused by repeatedly waking up and falling asleep in the morning.


Anyone else having results?





> Summer 2000 Newsletter - What is Awareness? How can I become more aware?   Check that link out, it's really helpful



I did a quick read-through on that link, and from what I read, she isn't aware of any correlation between awareness and lucid dreaming. Although I do agree that environmental awareness is a necessary component, I think that it has to be used in the mindset of speculating whether or not you are dreaming. Otherwise it might just make your dreams seem more realistic and not prompt you to take your environment as a whole into account.

Based on my experience so far, I strongly encourage anyone taking part in this research to not only become aware, but to become aware of your environment _as a whole_. What I mean by this is that you should be aware of the specific environment that you are in, in relation to the usual environments you encounter when you are awake. That way, in addition to paying attention to the details, you can also pay attention to your specific location. If you find that you're in an unfamiliar or unlikely location, then you can much more easily become aware that you are dreaming. Adding this to the original post.

edit: Nevermind, I just spent about fifteen minutes making some good changes and they got discarded due to the time limit on editing posts.

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## Shadow27

I've been meaning to try this anyway. I do this about once every two weeks or so and I had lucid
dreams at about that interval. Now, I do it a little more frequently and am having lucids every couple
nights. I think there may be something to this other than just doing it in the dream. Stephen LaBerge
actually recommends doing this for MILD so it could be a sure-fire way to get lucid. I only do it once
a day for a couple minutes so doing it constantly may have some promising results.

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## rynkrt3

> Yes, Yoshi created the term 'ADA' and the tech after I made this tutorial. I think his tutorial is useful but we have yet to see any results (to my knowledge). However I am hopeful in seeing results in either thread and I am looking to advance the technique even further.
> 
> 
> I had my first lucid dream last night in a while. It happened pretty spontaneously, and I can't say for sure that it was caused solely by waking constant awareness. I did have higher than normal awareness though, which I suspect might have been caused by repeatedly waking up and falling asleep in the morning.
> 
> 
> Anyone else having results?



Yet to see results?  Dude, awareness is not a quick method to have lucid dreams.  It has to be internalized, 2nd nature, natural w/e before it becomes that way in a dream.  This doesn't take a week, 2, 3, 4, it takes at least a few months.

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## MischiefManaged

I saw results after 6 days, 2 weeks and 3 weeks after starting. It doesn't mean that I'm any close to mastering ADA or whatever, but those are results too. It's not going to be like this - you are training ADA, don't have awareness triggered lucids at all and then BAM! once you've mastered it you have them everyday. There are steps in between those two.

I've been really busy last 4 days, didn't even write in DJ, but had two LDs due to awareness training beforehand  :smiley:  I think I'm making some progress with that. 

Just in case if anyone interested.

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## MindGames

As MischiefManaged said, I would imagine that at least some results would occur in as little as a few days or a week after starting continuous ADA. The same goes for people who just start out lucid dreaming; of course the techniques such as DILD and MILD aren't going to be embedded deeply into their subconscious in a short span of time, but they can normally expect to have their first lucid within a week or two if they use the technique correctly.

@Mischief, are you using any other techniques in addition to ADA? Also, are you somewhat aware prior to realizing that you are dreaming? If you are, then that would show that the LD's are not just spontaneously occurring, but are occurring as a result of having constant awareness.


Again, I want to stress to anyone attempting this technique that you should also try be aware of your absolute location at all times (in addition to paying attention to the aspects of your environment). From my experience, I have found that the majority of dreams take place in unfamiliar environments.

Oh, I forgot to mention that last night, I was very close to becoming lucid in a handful of my dreams. At times I was aware that I might have been in a dream, but I was predisposed to the fact that I was actually awake. I am convinced that if I had paid more attention to the likelihood of my environment, then I would have been more likely to realize that I was in fact dreaming.

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## MischiefManaged

> @Mischief, are you using any other techniques in addition to ADA? Also, are you somewhat aware prior to realizing that you are dreaming? If you are, then that would show that the LD's are not just spontaneously occurring, but are occurring as a result of having constant awareness.



At the step I am right now - I don't have constant awareness. I am fully aware few times of the day (in my case now about once every hour, in the beginning it was 4-5 times a day), when I make a conscious decision to do so. I stop doing whatever I'm doing and proceed with my awareness "practice". My goal is to do that all the time non stop - which is exactly what this thread is about  :smiley: 

So, I'm not aware in the dream before the moment I become lucid. I don't have constant awareness, I have some soft of boosts of it. Just like I train IWL. 
I concentrate on DILDs and MILD, but the MILD part of what I do is having motivation/intention for which I use the plan for lucid. It contains certain steps that I need to do after becoming lucid - grounding/stabilization and then task for the lucid.
It's really hard to explain that, but I can tell apart lucids, that occurred due to awareness training and those that I induced.

Now I'm reading what I've written and it hardly makes any sense X)

I also don't see the problem with the name of the thread. It can probably be slightly misleading, because yes, literally you can't become natural, but I agree with MindGames - it is the result that matters. And the result here would be - having exactly the same skills that naturals have.

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## MindGames

Yeah, I see what you're saying. You become lucid whenever you decide to increase your awareness. Those results pretty good; that's how I have the majority of my DILDs. I'm wondering if awareness usually starts to drop off after the point that you initially become aware.. If this were the case, then we would need to periodically increase our awareness (given that awareness is a constant behavior); at least until we develop a sufficient level of passive awareness. So we should make this a goal: Once you have developed constant awareness, or nearly constant awareness, try boosting your awareness periodically throughout the day. This should help eliminate any problems of having a lower-than-required baseline awareness, and should provide some insight as to whether or not an insufficient level of baseline awareness is a factor in becoming lucid as a result of passive awareness.

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## StonedApe

I've been trying to do this for about 3 months now. I got to a point where I was having LDs almost every night, like 5 days a week. Once I started DEILDing out of my lucids I was able to have a lot every night too, sometimes as many as 10 in one night, though most were short. Then I started getting stressed out about school, spring break hit and I picked up some weed, so I haven't been as consistant with it lately but I'm getting back into it again.

Once summer hits I'm very confident that I'll be able to do this.

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## MindGames

That's pretty impressive. That would almost qualify as being a natural lucid dreamer (in terms of quantity and consistency of ld's) for the span of time that you practiced. How often did you have lucids after you stopped practicing your awareness?

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## StonedApe

At first about 2-3 a week, then less but thats because I get stressed out and smoke way too much weed which in turn kills my recall. I probably only had 5 all through March, but maybe more and I just don't remember them.

The only reason I wouldn't call it "natural" was that I was MILDing, I was putting in a lot of effort. I feel like this is necessary at first, just so that you get used to LDing all the time. THen I think you can just sense it sort of, it becomes intuitive and second nature.

You might wanna read Dreams and How to Guide Them by Hervy Saint Denys(probably spelled his name wrong). I dont' think he was a natural but he developed the ability to be lucid in almost all his dreams. He didn't use any kind of induction techniques since they hadn't been come up with yet, he just dream journalled a lot and spent a lot of time thinking about the nature of dreams.

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## MindGames

Yeah I agree that you weren't a natural while you were developing awareness, but you were starting to approach it. I'm unaware of anybody (without regard to the guy you mentioned) who has developed their abilities to an extent that they have lucid dreams as frequent as naturals do. But that is the point of this thread.

As for Hervy, I am unsure as to whether he developed the same abilities that naturals have. For instance, I believe that naturals devote more attention to their environment, and in becoming familiar with the aspects of their environment and habitually analyzing it, they are better able to tell apart dreams from reality. In Hervy's case, obviously I'm not him so I don't know for sure, but it's possible that he developed different traits than naturals have. There are many ways to become a frequent lucid dreamer. However I'm focusing on the traits that natural lucid dreamers have that allow them to lucid dream so easily and frequently as opposed to focusing on other traits which may bring the same results, but not necessarily the best way to do so with minimal interference on your functional life.

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## MindGames

I've been having some success with this technique lately. 2 lucid dreams in the past 4 days, using nothing but this.  :smiley:  Anyone else seeing results?

I noticed that when yesterday I decided to really practice this technique during my entire walk to and from Starbucks and for a few hours afterward, that night I had a lucid dream. I usually don't lucid dream unless I have been practicing a technique pretty diligently for awhile, so this technique does show some promise in giving you relatively quick results directly related to the amount of effort you put into practicing it. Other than that I did have one lucid dream a few days ago that I forgot about the following morning, but just recently recalled.

Just a couple tips that I've learned in my research:

When practicing constant awareness, you should always be aware enough that if you were in a dream, you would recognize that you were in a dream. This means that you have to pay attention to your environment and always know where you are. This will definitely help get you lucid, since it requires you to activate your logical thinking. I speculated this when I made this thread, but I'm beginning to believe that it plays a key role in becoming a true natural.

You should always be paying attention to whether or not it feels like you're in a dream. You can better tell the difference by always being aware of all of your sensory input. KingYoshi has a good description of this in his ADA tutorial.

When you remember to become aware after you've forgotten, (common when starting out; I still do this) take a moment to become aware of where you are and how you got there. Try to remember the last time you were fully aware. If you notice nothing unusual, pay attention to your sensory input and decide for yourself whether or not it feels like a dream. If after you've become aware you're still unsure whether or not you're dreaming, it's okay to perform a reality check since all this does is establish which reality you're in. Over time you won't need to use reality checks anymore, since you'll become familiar with the feeling of being in a dream.


As always, good luck in becoming lucid!

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## tommo

I agree with your advice MindGames, but would just like to add that I don't think anyone should stop doing reality checks.
We use reality checks simply to make sure we don't try to fly or kill some one IRL.
It could be fairly dangerous to not use RC's if you think you're dreaming.

EDIT:  Wait, wtf lol  I knew there was something wrong with that.

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## MindGames

I see what you're saying. When I say you won't need to use reality checks anymore, I mean that you won't need to use them to be able to tell when you're dreaming. Over time as you become more familiar with the feeling, you shouldn't have to use them for that purpose. However, you should always use reality checks if you're not completely sure that you're dreaming, such as when you're only starting to learn how to lucid dream or when you're in a vivid, familiar environment. Even then, however, gradually you will most likely have to use them less often, as you'll become more able to be completely sure of your reality.

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## tommo

> I see what you're saying. When I say you won't need to use reality checks anymore, I mean that you won't need to use them to be able to tell when you're dreaming. Over time as you become more familiar with the feeling, you shouldn't have to use them for that purpose. However, you should always use reality checks if you're not completely sure that you're dreaming, such as when you're only starting to learn how to lucid dream or when you're in a vivid, familiar environment. Even then, however, gradually you will most likely have to use them less often, as you'll become more able to be completely sure of your reality.



Yeah I agree then.  So you won't use them that much, but if you believe you are dreaming, it would be a good idea, but it wouldn't be necessary in a lot of circumstances.

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## MischiefManaged

Haven't been on DV almost for two weeks, haven't been thinking about LDing that much like before and my last DJ entry - 9th of April. Still having lucids!  ::D: 

So I don't do anything apart from awareness training. I have almost no time to train it the way I did before, so now I'm doing it like MindGames mentioned earlier - aware all the time while I'm on the bus or on my way to classes or something similar. I also do a lot of RCs, but only because I see strange things all the time and have a lot of dreamlike situations, so I just feel like I have to do a RC. 

By the way, about "the strange things" - I think it's not that something unusual started happening, it seems like it's been there all the time, I just never noticed it before and I believe that now that I do it's all due to being more aware. 

Dreamlike situations is a big topic too. There are more and more moments when I feel like I'm dreaming, when I'm actually awake. One part of it is because it so hot now where I live, like it's the freaking July! So I just noticed that because of the heat pupils go wide, I feel really dizzy, the colors get very bright and in most of the cases it hurts my eyes. Strangely enough these exact cases make me sort of half conscious as if I'm on the edge of passing out, but at the same time I become super aware. It's like I can use all of my senses to the highest extent possible - I hear, see, feel just everything, as if my brain perceive every single bit of information there is. I don't particularly like this situations, but, I guess there is nothing I can do about it. And I'm already dreading the summer, when almost every single day is going to be like this. Damn, I hate our climate.

So, yeah, I don't think I will ever stop doing RCs - seems like they can be vital to keep my life out of danger X)

A little bit of statistics, just for the sake of it ^^
17/01/2011 found out about LDing
1st month - 4 LDs
2nd month - 4 LDs
At the end of the 2nd month - 12/03/2011 - started awareness training 
3rd (now) - 10 LDs (4 of them - coffee induced  ::D: , 6 - awareness)

Also, some significant things for me that I've noticed since starting awareness training:
- I have more and more semi-lucids. I don't count them as LDs, because I'm not in fact lucid, but I start feeling this "dreamlikeness" - that makes every non-lucid experience really great.
- When I got into LDing my usual dreams got mundane and boring. Now I brought my epic-crazy-bizarre-psychedelic dreams back and I'm super happy about it  ::D: 
- Awareness triggered LDs are more vivid, stable and LONG!! than those that are induced in some other way
- Quality of my waking life perception is just inexplicable. Sorry if it sounds cheesy - but I really do see things in a different way now.

I apologize for this hugeness, just thought it's relevant and felt like writing it  :tongue2:

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## MindGames

Thanks for your contributions, Mischief. It's apparent that having constant awareness is having some positive impact on your LD frequency.  :smiley:  You should really keep at it and continue to get better. Have you tried what I mentioned earlier, namely always knowing where you are and how you got there? Doing so should increase your brain activity; the type that makes you become lucid.

I can certainly relate to not having the time to practice constant awareness throughout the entire day, and sometimes I just don't feel up to practicing at all; either because I'm too sleepy or because my brain's really wired on caffeine. However over time I am finding that I use the technique more and more. One thing I would suggest is to hold on to a little bit of awareness while you're busy doing other things. Not so much that you're focusing a lot of attention on being aware, but just enough to stay aware.

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## MischiefManaged

> Have you tried what I mentioned earlier, namely always knowing where you are and how you got there? Doing so should increase your brain activity; the type that makes you become lucid.



Yeah, that's a big part of what I do in order to be aware. But I have to put in a lot of efforts to actually remember how I got here and what I was just doing. Struggling with this X)

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## MindGames

> Yeah, that's a big part of what I do in order to be aware. But I have to put in a lot of efforts to actually remember how I got here and what I was just doing. Struggling with this X)



Usually I just try to remember the main points of what I was doing; it goes something like this: I got up, went to Starbucks, went to my economics class, went home, and now I'm here. It should only take like 10 seconds at the most if you're only visualizing the main things and deciding if it's a coherent timeline. And you only have to do this when you lose awareness; when you're already aware, you should only be aware of what your current environment is, and also be aware of when you move into different environments if it is a coherent transition or not. Once you get into the habit of deciding if your environment is one you would normally be in, it shouldn't be too hard.  :smiley: 



Well I have some pretty good news of my own. Night before last, I had a handful of lucid dreams. Some were semi-lucid, but I know that at least one was fully lucid. I'd like to say that I had 2 fully lucid, but my memory is pretty hazy. At any rate, my semi-lucid was very vivid, and I got it to keep going for a long time. In the past my lucid dreams have always ended prematurely, but I'm working on making them stable by creating a waking environment archetype.

I have noticed a strong correlation, though: Every day that I actually put sustained effort into constant awareness, I have lucid dreams. I have yet to see an instance of not having lucid dreams the following night when I actually put effort into this technique. This could have some strong implications for those who are new to lucid dreaming, namely that if they practice this technique, it's possible that they could have lucid dreams during their first week, when their interest and effort in lucid dreaming is at its peak.


I'm going to reiterate the refined technique since I can't edit my original post:

Maintain constant awareness of your environment throughout the entire day.

1. Always be aware of your sensory input. Use it to be in constant determination of whether or not it feels like you're in a dream. As you progress, you will become more familiar with the feeling of being in a dream. You should do this passively over time. Use KingYoshi's ADA tutorial for tips on this.

2. Always know your location. If you regain awareness and don't know where you are after looking at your environment or don't know how you got there, you're probably dreaming. Maintain attention on your location, and pay attention to when you move from one location to another. Is your current location a usual one? Is the transition coherent? Over time, pay attention to more specific aspects of your environment in determining whether or not you're in a dream environment. Using this technique will activate higher level frontal lobe activity, the kind that you need to become lucid.


Most importantly, don't try to do everything at once, at least when you're starting out. I usually maintain sensory input awareness (#1) at all times in determining if it feels like a dream, and I use location awareness (#2) every time I'm moving from place to place, and periodically when I stay in the same place for a long time.

And don't forget to reality check once you realize you're dreaming. Use the nose plug technique to make sure you're in a dream before you do anything crazy (mostly to cover my ass).

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## lucydity

As of today i will begin to try this technique and mix it with other techniques i attempt. Thanks for this one

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## MindGames

Great, make sure you post your results! If you want to get quicker results I suggest you take a walk and maintain constant awareness (as described) of your environment for about an hour or two, and maintain your awareness afterward throughout your day.

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## MischiefManaged

Bad news guys. My results show that awareness can get worse if you stop training it after having progress (ok, that's obvious, I know X))

So, I've been a real slacker for the past week and not having lucids and even not being aware for some time didn't bother me until it all resulted in a dream I had yesterday. At one point in the dream I looked at my phone and saw the time - 173:42. Want to know what I did? I laughed and said "Wow, it's just like I'm dreaming, mom what's the time now, my phone's got crazy, I need to fix it". Ok. Actually the dream before that was complicated enough to mess up my mind for some time, but, seriously, I don't think there can be a legitimate reason for not recognizing the dream under such circumstances. It never happened before this way and I am concerned :/

What really upsets me, I just can't focus on lucid dreaming and awareness training now due to some major things going on in my life, so I thought I would just set it aside for some time and do just a small bit of what I was doing before not to completely lose the skills. Yeah, sure...

I'm actually pretty sure that if I was training for much longer time before reducing the efforts, that wouldn't happen. So, my conclusion - if you are beginner in doing awareness training - don't make any drastic changes.

This post is full of sadness and frustration, sorry X) But I was consider my results as the good ones, hopefully it's not too late to bring it back to the previous level  ::D:

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## MindGames

Yeah, it's understandable that you wouldn't have enough time to practice any lucid dreaming techniques. It's fun, but I also have other things going on that are more important. However when I'm not occupied and I feel up to putting an effort into it, I practice this technique. And for the most part whenever I put effort into this, I'm rewarded with lucid dreams the following night.  :smiley:  I think that since you have some experience with this it should be relatively easy to get back into lucid dream practice. And if you haven't read the updated original post, you should. The updated techniques are much more effective.

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## Max ツ

Bump. I am a natural lucid dreamer, had first LD when I was five.

The main thing I notice that I fail to see in 'normal' (hate to use a differentiating term >.<) people is that the are WAY less skeptical of their surroundings. I was born with a rather philosophical mind, ever questioning the possibilities, the REALITY of this universe. 
You have to learn to not trust what your eyes see, rather, proof your vision using cold, hard facts. Getting it to a subconscious level is basically what a 'natural' lucid dreamer does.

Sum: MORE RC, RC RC RC! 
I can't stress this enough, but here is the best way to put it in words. 'Turn your whole day into one big reality check.' (sound familiar?  :tongue2: )

My two cents.

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## MindGames

Thank you very much for your advice. In questioning your environment, do you find yourself paying attention to how it feels? Because as I'm sure you're aware of this, dreams have a different feel to them than physical reality. In addition, do you always try to stay aware of where you are? What other things do you take into consideration?

It seems as though your habits would activate constant frontal lobe activity, which I am led to believe is necessary for becoming a natural lucid dreamer. How often you lucid dream?

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## Max ツ

Yes, right on spot. I pay attention to how it feels. Dreams feel like a bubble. A beautiful, fragile thing, that no one really bothers about much, but can be fantastic in it's true nature. 

I try to always question reality. I don't have to see a very weird thing to do an RC. WHAT FLYING UFO I GOTTA DO RC!

No. I am more like, "'Hmm my legs feel a bit wuzzy. RC. - - - Oh that thing is new. Wait, RC. - - - WOW AWESOME. RC. - - -  Oh look a pretty doorway. RC.'"'

I can't put it in better words. 'Turn your whole day into one big reality check.'

I also notice me being 'skeptical' of reality on a subconscious level. It's really hard to explain that feeling.

I used to LD 5 to 6 nights a week. 2 LDs per night were common. Now, I have a lot of things keeping me busy, and I guess right now it's about one LD every 3 days or so. And reduced quality. >.<

Even us naturals have to stay in practice. It's not like I can sit back and watch LDs rolling in every other day.  :smiley:

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## saltyseedog

What I think is that people think all the time out of habit. You have to break the habit and bring your awareness to other things besides your thoughts and make that become a habit.

Really I am not tripping on whats happening around me all the time. I am aware of how I'm feeling all the time. I shifted my awareness from my thoughts to here. Right here, now. Now I am lucid in almost every dream. It changed the way I am. It changed my state of conciseness to more the way I am in dreams. A feeling of fearlessness and freedom. Not caring about anything. I feel most of my life takes place in my dreams. Its really weird because everyone around me in waking life doesn't understand that. Most of them don't even acknowledge dreams as a part of there reality. Their reality is only waking life. Which honestly sucks compared to the dream world. I feel really confused to. So much shit. It really just confuses the crap out of me. I am learning everyday now. I have discovered that I want to heal myself emotionally by myself. I want to let go of all these emotions my thoughts have created throughout my lifetime. All this negative energy. I want to heal the pain. I need to learn how to do it myself though. Not depend on someone else to heal me.

If you want to be lucid all the time you must be focused. Not daydreaming off all the time. If you were a warrior you would not be daydreaming. You would know what the fuck is going on and watching everything, stalking everything. You got to live your life this way. Be focused like a warrior. Be aware not spaced out. Stop spacing out all the time!! Stay focused on the situation. Stay focused on the people you are dealing with. Dealing with shitty people in life can make you more aware and focused because you are trying to anticipate what they are going to do to avoid their shittyness. You watch them, somewhat stalking there behaviors so you make sure you have to deal with there crap the least amount as possible. Be aware of these things. stop thinking all the time and spacing out!!!! Your going to die!!! Now are you aware? Be aware like that. Not like you have eternity to sit here and space out thinking about shit.

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## MindGames

@salty, I don't really think of lucid dreaming like that. It sounds to me like you're using it to deal with your real life. Personally, I would like to learn how to become a natural lucid dreamer simply because it's fun to lucid dream. But if you have any tips on how to actually become a natural, I'd be glad to hear them. I do think that people need to shift their attention to their environment to become a natural.





> Yes, right on spot. I pay attention to how it feels. Dreams feel like a bubble. A beautiful, fragile thing, that no one really bothers about much, but can be fantastic in it's true nature. 
> 
> I try to always question reality. I don't have to see a very weird thing to do an RC. WHAT FLYING UFO I GOTTA DO RC!
> 
> No. I am more like, "'Hmm my legs feel a bit wuzzy. RC. - - - Oh that thing is new. Wait, RC. - - - WOW AWESOME. RC. - - -  Oh look a pretty doorway. RC.'"'
> 
> I can't put it in better words. 'Turn your whole day into one big reality check.'
> 
> I also notice me being 'skeptical' of reality on a subconscious level. It's really hard to explain that feeling.
> ...



So, when you say Reality Check, are you referring to an actual reality check as in a nose-plug RC? Or do you simply make a quick judgement based on whether or not it feels/looks like a dream?

What I am testing is a state of mind where you always keep your attention focused on whether or not you feel like you're in a dream, and also whether or not you're in an unfamiliar environment. You seem to be constantly doing a bunch of reality checks, but maybe I'm misinterpreting your words. Can you elaborate on that for me?

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## saltyseedog

> @salty, I don't really think of lucid dreaming like that. It sounds to me like you're using it to deal with your real life. Personally, I would like to learn how to become a natural lucid dreamer simply because it's fun to lucid dream. But if you have any tips on how to actually become a natural, I'd be glad to hear them. I do think that people need to shift their attention to their environment to become a natural.



Well I'm not telling what to do with your lucid dreams just giving tips on how to be aware so you will know your dreaming when your dreaming.  I guess you can say that is natural. Its not like I naturally discover I'm dreaming all the time. I just kind of know right when I enter the dream. I am aware enough that I don't have to deal with crap from non lucid dreams. The random life situations and stuff. Its just I enter a dream knowing I am dreaming. Then I am free to whatever I please. Really I think the main thing is breaking the habit of thinking all the time. I our society we are tought to listen to our inner dialogue and it becomes a habitual behavior. You gotta just focus on something else, any thing else that is happening right now to keep yourself from creating more thoughts that lead to you looking like an unaware zombie. It might be hard at first, but over time it will become natural and habitual to not be creating thoughts all the time. You will be much more peaceful too.

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## MindGames

Great, thanks for your input. Essentially, the goal is to maintain awareness without losing it. What we have to do from there however is to be attentive of the aspects in particular that will get you lucid. For instance, from what I've learned, you're likely to become lucid because it _feels_ like you're in a dream. So it's not entirely about stopping your internal thinking; it's what you focus on in particular that will get you lucid. That's the main focus of the current version of the technique, which is on the first post of this thread.  :smiley:  Namely, you're going to focus on whether or not it feels like you're in a dream, in addition to knowing your location at all times.

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## saltyseedog

ya definatley. I have noticed that feeling of being in a dream. I think thats actually the reason I normally know I'm in dream.

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## Max ツ

> So, when you say Reality Check, are you referring to an actual reality check as in a nose-plug RC? Or do you simply make a quick judgement based on whether or not it feels/looks like a dream?
> 
> What I am testing is a state of mind where you always keep your attention focused on whether or not you feel like you're in a dream, and also whether or not you're in an unfamiliar environment. You seem to be constantly doing a bunch of reality checks, but maybe I'm misinterpreting your words. Can you elaborate on that for me?



No, I am not referring to an ACTUAL RC, though it is very much advised. Yes, I do make a quick judgement. I am not doing an RC all the time, I am just QUESTIONING reality all the time. My teachers used to say I look absent while doing that, but I have long since learn to keep my attention on the task at hand, too. This 'state' is hard to explain. It's like when you focus on something, your whole attention is on it. Now, try to think of something else WHILE doing that. You will notice a certain blur to how attentive you are. For example, you will no longer notice the less noticeable details, etc. That is pretty much how it is always in my head. Even while typing this, I can feel myself trying to distinguish whether this is reality or a dream.

I looked at the link you attached, and I will post my most frequent RCs.





> 1. Look at your watch or a clock
> When you are lucid dreaming, the part of your brain in charge of recognizing numbers and letters is still asleep. Therefore, when you check the time, it should be completely random. For example, if you look at your watch and it is "12:25" one minute and "2:33" the next, you know you are dreaming (barring the unlikely situation that your digital watch is extremely broke) and are therefore lucid.



*Question reality every time you see a watch. Good thing to remind yourself of RCing.*





> 4. Try to find unusual things in the world
> These are things to look out for in a dream. If, for example, the sky is green and an alien is attacking you, it is most certainly a dream. Of course, it is likely to be far more subtle than this, as is normal. When you pick up on this, try to alter your surroundings in some way - a usually easy dream trick. If you can, then you are either dreaming or magic.



*You don't necessarily need an alien to attack you, just TRY to find ANYTHING out of the ordinary, even if there isn't, and question reality. For the sake of clarity, I will refer to questioning reality as QR. It means you have to spare some time and ask, 'Is this really real?'.*





> 6. Trying something considered "impossible"
> Another method to test whether you are in a dream or not is to try somthing that you know is impossible in the waking life. Commonly used examples of this are: Putting your finger through your palm, crossing over through a mirror, levitating, etc. I suggest you don't try something like flying out your window or such... just to be on the safe side.



*Always be trying to do something 'impossible'. VERY efficient.* 





> 7. Memory Check
> This is a method where you are "asking" yourself what have happened during the day, or fortunately a dream. Try to think back as far as you can. When you perform this method, you will be aware if you have experienced anything illogical during the day, and you may have blank periods.



*THE BIGGEST BADDEST AND MEANEST RC OF THEM ALL. THIS is the one I am doing ALL day. My main RC. The writer here says something very valuable here.
 be aware if you have experienced anything illogical during the day,*





> 12. Emotion Analysis
> Pay close attention to how you feel. If something causes you to react a certain way - frustration, bliss, laughter, it would be a good time to determine your state. The feelings generated by a dream are the same as in the waking world, so it's certainly something to keep in check.



*Not a reliable RC, but I believe it is close to describing how that 'state of mind' is.*





> 13. Constant physical awareness
> If you're like me, you've been trained to be rushing from point A to point B throughout life. Life is a race and there's no sense of *now*. Learning to control the feeling of now is a great way to pick up on the inconsistencies. I find that learning to consciously acknowledge the little things in life is a great way to regenerate the minds' analytical ability. I find this to be very strong in kids. They will pick up on something insignificant to my mind, and point it out to me, and I will be thinking; "How did you notice that?" It's that sense of *now*; the feeling that there's not some light waiting at the end of a tunnel, but that the tunnel is filled with light.



*Insanely true. He has the words I was looking for. The feeling of *now*. The awareness.*





> the feeling that there's not some light waiting at the end of a tunnel, but that the tunnel is filled with light.



*The tunnel is your consciousness. When you are fully conscious, the tunnel is filled with light.*

24. Smell something
Quite easy. Spray something or some perfume or just smell something - does it smell as expected?

*I find smells are always different in a dream, or not there at all.*



So basically, my RCs are more, err, 'thought' RCs that lead me to QR.

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## fautzo

> [B][COLOR="red"] From the research that has been done so far, I am led to believe that natural lucid dreamers have a naturally high level of awareness of their environments in their everyday lives. This requires one to shift their attention from their thoughts, and to instead always pay attention to the environment that they are in.



HA, SO THAT'S WHY I'VE BEEN GETTING SO MANY LDS LATELY. I have really really trying to do this, and I guess it's been paying off.

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## Marm

Great guide! This is pretty much what I tend to do all the time since I was a little kid, except that I'm too lazy to write a big post about it  :smiley:

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## MindGames

Awesome  :smiley:  Looks like this is working for quite a few people.

As for me, I've been really busy with essays lately, so I don't have any time to practice the technique and give any input myself. I'd love to see some of the people who are just starting this technique post their results as they progress, though.

@ThePieMan, I'm curious, what's your LD frequency, and which parts of the technique do you focus on the most?

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## Marm

> Awesome  Looks like this is working for quite a few people.
> 
> @ThePieMan, I'm curious, what's your LD frequency, and which parts of the technique do you focus on the most?



Hi MindGames! To answer your question, I have a lucid dream pretty much every single night if I want to. Like I have stated in my biography I don't tend to use any techniques in particular because when I fall asleep lucidity comes very naturally for me. (Don't ask me how lol). There are times when I fail to become lucid because I have too much on my mind; to overcome that I relax and use MILD - simply because it's the most intuitive and easiest technique to grasp.

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## Max ツ

> Hi MindGames! To answer your question, I have a lucid dream pretty much every single night if I want to. Like I have stated in my biography I don't tend to use any techniques in particular because when I fall asleep lucidity comes very naturally for me. (Don't ask me how lol). There are times when I fail to become lucid because I have too much on my mind; to overcome that I relax and use MILD - simply because it's the most intuitive and easiest technique to grasp.



Do you use repetition to induce lucid dreams? e.g. ' I WILL have a lucid dream tonight.'

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## Marm

No that's too boring. Although for the MILD technique you should repeat a mantra like that, I just do it once and go to sleep.

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## MadMonkey

When I become lucid I usualy don't even have to reality check any more. I agree with Lucidmax, I can sort of sense if its a dream or not because it sort of feels different. Of corse I have to have something to make me think about weather it is a dream or not though. Its usualy spontainious or caused by MILD. I still RC often though because sometimes I really can't tell if its a dream because its so dang realistic.

My awarness in waking life has been way to low lately so I am going to try some all weekend awarness.  :smiley: 

Edit: ThePieMan, if you do it just once its not likely to do anything. Just be patient and do it for a minuite or two and it will be worth it.

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## MindGames

@MadMonkey, I think that what ThePieMan was saying was that he's able to induce a lucid dream by only using MILD once. I do agree however that it's easy to sense whether or not you're in a dream. That's one of the main focuses of my technique. My awareness is really low too, but that's because I haven't been practicing since I have finals coming up. All of my lucid dreams occur spontaneously; having constant awareness should increase the frequency of DILD since you'll train yourself to focus more on your environment.

@ThePieMan Although you say you don't really use any techniques, you do however consider yourself to have high awareness during the day, right? That's what I was referring to with my question; as in, what do you tend to be aware of in particular?

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## ooflendoodle

The OP is basically what I did to get to the point where I now have lucid dreams pretty much every night, so ya, this does work for anyone unsure. (P.S. I haven't updated my LD count in a while)

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## tommo

I've been trying this technique for a while now.  It may be because of my horrible sleep schedule, but it's not working.  I also can't seem to keep constant awareness.  I just sudden;y remember to be aware and see if it feels like a dream, if I can remember how I got wherever I am, if words and/or numbers are morphing etc.  But I'll get a proper sleep schedule and report back again.

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## Marm

One of the best guides on achieving lucidity. There, I basically summed up everyone's comments.

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## MindGames

> I've been trying this technique for a while now.  It may be because of my horrible sleep schedule, but it's not working.  I also can't seem to keep constant awareness.  I just sudden;y remember to be aware and see if it feels like a dream, if I can remember how I got wherever I am, if words and/or numbers are morphing etc.  But I'll get a proper sleep schedule and report back again.



Thank you for your feedback. Yeah, you should try and get your sleep schedule set up right before you try this. It takes a lot of mental acuity to initially be able to maintain constant awareness. Remember, by constant awareness I mean constant awareness on the feeling of whether or not you're in a dream and also determining your location at all times.

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## MindGames

Okay, I'm out of school now so it's time to start practicing this technique a lot more!  :smiley:

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## MischiefManaged

Reporting success! ::D: 
Got back into practicing some time ago and yesterday eventually broke the dry spell. Too bad it was a lucid nightmare, though  :Eek:

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## tommo

Also some success.  Sort of.  Progress, anyway. I had two moments 2 nights ago while dreaming  
where I realised that something was not right.
One involved the environment suddenly switching, and the other was my viewpoint changing strangely.
I didn't get lucid.  But I was at least questioning my environment in my dreams.

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## Shinice

Any idea whats happening to my head/mind at night? Going to lucid straight once I 'fall asleep'..without any drop of effort at all. My lucids are like taking place in another dimension/world/virtual reality. There are events, missions, festivals etc. I just have to act accordingly to whats happening, like I'm appearing out of nowhere and people didn't notice it..like I've been living/existing in it. Every night different situation..and yeh everything I 'experienced' felt real as well. So Yep, whats happening?

(And do everyone have to practice lucid to get it?)

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## tommo

> Any idea whats happening to my head/mind at night? Going to lucid straight once I 'fall asleep'..without any drop of effort at all. My lucids are like taking place in another dimension/world/virtual reality. There are events, missions, festivals etc. I just have to act accordingly to whats happening, like I'm appearing out of nowhere and people didn't notice it..like I've been living/existing in it. Every night different situation..and yeh everything I 'experienced' felt real as well. So Yep, whats happening?
> 
> (And do everyone have to practice lucid to get it?)



You lucky, lucky bitch.  hehe

Yes, most people have to practice.

Bitch....  ::lol::

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## Shinice

No..this just doesn't sound right. Compared to how things are explained here. Its weird  ::?: 
The mind of the Naturals..are they simple or complicated all the time?

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## Marm

I'm quite natural and I love simplicity.

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## Max ツ

> No..this just doesn't sound right. Compared to how things are explained here. Its weird 
> The mind of the Naturals..are they simple or complicated all the time?



Quite complicated.

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## Max ツ

> You lucky, lucky bitch.  hehe
> 
> Yes, most people have to practice.
> 
> Bitch....



Good day to you, too, tommo.  ::lol::

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## Shinice

Complicated in what sense? Any examples?

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## Max ツ

You have to be aware 24/7. ^_^

Or at least, try to. O_o

So there is always something extra going on in your head. Multi tasking takes a lot of effort.

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## Shinice

You mean 'there is always something extra going on in your head'..
Then wouldn't it be noisy and makes you unable to focus?
And aren't normal people always aware during the day?

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## Ctharlhie

My girlfriend is a natural but has pretty poor control and she can't be bothered to learn about it or train herself... *sigh*

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## MindGames

> You mean 'there is always something extra going on in your head'..
> Then wouldn't it be noisy and makes you unable to focus?
> And aren't normal people always aware during the day?



No, people are usually pretty unaware. That's why we have to practice being aware in waking life in order to get lucid in our dreams. Do you find that you're always pretty aware of what's going on around you?

By the way, don't feel weird for being a natural lucid dreamer. There are plenty of natural lucid dreamers and it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you.  :smiley:

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## Shinice

Do you know of any ways to 'quieten' the mind..especially when wanting to focus on other things?
Don't you experience problems with mind being too 'hyper-active'?

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## MindGames

I wouldn't say that my mind is too hyperactive, but sometimes I can't go to sleep when I'm thinking about a lot of things. If you want to focus on something else, just focus on it and disregard any other thoughts. You can also try clearing your mind or doing meditation. At night when I can't sleep, I just focus on making myself tired and I fall asleep pretty quickly.

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## Shinice

Good for you that it only affects you before sleeping..
And if I focus on something before sleeping, I'll be sure to 'go on a great adventure'  :Cheeky:

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## MischiefManaged

Wow, it's been so long...Are you practicing guys?

I can't believe I finally passed the last exam, can go back to lucid dreaming and awareness again. Yay! =)

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## Shinice

Good for you then. I'm still in it..but not practicing, just being aware of it that's all.

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## Marsupilama

I can't believe I stumbled upon this thread just now! This has been something I'm interested in for a while now, as I absolutely believe that it is possible to become a natural lucid dreamer. Of course, I started like everyone else, by keeping a dream jounal and doing reality checks. And it worked ok too, I think I had like 10 lucids over the first 4 1/2 months (I've been keeping a dream journal since February). But I stopped doing reality checks two or three months ago, since I read about natural lucid dreamers here on dreamviews. I just didn't wanna continue practicing a "bad habit"....

I've especially been taking an interest in KingYoshis All Day Awareness and SilverBullets Key to lucid dreaming thread. In my mind, everything can be achieved by anyone. I think this thread needs to explore way more different approaches...I've read all prior pages and basically the only thing discussed is ADA. Don't get me wrong. I love the idea of ADA and think despite lucid dreaming, it would definitely benefit other areas of my life too. I just don't think this is the only way. There are lucid dreamers out there who are doing nothing, literally nothing, for their ability to lucid dream, so since not everybody is able to practice ADA like a pro I would like to explore a way to do that without keeping your awareness up all the time.

One thing I though about was, what keeps us away from becoming lucid every night. The thing that came to my mind, that keeps us away from lots of things, is entitlement. We've been hardwired to think that you have to work long and hard for everything in your life. This is a believe very hard to get rid of, as you probably already made this experience yourself. And hey, a certain amount of work definitely has its benefits, but after some time it just gets in your way because you give up since you didn't achieve any accomplishments with your efforts. I already posted my opinion on entitlement in SilverBullets new thread, so I'm just gonna quote myself here:

"I don't think most people really feel entitled to actually lucid dream every night. And by feel entitled I don't mean saying "Sure I'm confident I can lucid dream naturally every night!", I mean truely believing it deep down on a subconscious level. Now the difficult question is, how does one establish that? Obviously everyone comes from a different background and therefore might face more or less difficulties on accepting the idea of dreaming lucid every night without any aids isn't a big deal. I don't know if there is any quick guide on gaining entitlement (to anything what you want and don't get really), but I think if you (or anyone else) have any ideas on that, it may greatly improve the results..."

let me know what you think...





> Any idea whats happening to my head/mind at night? Going to lucid straight once I 'fall asleep'..without any drop of effort at all. My lucids are like taking place in another dimension/world/virtual reality.



This
is awesome. I actually just read in another thread about a girl who has the same scheme like a week ago. She goes to bed and wakes up in the dream world. She was even aware during NREM sleep, which she described as "calm blackness". Then she said the dream just continued. Her dream world is like a second life she lives. She also said when she goes to bed in the dream world, she wakes up IRL. Now at first I thought this should be really exausting, but to her it is natural, she doesn't know otherwise...

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## Shinice

Well..I'm not sure of what the reason was, but I do feel tired after I wake up.
And I still do not feel comfortable about the mixed emotions I acquire in the morning during the LD..
Its like feeling something that I did not actually do it..and yet, it felt so real. Argh~
Guess that more study will have to be done on LDing  :tongue2: .

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## ilovefrootloops

> This
> is awesome. I actually just read in another thread about a girl who has the same scheme like a week ago. She goes to bed and wakes up in the dream world. She was even aware during NREM sleep, which she described as "calm blackness". Then she said the dream just continued. Her dream world is like a second life she lives. She also said when she goes to bed in the dream world, she wakes up IRL. Now at first I thought this should be really exausting, but to her it is natural, she doesn't know otherwise...



That sounds dangerous; it would be way to easy to get caught up in the second life.

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## Marsupilama

Yeah I think it is really hard to grasp what that would be like...

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## zhineTech

> This is awesome. I actually just read in another thread about a girl who has the same scheme like a week ago. She goes to bed and wakes up in the dream world. She was even aware during NREM sleep, which she described as "calm blackness". Then she said the dream just continued. Her dream world is like a second life she lives. She also said when she goes to bed in the dream world, she wakes up IRL. Now at first I thought this should be really exausting, but to her it is natural, she doesn't know otherwise...



tibetan monks who practice dream yoga claim to be able to stay aware during NREM sleep stages

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## Shinice

> That sounds dangerous; it would be way to easy to get caught up in the second life.



I don't think so. Because it should be obvious (to me) to which one is the reality after waking up.
Just a bit of confusion if I do not sort my memories though. And whats NREM?

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## zhineTech

Non REM sleep. most dreams we remember are during REM sleep.

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## ilovefrootloopz

> I don't think so. Because it should be obvious (to me) to which one is the reality after waking up.
> Just a bit of confusion if I do not sort my memories though. And whats NREM?



That's not what I meant.  I meant that it would be easy to begin to neglect reality and instead spend too much time in the dream world.

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## Max ツ

> That's not what I meant.  I meant that it would be easy to begin to neglect reality and instead spend too much time in the dream world.




Nah, shit isn't real. It only happens in Inception.  :tongue2: 
Real life you could have good long lucids every day and still enjoy them AND continue to live as before.

There *could* be a stage where you prefer dreams over reality, possibly when you have insanely high frequency and huge control, but I have never experienced it. The closest I got was when I was in the blues (relationship probs, -.-) and started to rely on my dreams for relaxation. I'd sleep 12 hours everyday and have lucids most of the time.  :Cheeky:

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## Shinice

Then how do we know whether the dream remembered is from the REM or NREM sleep?
And..dream time moves faster then reality to me. Although it felt longer, all happened like within..minutes?

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## Marsupilama

bump

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## Duncan

Im going to start doing more ADA, for me, when I was practising awareness my lucid count pretty much doubled. Personally I believe that awareness is the key to getting quality lucids as well as quantity, of course I have no proof of this but it's just how I feel. So, from today, ADA and meditation, I'll let you all know how it goes  :smiley:

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## Shinice

May I ask: Do people with history of fits get dreams (lucid and non lucid) more often because they have higher brain waves?
Is this true?

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## StonedApe

Gonna start working on this again. I got to about 50% about a year ago, but I've been lazyyyyyyy.

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## MindGames

I haven't done this for a long time, and I probably won't. It's too much work for me. I do reality checks now. Lucid dreaming is hard work  :tongue2:

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## Alundra

Glad to see that you posted this, it does work, meditation and selfawareness at all times will increase your chances of becoming lucid, I came to the point where I had LDs even when I no longer intended to have them. There is this "dream" feeling that one must learn to distinguish, you can easiest learn this by looking (use your senses, feel, touch, smell etc) at where you spend most of your time (the awakened state), so whenever you enter the dream, you will most likely feel that the air or something in it differs, from my own experience it became easier for each LD that I had, so once you get your first LD it will be easier from there on. The answer is NO when it comes to the decreased feeling of vividness, I have had at least one LD/AP which felt more intense than life itself, difficult to explain that part though, but it is possible to have fully vivid/realistic LDs and still differ it from awakened state.

I wish all of you out there good luck!

BTW nice work for posting this for everyone!  :smiley:

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