# Off-Topic Discussion > Extended Discussion >  >  LSD explained for what it is.

## SKA

Really great Documentairy about LSD, because it's unbiased, scientific and complete.

This is great for washing away the lies and propaganda that the masses have been told about LSD.

Edit by Xaqaria:

New links, thanks to Motumz. These are downloads.

*Part 1:*


```
http://hotfile.com/dl/18470981/dab4c0f/National.Geographic.Explorer.Inside.LSD.2009.WS.HDTV.XviD-OMiCRON.2ebe.DedicatedTV.net.part1.rar.html
```


*

Part 2:



```
http://hotfile.com/dl/18471295/7882694/National.Geographic.Explorer.Inside.LSD.2009.WS.HDTV.XviD-OMiCRON.2ebe.DedicatedTV.net.part2.rar.html
```


*
Enjoy!  ::D: !

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## MrFantasy

Nice hopefully this will open some minds

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## spinningchurro

Extremely interesting.

This only makes me want to take acid even more, and it makes me even angrier that the US government classifies it as having no medical use.

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## baccuss

My opinion of course. LSD just makes me think of blood and horror...literally.
Now certain shrooms....that's a whole different and enlightening experience. 
Well for me.

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## SKA

> My opinion of course. LSD just makes me think of blood and horror...literally.
> Now certain shrooms....that's a whole different and enlightening experience. 
> Well for me.



That sounds to me like it could be quite a troubled, damaged state of your subconscious being.

I do reckon acid has a bit of an animalistic rage-edge somehow. Like it makes you feel the way a Piraña fish becomes manic and wild when it smells blood. But to me it is very dependant on the feelings present in the deeper layers of your mind/soul. If you are in a light, positive, fresh- emotional/mental state of being then your LSD trip is likely to be similair, only more extreme and magnified. If on the other hand you are in a heavy, dark, sad or bitter state of being then your LSD trip is likely to be of a similair nature, only more intensely so. Your LSD trip may be revealing/exposing a troubled, darkened, negatively charged part of your being of which you were totally unaware. This is why LSD (and other Entheogens) is so good at diagnosing mental ailments/wounds and, in turn allow you to heal them. By dissolving the ego it removes barriers which allow acces into previously unknown and long "forgotten" parts of your psyche/soul and it enables you to make connections you were previously unable to make. It allows exploration into the unexplored depths of our being that lay behind the Ego-barries that we usually can't cross in our Ego-dominated consensus daytime awareness. This is how LSD helps so many people (artists, Architects, Neurologists..etc) "reach their full potential" as is often said about LSD.

However high enough doses of Psilocybin Mushrooms can cause the same degree of Ego-dissolving and deep introspection. So the mushrooms can also make you aware of negatively charged parts of your being, resulting in the experience of negative sensations, emotions, thoughts and visions. That does not mean it has to be a Negative experience. That all depends on how you handle the experience
If you resist these sensations it will result in a negative experience of fear, sadness, confusion. If however you succeed it letting these negative sensations flow freely through you, they will flow through and out of you. And so you will be freed/healed from them.
This is the art of Entheogenic healing. And most human beings can learn it believe me.
I have trained myself with numerous psychedelic experiences (Mushrooms, LSD), once every 1, 2 or 3 month, gradually increasing the dose to learn this state of surrender where I let all sensations (negative or Positive) run freely through me, while I remain meditating in passive awareness. I now know my personal ideal doses of LSD, DMT and Mushrooms(not too high, not too low) and I now have the right mindset and approach to psychedelic experiences to no longer fear getting caught up in negative sensations. If you manage to achieve such a surrendered, meditative state of being during a psychedelic experience, suddenly the common, populair saying "Go WITH the Flow" makes alot more sense to you.

On LSD I have had visions of beautyfull, yet terrifying dragons, of beautyfull geometrical flower bookets overlaying the sky and all surfaces, I've seen gigantic mushrooms rotate in the sky, screaming faces emerge from behind the wall, as well as 100ds of airborne, illuminated, orb shaped beings that sing inredibly high pitched, healing chants/vibrations....etc

So the things I've seen on LSD were of a supernatural/magical nature; Both Dark and Light. Scary and Comforting at the same time. Usually mixed together in equal portions.

If you see blood and horror on LSD that might indicate that a certain part of your being/spirit is rather troubled and needs some special care/healing.
Ironically LSD can be used to heal that as well. If you face the horror and let it "come out of you" then you may one day be rid of it. Whatever it may be. 
This blood and horror sounds to me like a reflection of troubled part of the self.

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## dtc119

sick videos. wow. *applauds* Thank you national geographic.
and WTF about the rats? 150 micrograms!??! every 48 hours!? those rats are perma-tripping
another edit: My doses have been interesting so far. I've had these bad trips where I forget that I'm tripping, think I've died, that I'm living the afterlife and everything that is happening to me is eternal hell. A couple of those, but not quite blood and horror.. well, a little horror. 
bad shroom trip where I forgot I'm tripping, thought my contacts hardening up(I had had my eyes open for quite a while probably) was my dead eyeballs crusting.. man.
Honestly I need some good, down to earth not-going-to-fuck-with-you and will-remind-you-that-you're-tripping kinda people with me when I trip acid. 1/2 an 8th of shrooms and i'm set.
but on higher doses of shrooms or moderate doses of acid.. it seems to reoccur that when my brain starts to lose the logic/reasoning part, I freak the fuck out.

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## MrFantasy

Yes, I've personally found mushrooms to be more effective in the way of ego dissolution. Every mushroom trip I take just seems to go there whether I want it to or not. They make me feel okay with myself in a very profound way, like I'm finally accepting myself for who I really am, flaws and all. In this state of "okayness," I can let my guard down completely and no longer need to project an image of respectability out to the world in order to make people think a certain way about me.

LSD however is also a very powerful drug with much healing potential. For me personally I have found it most useful in the area of creativity enhancement. I have noticed that since my 5th or 6th or 7th LSD trip, I have an overall greatly expanded appreciation for natural beauty. I find myself stopping to stare in awe at a beautiful wisp of cloud, or a tree, or even something as simple as the mark of old leaves left on the sidewalk that no one would ever think to look twice at. I also have to say that my musical appreciation and tastes have grown exponentially since I started using LSD.

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## baccuss

I wasnt totally clear sorry...when I think / see blood and horror. It's only with my eyes closed. I have a great time with them open. Seeing music as colors...etc

Shrooms do reduce the ego into a oneness with the universe feeling.

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## Beyond Reality

I have a few questions about LSD if you don't mind:

For one thing how similar to P. Cubensis are they? I am very experienced with shrooms (done them about 20+ times) and never once experienced a bad trip. Evertime I do them I come out with something similar to what you have experienced... an overall appreciation for the small parts of the world (mostly nature) and also what shroom users call the "after glow". I've been wary of trying LSD mostly because so many people tell me about bad trips and flashbacks, but after seeing those videos on it I believe I now want to try. 

How long do flashbacks last for, and how intense are they? Are they just as intense and long as a normal LSD trip?

And for a first time acid experience would it be possible to trip on half a tab? My friend told me to cut it in half for my first and second trips, then after I have gotten used to the experience take the entire blotter.

One more... you said you have experimented with many different psychadelics... would that include Amanita Muscaria (Fly Agaric)? If so how closely do LSD and Fly Agaric trips relate?

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## MrFantasy

I've taken mushrooms about 9 or 10 times and LSD about 13 or 14 times, and to be honest I find LSD much easier to handle. Don't get me wrong, I love mushrooms, but mushrooms (at least for the doses I've taken) are much more intense. I need to have a safe-house where I can chill when I eat mushrooms, and I need to be around people I trust and love. With acid however, I have no problem being in a public place with lots of strange people such as a festival or a phish show where I'll dance my ass off, something I could never do on mushrooms. I have never had a flashback, and I have never talked to anyone who has (I know a lot of people who use LSD). However this doesn't mean they don't happen. Here is a youtube video which discusses flashbacks pretty thoroughly. I'm not an expert, but it seems to me that it's something you only have to worry about with frequent, heavy LSD use.

As far as the actual experiential differences of the trip, a mushroom trip lasts about 5-6 hours, and an LSD trip lasts about 9-12 hours. I only sometimes experience visuals from mushrooms, but I almost always get very pretty visuals from LSD. I have never had a bad trip from LSD, and I have only had a few moments during my LSD trips where anxiety started to creep in. However for me, I almost always experience anxiety for extended amounts of time during my mushroom experiences. It always resolves though, and I end up feeling much more whole and happier than I did before I tripped.

If you've tripped mushrooms more than 20 times then I'm pretty confident you would have no problem having a great trip from LSD. If you feel hesitant, there's no harm in taking a half hit or a hit your first time, but like I said, you would probably have no problem taking 2 hits your first time.

O yes one more thing. On mushrooms I usually just like to listen to silence or the subtle sounds of nature: crickets, wind blowing through the trees, rain, etc. There things are all very nice to listen to while on LSD too, but I have found that LSD enhances music soooo much more than anything I've ever experienced. If you do try it, make sure you bring a CD of some awesome music you want to listen to.

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## BeenThere

Years ago I was a person who dabbled in such things..."I" of course referring to a very fluid concept.  The fungus is potent, but earthy and "darker", however not implying negative.  High doses do induce deeper trips, but these still feel more earthbound.  Uncle Cid is more like a crazy wild animal - it doesn't just take you places, it rips you out of your body to worlds beyond imagination.  Be careful with that one, it can rip you to shreds if you're not careful...I've met some high dosing folks who never came off the merry-go-round.  For a while I was one.

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## Beyond Reality

> I've taken mushrooms about 9 or 10 times and LSD about 13 or 14 times, and to be honest I find LSD much easier to handle...



It's strange that you would say that... out of all the people I've talked to about differences/ similarities between caps and acid you're the first person I've heard say that you think LSD is less intense. I've always heard it was a cry baby shroom experience (you trip so much harder and longer than shrooms that you're crying to come down).

The fact that flashbacks (hopefully) aren't as coming for a first timer is uplifting, and I certainly would like to see some very good visuals. The most I've gotten out of caps (4 grams, holy shit) was seeing colors that weren't there actually emerge and swirl around out of nowhere and thinking a wall was breathing. Usually things just get a lot brighter, sometimes colorful, and shimmers. One of the reasons I'm so fond of shrooms is that I feel ULTRA connected with nature, and the environment, which is truly a divine feeling. Plus you're able to see things in a new light and different perspectives that can change the way you view some topics for the rest of your life. Incredible. So far it sounds to me that acid is more of a visual thing. Now tell me if I'm wrong, but my perspective is: take acid, see shit and get freaked out. Take caps: connect with nature, bring out your inner voice, let your body fuse with the world. I'll probably try LSD but I doubt I'll like it, I'm just a shroom guy I guess. 

It's true, listening to nature is one of the best things you can do. Being outside in the rain is MIND BLOWING. Listening to music while tripping caps is a good thing to do, but not marvelous. 

There's something else I've been wondering, if you've tried Salvia before, what's that compared to an Alice trip.

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## MrFantasy

I have never taken a large enough dose of LSD to actually "hallucinate," such as see things that completely are not there. When I say visuals, I mean objects breath, clouds will swirl around and morph, bunches of leaves in a tree will move in geometric fractal patterns, ripples in water will blow your mind, and other things like the grain in wood will swirl and move when you look at them.

I have done salvia a few times. Most of the times I tried it I only felt it a little bit, but one of the times  I actually "got off." It was the most intense/weirdest/scariest drug experience of my life and I haven't done it since, but I'm thinking I might sometime. Salvia is nothing like LSD, at least not at the doses I've taken. Acid is much calmer, you won't forget your name on acid. Acid can freak you out a little bit, but it can also make you laugh your ass off, and weep for joy. It's really all about set and setting, but you probably already know that being an experienced mushroom user. 

One thing you should know if you try it, it takes about 45 min-1.5 hours to kick in, and because it peaks right away the come-up is the most intense part. This graph from erowid shows it well. You will probably feel anxious, tense, and a little nervous/weird during the first hour of it, but once you get over the initial hump just go with the flow and you'll be groovin'.

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## SKA

I find acid more tense whereas I find mushrooms more relaxed and smooth. On the other hand... I find Mushrooms more of an authoritairian, hard teacher, whereas I find Acid to be a more relaxed teacher that allows you more free will. With that said I find Mushrooms a better Ego-solvent/Spiritual Healing I find Acid more of a psyche-exploratory, intelligence/intuition enhancing, extatic/aphrodesiac, creativity stimulating, self-development/help tool.





> Honestly I need some good, down to earth not-going-to-fuck-with-you and will-remind-you-that-you're-tripping kinda people with me when I trip acid. 1/2 an 8th of shrooms and i'm set.
> but on higher doses of shrooms or moderate doses of acid.. it seems to reoccur that when my brain starts to lose the logic/reasoning part, I freak the fuck out.



Sure. I can perfectly handle a mushroom trip. Or an Acid Trip. Or an Ayahuasca trip. Or a DMT trip. Nevertheless must I say that there's a limit to what I can take. If I take too much acid I notice I become VERY stimulated; Like totally charged with tense energy. My reasoning starts to become disturbed. I'm no longer aware of what I'm doing, cause my awareness is in a TOTALLY different "place" than my physical body. Such an experience would ONLY be responsible if it were under strict guidance of a sitter. Same goes for mushrooms. If the dose is too high the experience amounts in too much confusion and incoherent perception. Off course what dose is "small", "moderate", "high"and "too high" differs from person to person.

But I tend to take no more than 1 blotter acid for a trip. For social celebrations, artistic, meditative and oneirogenic purposes I like to take only 3/4th of a blotter or less.

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## Beyond Reality

> I have never taken a large enough dose of LSD to actually "hallucinate," such as see things that completely are not there. When I say visuals, I mean objects breath, clouds will swirl around and morph, bunches of leaves in a tree will move in geometric fractal patterns, ripples in water will blow your mind, and other things like the grain in wood will swirl and move when you look at them.
> 
> I have done salvia a few times. Most of the times I tried it I only felt it a little bit, but one of the times  I actually "got off." It was the most intense/weirdest/scariest drug experience of my life and I haven't done it since, but I'm thinking I might sometime. Salvia is nothing like LSD, at least not at the doses I've taken. Acid is much calmer, you won't forget your name on acid. Acid can freak you out a little bit, but it can also make you laugh your ass off, and weep for joy. It's really all about set and setting, but you probably already know that being an experienced mushroom user. 
> 
> One thing you should know if you try it, it takes about 45 min-1.5 hours to kick in, and because it peaks right away the come-up is the most intense part. This graph from erowid shows it well. You will probably feel anxious, tense, and a little nervous/weird during the first hour of it, but once you get over the initial hump just go with the flow and you'll be groovin'.



In my previous post I wrote "coming" instead of "common" ha ha. Oops. Oh trust me I know exactly what you mean when you say you've never actually "hallucinated" while tripping Alice/ shrooms, as in you believe that someone or something you perceive with your ears or eyes is, in fact, 100% real. Only stuff like certain Alkaloids and DMT can do that shit. From all the posts and reviews about taking LSD that I have read, it sounds a lot like I've experienced "RELATIVELY" close to the same visual experience while on P. Cubensis. 

I have done salvia also, but both times I tripped way to hard to enjoy it. I was just wondering if it was like acid, because if you would have said "yes" then that would definitely be a turn off. (Whew!)

Oh yes ha "set and setting, set and setting", the most common thing you'll ever here from a previous tripper. 

I know about how long it takes, and I think I'm pretty accustomed to long periods of pre trip time. Is acid like caps in the sense that it creeps up on you and than smacks you in the face?

Hey, thanks for answering all of my questions BTW. This is more help than what I could have gotten from 20 other websites.

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## SKA

Nicely explained Mr.Fantasy,
This "Okayness" sounds like the state of surrender I spoke of earlier. It will show you all your flaws, but because the ego is removed for that level of introspection you can see all your flaws objectively: Without fear, Without Guilt, without Shame, Without Grief, Without Lies, Without Illusion and Without Earthly attatchment(note how these 7 "Sins" correspond to the 7 main Characteristics of the Ego that can block each of the 7 Chakra's From Root to Crown respectively) 

Being stripped of Ego by a psychedelic or other medium results in all life energy flowing freely through you again. This is a state of Zen. Enlightenment. Complete stillness of Mind. Being ultimately open in the here and now and no longer being self-absorbed with thoughts, worries, feelings, memories concerning the past and the future. 

This is how we are supposed to be. 





> I wasnt totally clear sorry...when I think / see blood and horror. It's only with my eyes closed. I have a great time with them open. Seeing music as colors...etc
> 
> Shrooms do reduce the ego into a oneness with the universe feeling.



Like all different parts of your body belong to you, so do all living creatures on this Earth belong to the massive Earth body. And so does all of existance.

Your Arm is no seperate entity, it is part of you. Your arm, together with the rest of your physical and nonphysical being, forms a whole that is "You". Similairly "You" are no seperate entity from the Earth of the planet you walk on and all other living beings on that planet. Together it forms a whole that is hard to name. It has been called many things, this "whole"; Allah, Buddha, Jahweh, Jah, Elohim, Addonai, Krishna, Eloh, Tao, God, Zeus, Charles Mingus..etc

The physical and spiritual/mental enviroment around you should be seen as an extention of "You". As an extention of your own, individual being. You are in no way even remotely seperate from the rest of existance. It is the Ego that limits our sense of "self" to our physical bodies and the therein present "individual" thoughts, experiences, beliefs and desires. If a psychedelic is taken, the Ego is dissolved and suddenly we have no problem at all seeing how there is no "border" whatsover between your "own" body, and the physical enviroment around you. And that there is no border either between your "own" consciousness and that of any other human, Fish, Insect, Tree, Mushroom or Plant. 

All of existance is one being.

If human communities dissolve the Ego on a frequent basis with Entheogenic plants and substances, like Santo Daime's people do, then they would remain in this state of Egoless, blissfull, awakened consciousness and it would greatly benefit the social structure of their communities. 

Cause the true enemy of mankind aren't manipulative Reptilians, Aliens, Mutants, Matrix Programmers, Jews, Gays or Communists like many wackos keep trying to have us believe.

The only True enemy of Mankind is it's Ego. It is the cause of all human miserable, destructive behaviour.

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## Rosewhip137

I must say that documentary has tempted me...

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## fairytale complex

does anyone know about Lithium/ Lsd interactions ? ....it can be  bad maybe fatal , my question for the smart people is , how long approx would one have to stop taking lithium to be in the trip safe zone ?

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## The Cusp

http://www.sirbacon.org/4membersonly/docellis.htm

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## dtc119

'SWIM' is tripping and re-reading this thread. fun stuff

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## Noogah

What is the point of taking LSD anyways? Kind of sounds like drinking plain decaf coffee.

Useless.

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## dtc119

> What is the point of taking LSD anyways? Kind of sounds like drinking plain decaf coffee.
> 
> Useless.



troll, or ignorant. You decide.

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## BeenThere

> What is the point of taking LSD anyways? Kind of sounds like drinking plain decaf coffee.
> 
> Useless.



 :Confused: What do you mean?  Have you ever taken it?  Definitely not a drug I'd label as "decaf".

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## Noogah

> What do you mean?  Have you ever taken it?  Definitely not a drug I'd label as "decaf".



I'm asking a question.

What's the use of LSD in the first place? I mean, besides nausea, logic impairment, increased blood pressure, possible acute depression and bad trips, etc.

Does it do anything...oh...I don't know...useful? Practical? Beneficial? Productive?

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## BeenThere

> I'm asking a question.
> 
> What's the use of LSD in the first place? I mean, besides nausea, logic impairment, increased blood pressure, possible acute depression and bad trips, etc.
> 
> Does it do anything...oh...I don't know...useful? Practical? Beneficial? Productive?



Why don't you give it a try and find out?  Certainly it has effects other than what you listed or supposed (assuming you've not tried it).  Or are you just fishing with sarcasm?

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## Beyond Reality

> I'm asking a question.
> 
> What's the use of LSD in the first place? I mean, besides nausea, logic impairment, increased blood pressure, possible acute depression and bad trips, etc.
> 
> Does it do anything...oh...I don't know...useful? Practical? Beneficial? Productive?



Man what the hell are you talking about. There are THOUSANDS of reasons to take LSD (and magic mushrooms of course). It is an incredible substance. It's magical. It opens you up to new creative worlds, that are yet to be explored by most. You can view topics and the world in general in a new light and from different perspectives that you might have missed before. It is mind altering, during the session and after the session. It can permanently change your overall look on life and put a new spin on it. It brings life into the light of spiritualness and it makes the unobvious seem obvious.

Try it before you judge.

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## The Cusp

> What's the use of LSD in the first place? I mean, besides nausea, logic impairment, increased blood pressure, possible acute depression and bad trips, etc.
> 
> Does it do anything...oh...I don't know...useful? Practical? Beneficial? Productive?



First of all, that's the worst description of LSD i've ever heard.  I've never known anyone who got nauseous, bad trips are fairly rare, and often the result of the individual being fucked up in the first place.  LSD is often used to tread depression. 

As for logic impairment, that is hardly the case.  While playing online videogames on LSD, my opponents quit and accuse me of cheating because I'm too good.  A friend of mine did some for his hockey league and scored 9 goals!  That link I posted earlier about the guy pitching a perfect game on acid.  

LSD is like a temporary computer upgrade, where you supercharge your processor.

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## StonedApe

This was just on TV about a week ago, very well put togther.

Does anyone know how long acid will last? Not the effects, but the doses themselves. My friends got a vial right now and he's been putting them on sour patch kids. I'd like to buy some and save them for about a month or 2 from now, but I don't want to waste my money.

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## The Cusp

> Does anyone know how long acid will last?



I think oxygen and sunlight are the two biggest things that will degrade your acid.  Keep it wrapped and out of the sun and it should keep for long enough.

Lol at the sour bears.

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## Noogah

> It is an incredible substance. It's magical. It opens you up to new creative worlds, that are yet to be explored by most. You can view topics and the world in general in a new light and from different perspectives that you might have missed before. It is mind altering, during the session and after the session.



...these are also known as "hallucinations"

Also not very good for your mind.





> While playing online videogames on LSD, my opponents quit and accuse me of cheating because I'm too good. A friend of mine did some for his hockey league and scored 9 goals!



1.You sure it wasn't just a hallucination?

2.That doesn't prove that your/his logic was not still impaired.





> Why don't you give it a try and find out?



Come to think of it, there is also the small matter about LSD being illegal. You know, I've heard of people going to jail for using illegal drugs.

I'm not going to jail for a drug, nor will I abuse my mind/body.

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## StonedApe

> Also not very good for your mind.



Really? Have you ever tried the stuff? Every time I take it I feel like certain illusions I held in my mind have been smashed and I come out of it thinking much more quickly.

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## Noogah

> Really? Have you ever tried the stuff? Every time I take it I feel like certain illusions I held in my mind have been smashed and I come out of it thinking much more quickly.



I don't need to toast my hand to know that burns are bad for me.

The reason you feel like you're thinking faster is because:

1.Your heart is racing
2.Your brain has had some time to rest during the temporary logic impairment
3.Since you weren't thinking clearly, when you do start to think clearly, it feels much better

Also, I'm no scientist, but from my laymens perspective, making your mind work harder then usual after a dose isn't very good for it either.

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## dajo

There is no real way to explain. Noogah, you just can't have any idea. 
It is a lot different than you imagine, or describe here.

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## ragincajun2288

Saying that having an enlightening spiritual trip is not good for your mind is ridiculous. I've taken LSD and Shrooms many times and although I haven't done them in awhile it's not because they made nauseated, impaired my logic whatsoever, or caused any depression, (nor for any of the many trippers I know), it's because I've learned so much from those experiences I feel as if I don't need to trip at all in this point of my life. (But perhaps later I hope  ::D: )

So don't speak on the subject if you haven't personally studied it sir.

Oh, and one more thing, your heart really doesn't race much quicker at all. I've always been very calm on all my trips and feeling my heart beat was a favorite pastime of mine while I was tripping. It's hardly noticeable really.

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## Noogah

> Saying that having an enlightening spiritual trip is not good for your mind is ridiculous.



...you mean a hallucination? They aren't the same things.





> There is no real way to explain. Noogah, you just can't have any idea.



Of course there isn't, and of course I can't! That's because it's a psychotic hallucination which cannot be translated into English language.

It's a hallucination. A byproduct of a mere chemical imbalance.

That's as deep as it goes. Taking a drug cannot enlighten you, no matter how weird things can get.

You know, I used to love standing on a balcony above the sea, and feeling the wind rush past my face, smelling the salty air, and watching the waves crash against the shore. I would hold my breath until I almost swooned, and then breathe again. It was so peaceful and relaxing. It was probably the best experience anyone could ever have.

Then one day I held my breath for too long. I never went near that balcony again.

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## Beyond Reality

> ...these are also known as "hallucinations"
> 
> Also not very good for your mind.



No, Noogah, I'm not talking about "hallucinations". When under the influence of one session of LSD or magic mushrooms there certainly are some very incredible hallucinations (and they can be very relaxing and creative, sometimes even relieve stress and depression), but those are not the mind altering aspects of the drug I'm trying to communicate to you.

I'm talking about the quieting of your ever so mouthy outer voice. The one that constantly insists on yelling it's first impression thoughts at you. It is stilled, so as to let your INNER voice come out, and speak for a change. And that, my friend, is truly enlightening. It is the thing that so many of us search for in life. Many people are so lost, going about their day, trying to find the right thing to fill up the void inside of them, sometimes with worldly things such as sex, or alcohol. Sometimes they are workaholics or have to constantly be active in community services. The answer to these situations of people who are searching for a filler to the void is SO SIMPLE. The void is a result of a lack of their inner voice. Yoga and forms of meditation are also wonderful ways to find yourself, still your out voice, and bring out your inner self, but talking psychedelics is far more convenient for most of us, and usually much deeper. 

As you so often love to bring up, there is a chemical imbalance in your brain when under the influence, I understand that. LSD trips require it produce the divine effects. But if having an imbalance in brain chemicals for a short period of time is the only thing holding you back from the ultimate exploration of your inner mind and body, then why not take the drug? The effects on the mind, as well as the brain chemicals, are not permanent. Soon enough you are back to normal with no damage to your body, and you have gained so much for your mind.

I view LSD and shrooms as being very similar to lucid dreams. Lucid dreams can be an inner exploration the the mind and psyche. You can delve into the depths of your subconscious and and come back to reality with a new understanding of your mind and sometimes environment. Do you disagree with this statement? If you don't then I can't possibly see how you could judge upon something so similar in nature.

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## Noogah

> I'm talking about the quieting of your ever so mouthy outer voice. The one that constantly insists on yelling it's first impression thoughts at you. It is stilled, so as to let your INNER voice come out, and speak for a change. And that, my friend, is truly enlightening.



Dude, I get that. That is not "inspiring", it's concentration. You can achieve the same results by simply sitting down in a quiet corner, and sorting through your mind.





> any people are so lost, going about their day, trying to find the right thing to fill up the void inside of them, sometimes with worldly things such as sex, or alcohol. Sometimes they are workaholics or have to constantly be active in community services.



And a chemical cannot fill that void. I know what you're talking about. Every testimony of someone who became a Christian talks about it. A terrible void in their heart. In fact, I've heard of many who actually resorted to drugs to fill that void, but it never lasted. And they just needed more and more. When they became a Christian, God didn't "run out" He was always there for them in trouble, and in need. EVen when things were going right, and I can testify to that.

 What happens when you run out of lsd? There goes your "enlightenment". You have to get more. But then, what happens when your stuck in jail with none? When you can't have anymore? Will you sit in a corner and be depressed?

It may make you feel good for a few minutes, but it won't last.





> divine effects



It's a physical effect!!! Don't you get it!? You can't cure lifes problems by constantly entoxicating your mind with chemicals. It can make you feel great, but what good is that? It doesn't solve anything, it doesn't improve your mind or body. It only gives you a few peaceful moments, and wild hallucinations.





> Do you disagree with this statement?



In a way, no. Lucid dreaming brings about a different state of mind, as does lsd. But that's all it is, and I never claim that it's anything else.

A chemical cannot bring about spiritual enhancement. 

You can't hurt a ghost with a stick either.

----------


## The Cusp

> You can't hurt a ghost with a stick either.



But you might be able to hurt one with the idea of a stick.   ::D:

----------


## Bonsay

> And a chemical cannot fill that void. 
> 
> It's a physical effect!!! Don't you get it!? You can't cure lifes problems by constantly entoxicating your mind with chemicals. It can make you feel great, but what good is that? It doesn't solve anything, it doesn't improve your mind or body. It only gives you a few peaceful moments, and wild hallucinations.
> 
> A chemical cannot bring about spiritual enhancement.



A physical brain, a physical universe - a "physical" enlightenment. 
_"Who are you who are so wise in the spiritual ways?"_





> It may make you feel good for a few minutes, but it won't last.



How do you know?

----------


## Noogah

> But you might be able to hurt one with the idea of a stick.



Lol, well, I guess that's true.





> A physical brain, a physical universe - a "physical" enlightenment.



Precisely my point. While there is a spiritual world, a chemical from the physical world can only bring physical effect, not spiritual.





> How do you know?



I haven't tried it if that's what your getting at.

But I don't need to try something to know about something. I learn plenty of stuff in school that I don't actually experience.

Are you trying to say that it's not true?

----------


## Bonsay

> Precisely my point. While there is a spiritual world, a chemical from the physical world can only bring physical effect, not spiritual.



Sorry. There is no spiritual world. Not the way you're trying to make it. If I cut out some quasi clump of neurons (chemicals if you will) that are responsible for negative emotions, I'd be the happiest person on Earth. If a chemical makes you a Buddha for a certain amount of time, by changing your brains, then that's what it does. 






> I haven't tried it if that's what your getting at.
> 
> But I don't need to try something to know about something. I learn plenty of stuff in school that I don't actually experience.
> 
> Are you trying to say that it's not true?



Yes actually. Studies into the positive effects of psychedelics are being revived. Something that wasn't possible because of people with your attitude. People who like to decide what's generally good or bad based on their feelings.

----------


## Noogah

> Sorry. There is no spiritual world.



We may not live in one, but there is one.





> Yes actually. Studies into the positive effects of psychedelics are being revived. Something that wasn't possible because of people with your attitude. People who like to decide what's generally good or bad based on their feelings.



And how does this discredit my point that the effects of LSD are only temporary?

----------


## Bonsay

> We may not live in one, but there is one.



If we do not live in one, then we don't know if there is one.




> And how does this discredit my point that the effects of LSD are only temporary?



As temporary as World War 2.

----------


## SKA

> I'm asking a question.
> 
> What's the use of LSD in the first place? I mean, besides nausea, logic impairment, increased blood pressure, possible acute depression and bad trips, etc.
> 
> Does it do anything...oh...I don't know...useful? Practical? Beneficial? Productive?



You haven't watched the Documentairy have you?
'Cause if you HAVE watched the documentairy you would have learned that LSD has been succesfully used to treat people with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and has been very succesfull at getting addicted people off of their Alcohol or Opiate addiction. It helps scientists, artists/musicians, architects think more freely and more creatively inspired. Leading to an improvement of their work. 

So to sum it up: Help people overcome PTS-Disorders, Ending addictions and intense enhancement of creative thought. If that doesn't sound "ufesull" to you then I don't know what will.

Off course you would have KNOWN that LSD hase these marvelous, powerfull, usefull effects if you would have Watched the Documentairy. 

So why don't you go watch that Documentairy? Your question "what use has taking LSD?" will be answered in great detail there.

PS: LSD is very unlikely to cause nausea, unless you take rediculously much. Depression and Bad trips are highly unlikely too, unless LSD is taken in severely irresponsible circumstances/doses.
It's actually more likely to Clear up and sharpen your logic thinking, than impair it. It can do that, but again only if taken in irresponsibly high doses. I find it astonishing how people who have obviously never taken LSD, come up with the most rediculous lies and myths about LSD. It's the imprint of  propaganda on your mind, believe me.

It's especially amazing how unknowledgable people telling you ghost stories that they heard or read about LSD are not open and willing to listen to Your knowledge and view of LSD, even though you have actually experienced taking it. Instead they stick to this dogmatic belief structure concerning drugs. The globalised authority have imprinted their Drugs-Doctrine uppon you and now you will defend these "beliefs" as if they were your own. Everywhere in the world the same ignorant, hypocritical laws, the same propaganda lies, the same masses of brainwashed anti-drug people. Every government in the world is telling it's people LIES about the dangers of drugs. Why? The same reason so many Governments tell their people lies about the reasons of going to war; The good old Power and Money off course. This Documentairy seeks to make an end to that, starting with Un-brainwashing the people's minds.

Watching this Documentairy will soon crumble and flush away these illusionairy beliefs concerning LSD and instead show you the bare naked, unbiased truth about LSD. That's why I posted this thread: Cause I know alot of people walk around hanging on to a bunch of propagated Bogus lies about LSD and similair substances and this Documentairy is a nice way to make all of the rediculous lies, myths and propaganda surrounding LSD disappear once and for all.

----------


## dajo

The things you are experiencing are not hallucinations, at least the profound 
things. You experience for a period of time a rewiring of the neuroways of the 
brain, giving you an opportunity to actually "see things different", but it's no 
more an hallucination then everydaylife. Of course the visuals could be called 
hallucinations, but they are not the core of the experience. 





> And how does this discredit my point that the effects of LSD are only temporary?



Studies have shown, at least I know of one with mushrooms, that they can 
have long-lasting poitive effects, which is not surprising the least. Many, many 
people described long lasting positive effects, a new outlook on life.

Life is also temporary, so should we stop living then? 





> What happens when you run out of lsd? There goes your "enlightenment". You have to get more.



LSD is physically non-adictive. You don't even want or can't do it too often. 





> But I don't need to try something to know about something. I learn plenty of stuff in school that I don't actually experience.



Sincerely: What do you want? You are not open to have your mind changed, 
because you 'already know'. If you think you know what psychedelics are 
all about, because of _school_ then why come here? Noone is trying to 
get you to try them - this is for people wanting to _inform_ oneself.

----------


## ragincajun2288

His mind seems closed. Which is sad. His journey will be short. All things must be experienced before truly understood, this I leave you with.

----------


## Noogah

> If we do not live in one, then we don't know if there is one.



...and vice versa.





> As temporary as World War 2.



So the effects of LSD lasts six years? Wow!





> LSD has been succesfully used to treat people with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and has been very succesfull at getting addicted people off of their Alcohol or Opiate addiction



Do you have PTD? Are you addicted to alcohol? Are you addicted to Opiate?

You don't drink cough medicine when you don't have a cough. And even when you do have a cough, you only take as much as you need to get rid of it.





> It helps scientists, artists/musicians, architects think more freely and more creatively inspired. Leading to an improvement of their work.



I hear that square dancing on a five hundred year old rickety rotting bridge above a seven thousand foot gulch is also VERY inspiring. 





> It's especially amazing how unknowledgable people telling you ghost stories that they heard or read about LSD



I do my own research, thankyou.





> Studies have shown,* at least I know of one with mushrooms*




Dude...could you do a little better then that?





> Life is also temporary, so should we stop living then?



But when life is over, so is everything else. At least, on this earth. When an LSD experience is over, there is still a life to live.





> LSD is physically non-adictive.



1.Yes it is.
2.I meant that in order to continue this new found "enlightenment" you must have more lsd, or else your "enlightenment" is all gone.





> What do you want? You are not open to have your mind changed,
> because you 'already know'. If you think you know what psychedelics are
> all about, because of school then why come here? Noone is trying to
> get you to try them - this is for people wanting to inform oneself.



Well excuse me for not changing my mind. You haven't your either. If a post is made to explain LSD, then it should also be open to debates.

I'm not trying to be deviant here. All aspects of a topic should be stretched and covered. It's beneficial to everbody. I'm debating because, well, would it be any fun if everybody here thought the exact same thing?





> His journey will be short.



In other words, I'll die prematurely because I'm closed minded about LSD?





> All things must be experienced before truly understood



I understand that you are weghtless in space. I've never been weightless. True, I don't understand it to teeny detail, but I understand it enough.

----------


## Serith

Excellent!  I'm sure that's proven to all these people that their positive experiences with LSD were all dangerous lies, and your hostility will definitely convince them to see things your way.  

If you want to convince anyone of anything, you need solid sources and arguments, and also to not be insulting, and even then you shouldn't be surprised when people stick with what they know.  Otherwise, your argument really isn't better than trolling.

----------


## DeeryTheDeer

Noogah, if you're too closed-minded to want to experience anything in life and would rather just hear or read about it at school (as if those external sources are entirely trustworthy to begin with), then why are you on a lucid dreaming forum? Lucid dreams are even more temporary than LSD, and in most cases less vivid or life changing. Your arguments against LSD are very similar to general arguments against lucid dreaming.

Not trying to get too personal, but really.

----------


## Speesh

To everyone arguing with Noogah: stop taking his bait. Ignore him and he'll go away, and then we can have some worthwhile discussion!

Great documentary, by the way. Its so rare something this unbiased comes along. I'm all for anything that can help facilitate self-awareness and understanding. I've never taken LSD, but I tried mescaline once and it caused me to become aware of and begin to solve a self-esteem issue that's been around since I was a kid. I really wish they were legal and not so stigmatized, its unarguable that these drugs are capable of amazing things.

And I guess I wouldn't say they're bad for the mind, they just alter brain chemistry for a bit, but they do it in such a way that involves a risk factor. They force the brain through a staggering amount of change in a short period of time. Every mind is different, and not all of them can handle something like that. The stories about schizophrenia aren't propaganda. That shit happens. Still, for this is should be researched, not banned. I'm hoping we see more LSD related research in the near future.

----------


## Bonsay

> ...and vice versa.



Give me a break Noogah. The reason you believe in spiritual worlds is not because you lack evidence for it. If you want to believe in flying donkeys for the simple reason they can't be proven, then be my guest. Watch out an invisible flying donkey is watching your every move now.






> So the effects of LSD lasts six years? Wow!



Oh sorry Noogah. I see I have overestimated your cognitive abilities in abstract thinking which you seem to have replaced with misplaced arrogance. If you really need an explanation - I meant the same thing as dajo. World War 2 only lasted for six years. Now go tell my grandmother how trivial and temporary the war was. Apparently you only live in the present and aren't influenced by anything for more than the present moment; gold fish memory?

----------


## Noogah

> your hostility will definitely convince them to see things your way.



Hostility!? Surely you jest! My goal here is not to make people "see things my way". I think differently then most people here. Arguing it out is beneficial for both sides to weigh out the right and the wrong. I'm not trying to force, or condemn anybody for anything.





> Noogah, if you're too closed-minded to want to experience anything in life and would rather just hear or read about it at school



Listen deer (I love your username!  ::D: ) just because I don't wish to try LSD doesn't mean that I wish to try nothing.

Are you saying that I haven't lived life until I take LSD? Of course your not. 





> Lucid dreams are even more temporary than LSD, and in most cases less vivid or life changing.



But I never claimed that they were more than that. Nor are dreams dangerous in any way. I never said dreams were life changing or spiritually enlightening. They won't put me in any danger, so they are two different things really.





> Not trying to get too personal, but really.



The same, of course. Don't worry, I'm not easily offended. I don't mean anything personal to anybody.





> Ignore him and he'll go away, and then we can have some worthwhile discussion!



...waht discussion? If everybody thinks the same thing, there is little point in "discussion"
_
Likeminded person 1: I can't stand pickles.

Likeminded person 2: Me neither!

Likeminded person 3:They're gross.

Likeminded person 4:Yeah

Likeminded person 2: I mean, I just can't stand them!

Likeminded person 3: I know what you mean dude.

Likeminded person 5: Anyone here hate pickles?

All the likeminded people: YEAH!_

These fellow pickle haters haven't had much worthwhile discussion. What was this thread made for if not to talk about the true nature of lsd? If everyone believe the same thing about, then what's the point in even discussing it?





> If you want to believe in flying donkeys for the simple reason they can't be proven, then be my guest.



God cannot be "proven" by means of physical measurement. But, there is not just lack of disproof, there is wealth of evidence and reason itself to believe in a God. There is absolutely no reason to believe in a flying donkey.





> Now go tell my grandmother how trivial and temporary the war was.



I can hardly believe you are comparing the effects of lsd to WWII. Are you just messing around? 

Please! You have to be kidding!! I don't know for certain how long the effects of lsd are, but I'm quite sure that it is less then twenty-four hours at most times. You cannot comapre the physical effects of a chemical to your mind haht take place over a few hours span to the second World Ward, which lasted six years and killed thousands of people, ruined thousands of families and caused heartache destruction and general turmoil across the world.

By the way, forgive me if I come across as rather rude. It's just, this is my first debate since being banned from the R/S section. I'm having a blast. It will probably wear off after a few more posts.

----------


## Aspartamebraintumor

I've only ever tried it once, but LSD was a very liberating experience for me. I was in my friend's basement with him and another person. We took two hits each. 
It was as though the world had ended thousands of years ago and we were burried by weather many miles underground. Everyone and everything I knew outside of the basement were ancient memories. The basement was the last room in the universe. It felt like I would be there for all eternity and it didn't matter one bit. Very calming experience.
Also, the site of my friend standing, looking at the dawn through the basement window would've made the perfect album cover!

----------


## Bonsay

> God cannot be "proven" by means of physical measurement. But, there is not just lack of disproof, there is wealth of evidence and reason itself to believe in a God. There is absolutely no reason to believe in a flying donkey.



It's an infinitely powerful flying donkey. It's omnipotence makes it's existence as valid as any other gods. So all evidence you think you have is actually the evidence for a flying donkey. It can't be disputed since it exists "outside" and it's existence can explain everything.

By the way, I never started anything about gods. Only "spiritual worlds". 





> I can hardly believe you are comparing the effects of lsd to WWII. Are you just messing around? 
> 
> Please! You have to be kidding!! I don't know for certain how long the effects of lsd are, but I'm quite sure that it is less then twenty-four hours at most times. You cannot comapre the physical effects of a chemical to your mind haht take place over a few hours span to the second World Ward, which lasted six years and killed thousands of people, ruined thousands of families and caused heartache destruction and general turmoil across the world.



Why can't I compare it? All you are doing here is crying about how bad the war was and how "just chemicals" (which happen to define every ounce of our existence) can't do anything to compare. Argumentum ad consequentiam? No offense, but highlighting the "sadness" of an event doesn't address the point of the argument at all. Instead of telling me how surprised you are that I actually believe the fact, that experiencing the war is as real as a dream or an effect of some drug, you might want to explain why a spiritual experience of some kind can't change your life. Don't think with your emotions if you want to be rational.

----------


## Serith

> Hostility!? Surely you jest! My goal here is not to make people "see things my way". I think differently then most people here. Arguing it out is beneficial for both sides to weigh out the right and the wrong. I'm not trying to force, or condemn anybody for anything.



I'm sorry, I've just never understood internet arguments like this one.  What is the appeal of these things, anyway?  Obviously neither side can teach anything to the other, as both side's arguments are based on irreconcilable philosophies.  Do you feel you learn something from the debate?  This goes to everyone, not just Noogah.

----------


## Noogah

> So all evidence you think you have is actually the evidence for a flying donkey.



No dude. I don't what your trying to do here, but now you're just acting like a lunatic.





> Why can't I compare it?



Okay, I'm going to be as simplistic as I can.

The effects of war do not equal the effects of chemical/pill/drug/medicine/food intake.

Okay? Please come up with a better analogy.





> Do you feel you learn something from the debate?



In a strict sense, no. But I feel that I better understand the point view of those who defend LSD.

----------


## Banana

I have watched the documentary that was spoken of earlier. They gave some scientists that had troubles figuring something out some LSD and some relaxing music. You know what happened? They all solved their problems. Every single one. Some of these were math problems, some of these were philosophical theories. Either way, they came to a conclusion. LSD allows you to think more open minded and lessen how much you try to pull from thoughts you already have. This causes you to create new thoughts and connections for things, which helps in numerous ways.

----------


## Bonsay

> No dude. I don't what your trying to do here, but now you're just acting like a lunatic.



Well that's what you do, don't you? If you can't understand it or come up with an argument, the other person must be a lunatic. Ignorance is bliss I guess.





> Okay, I'm going to be as simplistic as I can.
> 
> The effects of war do not equal the effects of chemical/pill/drug/medicine/food intake.
> 
> Okay? Please come up with a better analogy.



You are being simplistic. For some reason you don't want to except the fact that you can experience some sort of enlightenment from a drug. It was not an analogy. I was trying to explain to you that it doesn't matter what makes you experience something. It's the experience that counts. Whether it's a hallucination from a drug, meditation in the desert or experiencing a war. It's not a temporary fix, if you're doing some psychedelics you aren't shooting up heroin.

----------


## Supernova

Damn Noogah, they should hire you to do anti-drug propeganda commercials.

----------


## acatalephobic

I watched this when it was on, and found a lot of it was old news. But to someone who knows little about it's pharmaceutical history I'm sure it would be a bit of an eye-opener. 

It made me so sad to see that man suffer from cluster-headaches, simply because of his promise to "never take *illegal* drugs". Because synthetic drugs that are deemed illegal are _just so different_ from those deemed legal and profitable.  :tongue2: 


My only wish is that they'd do a similar doc on psilocybes as well. Or on simple DMT alone. Natural substances are far more fascinating, and [in my opinion] deserve a far more objective analysis than they currently get. *If synthetics get that benefit, it makes absolutely no logical sense that organics wouldn't.*

----------


## Noogah

> Well that's what you do, don't you?



....uh....no. No Bonsay.





> For some reason you don't want to except the fact that you can experience some sort of enlightenment from a drug.



...you can't! If you can show me HOW, that could be slightly beneficial to this argument. In fact, it might totally end it. Don't you agree?





> it doesn't matter what makes you experience something



Indeed. So why take LSD when you could just meditate?





> It's not a temporary fix



I think I kind of get what your saying. It's the memory that counts right? Somehow I don't think that's what you're saying. If it is, then that still does not justify LSD.  ::?: 





> they should hire you to do anti-drug propeganda commercials.



Somehow, I get the feeling that the image of a thirteen year old kid explaining the downside to drugs would hardly be convincing.  ::D:

----------


## Hukif

> ...you can't! If you can show me HOW, that could be slightly beneficial to this argument. In fact, it might totally end it. Don't you agree?



Uh... watch the video for that one, if you don't want to watch it, stop trying to debate on a thread about a video that explains LSD.

----------


## Noogah

> Uh... watch the video for that one, if you don't want to watch it, stop trying to debate on a thread about a video that explains LSD.



If any of these videos explains how LSD will enlighten you, I will indeed watch it. Please, tell me specifically which one/s, because I don't want to watch all of them.

----------


## Bonsay

> ...you can't! If you can show me HOW, that could be slightly beneficial to this argument. In fact, it might totally end it. Don't you agree?



http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/press.../07_11_06.html
http://www.bpru.org/cancer-studies/faq.html
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5...PZGqel--WwEJLg
...




> Indeed. So why take LSD when you could just meditate?



Why meditate when you could just take LSD? Why be Christian when you could be Buddhist? Why live if you could just die? The fact is that you can do whatever you want to do. I don't see why this fact discredits the power of psychedelic drugs. Does the existence of cars discredit bicycles? You still haven't given a valid reason why "drugs are bad".





> I think I kind of get what your saying. It's the memory that counts right? Somehow I don't think that's what you're saying. If it is, then that still does not justify LSD.



Nothing justifies LSD for you. Apparently all you see in LSD is _"drugs are bad, m'kay?"_. Why wouldn't that justify LSD? You haven't given a reason other than: I don't like drugs, therefore there is no reason for anybody else to like them either. Sadly, as we've seen in the marijuana thread, you like to enforce your likes or dislikes on the rest of the population. The illegality of drugs causes more damage than anything a legal status would've done. But I guess you don't care about those who go to jail for growing plants with certain beneficial characteristics.

----------


## Noogah

> http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/press.../07_11_06.html
> http://www.bpru.org/cancer-studies/faq.html
> http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5...PZGqel--WwEJLg



All that those links seem to explain is that a chemical is produced in the brain which causes strange hallucinations. Maybe you should explain it in your own words.





> Why meditate when you could just take LSD?



Oh, I dunno. Maybe because you don't risk your health when you meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't risk going to jail when you meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't have to spend gobs of money to meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't risk becoming a chronic meditation addict?

Maybe because, meditation can't possibly ruin your life?

Savvy?





> Why be Christian when you could be Buddhist?



Flawed analogy. In the case of lsd vs. meditation, the two accomplish the same task. In the case of Christianity vs. Buddhism, they are two totally different beliefs that say different things.





> Why live if you could just die?



Another flawed analogy, for the same reasons as before. Two opposites, once producing a positive result, the other producing a negative.





> I don't see why this fact discredits the power of psychedelic drugs.



I said nothing about it discrediting the hallucinations you experience with LSD. I was only making the point, why choose lsd when there is a much safer, and better alternative?





> Apparently all you see in LSD is "drugs are bad, m'kay?".



Scroll through my posts dude. You'll see that I have much more to say about LSD/drugs in general then that. I've discussed how unhealthy it is, how useless it is, and on top of it being illegal, it is a bad idea.

I never said "Stop taking LSD you guys! It's bad!" in any such form or fashion. I'm not forcing anything on you guys either. I'm only giving my opinion, as you are giving yours. 

But I'm not complaining about your opinion.





> Why wouldn't that justify LSD?



Just because something gives you pleasant memories doesn't justify it. I'm sure that I would have pleasant memories of how fun the roller coaster was before I fell off. Not a great analogy of course, but you get the point.





> But I guess you don't care about those who go to jail for growing plants with certain beneficial characteristics.



I don't. They disobeyed a perfectly reasonable law. You can live without LSD. Heck, you can live quit comfortably without it. It was their choice. They didn't have to go to jail.

If you want to kill your brain with drugs, get out of America. No one's forcing you to do anything. It's not like you don't have a choice in the matter. If your going to play the game, you have to play by the rules. And if you get caught breaking the rules, there will be a penalty, and that's your fault.

If you can't stand the rules, quit the game and go play a different game.

Also, I highly doubt that any of these people arrested for LSD were growing it for it's health benefits. I'm pretty sure it was just for the trip.

Now, if there were people growing some herb to soothe a sore throat or something, and the police just drove by and threw them in jail, then of course I would care.

However, that is not the case.

----------


## SKA

Noogah,

Stop ruining a perfectly fine, objective and scientific Topic by overloading it with your opinion which is mindless, ignorant dirt that no one's waiting for.
This documentairy is meant to break taboos and spread the unbiased truth and here you throw in a counter offensive of your Opinion; Which consists of foolish myths and lies that are scientifically ungrounded. 

But you're just a pathetic frustrated anti-social forum-troll. 

We would do best ignoring this poor, troubled soul. No matter how much he posts senseless provocations. We should ignore him as if he's not in this discussion at all.

So instead we can discuss this Documentairy unhindered by forum-bullying sociopaths who seek to ruin every good intelligeble discussion and end it in a riot.
To all you damn fools who wish to come spread lies and redicule other people's views(while not being aware of just how rediculous your own views are) I'd like to say:

*Shut your loud mouths and Watch the Documentairy.*

----------


## CarmineEternity

*





 Originally Posted by BeenThere


Why don't you give it a try and find out?  Certainly it has effects other than what you listed or supposed (assuming you've not tried it).  Or are you just fishing with sarcasm?



Noogah is 11, don't tell him to do acid.*

----------


## Bonsay

> All that those links seem to explain is that a chemical is produced in the brain which causes strange hallucinations.



If you wanted to understand it you'd read it.





> Oh, I dunno. Maybe because you don't risk your health when you meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't risk going to jail when you meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't have to spend gobs of money to meditate? Maybe it's because, you don't risk becoming a chronic meditation addict?
> Maybe because, meditation can't possibly ruin your life?
> 
> Savvy?



We risk health every day. Maybe you should start an anti driving thread, you know you can die doing this as well.

Risk going to jail? Yeah, thanks to people like you. You're saying that something is wrong because it sends people to jail, which is basically a logical fallacy. Maybe  you like to bend over to senseless authority, but that's not how I want to live my life.

You don't have to spend money to do drugs either.
You don't become a drug addict from psychedelics. 

People who like to climb mountains get killed, divers drown, eaters get fat and die of a heart attack. People like to live their lives a certain way, and some psychonaut does just that. Now unless you go from person to person, warning them how they could die, I don't see why you're doing this here.

Savvy?






> Flawed analogy. In the case of lsd vs. meditation, the two accomplish the same task. In the case of Christianity vs. Buddhism, they are two totally different beliefs that say different thing.
> 
> Another flawed analogy, for the same reasons as before. Two opposites, once producing a positive result, the other producing a negative.



I don't know why you keep seeing analogies everywhere. Maybe you just like to tell people how flawed their analogies are or something. That was not an analogy, I was going off on a tangent, trying to explain the same thing as I did above. You've made up your perfect life model. Now everybody has to do things as you do them; or else they are lunatics. If somebody wants to do LSD, let him. If he want's to meditate, fine...get it?






> I said nothing about it discrediting the hallucinations you experience with LSD. I was only making the point, why choose lsd when there is a much safer, and better alternative?



Again. You have your perfect life model. If somebody wants to do LSD, let them, you'll never see things his way and neither will he see it your way. I mean, why would you choose Christianity, where there is a better alternative? This is what you keep asking, and now you can perhaps see how it sounds.






> Scroll through my posts dude. You'll see that I have much more to say about LSD/drugs in general then that. I've discussed how unhealthy it is, how useless it is, and on top of it being illegal, it is a bad idea.
> 
> I never said "Stop taking LSD you guys! It's bad!" in any such form or fashion. I'm not forcing anything on you guys either. I'm only giving my opinion, as you are giving yours.



Well we've told you how healthy drugs can be, how useful they are, and how stupid it is that they are illegal.






> Just because something gives you pleasant memories doesn't justify it. I'm sure that I would have pleasant memories of how fun the roller coaster was before I fell off. Not a great analogy of course, but you get the point.



Meditation is also just pleasant memories. And also it is useless. You could've done something useful in that time, like help the less fortunate or something. How does anything justify meditation? 

Justify is a subjective concept. To some extremist 9/11 is justifiable. Now I'm not a Muslim extremist, but I can see why it would be. I'm not a member of some tribe in the Peruvian jungle, but I can understand why their culture revolves around a psychedelic drug. I can also understand your justifications. But since we share these laws, in the light of the potential positive effects of a drug and the negative effects of persecution, I favour legalization.






> I don't. They disobeyed a perfectly reasonable law. You can live without LSD. Heck, you can live quit comfortably without it. It was their choice. They didn't have to go to jail.



As I said above, these might be your values. Live this way, follow this law, do what I say... But I am sorry. As I said, stupid laws shouldn't be followed. It was perfectly reasonable to execute Jews in Nazi Germany too, so it's easy to see why laws shouldn't be taken as absolutes. Unless you support totalitarian systems.

You can live comfortably without it? You might not need to smoke weed when you feel like it. But the research on cancer cures might just be something useful, don't you think? I like to feel like I own my body. Including what I ingest, if it doesn't influence others. If I want to smoke or use a drug, then it's none of "your" business. So no, illegality makes no sense. Unless countries also own the people, instead of it being the other way around.





> If you want to kill your brain with drugs, get out of America. No one's forcing you to do anything. It's not like you don't have a choice in the matter. If your going to play the game, you have to play by the rules. And if you get caught breaking the rules, there will be a penalty, and that's your fault.



The only problem is that the country should belong to the people. Not to some dictator who happens to share your opinion on the matter.

----------


## DeeryTheDeer

> But I never claimed that they were more than that. Nor are dreams dangerous in any way. I never said dreams were life changing or spiritually enlightening. They won't put me in any danger, so they are two different things really.



LSD may have a few risks, but I wouldn't necessarily call it dangerous. It's certainly never killed anyone, just by its own direct causes.

----------


## Serith

I have a question for those of you who have done psychadelics.  What have you learned from the experience?  I've heard some fascinating responses to that question elsewhere, but I'm curious as to what DV members in particular have learned.

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## Kuhnada29

Well I've learned something from weed..that's the only psychedelic I've done. 

I've learned...just be yourself....be happy. Weed reveals your true self to you. If you hit the cheeba, and your scared or paranoid...that's how you are sober...unconsciously. 

I hang out, and just am so happy and positive, that people look at me like I'm coked up or something.

Sometimes when I drink with my neighbor, I act like my inner child completely, hype and energized and shit, he probably thinks I do coke or something when I don't. I just be myself, and release all of the fear. 

This really has to be experienced, It can't be put into words...like you really feel a high when you release the fear and be yourself and be happy.

Weed took me down low.....then took me ALL the way HIGH.

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## Noogah

> But you're just a pathetic frustrated anti-social forum-troll.



Are you kidding!? YOU may be having a bad time here, but I'm rather enjoying this debate. It's like taking your brain on a walk. 

No one invited you. Ignore me if you wish. Go right ahead. That's your right.





> Noogah is 11



*13





> If you wanted to understand it you'd read it.



Are my facts about the articles incorrect?





> We risk health every day. Maybe you should start an anti driving thread, you know you can die doing this as well.



Driving is a means of transportation. It does something useful. It is vital to to our way of life.





> Risk going to jail? Yeah, thanks to people like you.



Do you know why LSD was abolished in the first place? And "just because" is not an adeuqate answer. It wasn't just banned to be mean, there were reasons for it. GOOD reasons. You might look them some day.





> You don't have to spend money to do drugs either.



No, drugs just sprout inside of your pockets.





> You don't become a drug addict from psychedelics.



Apparently I don't know the difference, but I'll take your word for it.





> People who like to climb mountains get killed



People start mountain climbing healthy. It is not until they fall that they get hurt. Now with LSD, it's inevitable. Your not hiking up a mountain, your jumping from a ledge. There WILL be negative effects to a degree. You will be mentally impaired. When you take it, you basically put your health in the hands of the drug.




> eaters get fat and die of a heart attack.



They have bad diets. Also, do you see any alternative to eating?





> People like to live their lives a certain way, and some psychonaut does just that.



I hardly consider entoxicating your mind to be a way of life. It's an activity, not a style that is consistently reflected in your daily affairs.





> Now unless you go from person to person, warning them how they could die, I don't see why you're doing this here.



Life is life. Life has risks. No need to induce more risks by taking a useless drug.





> You've made up your perfect life model.



I hardly consider myself as having a perfect life model. I disagree with drugs. That's a life model?





> If somebody wants to do LSD, let him.



Well I'm not stopping you am I? I'm only debating as to wether or not it bears any practical use.





> Well we've told you how healthy drugs can be, how useful they are, and how stupid it is that they are illegal.



Right. And the whole reason I'm here is because to me your reasoning seems illogical, and I'm debating it. You're here for the same purpose, or so I presume.





> Meditation is also just pleasant memories. And also it is useless.



...and it also takes no toll on your body.





> It was perfectly reasonable to execute Jews in Nazi Germany too, so it's easy to see why laws shouldn't be taken as absolutes.



No, it wasn't. Here you go again on some weird rant. Are you comparing the murdering of Jews to the abolishment of drugs???





> But the research on cancer cures might just be something useful, don't you think?



Do you have cancer?

As I've said before. You don't take cough medicine when you have no cough. And when you do, you only take enough to cure it.

Your purpose for using LSD is for the hallucinations it gives you, or "enlightenment", or whatever. Not because you have cancer.





> The only problem is that the country should belong to the people.



The country does belong to the people, and the abolishment of drugs was the people's decision.




> Not to some dictator who happens to share your opinion on the matter.



What dictator? America has no dictator.

----------


## Bonsay

I'm going to stop this because you're just "quote mining". The important parts of my post go unnoticed, while you take the pleasure to chop it all up and respond to these small trivial parts, then be sarcastic about it. I don't know why I'm even trying.

----------


## Beyond Reality

Hey my internet's been down all weekend so I'm a bit behind on replies, but I'm getting caught up with the convo today.  :smiley: 





> Dude, I get that. That is not "inspiring", it's concentration. You can achieve the same results by simply sitting down in a quiet corner, and sorting through your mind.



As I had previously stated: Meditation is also an excellent way to bring forth your inner voice... I don't deny. And if you are acknowledging meditation as an aid in your search for inner peace and a "void filler" than you also are proving my argument about LSD and psychedelic mushrooms. IT IS PRACTICALLY THE SAME AS A DEEP TRANCE INDUCED BY MEDITATION, in a sense.





> And a chemical cannot fill that void. I know what you're talking about. Every testimony of someone who became a Christian talks about it. A terrible void in their heart. In fact, I've heard of many who actually resorted to drugs to fill that void, but it never lasted. And they just needed more and more. When they became a Christian, God didn't "run out" He was always there for them in trouble, and in need. EVen when things were going right, and I can testify to that.



Religion can be a "void filler". I view psychedelics as a "type" of religion. All religion actually does is help you find peace with your inner being. (Same thing that LSD does "ironically"). Whether its a substance or a God, it makes no difference.





> What happens when you run out of lsd? There goes your "enlightenment". You have to get more. But then, what happens when your stuck in jail with none? When you can't have anymore? Will you sit in a corner and be depressed?



A person could be totally enlightened and freed from depression in as little as one trip. It's as simple as that. It's not a chemically addicting substance. So, technically, your entire life could make a 180 in an eight hour period and  you'll never be the same again...





> It's a physical effect!!! Don't you get it!? You can't cure lifes problems by constantly entoxicating your mind with chemicals. It can make you feel great, but what good is that? It doesn't solve anything, it doesn't improve your mind or body. It only gives you a few peaceful moments, and wild hallucinations.



I understand it's a physical effect, thank you for making that so clear. But the result of that physical effect, is in fact, a very spiritual effect. You could only possibly know what I'm talking about by experiencing it yourself, but I also think I have giving enough information, as well as others, to give you a good idea. If you weren't so closed minded you might be willing to except the new idea, not blindly reject it. The way our minds work while we sleep... would you consider that a physical effect on our body? Or can it be spiritual? I have heard "christians" tell me about "visions and prophecies" that came to them through dreams. In times like this the physical and sub-real can cross over. Or at least that's my belief.  :tongue2: 

...Before Columbus, the world was believed to be flat...[/QUOTE]

----------


## Kuhnada29

> I'm only debating as to whether or not it bears any practical use.



how the fuck do you know what's it's practical uses are if you've never even done it lol. 

That's like telling me riding a bike isn't fun, when I KNOW it is. Your on a slow boat going nowhere fast man.

No one has ever died from any psychedelic by itself...ever. Anyone who says other-wise is lying there ass off. 

You claim psychedelics aren't spiritual. but yet you "believe" in a spirit world?....LOL. 





> But you're just a pathetic frustrated anti-social forum-troll.



LOL +10

----------


## Supernova

Ah, I see the issue now.  Noogah doesnalt understand the idea of a psychadelic experience.  He equates it to any other drug like coke, heroin, anything that just gives you a temporary high and then it's over.  He doesn't understand that with psychadelics, it's not so much the experience itself as what you gain from it.

----------


## Beyond Reality

> Ah, I see the issue now.  Noogah doesnalt understand the idea of a psychadelic experience.  He equates it to any other drug like coke, heroin, anything that just gives you a temporary high and then it's over.  He doesn't understand that with psychadelics, it's not so much the experience itself as what you gain from it.



My friend I totally agree. 

Unlike drugs like amphetamines, cocaine, and barbiturates, psychedelics are non addictive and totally different in nature. Most of the people on this blog I would say do NOT take hallucinogens for the high, but instead for the deep understanding and pleasure of an open mind/ closed body.

Our other friend Noogah can't understand that.

My guess is he has been brought up and taught by unlearned and suppressed all out drug haters. (That's a bad thing, you know.) He has a general outlook on all drugs as being "bad for you you".

I'm not worried at all about what Noogah thinks. I don't care if he doesn't like psychedelics, or if he doesn't have enough information on them to make a non ignorant accusation that EVERY hallucinogen is bad. What I'm worried about is the misleading information he gives off to persons potentially looking for this kind of thing (psychedelics) in their life. If I was a newbie to LSD/ Psilocybe mushrooms, and I was looking for information on them, reading Noogah's posts about how they are all "bad" would probably be a major turn off. That's wrong.

Cheers.

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## Beyond Reality

> And how does this discredit my point that the effects of LSD are only temporary?







> As temporary as World War 2.



Excellent.

----------


## Noogah

> I'm going to stop this because you're just "quote mining". The important parts of my post go unnoticed, while you take the pleasure to chop it all up and respond to these small trivial parts, then be sarcastic about it. I don't know why I'm even trying.



I quoted everything that you said that was relevant! I didn't leave out anything that I didn't find relevant!

What do you wish me to do? Study your entire post and respond word for word?

Fine. I was actually just logging in to tell you that I'm finished with this debate too.

I mean, I think there comes a time that one must agree to disagree. No one is getting anywhere, and it's quite obvious that this helping very little except to make each page of this thread longer, and more heated.





> Noogah doesnalt understand the idea of a psychadelic experience.



Maybe I doesnalt, or maybe I doalt. Apparently I knew enough to debate.

----------


## Aumanawa

> I have a question for those of you who have done psychadelics.  What have you learned from the experience?  I've heard some fascinating responses to that question elsewhere, but I'm curious as to what DV members in particular have learned.



i'm going to respond to you in particular as you seem to be interested in genuinely exploring this subject with an open mind...so interesting to see how varied people's experiences are....i no longer do acid or any drugs for that matter, but when i did, i probably did acid a over a hundred times and mushrooms maybe half that many times...and ketamine once...one time i did lsd everyday, several times a day for a week...and i found that one builds a tolerance for it very quickly...after the second day i could pretty much do any amount...i mean a dozen or more hits and it all seemed about the same...and after three days or so...didn't feel very high at all...in my experience, lsd was much cleaner and more enlightening than mushrooms...but that was in the early 70's and i knew a guy who made it himself and gave it away...that kind of stuff isn't available anymore as far as i can tell...most of the heart racing and such is most likely a result of the speed it's cut with...i feel that it has the ability, (for some people) to completely transform your life for the better...even in a single experience....i would add, that some people should never do it...as an artist i found that it opened up new doors to creativity and gave me a fuller understanding of how the medium i was using (oilpaint) could be used, and expanded my awareness of the possibilities exponentially...i feel i gained years or growth as an artist from what i learned while painting under the influence...in the realm of personal growth, my own opinion is that it is better to take a fairly large dose in a controlled setting with people you trust than to take a small dose...taking smaller doses is a way of trying to hold on to your current reality and that isn't the point....in fact, trying to hold on to anything is a great way to trigger a bad trip...letting go into the experience is a far better strategy....what i learned from it spiritually is too internal and personal to my own life too attempt to convey it with words...and i find that people who try to explain their experiences usually come off sounding abstract and dreamy...the experience for me was anything but dreamy, but like was said, trying to explain the experience is like trying to describe colors to a person born blind...also, unlike many here, i found mushrooms to actually be kind of ego-producing...it sort of made me feel a bit self-important...i've talked to others who said the same thing about them...never found that to be true with acid...i think that the govt position on lsd is tragic...i saw one acid trip and a moody blues concert turn a shit-kicking redneck into a repentant loving compassionate person...one trip and he was changed forever...and i also think that trying to explain any of this to someone who has no experience with it is pure folly....

----------


## ragincajun2288

A trip can totally send you back to small things in your subconscious from your childhood that bothered you and can help you mend them.

I had a problem with impatience and sudden flares of rage for a long time.
While I was tripping I evaluated those flaws in my persona. And when I saw the seconds within seconds in space and time and realized the futility of my anger and impatience I was able to cope much better with every day situations.

It did change me for the better. That fact can not be debated.

And that's great to hear Barry.

----------


## SKA

Yeah Entheogens give objective insight into the self and that's why it's so therapuitically valuable. It moves people to understand and see into the causes and cores of their own problems. Only then can these "wounds" be healed.

----------


## wakefulsleeper

Hi everyone I thought I would share SWIM's experience with LSD in order to help clarify its' actual effects from a (hopefully) unbiased perspective. SWIM is strong minded and happy with himself as a person and his goals in life. SWIM has taken LSD twice and has smoked cannabis off and on for years as well as salvia on occasion. He has also taken other pharms incidentally but has come to the conclusion that they are unsafe and really only smokes (cannabis) and sometimes drinks due to the addictive and dangerous effects other drugs have. SWIM always fully researches the chemical and anecdotal information about a substance fully before he ingests it into his person. 
After a LONG time of believing psychedelics were something he could handle mentally and that they would not harm him if taken correctly a situation arose for him to take some doses from a previously "tested" (already taken by a highly experienced friend) in a safe environment. The first time SWIM ate one tab (tiny piece of paper with LSD on it). He was slightly nervous due to its reputation as a dangerous hard drug despite all he has read. Surprising, he felt sober mentally but if he saw something out the corner of his eye, glanced at something quickly, or let his eyes rest (like those hidden image puzzles) he would hallucinate (your creative brain filling in the empty spaces?) 
SWIM saw beautiful neon pulsing color changing geometrical patterns and images. He saw stucco ceilings change into alphabetical letters/snakes/etc moving around as if they were in lanes of traffic (starting stopping moving). He saw amazing beautiful colors and vivid visuals whenever he looked at light and "tried" to trip. The stitching in his pants flowed like water, as did grains on wood. SWIM looked at the stars and saw indescribably (or descriptions don't do the experience justice) amazing things. 
SWIM felt like a little kid seeing the world for the first time. It was as if everything was the same but more detailed, active, alive, and significant. Whenever SWIM closed his eyes he saw insane visuals, which could either be colorful patterns flying through tunnels of intense light or just vivid images that ranged from awesome to terrifying. Music was incredible and helped bring on visuals that happened in accordance to the music (as if it was a light show to the music). Food was especially delicious (despite the fact it took eons to eat haha).
SWIM watched the sunrise and watched clouds transform into complex alien like structures or ships. The colors were unbelievably vivid and beautiful. Eventually SWIM got to a point where he could control his hallucinations (through focus and thought and only to some extent and with the aid of natural light (sunrise)). SWIM transformed a forest into the richest, deepest red SWIM had ever seen. It blew his mind (it was as if it was a new color red, it was almost wet with color). SWIM focused on blue and changing everything blue and eventually his entire vision was colored a shade of white or blue (mega intense disconnect with reality that he had to eventually break off). 
As SWIM left the vantagepoint he briefly looked back to see an enormous cartoon cobra commander saluting him on the wall. (With a feeling as if he was congratulating him for accomplishing all SWIM had set forward to accomplish (visually) with his trip. It was however not all fun and happy. There were a few unwelcome or scary hallucinations that were experienced but he did not let them dominate his trip and therefore were fleeting (funny what a positive attitude and some cannabis can do haha). 
Some of these unpleasant hallucinations consisted of closed eye visuals of demon faced people. (Sharp teeth and scary eyes can’t really describe it but they were very unappealing to look at) A pile of gore on the ground that when SWIM asked about them to his friend turned out to be leaves, hearing other people talking in the shower stall next to SWIM when SWIM knew quite well I was alone. These merely bothered SWIM because they were visually unappealing/strange because SWIM knew they weren’t real. They didn’t distress SWIM too much however and SWIM knew the whole time when SWIM was hallucinating or not.
Later on SWIM decided to take a larger dose of the same stock. This time SWIM took two of the same blotters. This trip was similar in the beginning but faaaaar more intense. At the peak he was nearly fully disconnected with the real world (this time not through mental means (meditation? Sort of?) But purely chemical means and only saw a small interpretation of it. He was in a room with his friends and at times thought the house was tethered to the ground and was floating around. 
The geometrical patterns and colors rushed at him sooo powerfully from the window he was looking out of that he couldn’t even speak and when spoken to responded harshly because it was all SWIM could do to just take it all in. People around him started to play a violent video game (Nazi Zombies COD) and he asked one of his good friends to help him out of the situation (SWIM wasn’t sure if he would be able to walk next door safely by himself!). SWIM looked at the carpet and heads would emerge in geometrical ways out of the carpet. Reminiscent of Mummy Returns’ head coming out of sand.
The room SWIM moved to was covered in drawings on the walls (real ones haha). They all came alive in their own way. There were clouds of smoke on the walls and they would bubble up the wall as if they were really clouds of smoke. A sketched out drawing would UN-draw itself from super detailed finished piece to less and less detailed to nothing. A picture of a DJ booth boomboxes would pump as if they were actually playing, records spun etc. In general it was similar but just far more intense visually. This time when SWIM listened to music the lyrics if they weren’t cryptic enough or non-existent would be taken literally into SWIM's mind. (Ex. Where’d all the good people go? -Jack Johnson SWIM would feel as if it was his thought or as if it applied exactly to this situation as if SWIM was wondering where all the good people went. This doesn’t really capture it well but I hope it makes some sense)
SWIM also felt as if he could tell what his friend who also was tripping was feeling by looking at her. As if they had some nonverbal communication that let SWIM know how she felt. SWIM felt that he had to take care of her because she was with all of his friends (and one dick who really fucking creeped her out haha) and also she was on the same dosage he was haha. It was sort of stressful in a way because SWIM felt SWIM had the responsibility to protect her and SWIM was in a very difficult state to do so in. She is a good friend of SWIM and SWIM did the best he could to make her feel comfortable and she responded very well (especially for being in a foreign environment/with strangers). 
After the peak it continued off in a stronger way as the same one but also with some mental changes as I have described. SWIM played guitar, hung out with friends, smoked sour diesel (which by the by brought him back into full out tripping face every time he smoked again (like literally would see patterns and colors in the smoke as SWIM exhaled (smoke in general was awesome to look at during both experiences and caused SWIM to smoke way too many cigs)), and generally just enjoyed visuals until everyone went to sleep. While by himself SWIM could not fall asleep. 
He was still tripping 10 hours after dosage and again was exhausted and just wanted to sleep. SWIM had no music with him (SWIM craved music the whole time as it felt so good/right). SWIM looked at the microfiber blanket he had on him and saw a super miniature Spartan battle rage on a 2d plane (by that I just mean one at a time like a side scrolling video game all in the color of the blanket) of the edge of the blanket. At this point, there were no stimuli to distract SWIM. He began to get lost in his own thoughts. He wished there was someone with him but didn’t want to bother his friends because it was late and they were all very drunk/high in a coma of rest. 
This was at the same time the worst and best part of the trip. SWIM had considered himself to be totally mentally prepared and mentally tough enough for the trip. Suddenly thoughts came to mind of an old love interest, which had ended very poorly months before. He had just cut of communication with her and never really gotten closure. SWIM thought he was over her but it all came rushing back in. SWIM was forced to face many psychological issues that night that he had not even consciously recognized he had. 
The next morning he felt reborn. He had removed all of the unconscious pain and stress that he had been carrying around without even recognizing it. It was however very intense and SWIM has yet to take it again. SWIM however, plans to take it again when the time is right (both setting and SWIM’s personal mental (spiritual?) preparedness.
 In small doses LSD can be a great way to gain new experiences which would never be possible Imo without its’ (or some other) aid. (Both times SWIM took LSD SWIM recognized its power and respected it for what it could do, SWIM went into it both times with the attitude that SWIM would see incredible things and that SWIM wanted to see them and that he accepted whatever it wanted to show him). In higher doses and possibly even in a smaller dose it can be an amazing psychological healing tool to reveal your unconscious to your conscious awareness.
SWIM is an atheist and remains one but after these experiences is a far more spiritual person. SWIM now recognizes that there is a lot that we don’t know about the world we live in and respects nature and the universe in that regard. After seeing the world in a totally new way SWIM realized fully how much he had yet to learn, see, hear, experience and that he needs to be more open then he previously was about our existence. Life is beautiful and he realized the mystery wasn’t something he was angry about not knowing but instead was a reason to never stop searching and a reason to find wonder in our world everyday.

----------


## wakefulsleeper

I realize how godamn long that post is but it kind of needed to be to get my point across. Keeping things on topic, that link is broken. What was the video called?

----------


## CanceledCzech

The documantary is no longer available ;_;

----------


## MrFantasy

Speaking of LSD a few days ago I dropped a tab and a half of some, waited about 2 hours, then smoked a few bowls and went to see the new Avatar movie in the Imax 3D. Some of you may say that this is an irresponsible use of such a powerful drug, and your argument may have merit, but let me say that this was the most visually spectacular, emotionally moving, and most beautifully intense movie experience I have ever had. I wept for joy. I would not recommend doing what I did, but I would highly recommend seeing the movie if you have any interest in the fantasy/science fiction genre. It also gave me (and I suppose may give many of you) some fabulous ideas for dreaming.

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## katielovestrees

Hmm. Just read this entire thread, now to see the documentary. Someone said the youtube links were broken so I searched the Nat Geo website and found this, I'm assuming that's it?: http://channel.nationalgeographic.co...ideos/07395_00

Gonna watch it one way or another. It seems very interesting, and I've done a lot of research on this kind of stuff (researching psychedelics in my spare time is kind of a hobby of mine  :smiley:  ), so I feel like I might have seen it before, but it's always nice to hear peoples' perspectives.

----------


## Awakening

I would really like to give it a try. But I have fear that it trigger a schizophrenia, and I heard it is most likely mixed with other drugs. Have to see the documentary yet.

----------


## nina

Don't bring SWIM onto this site...seriously. Man up.

MrFantasy...I thought about going to see Avatar on lsdxm. But I didn't have a ride to the theater.  :tongue2:  Maybe soon though, I still haven't seen it yet but I hear it's awesome.

Also I've realized this combination is two words. Fucking Beautiful. No less.

----------


## SKA

> Don't bring SWIM onto this site...seriously. Man up.
> 
> MrFantasy...I thought about going to see Avatar on lsdxm. But I didn't have a ride to the theater.  Maybe soon though, I still haven't seen it yet but I hear it's awesome.
> 
> Also I've realized this combination is two words. Fucking Beautiful. No less.



 
lsdxm..haha nicely said. Suppose that'd be out of bodyísh and visionairy.
Never quite liked dxm myself though.

SWIM plans to do Yoga and Tai Chi on lsdmt.

LSD shouldn't be a tradegood. It should be produced by a group of knowledgable, ideological people that together share the production costs. A small bunch could be sold to close friends untill the production costs have been urned back. The remaining LSD should be stored and shared amongst the relatively small, responsible circle of people.

Acid production is quite complicated and also risky due to it being illegal.
If underground, good quality acid is to be produced properly and cautiously it would be best if it was run by a small company of people.
First there should be some people with a couple of acres of fertile land on which a significant amount of Rye-grain is to be  cultivated.
So a farm would be required. A shed on this farm would have to be transformed into a sterile terrarrium for the Cultivation of Ergot mushrooms and the collection of their spores. The collected spores are used to intentionally "infect" the kernels of the Rye grain. This will result in Ergot growths replacing the Rye kernels resembling black grain kernels. These will have to be collected in a barn, ground up into a powder, packaged for conservation and transported to a small lab for the final extraction & synthesis into Lyseric Acid Diethylamine.
So a lab, much more sophisticated than your average amateur-lab, is required too.

So it isn't easy, but if people owning a farm, people with some of the more advanced chemical knowledge, and some people with either money or the nececairy lab-equipment are united and put some effort into it, then it can be done.

And to remain undetected and safe from prosecution it would be best if this acid isn't widely distributed to the wider public, but kept within your small circle of the people responsible for the production + perhaps a couple of close, trustworthy friends just for personal use.

----------


## nina

> lsdxm..haha nicely said. Suppose that'd be out of bodyísh and visionairy.
> Never quite liked dxm myself though.
> 
> SWIM plans to do Yoga and Tai Chi on lsdmt.



Ok, I'm jealous.  :smiley:  
I've still never tried dmt.  :Sad:  Hopefully that will change soon though, I'm looking at getting some things to brew my own ayahuasca.

Have you ever tried dxm hbr powder? Or just OTC preparations? I won't lie...I'm a powder fairy. I love the stuff. However when I compare it to things like lsd/shrooms it seems very...hmm...mechanical. Like I'm just vibrating at a super high frequency. It's bizarre. Also it makes OBEs/WILDs extremely easy because you have full control over your body...so it's super easy to control the heartrate/fall into a trance/go into SP or HI/etc. But lsdxm is just breathtaking though.

----------


## katielovestrees

For those of you who have tried LSD or any psychedelic, I have a few questions, if you don't mind - any and all advice on this matter would be greatly appreciated (excepting those posts à la "dont do it drugz r badd" - aka Noogah, stay out of it) :

1. How did you come in contact with it?
2. Was it out of personal curiousity or did you have friends into psychedelics that were able to give you access?
3. How much did it cost you? ($USD, please.)
4. How would you recommend someone to obtain it?

I don't have any friends that are into psychedelics like I am, and though I've been researching in my spare time for the past couple years, I have yet to try them due to a lack of access and a lack of knowledge about obtaining access, though I know they aren't hard to get where I live. I'm sheepish about asking around because the few people I do know that are into drugs aren't people that I consider to be very trustworthy or knowledgeable. (So, logically, I come online to ask a bunch of complete strangers their opinions  :wink2:  )

I know that if I wanted to I could probably get shrooms pretty easily (I'd kind of hope to start with them, because they sound like the best to start with for me personally, from what I've read and heard from those who've taken them), but because I've never paid so much as a cent for even marijuana (always gotten it through friends who were nice enough to spare a couple hits - I'm a lightweight and don't smoke often, so my tolerance is pretty low which makes people more willing to share, plus I gladly splurge for munchies), I wouldn't know how to work with dealers and wouldn't want to risk getting screwed over. I'm not good with anything science-y so dosaging purposes and for the sake of having a trusty person to trip with and get me going in the process of "feeding my head" and such.

I guess what I'm really trying to ask here is how did you come up with the contacts you did, finding people that are interested enough in the stuff to actively pursue it? Because of the illegality of these drugs, I don't think it'd be the best idea in the world for me to go around asking everyone I know if they know how I can get hold of 'em, and because of my own personal trust issues I want to know how to best build up a relationship with a tripper/dealer. Any advice would be great.

Thanks in advance - and I will read and respond to your posts, I promise!

-Katie

----------


## nina

Real quick...I just want to mention that there should be no supplier or price discussion on the site. I don't think that's really what you're asking for Katie, but I just wanted to prevent any discussion from going that route.  :wink2:

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## katielovestrees

> Real quick...I just want to mention that there should be no supplier or price discussion on the site. I don't think that's really what you're asking for Katie, but I just wanted to prevent any discussion from going that route.



Haha no. I guess my question about price is generic, but if you'd like me to take it off I will.

----------


## nina

> Haha no. I guess my question about price is generic, but if you'd like me to take it off I will.



No worries...your questions were ok. Generic prices and such are ok...I've just seen this sort of discussion get into dangerous territory before and wanted to prevent that.  :wink2:  

As for LSD, I've usually gotten lucky and have had friends give me a bit...I really don't know how much people expect to pay for it normally though.

I've always known I was interested in drugs though. Ever since I first learned about them in the D.A.R.E program at school, lol. Ironic, isn't it? I would never suggest anyone do drugs before the age of 18 though, maybe 21. Especially for some drugs like lsd or dmt...I'm glad I wasn't introduced to them before my early 20s. They will seriously warp your mind and you really need to be prepared for it.

Also the best way of finding things is just to ask around, at least that's what I discovered. Even people that you would NEVER expect to do drugs have sometimes supplied me with things. Sort of funny.

----------


## katielovestrees

> No worries...your questions were ok. Generic prices and such are ok...I've just seen this sort of discussion get into dangerous territory before and wanted to prevent that.  
> 
> As for LSD, I've usually gotten lucky and have had friends give me a bit...I really don't know how much people expect to pay for it normally though.
> 
> I've always known I was interested in drugs though. Ever since I first learned about them in the D.A.R.E program at school, lol. Ironic, isn't it? I would never suggest anyone do drugs before the age of 18 though, maybe 21. Especially for some drugs like lsd or dmt...I'm glad I wasn't introduced to them before my early 20s. They will seriously warp your mind and you really need to be prepared for it.
> 
> Also the best way of finding things is just to ask around, at least that's what I discovered. Even people that you would NEVER expect to do drugs have sometimes supplied me with things. Sort of funny.



Haha, I'll keep that in mind. I'm thinking about asking a friend of mine who I know smokes a lot of pot...I feel like he might be into them and if he isn't he must know somebody.

And yeah, I didn't smoke pot for the first time until I was 17 and I'm glad for it because I think I would have made it a bad habit if I'd tried it earlier. I told myself I'd wait until I was older before I tried anything else, and so far I'm sticking to that decision...that's why I want to build up a relationship with someone who can help me with this, and not just jump into it on a whim. I can be patient, because I know that if I'm patient I'll be doing things in a way where I feel comfortable, and that will make the experience much more worthwhile.

----------


## MrFantasy

You should never pay more than $10 a hit, and as far as where to get it, you kinda just have to know somebody. However if you have absolutely no connections, you can always go to any major jamband show parking lot or festival where you will be bombarded by an abundance of LSD as well as a cornucopia of other drugs you probably never even heard of. However buying it from people you don't know is always risky of course, (not that I haven't done it) but there's always the possibility of bunk doses, i.e. fake LSD.

----------


## katielovestrees

> You should never pay more than $10 a hit, and as far as where to get it, you kinda just have to know somebody. However if you have absolutely no connections, you can always go to any major jamband show parking lot or festival where you will be bombarded by an abundance of LSD as well as a cornucopia of other drugs you probably never even heard of. However buying it from people you don't know is always risky of course, (not that I haven't done it) but there's always the possibility of bunk doses, i.e. fake LSD.



Thanks man. And yeah I imagine that would be the most likely result, I suppose I could have a daring friend try some and watch them first to know if it's real or not, etc. I don't mind if it's only like $10. For some reason I was thinking it'd be a lot more. 

Thanks  :smiley:

----------


## Vidule

I've found faults in Noogah's arguments, and faults in those who are against him. Usually something illogical or hypocritical. Perhaps neither parties are completely correct.


To each, their own. A simple debate with relatively-unknown persons won't decide your actions. Noogah won't take LSD, he is thinks only of the negative side effects. Everyone else won't stop because they know only the positive experiences.

please do not spam emoticons, thanks -nina

lols did someone actually complain about that, nina? Learn to prioritize your moderation efforts.

----------


## JamesLD

hey ska, what was the name of the documentary?

cause youtube took down all the videos :Sad:

----------


## handbanana808

> For me personally I have found it most useful in the area of creativity enhancement. I have noticed that since my 5th or 6th or 7th LSD trip, I have an overall greatly expanded appreciation for natural beauty. I find myself stopping to stare in awe at a beautiful wisp of cloud, or a tree, or even something as simple as the mark of old leaves left on the sidewalk that no one would ever think to look twice at. *I also have to say that my musical appreciation and tastes have grown exponentially since I started using LSD*.



amen to that brother..

----------


## Speesh

> Haha, I'll keep that in mind. I'm thinking about asking a friend of mine who I know smokes a lot of pot...I feel like he might be into them and if he isn't he must know somebody.
> 
> And yeah, I didn't smoke pot for the first time until I was 17 and I'm glad for it because I think I would have made it a bad habit if I'd tried it earlier. I told myself I'd wait until I was older before I tried anything else, and so far I'm sticking to that decision...that's why I want to build up a relationship with someone who can help me with this, and not just jump into it on a whim. I can be patient, because I know that if I'm patient I'll be doing things in a way where I feel comfortable, and that will make the experience much more worthwhile.



Good idea (the finding a friend part). In my experience its a great asset to have people tripping with you, or at the very least to have a sitter. Something about the social dynamic of being with others is a great way to get out of your head. When we're alone we tend to introspect, which can be cool but sometimes it gets really intense. If that happens its good to have someone there to bring you out of it. Also, it can be massively fun to interact  ::D: .

Also I suggest starting small. Small doses and big doses can create very different experiences, but going small first can give a pretty good idea of what its like. Also this tends to be very subjective from person to person. Some people say that an eighth ounce of mushies is standard, and yet I've had my mind blown by half an eighth. Every mind is different.

----------


## katielovestrees

> Good idea (the finding a friend part). In my experience its a great asset to have people tripping with you, or at the very least to have a sitter. Something about the social dynamic of being with others is a great way to get out of your head. When we're alone we tend to introspect, which can be cool but sometimes it gets really intense. If that happens its good to have someone there to bring you out of it. Also, it can be massively fun to interact .
> 
> Also I suggest starting small. Small doses and big doses can create very different experiences, but going small first can give a pretty good idea of what its like. Also this tends to be very subjective from person to person. Some people say that an eighth ounce of mushies is standard, and yet I've had my mind blown by half an eighth. Every mind is different.



Yeah. I've read too many stories about people in need of being calmed down or reminded that they're just tripping, and I've had a bad experience just from weed (although there were a lot of people there, it was the wrong kind of crowd, and the first time I was ever actually high, and very disoriented - no one really tried to help me and that caused a lot of problems) and definitely wouldn't want to repeat it with something more intense.

I appreciate your advice  :smiley:

----------


## SKA

LSD isn't without risk, but if you say LSD is dangerous you have an impaired sense of relativation and risk-assessment.

Alcohol has risks too. FAR greater risks infact. Yet I wouldn't call Alcohol dangerous.

*Irresponsible behaviour is dangerious*. Someone who will use Alcohol irresponsibly is at great risk. Same for irresponsible use of LSD and then yet the risk is infinitely lower than that of alcohol abuse. ALOT of people had a bad trip at least once, but only very fewcame out perma-fried and schizophrenic.

However Far too many people who use alcohol, abuse alcohol(due to it's habit forming and physically addictive qualities) and those that do are all alot less likely to come out of their binge drinking unscaved(Murder, traffic accidents, Acute Toxicity, long term liver and brain Damage, becomming anti-social, domestic violence..etc)

The cold hard facts and statistics don't lie.


Well here is another Youtube link of the same documentary:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3CbfMuR2YA

----------


## Elem3nt0

Hmm, i always heard that acid burns a hole in the back of your brain. i have a friend that did acid alot and now he is truly insane in my opinion.

Oh and the videos are removed.

----------


## JamesLD

> Hmm, i always heard that acid burns a hole in the back of your brain. i have a friend that did acid alot and now he is truly insane in my opinion.
> 
> Oh and the videos are removed.



if acid did burn a hole in the back of your brain, id probably be dead right now. what you heard was bull shit.

----------


## SKA

It's amazing how so unbelievably people have been brainwashed with these 50s and 60s Nixon lies and myths.

Common man can't you be bright enough to see that "Acid burns holes in your brains" and "Acid is stored in spinal fluid and when you crack your backbone you can go schizophrenic" are really far from realistic? Can't you hear the high Urban Myth-factor in it?

I can't see why so many "grown up" people still aren't bright enough to realise how rediculous and medieval those beliefs are.


And the crazy thing is the objective, scientific truth is right in front of their nose, bundled and presented by National Geographic, and scientific reports. The truth that shows LSD, as allmost all other psychedelics, does no bodily harm. And allthough the risk of mental disturbance is present, it is largely overestimated and has everything to do with the responsibility and intent of the psychonaught.

LSD, and similair working psychedelics, bring consciousness to one's subconscious mind and subconsciousness(dreams, visions, ESP) to one's conscious mind. It merges the conscious(The Knowledge) and the subconscious(The Intelligence;Intuition) thereby combining their abilities and capacities. This is how LSD can and so often does unlock people's hidden potential.



Some chose to ponder uppon the subconscious(intuition). Some meditate deeply uppon it. Some take Psychedelics to explore it. Some drum and dance into a trance to explore it.

These are all different roads to Rome and the truth is none of them is wrong.
Wrong is but a subjective perception. What is a Right way for one person to access their subconscious could be the Wrong way for another person to access their subconscious.

Please follow your own individual road and do not judge the paths of others. Assume they do what's right fo them and what works for them.

----------


## JamesLD

very well put SKA.

----------


## Bluemangroup

I would like to watch this but it is down.
if LSD is like what weed used to be like for me then I'm all for it
^ If that doesn't make sense I guess i'm trying to say that propaganda turned me away from this sweet herb but came to realize it is all lies.

----------


## Peel

I'd like to try LSD...

But I'm scared that I'll get something else posing as LSD, and screw myself over. Does anybody have any suggestions on how one can play it ultra-safe with knowing what they're taking? I've always figured I'd just try it when I found a source where I knew exactly where it came from. That may never happen though...

----------


## LRT

> this sweet herb



LSD isn't an herb, it's synthetically made!

----------


## jarrhead

> Really great Documentairy about LSD, because it's unbiased, scientific and complete.
> 
> This is great for washing away the lies and propaganda that the masses have been told about LSD.
> 
> It's a 5 part documentairy. Enjoy:
> Part 1:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06Zv7Hawvb0
> 
> Part 2:
> ...




No longer available for copyright..  :Sad:

----------


## katielovestrees

> LSD isn't an herb, it's synthetically made!



He was referring to weed.

----------


## SKA

Teeheeeheeeheehee! I just can't beieve how much commotion, positive as well as negative, people make about a molecule  :tongue2: 

Albert Hofmann created a molecule and the world is in turmoil about it.  ::D: 

Just another typical case of human development being inhibited and hindered by conservatism, fear and narrowmindedness.
Well let's hope the medieval folkoristic beliefs and politically uncompromising additude will melt and make way for science to continue investigating LSD's potential without hinder.

----------


## dajo

Bruce Eisner: Eleusinian & Neo-Eleusinian Mysteries: The History & Future of LSD 
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...6543714324469#

----------


## bushi

> No longer available for copyright..



You can find this available via torrent download.

----------


## Motumz

I'd like to try LSD and Ecstasy. I would just like to know more about it. I've made up my mind about Ecstasy and I'll try it.

But as for the LSD, I kind of think I'm to young to do it. **!!DO NOT FLAME ME, I COULD HAVE MY "FACTS" WRONG!!** I heard if you have a bad trip, it could scar you mentally and you could have breakdowns. Or, it stays in your system _(or spinal cord?)_ and it comes back randomly and give you an unexpected trip.

But uhhh, please correct me if I'm wrong. I'd love to know more about it! As for the video, I'll just pirate it haha.

----------


## Elem3nt0

Ok tel me why my friend who did acid a redicolous amount of times, is pretty much insane now?

----------


## jarrhead

> Ok tel me why my friend who did acid a  redicolous amount of times, is pretty much insane now?



Maybe this is why..?
vvvv





> if you have a bad trip, it could scar you mentally and you could have breakdowns. Or, it stays in your system _(or spinal cord?)_ and it comes back randomly and give you an unexpected trip.

----------


## Motumz

Maybe he has dementia now? Or schizophrenia? Maybe a bad trip he had induced one of those mental illnesses that were already set in to effect him in his later years.

But I dunno, just speculating. You aren't really supplying any info other than he did acid, and he is now _"pretty much insane"_.

----------


## Elem3nt0

Well i mean what else is there to say? He admits it himself that doing acid so many times has made him feel a bit crazy in the head.

----------


## Motumz

> Well i mean what else is there to say? He admits it himself that doing acid so many times has made him feel a bit crazy in the head.



So? That's his fault. No offense. You can abuse anything.. especially drugs. I'm not saying that's what he did, because for all I know he had a horrid trip. You should definitely ask him what he thinks went wrong, and what his regrets were. And.. what his positive feelings towards LSD are. He could give us some more insight on LSD.

*
Also, I read somewhere on here that there is 2 types of LSD. 1 type makes you hallucinate and trip. The 2nd type just gives you a greater understanding of things, and expands your knowledge with no risk of having a bad trip or anything.

Now maybe the hallucinogenic LSD type does what the 2nd type does as well.. not sure. But does anyone know? If so, I would like to try the 2nd type for sure.*

----------


## StonedApe

Where'd you hear that? I've gotten 2 types of acid before too, bunk and dynomite. From my experience the stuff that doesn't make you see much has been acid cut with speed.

----------


## Motumz

> Where'd you hear that? I've gotten 2 types of acid before too, bunk and dynomite. From my experience the stuff that doesn't make you see much has been acid cut with speed.



Ahh I see. And I'm not sure, it was just while I was on the internet somewhere.

But that's cool, maybe I can buy some good acid and cut it and take an adderall pill. Then I could get more experienced with 2 acid experiences. Then move on to heavier doses.

----------


## StonedApe

> Ahh I see. And I'm not sure, it was just while I was on the internet somewhere.
> 
> But that's cool, maybe I can buy some good acid and cut it and take an adderall pill. Then I could get more experienced with 2 acid experiences. Then move on to heavier doses.



I wouldn't recommend it. I was actually kind of joking. LSD that's been cut can suck. It gives you the jitters, but I guess if you like speed you might like it.

If you want a light trip take a light dose.

----------


## Elem3nt0

And Motumz. Dont ever think that ecstacy is any more safe than acid. People have died from one single pill of ectasy. Theres all kinds of chems and drugs in a x pill. None of this shit is to be taken lightly. This is some very serious shit.

----------


## JamesLD

> Theres all kinds of chems and drugs in a x pill. None of this shit is to be taken lightly. This is some very serious shit.



not if its a pure mdma pill. that shit is bomb.

----------


## Elem3nt0

> not if its a pure mdma pill. that shit is bomb.



Ive never heard of any x pill being pure anything.

----------


## velinxs

the purer the lsd the less visualistic it is in my opinion... that is unless you just take more of it. 

the most visuals i have ever gotten were from bunk acid which was like hell basically.. sick visuals though.

p.s. its impossible to cut lsd with speed.

and it is possibly to get pure E it's called MDMA or "Molly" usually in a capsule with powder but can be pressed.

you can test a pill by the taste of it, ofcourse you have to know what molly tastes like. it's generally less bitter/tang.

----------


## MrFantasy

Obviously taking a shit-load of LSD is not going to be good for you. Almost all of the arguments that people make for the illegalization of LSD stem from irresponsible idiots who don't know what they're doing and abuse it. I would say you should never take it more than 12 times a year at most. Taking it on a daily or even weekly basis is going to fry your brain.

----------


## velinxs

LSD is not biologically harmful.. can definitely have detrimental psychological effects. can have equally opposite positive effects though too.  use with caution  :smiley:

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## Motumz

Well I don't take full doses of speed either. I cut it up and only give myself what I need, and so it doesn't effect my sleep. I'm kind of a slow person when it comes to school, so I use it illegally.. but not recreationally, er.. not for fun anyways.

But yea, I'll just half it I guess? I want to start light and then build up ya know? Just to be safe.

----------


## Speesh

> Obviously taking a shit-load of LSD is not going to be good for you. Almost all of the arguments that people make for the illegalization of LSD stem from irresponsible idiots who don't know what they're doing and abuse it. I would say you should never take it more than 12 times a year at most. Taking it on a daily or even weekly basis is going to fry your brain.



Not every brain. LSD basically just overstimulates the brain temporarily. Some brains can take it, some can't. Jon Fishman (Phish's drummer, one of my favorite musicians) took it every day of his senior year in high school. He claims he got his best grades that year. Then again, I know someone who broke into schizophrenia after one use. Its always a gamble, but hey, so is driving a car.

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## JamesLD

> Ive never heard of any x pill being pure anything.



then you have obviously done little research on the drug, and have probably never taken it. the active chemical in ecstasy is MDMA. though yes a lot of the time it is cut with other drugs, sometimes even meth. but it is possible to get an x pill that is pure mdma. and mdma is actually one of the least harmful drugs out there

----------


## Elem3nt0

> then you have obviously done little research on the drug, and have probably never taken it. the active chemical in ecstasy is MDMA. though yes a lot of the time it is cut with other drugs, sometimes even meth. but it is possible to get an x pill that is pure mdma. and mdma is actually one of the least harmful drugs out there



Ive done it one time. it was extremely fun but the next two days i felt like absolute shit. I would be super hot, yet my skin would be extremely cold, things were just....weird. Like a really bad extended hangover. Ive been around it ALOT, i cant flat out tell you why, to protect myself, and for legal matters.

Every single one i have ever seen was always a mix of all different kinds of drugs, i would really like to know where to get some of this "MDMA"

----------


## JamesLD

> Ive done it one time. it was extremely fun but the next two days i felt like absolute shit. I would be super hot, yet my skin would be extremely cold, things were just....weird. Like a really bad extended hangover. Ive been around it ALOT, i cant flat out tell you why, to protect myself, and for legal matters.
> 
> Every single one i have ever seen was always a mix of all different kinds of drugs, i would really like to know where to get some of this "MDMA"



most x pills are at least one part mdma and are mixed with other drugs. the pure mdma stuff has a really clean roll or "high" and there isnt a bad come down , its really amazing stuff. i guess you just gotta know the right people to get it and a good way to check if the pill is pure mdma you can look it up on pillreports.com

----------


## Peel

> Ok tel me why my friend who did acid a redicolous amount of times, is pretty much insane now?



Perhaps he took something that was only passed off as acid but was really god knows what?


From what I understand, a lot of acid sold these days isn't real LSD 25. People say that they went crazy from acid, but who knows what they were REALLY on? Perhaps it was acid, perhaps not. If it were legal to sell in stores, we would probably know the real dangers, and my bet is a lot less people would say that they "went crazy after taking acid".

----------


## SKA

> Ok tel me why my friend who did acid a redicolous amount of times, is pretty much insane now?



Well most likely your friend either did it way too often. I myself take it every couple of months. Now I haven't taken it in more than a year. Some people take it 3 times a month or more which I would consider too much.

Also your friend could have been taking lsd doses way too high at once. I myself know that 1/2 a blotter is "half a trip". A gentle but defenite psychedelic touch to an otherwise sober, normal day. Ad 1 whole blotter provides 1 full blown, deep psychedelic experience. I only once took 1 and 1/2 blotter. I couldn't stop laughing and found it hard to stay focussed on my actions. I found this dose to be a bit dissociating; My mind was wandering away from my physical body. Taking more than that could possibly be troublesome. 

I prefer to stay aware and in control of my actions so allthough that experience was by no means troublesome, I prefer to keep my acid doses at maximally 1 hit.I've seen people take acid very irresponsibly; In messy, crowded, hectic enviroments, in much too high doses, in combination with cocaine, alcohol and/or speed. These people will eat and snort anything that passes along. They usually have serious issues which they refuse to face and resolve to begin with. I expect 70% of these people to be dead or in a psych ward before they're 40.

But I know many people that take LSD once a year or once every 6 months or so in a company of friends; 
Fellow students. And fellow scientists. Psychologists, Psychiatrists and Neurologists. Musicians and Painters.
Their LSD experiences yielded deeper understanding, deeper vision, less inhibited imagination which lead to new medicines, new ways of psychotherapy, study of the human psyche, magnificent stimulation of artistic inspiration for graphic art, literature, poetry, theatre and music, scientific and philosophical concept development. In simple words for these people, with this intent, LSD incredibly enhances our intelligence and intellect. By removing the barriers(Ego) between the Subconscious Intuition and the Conscious concrete knowledge, Intuition and knowledge are connected better and work together better.

So what that means is that what kind of an effect LSD has is completely decided by who takes it, in what dose/frequency and with what intent.

----------


## Motumz

I've heard of pure MDMA. But uhhh, the ecstasy I'm trying to find is only speed based.

But by the way, there is only 2 deaths a year by ecstasy. They probably just took WAY to much and their heart just stopped.

I'll find a good dealer, cut it in half. Take a half, if I in fact feel good and want more, I will take the other half. Simple as that.


Also, if I ever do find pure MDMA, I would probably combine it with a half of a speed pill to start things off haha.

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## SKA

MDMA is a Shulgin creation. LSD is a Hofmann creation.
Both these chemists used their own substances. They did it wisely. Carefully dosed, in the right envroment, with a pure and clear intent. Didn't use it very frequently.

Both whave lived their lives as very succesfull, happy and stable people. Hofmann died at age 107 recently. Happy and Sane. He's been known to take LSD with his friends and fellow scientists every year. It never hurt him in any way. Only helped him.

----------


## MrFantasy

Yah most ecstasy pills are little more than 10% actual MDMA and the rest is usually low grade speed and behavioral meds and god knows what. Molli is the street name for pure MDMA, which is the only form of it I would take or recommend taking. 

By the way I knew Fishman did a lot of acid but I didn't know every day. If that's true, kudos to him, but I still say tripping everyday is way too much. Sick drummer though. I think Trey said Fishman when he was asked who was the best musician he ever had the honor to play with.

----------


## I U

One of the very few drugs to cause effects in individuals egardless of consumption.

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## Motumz

> Yah most ecstasy pills are little more than 10% actual MDMA and the rest is usually low grade speed and behavioral meds and god knows what. Molli is the street name for pure MDMA, which is the only form of it I would take or recommend taking. 
> 
> By the way I knew Fishman did a lot of acid but I didn't know every day. If that's true, kudos to him, but I still say tripping everyday is way too much. Sick drummer though. I think Trey said Fishman when he was asked who was the best musician he ever had the honor to play with.



Wow 10%?...  ::?:  Fuck Ecstasy. I'll just keep looking till I find pure MDMA..

----------


## JamesLD

> By removing the barriers(Ego) between the Subconscious Intuition and the Conscious concrete knowledge, Intuition and knowledge are connected better and work together better.



I experienced ego death on a very high does trip of mushrooms. probably one of the greatest moments in my life. it totally changed my life and made me a better person, and has pretty much shaped the rest of my  life. ego death is not to be taken lightly though, it can be pretty intense, and if your not ready for it, it could be really bad.

my third eye was squeegeed clean! ::D:

----------


## velinxs

i had that similar experience after a month of doing acid 3 times a week taking 1 - 5 hits at a time... afterwards i did not know what to think and it was like i pushed a reset button.. now i am much more aware, more profound, more in tune ki wise, and above all happy without relying upon stimuli to promote happiness.  although for a while there i was very confused needed a lot of time to reorient.  I have no regrets about it but now if i trip i only take 1 - 3 hits of liquid though... which is about the same as 1/2 to 1 dose of good blotter acid.

----------


## Bluemangroup

I was looking around and stumbled on a thread on another website saying LSD is hard to come by because it is intense when it comes to legal matters, and also it is very difficult to create.  They made it seem like the Rolls Royce of drugs.

----------


## dajo

> Hofmann died at age 107 recently.



102





> One of the very few drugs to cause effects in individuals egardless of consumption.



"LSD is a psychedelic drug which occasionally cases psychotic behavior in people who have NOT taken it." 

hehe

----------


## Speesh

> Yah most ecstasy pills are little more than 10% actual MDMA and the rest is usually low grade speed and behavioral meds and god knows what. Molli is the street name for pure MDMA, which is the only form of it I would take or recommend taking. 
> 
> By the way I knew Fishman did a lot of acid but I didn't know every day. If that's true, kudos to him, but I still say tripping everyday is way too much. Sick drummer though. I think Trey said Fishman when he was asked who was the best musician he ever had the honor to play with.



Yeah he's unbelievable. He talks about it towards the end of this interview, pretty good read if you're interested. http://www.phisharchive.com/articles/1996/fishuk.html





> I was looking around and stumbled on a thread on another website saying LSD is hard to come by because it is intense when it comes to legal matters, and also it is very difficult to create. They made it seem like the Rolls Royce of drugs.



Yeah the government's really afraid of it. A friend of my roommate's got caught in New York City with 10 hits and got charged with, I shit you not, "conspiracy against the government". Luckily he had a decent lawyer and the judge took pity, but he still had to spend the next 8 months in jail. 

It can be hard to come by too. Its been around here for a while but now that I actually want some it seems to have all disappeared hehe. 





> "LSD is a psychedelic drug which occasionally cases psychotic behavior in people who have NOT taken it."



Haha nice one, I'm gonna have to use that  ::lol:: .

----------


## bushi

I'd wait until you're a bit older to start drugs.  At least 18, even though it's still bad for you because you're brain doesn't stop developing until like 22-24 or something.

If you try eccys you'll either not like it, or you might really like it and spend the next year or longer on it every weekend.

Def try E before acid.  Just get a feel for something less intense first.


Your friend is probably crazy in the head because he abused the fuck out of drugs.  Just like any drug if you take it enough, you're gonna be an airhead.

LSD is made up from house hold items including battery acid.  That could be why it's also known as acid and why it's so cheap for such a long trip.


My mate bought some magic mushy's from Nimbin a couple of weeks ago and I'm waiting for a good oppertunity to try them.  Can't wait for that!


But just be with people you trust when you take any drug, coz you could wig out on anything - you don't know how you will react if you haven't tried anything before.

----------


## JamesLD

> LSD is made up from house hold items including battery acid.  That could be why it's also known as acid and why it's so cheap for such a long trip.



COMPLETE BULL SHIT. How the hell did you even come up with that? Congratulations, you are a moron :Clap:

----------


## jarrhead

Battery Acid? That's meth.. Which also contains rat poison..

If LSD had battery acid you'd be seriously screwed up.

----------


## Odd_Nonposter

> LSD is made up from house hold items including battery acid. That could be why it's also known as acid and why it's so cheap for such a long trip.



LSD is known as "acid" because the chemical name is _Lysergic Acid Diethylamide._ Its synthesis is an extremely involved process that uses chemicals extracted from ergot and diethylamine.




> Battery Acid? That's meth.. Which also contains rat poison..



Please, before we start tossing around "drug A contains X poison," can we look up the actual synthesis route first? 


*Spoiler* for _Synthesis Route 1_: 







> Most methods of illicit production involve hydrogenation of the hydroxyl group on the ephedrine or pseudoephedrine molecule. The most common method for small-scale methamphetamine labs in the United States is primarily called the "Red, White, and Blue Process", which involves *red phosphorus*, *pseudoephedrine or ephedrine* (white), and blue *iodine* (which is technically a purple color in elemental form), from which hydroiodic acid is formed. In Australia, criminal groups have been known to substitute "red" phosphorus with either hypophosphorous acid or phosphorous acid.[61] This is a fairly dangerous process for amateur chemists, because phosphine gas, a side-product from in situ hydroiodic acid production, is extremely toxic to inhale.








The only reason it would contain "rat poison" would be to obtain Zinc phosphide for the phosphide ion, and there are better ways of doing that such as breaking off match heads or buying phosphoric acid itself from a welding supply shop. Most rat poisons today contain vitamin K antagonists such as Warfarin anyway.

Maybe the myth was started from the other common synthesis route, which utilizes lithium from lithium ion batteries and anhydrous ammonia. (Which, being a farmer, I know is incredibly difficult to handle safely.)


*Spoiler* for _Synthesis Route 2_: 







> Another common method uses the Birch reduction (also called the "Nagai method"),[62] in which metallic lithium, commonly extracted from non-rechargeable lithium batteries, is substituted for difficult-to-find metallic sodium. However, the Birch reduction is dangerous because the alkali metal and liquid anhydrous ammonia are both extremely reactive, and the temperature of liquid ammonia makes it susceptible to explosive boiling when reactants are added. Anhydrous ammonia and lithium or sodium (Birch reduction) may be surpassing hydroiodic acid (catalytic hydrogenation) as the most common method of manufacturing methamphetamine in the U.S. and possibly in Mexico.

----------


## WILDlife

Battery acid?...that cracked me up  :smiley: 

So have any of you folks tried DMT or Ayahausca?

----------


## velinxs

i've thought about doing DMT, but waiting for the right inspiration... when it's time to complete the spiritual revolution  :smiley: 

and while we are one the topic of methamphetamine.. note that i myself have done plenty of ecstasy, i wouldn't say abused considering i know people who ABUSE it. i like to take it once in a while, just a pill. but the full name of MDMA or ecstasy is 
MDMA (3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine)

is basically the cheapest way of making meth.  that being said it is VERY different from meth... just use responsibly if you are going to use it...  i know too many people who have holes in their brain, and i know a lot of people who actually grew from doing it.

----------


## bushi

Haha alright calm down mate!


This is what I was told years ago...  But maybe I was too fucked to understand what I was being told!

----------


## Motumz

> Battery acid?...that cracked me up 
> 
> So have any of you folks tried DMT or Ayahausca?



What exactly does Ayahausca do?

----------


## Peel

> What exactly does Ayahausca do?



It does what DMT does, except it lasts 3-4 hours(ish). The active ingredient is still DMT.

Ayahuasca is essentially DMT made orally active from combining it with an MAOI.

----------


## dajo

> i know too many people who have holes in their brain



Ah, that damn MTv Myth. 

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Does_ecsta..._in_your_brain
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/shul...brainholes.htm
http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/mdma...oxicity3.shtml

----------


## Motumz

> It does what DMT does, except it lasts 3-4 hours(ish). The active ingredient is still DMT.
> 
> Ayahuasca is essentially DMT made orally active from combining it with an MAOI.



Damn. So what exactly does someone who is smoking DMT look like? Are they asleep? Or are they seeing the hallucinations and their trip while awake?

----------


## JamesLD

> Damn. So what exactly does someone who is smoking DMT look like? Are they asleep? Or are they seeing the hallucinations and their trip while awake?



basically asleep, they pretty much go into a trance

----------


## Motumz

> basically asleep, they pretty much go into a trance



Daang, that just makes DMT look like an even more mysterious drug in my opinion..  ::shock::

----------


## JamesLD

> Daang, that just makes DMT look like an even more mysterious drug in my opinion..



oh definitely, its the craziest psychedelic known to man.

----------


## Motumz

> oh definitely, its the craziest psychedelic known to man.



And I'll have it in my possession in the next couple of weeks!  :smiley:  Apparently it will be around 100mg's. So that should be go for 2 - 3 trips. Hopefully I will smoke it right..

But also, I need to prepare myself. Would you have any techniques for doing so? Like meditation ect.

----------


## Odd_Nonposter

> And I'll have it in my possession in the next couple of weeks!  *Apparently it will be around 100mg's.* So that should be go for 2 - 3 trips. Hopefully I will smoke it right..
> 
> But also, I need to prepare myself. Would you have any techniques for doing so? Like meditation ect.



Do you mean milligrams (mg) or micrograms (µg)? 100 milligrams of LSD is a helluva lot of acid because most doses are literally a thousand times less than what you claim you'll get.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LSD#Dosage

----------


## tommo

I lol'd at the battery acid thing.





> The only reason it would contain "rat poison" would be to obtain Zinc phosphide for the phosphide ion, and there are better ways of doing that such as breaking off match heads or buying phosphoric acid itself from a welding supply shop.



Good post, but the only wrong thing is phosphorous is found in the striker on the matchbox not the match heads.  Unless you don't buy safety matches, and I'm not sure whether the non-safety matches are even available anymore.




> Do you mean milligrams (mg) or micrograms (µg)? 100 milligrams of LSD is a helluva lot of acid because most doses are literally a thousand times less than what you claim you'll get.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LSD#Dosage



I think he was talking about DMT.

BTW the links are dead.  I'm assuming this is the documentary Inside LSD?
Sorry I haven't read most of the thread.

----------


## Motumz

Yes, I was talking about DMT (crystals). Also, if anyone needs the video just message me. I uploaded it to a fast hoster if anyone else needs the video.

----------


## khh

The videos OP posted are down. Does anyone know somewhere else to see them? They looked interesting.

----------


## Motumz

*Part 1:*


```
http://hotfile.com/dl/18470981/dab4c0f/National.Geographic.Explorer.Inside.LSD.2009.WS.HDTV.XviD-OMiCRON.2ebe.DedicatedTV.net.part1.rar.html
```


*

Part 2:



```
http://hotfile.com/dl/18471295/7882694/National.Geographic.Explorer.Inside.LSD.2009.WS.HDTV.XviD-OMiCRON.2ebe.DedicatedTV.net.part2.rar.html
```


*
Enjoy!  ::D: !

----------


## dajo

It's kind of like this:

----------


## Motumz

> It's kind of like this:



I kind of see the LSD user sitting and leaning against the tree thinking, and then they should have another one where he is on shrooms and he is hugging the tree  ::D:

----------


## Xaqaria

Since the videos posted in the OP are down and the discussion as turned into a who's done what thread, I'm closing this.

Ska, (or anyone else) if you can find links to those videos, let me know and I'll fire it up again.

Edit: Motumz kindly informed me that he already posted new links to the vids so I put them in the OP; Thread Revived!

----------


## SKA

Oh yeahthey seem to get systematically deleted by corrupted Youtube due to Copywrite greed of National Geographic.

Allthough if you search youtube for "Inside LSD" you will find it there. All 5 parts. 'Cause as systematicly as youtube-folks are deleting it, other youtube members systematicly re-upload it.  ::D: 
Hoorray for the interweb.

----------


## katielovestrees

> Oh yeahthey seem to get systematically deleted by corrupted Youtube due to Copywrite greed of National Geographic.
> 
> Allthough if you search youtube for "Inside LSD" you will find it there. All 5 parts. 'Cause as systematicly as youtube-folks are deleting it, other youtube members systematicly re-upload it. 
> Hoorray for the interweb.



Orrrrrrr you can just go the National Geographic website and watch it on there.


*Spoiler* for _me whining (feel free to ignore this entirely as it is completely irrelevant_: 



which i'd like to say for the record i posted way before the person who got credit for posting links to it did, but i don't want to sound like a whiny bitch or whatever but i wanted to whine so i figured by putting spoiler tags around this. i guess it would just be nice to get a thank you or something. just needed to get that out.

----------


## Tarsier

just stopping in to make sure this thread isn't turning out to be one of those "psychedelic drugs are good for you" things.

remember that they cause brain damage and can give you psychosis and trigger schizophrenia. and a number of other mental problems which you don't want.

don't do drugs kay? they bad.  :smiley:

----------


## Motumz

> just stopping in to make sure this thread isn't turning out to be one of those "psychedelic drugs are good for you" things.
> 
> remember that they cause brain damage and can give you psychosis and trigger schizophrenia. and a number of other mental problems which you don't want.
> 
> don't do drugs kay? they bad.



Hahaha, okay mom!  ::roll::

----------


## tommo

> just stopping in to make sure this thread isn't turning out to be one of those "psychedelic drugs are good for you" things.
> 
> remember that they cause brain damage and can give you psychosis and trigger schizophrenia. and a number of other mental problems which you don't want.
> 
> don't do drugs kay? they bad.



SOURCE SOURCE SOURCE SOURCE?
Cause brain damage - LOL
Watch the fucking video.

----------


## Tarsier

what i said is the truth. you'll find it if you either research in the right places, or out of your own experience.

----------


## katielovestrees

> what i said is the truth. you'll find it if you either research in the right places, or out of your own experience.



That sounds more like encouraging than discouraging to me.

----------


## Speesh

> what i said is the truth. you'll find it if you either research in the right places, or out of your own experience.



Try looking at Neuroscience. The main effects of these drugs is simply stimulating the brain to the point where its creating much more seratonin and dopamine than usual. The actual drug is gone long before the effects, which are mostly natural. After such a dramatic change in chemistry the brain's likely to be slightly different than it was before, for better or worse (usually better in most experiences). But don't call that brain damage. Physiologically speaking a night of binge drinking does infinitely more damage. Alcohol destroys neurons, psychedelics rewire them.

Neurologically speaking those who are very experienced in meditation can cause nearly identical effects in the mind (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11958969). There have even been psychotic episodes recorded in people practicing meditation _who weren't educated about and mentally prepared for a change in consciousness_. Use responsibility, get educated, and practice moderation if you're concerned for your safety. 

Sure there's a risk factor of illness, but its a far smaller one than you'd think. There's a relatively similar risk factor of crashing every time you take the bus. Nobody's going to stop meditating or taking the bus though.

----------


## Motumz

> what i said is the truth. you'll find it if you either research in the right places, or out of your own experience.



LOLZ I SAID IT, IT MUST BE TRUE! I MAKE UP MAI OWN SOURCES!

Dude, you have brain damage and I bet you haven't even taken a single drug in your life..  ::roll::  I'm also guessing your 14 or under and is still in your mom's ass about "Drugs are bad for you for no reason, don't do em"..

I'm not really ganna argue cause I don't care, there is plenty of research. Now instead of telling us to do the research, how about YOU do it yourself. You'd be surprised how many drugs you *thought* could harm you can't.

----------


## Tarsier

"After such a dramatic change in chemistry the brain's likely to be slightly different than it was before, for better or worse (usually better in most experiences)."

that's brain damage.

----------


## Speesh

_"'Brain damage' is a term no longer used today and has been replaced in recent decades by 'brain injury' (BI); meaning the destruction or degeneration of brain cells, often with an implication that the loss is significant in terms of functioning or conscious experience."_

Destruction? Never.
Degeneration? Very rarely, if someone already has an underlying condition.

Also, I realize you're here with the best of intentions, but saying these things in a thread full of people who are interested in experimenting is only going to build a stigma that may cause someone to have a bad time. This isn't the time or the place for giving people doubts.

----------


## SKA

Steesh, don't even bother.
We've all been through it a 1000 of times; Explaining uninformed people that as good as all psychedelics are physicaly harmless, non-addictive and totally low risk substances.
Obviously it doesn't help. People tend to just hold on to their beliefs and let nothing change their minds. 
So let people believe what they choose to believe. I'm soooooo tired of explaining people the unbiased, scientificly proven truth to just see them reject it and try to shove their ignorant, false beliefs down my throat instead. I'm not even going to try anymore. I'm just going to keep my distance from such people.






> just stopping in to make sure this thread isn't turning out to be one of those "psychedelic drugs are good for you" things.
> 
> remember that they cause brain damage and can give you psychosis and trigger schizophrenia. and a number of other mental problems which you don't want.
> 
> don't do drugs kay? they bad.



Tarsier. I do not intend this to turn into a moral discussion on wether drugs are good or bad.
This is simply for people to learn the unbiased truth about LSD. Facts.

Saying "Drugs are bad" is a vague statement since both Cafeïne and Heroin are drugs. You cannot generalise all drugs and then label them "Good" or "Bad" all together.
Please don't scare people off with misinformation. I wasn't discussing the use of Heroin or Cocaine here.

LSD is a proven to be low risk, great potential substance. Totally risk-less? No. But very low risk indeed. With proven high potential as medicine, therapuitical aid, consciousness-exploratory tool and Creative enhancer.
Watch the documentairy. It will change your view on LSD and show you what it truely is.
Unless you wish to defie well-educated scientists with in depth knowledge of LSD.

----------


## Motumz

> "After such a dramatic change in chemistry the brain's likely to be slightly different than it was before, for better or worse (usually better in most experiences)."
> 
> that's brain damage.



Why are you telling us this? No one wants your opinion, it isn't even fact.

No one is going to listen to you. I'm taking acid in 3 weeks, your fail opinion has only made me want to try it more.

You aren't a prophet for the DEA, now shut up, leave the thread, and go back drinking your tea. No one cares about you, or your false statements about drugs. You know nothing other than "it causes brain damage"

Which is extremely vague. You listed no source. And ANYTHING can give you brain damage dumbass. Especially when abused.


We know our stuff. Now please leave.

I also think it's funny how you think you know better than, *Scientific Proven Data*, *Wiki*, *National Geographic*, and countless other sources. It's pathetic..  ::roll::

----------


## dajo

My 2 Cents: 

It is important that people, who do them, know what they're doing. And 
are mature and in a good place in their life, feel comfortable with themself. 
Psychedelics are a powerful tool, but if used irresponsibly, or too early, can 
really screw things up. Looking at the bigger picture, I think someone, who 
uses psychedelics should be thoughtful and respectful of them - because if 
he/she isn't, it distorts the public opinion, of what they're really all about. I 
think this is more damaging than all the anti-drug propaganda you can buy. 

And with a certain level of maturity, I also mean that a sixteen-year old should 
notice that it is better to wait a few years and be garanteed a life-enhancing 
experience, rather than risk psychological (not so much neurological) damage.

So in my opinion, everyone, who holds an interest in or uses psychedelics 
holds a responsibility to do so intelligently and to (if at all) reflect just that 
into the world - in our case the dreamviews forum.

----------


## Motumz

> My 2 Cents: 
> 
> It is important that people, who do them, know what they're doing. And 
> are mature and in a good place in their life, feel comfortable with themself. 
> Psychedelics are a powerful tool, but if used irresponsibly, or too early, can 
> really screw things up. Looking at the bigger picture, I think someone, who 
> uses psychedelics should be thoughtful and respectful of them - because if 
> he/she isn't, it distorts the public opinion, of what they're really all about. I 
> think this is more damaging than all the anti-drug propaganda you can buy. 
> ...



Hmm, so you think I should wait up on the LSD? It's weak, but still potent.

I've already done Salvia and Shrooms. And I'm doing DMT reguardless. It's too late, I already bought it  :Cheeky: 

What's y'alls opinion on me doing acid? Should I wait till my body and mind are fully developed? At like 19'ish and up?

----------


## dajo

I haven't done DMT, so I can't compare. 

You are the one that has to decide in the end, if it's the right time or not.
But I would generally say it is safer to wait, yes, maybe until you're 19ish.
Body and mind should be fully developed, you don't want to get in the way 
of that. But age depends on the individual. 

Considering that at yours (I read somewherer 16/17 if I remember 
correctly) you have already done shrooms and salvia and are in posession 
of dmt, as well as planning on doing acid in the next three weeks, it shows 
to me that you should take a step back. It is not a race to the top!

----------


## JamesLD

> Hmm, so you think I should wait up on the LSD? It's weak, but still potent.
> 
> I've already done Salvia and Shrooms. And I'm doing DMT reguardless. It's too late, I already bought it 
> 
> What's y'alls opinion on me doing acid? Should I wait till my body and mind are fully developed? At like 19'ish and up?



IMO, do acid before you do dmt. DMT is out of this world. acid is great you have nothing to worry about, and it will deffinetly help prepare you for the dmt trip.

BTW, how much did you get the dmt for?

----------


## SKA

> I haven't done DMT, so I can't compare. 
> 
> You are the one that has to decide in the end, if it's the right time or not.
> But I would generally say it is safer to wait, yes, maybe until you're 19ish.
> Body and mind should be fully developed, you don't want to get in the way 
> of that. But age depends on the individual. 
> 
> Considering that at yours (I read somewherer 16/17 if I remember 
> correctly) you have already done shrooms and salvia and are in posession 
> ...



Indeed. Psychedelics and haste do not mix.
However if you've done Salvia and Mushrooms and managed those experiences well, then a small dose of LSD really isn't that much of a step further if you know what I mean.

Just don't ever take LSD lightly. Never consume large doses for your first time. Of anything. Don't you take DMT lightly either. A sufficient dose of DMT makes LSD seem like a walk in the park ^^
I remember on the Drug forum reading a comparison between LSD and DMT I very much agree with. Someone said: "Where LSD is like riding a Bicycle, DMT is more like riding a Scudmisile into a black hole." Great description.

Allthough taking high doses of LSD or DMT for your first time might deliver an experience you find terrifying, I do reckon that taking really low doses of them are very unlikely to produce experiences so intense that you find them disturbing. Start with VERY low doses. So low they aren't even likely to be effective. And then VERY gradually increase the dose until a desirable effect is attained.

For good objective information about LSD and DMT(as well as allmost ANY drug known to man), unlike folkloric/urban myths, inquire www.erowid.org

----------


## Motumz

Well I was going to take very low doses of acid. I'm getting 2 hits. 1 should be enough to see visuals and maybe trip. But since I don't actually know the potency, I was going to take the first one and split it in 4ths. And take all 4 separately. Then, I will have a feel for how potent it is.

And as for the DMT, I can't really start with a low dose, because I only have enough for 1 blast off. I could maybe split it up into smoking 1/4. Then smoking the other 3/4's.

I can provide pictures next Wednesday. Maybe someone could eye it. But I'm also getting a scale this weekend, but I doubt it goes as low as how much the DMT will weigh.

----------


## JamesLD

> Well I was going to take very low doses of acid. I'm getting 2 hits. 1 should be enough to see visuals and maybe trip. But since I don't actually know the potency, I was going to take the first one and split it in 4ths. And take all 4 separately. Then, I will have a feel for how potent it is.
> 
> And as for the DMT, I can't really start with a low dose, because I only have enough for 1 blast off. I could maybe split it up into smoking 1/4. Then smoking the other 3/4's.
> 
> I can provide pictures next Wednesday. Maybe someone could eye it. But I'm also getting a scale this weekend, but I doubt it goes as low as how much the DMT will weigh.



every time ive taken 1 hit of acid its always been a really mild trip with little to no visuals, so id suggest since you dont know the potency of the acid, take one, see how it makes you feel and if you think you can handel more take the other one, and youll pretty much have the best time ever.

as for dmt, smoke it all at once and blast off. i think its a waste if you only do a little bit and dont breakthrough.

----------


## Motumz

> every time ive taken 1 hit of acid its always been a really mild trip with little to no visuals, so id suggest since you dont know the potency of the acid, take one, see how it makes you feel and if you think you can handel more take the other one, and youll pretty much have the best time ever.
> 
> as for dmt, smoke it all at once and blast off. i think its a waste if you only do a little bit and dont breakthrough.



That's what I was thinking. But I want to smoke it just right, so any tips? How did you smoke it with success?

I already have a lot of info on it, but I want your techniques..  :smiley: 


And you got no visuals with acid and just a mild trip? Eh, I kinda don't want to take it now. I just want visuals, and no trip. Even if I hallucinate hardcore. I'll trip later when I'm older I guess. I just want to experience visuals with a clear mindset, and not trippin'.

----------


## SKA

When we say "1 hit" of acid, we do mean 1 blotter tab don't we? Just wanna clear things up.

I've allways taken blotters, except for my first LSD trip when I took liquid mixed with water.

Speaking of blotter tabs: I've had various strength acid tabs, but most average acid takes only 1 tab to produce quite an intense, deep experience. If you take one and are not tripping your face off then it is obviously weak LSD.

But let's assume it is powerfull LSD; then 1 tab is 1 trip. Half a tab is still quite a trip, but alot less intense and alot more sober.

Never take more than 1 blotter tab at once. It may be a bummer to not trip as hard as you aimed for, or not at all, but it might just suck a whole lot more if you take too much.

----------


## Motumz

> When we say "1 hit" of acid, we do mean 1 blotter tab don't we? Just wanna clear things up.
> 
> I've allways taken blotters, except for my first LSD trip when I took liquid mixed with water.
> 
> Speaking of blotter tabs: I've had various strength acid tabs, but most average acid takes only 1 tab to produce quite an intense, deep experience. If you take one and are not tripping your face off then it is obviously weak LSD.
> 
> But let's assume it is powerfull LSD; then 1 tab is 1 trip. Half a tab is still quite a trip, but alot less intense and alot more sober.
> 
> Never take more than 1 blotter tab at once. It may be a bummer to not trip as hard as you aimed for, or not at all, but it might just suck a whole lot more if you take too much.



Well he said they were weak. So I might as well just take the whole thing. But I honestly don't know, so I guess I will just start out with a half, then take the other half if I feel I need it. But I heard that could be risky, because you could peak off the acid pretty much at anytime. So if a half were enough for me, than taking another half to soon wouldn't be smart.

But the only way to know is to just do it. I think I have made up my mind to take acid. I am sticking with low doses though. I might ramp it up once I get the feel for it, but that's about it. I just want visuals and hallucinations while feeling sober.

----------


## SKA

I once took "too much" acid.
I took 1 and a half blotter tab. It was very amusing. I started laughing uncontrolably. Joyfull hysteria, but a little too far out of control for my likings. It was a lowly intelligent, but enjoyable experience.

I had a ziplock baggy with about 3 more trips. I was in daze and then half way in the trip I FOUND myself eating another tab. Not even realising it at first. I put it away, yet a bit later I "caught" myself again with another tab in my hands. I was having a good time, but a bit on the irresponsible side. Afterwards I couldn't find the remaining tabs.

To the day of today I don't know wether I lost them or ate them all.
It was in a friend's house and it was all okay, but from that moment onwards I decided to stick with 1 hit of acid and no more.
I would be interrested in taking 2 tabs of acid one day, but I think I'll make sure there will be a sober guide.



Generally acid peaks within the first 2 hours after ingestion so if by then you aren´t tripping as hard as intended it is okay to take some more. About 1/4th hit more.

----------


## tommo

> IMO, do acid before you do dmt. DMT is out of this world. acid is great you have nothing to worry about, and it will deffinetly help prepare you for the dmt trip.
> 
> BTW, how much did you get the dmt for?



I don't know if I agree with this.  From what I have read, which is extensive, DMT is like nothing you will ever experience on any other drug.  The closest drug though is apparently shrooms.  But that's using close loosely.

So IMO I think it would be fine to try a small hit of DMT first just to get a feel for it's effects and then work up to a breakthrough.

I don't know why, but I see this contradiction all the time.  "DMT is like no other psychedelic"  "try acid first though".

Doesn't make much sense to me....

Also Motumz, do NOT. EVER. take the dealers word as gospel.  They are mostly scum.  "Weak" is objective, he could take acid everyday for all you know and therefore he thinks it is weak, whereas for a first timer it could be incredibly potent.  Or he could just be flat out lying.

Anyway, take care.  And remember, set, setting, dosage, sitter.

----------


## JamesLD

> I don't know why, but I see this contradiction all the time.  "DMT is like no other psychedelic"  "try acid first though".
> 
> Doesn't make much sense to me....



how does this not make sense? say a person has never taken psychedelic, and there interested in dmt, would you suggest they try dmt first?? thats a little crazy, thats why i would suggest trying other psychedelics first so you get an idea of what the psychedelic experience is like.

----------


## JamesLD

> That's what I was thinking. But I want to smoke it just right, so any tips? How did you smoke it with success?
> 
> I already have a lot of info on it, but I want your techniques.. 
> 
> 
> And you got no visuals with acid and just a mild trip? Eh, I kinda don't want to take it now. I just want visuals, and no trip. Even if I hallucinate hardcore. I'll trip later when I'm older I guess. I just want to experience visuals with a clear mindset, and not trippin'.



they say the best way to smoke dmt is to vaporize it using a crack/meth style pipe.

and im sorry but i am not aware of being able to take acid and get visuals and not trip, it goes hand in hand. Ska, you seem experienced, correct me if im wrong

----------


## tommo

Afaik having visuals is the trip.  How can you separate them? lol
Unless you mean no mind expansions etc, just pretty colours.  In which case I would take some Valium or something with it, I heard that pretty much keeps it just a fun thing with no mind expansion.  Although I wouldn't count on it.

Well why people might not want to take others first is because they last a lot longer and they could just as easily take a small hit of DMT to test the psychedelic arena.  Makes more sense to me.  And since acid is almost nothing like DMT, how would LSD prepare you for DMT?

----------


## SKA

Well having experienced quite alot of both high and low doses of both LSD and DMT
I can personally say that a low dose of DMT is nothing to even remotely fear.

The same can be said for low doses of LSD except the potency of LSD is alot harder to determine than the potency of DMT.

Even if you have relatively impure DMT(with alot of plant oils and fats still mixed through) a needle-pin volume(roughly translated in between 30 and 40 miligrams) of DMT is pretty much allways effective.(crossing the bottem line of peripheral effects)

A low dose of DMT is a very friendly, calm, meditative experience unlikely to be intense to even the most inexperienced psychonaught. It is VERY different from a high breakthrough dose of DMT; Which indeed IS much like riding a scudmisile into a black hole in terms of intensity.

----------


## Xaqaria

> I don't know why, but I see this contradiction all the time.  "DMT is like no other psychedelic"  "try acid first though".
> 
> Doesn't make much sense to me....



The experience you get from LSD is a good stepping stone to DMT, that's all. It's like this. Someone who has done nothing will not be able to even properly conceptualize what the DMT experience is. Someone who has taken LSD can at least imagine the experience even if the actual experience is not very similar to what they imagined. From what I know, I would suggest also becoming familiar with Salvia before experimenting with DMT.

----------


## SKA

I guess we agree Xaqaria.

My personal stepping stones (in chronological order)were:
Marijuana, Mushrooms (over abt. 15 experiences), 3 Hawaiian Baby WoodRose seeds(containing LSA), LSD( abt. 10 experiences) then DMT, then Ayahuasca.

What the psychedelics I did before I did DMT and Ayahuasca have taught me was a sort of "framework" in which to manage and interpret such experiences. Most valuable lessons were:

-Let whatever is, be. Don't resist. Don't seek to control the experience Ride it out. Accept everything; both negative and positive.
-Have faith in the healing & teaching nature of whatever it is you're ingesting. Otherwise you shouldn't be taking it.
- If negative thoughts, feelings, perceptions..etc arise, don't freak out. Remain calm and regard them as teachers and pay close attention.
- Detatch yourself from a 1st person perspective where it seems that everything is happening to "You". Instead see yourself in 3d person, like just another human being having just another human experience. This detatchment(from the ego) makes for a far calmer, clearer and observant perspective.

----------


## OuroborosEterna

Ahh, you've taken LSA.  That is the only psychedelic I've ever done.  The friends who gave it to me were incredibly irresponsible, and I was young and dumb.  I took 6 seeds at their suggestion...then a couple hours later, when I thought I couldn't feel it (even though I was actually starting to trip pretty hard), I asked if I could take some more.  They said sure, told me to take 2...and because I was already half gone, I decided to take 4.

It didn't help that the atmosphere was a beat up apartment inhabited by a schizophrenic psychopath obsessed with serial killers (and who fit the profile of one himself) and his clinically depressed boyfriend.  

Worst day/night of my entire life.  Caused some psychological damage, too.  I'm so glad I don't hang out with them anymore.  Never would have in the first place if they weren't "close" friends of my roommate at the time.

I don't blame the drug, though.  I'm sure if I had been responsible about it things would have gone much better.

----------


## SKA

Yeah the enviroment in which you undergo Entheogenesis is VERY influential.

I took ayahuasca with the Santo Daime members in their church. It was a really healing ritual. Their chanting gave me the courage to face and overcome the darkness/fear/anger I was meaning to rinse out of myself.

Had I done this in a cluttered squad-building full of smelly, confused, irresponsible people I don't even dare to think of how that might have affected me.

Instead, by taking Ayahuasca in ceremonial setting with strong, responsible and knowledgable people, it was a true blessing. I was truely able to take a HUGE burdain off of my shoulders, encouraged by so much love, strength and chanting.

----------


## OuroborosEterna

Something like that, I would love to experience.

Right now I'm avoiding entheogens because I want to attempt consciousness-expansion without them first (meditation, LDs, etc.)

But if I had an opportunity to attend/experience a ritual like that, I'd jump at it.

----------


## SKA

Well I don't know where you live, but Santo Daime has chruches worldwide. Maybe worth looking on Santo-Daime's site to see if there are any local churches.

----------


## tommo

> Well having experienced quite alot of both high and low doses of both LSD and DMT
> I can personally say that a low dose of DMT is nothing to even remotely fear.
> 
> The same can be said for low doses of LSD except the potency of LSD is alot harder to determine than the potency of DMT.
> 
> Even if you have relatively impure DMT(with alot of plant oils and fats still mixed through) a needle-pin volume(roughly translated in between 30 and 40 miligrams) of DMT is pretty much allways effective.(crossing the bottem line of peripheral effects)
> 
> A low dose of DMT is a very friendly, calm, meditative experience unlikely to be intense to even the most inexperienced psychonaught. It is VERY different from a high breakthrough dose of DMT; Which indeed IS much like riding a scudmisile into a black hole in terms of intensity.



Definitely.  So basically nothing will prepare you for a high dose of DMT, is that what you're saying?  The best you can do is meditate, have the right mindset, setting etc.?

EDIT:  Just realised there was another page.
So you're also saying that doing other psychedelics provides the framework for dealing with DMT.
Ok I get it now, thanks Xaq and SKA, that's something I never really understood.

----------


## Motumz

> Well I don't know where you live, but Santo Daime has chruches worldwide. Maybe worth looking on Santo-Daime's site to see if there are any local churches.



Hmm, I can't find a site, would you be so kind to provide one for me?  :smiley: 

Also, I'm just curious, but how old are you?  ::D:

----------


## SKA

> Hmm, I can't find a site, would you be so kind to provide one for me? 
> 
> Also, I'm just curious, but how old are you?



I looked up the dutch Santo Daime site, clicked on the english version-icon, but that does not seem to work.
Here you can learn more about Santo Daime too:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santo_Daime

And for your information I am 24 since the 4th of Januari this year. I had my ayahuasca experience with Santo Daime 2 years ago, at the age of 22.

Actually I'm planning to prticipate in another ayahuasca ceremony with Santo Daime soon.

----------


## dajo

A documentary on LSD I really liked was 'Getting High - The history of LSD' 
from the history channel. You can watch it here, I think:
http://www.leary.ru/english/video/?n=01

----------


## Motumz

> I looked up the dutch Santo Daime site, clicked on the english version-icon, but that does not seem to work.
> Here you can learn more about Santo Daime too:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santo_Daime
> 
> And for your information I am 24 since the 4th of Januari this year. I had my ayahuasca experience with Santo Daime 2 years ago, at the age of 22.
> 
> Actually I'm planning to prticipate in another ayahuasca ceremony with Santo Daime soon.



Thanks.

And cool. 22 actually sounds like the perfect age to part take in an ayahuasca trip / ceremony  :smiley:

----------


## Dannon Oneironaut

Wow, So much to say. It took me hours to read this thread, I don't know how I haven't seen it before.
     Like a lot of you here, I was a curious teenager. I researched LSD. All the research I did gave me a false impression of it. I thought that it would put me into an _unreal_ frame of mind where I would be overcome by swirly colors and not know what reality is. I was afraid that I would 'freak out'. I was still curious. 
     The first time I tried LSD was at a Rainbow Gathering. It was my first day at my first Rainbow Gathering and I went down to the main fire pit drum circle and was watching all the hippies playing drums and dancing when up comes a hippie chick and puts a tab of acid in my hand and dances off! I looked at it and thought "Here is LSD! Should I take it? What if I freak out? Well, I'm having a good time, everyone else is having a good time, I'm in the middle of the woods, what the hell!" And I ate it.
     Then I just started dancing. And I forgot that I took it. After a while I thought 'it must've been bunk, I don't feel anything. I just feel good from dancing'. And I jept dancing. I felt very very good. I went to pee in the bushes and I thought I saw someone in the bush and I realized that there was nobody there. Someone walking by said "look, he's tripping!' and I laughed because they thought I was tripping when obviously the acid was bunk and I was just high from dancing, or was I? Oh, I was tripping! I felt like a child and I saw the world fresh like I did when I was three years old. Everything was beautiful! I understood the depth and truth of subjective feelings and was filled with insights. i was laughing hysterically! There was nothing to be afraid of! This is so natural and fun! It is like losing your virginity or falling in love. Yes, falling in love can be dangerous. You can become obsessed with the beloved, you can get your heart broken. I was in love with everything! 
    Since then I did it a lot, I lost all fear of it. Sometimes I took too high of a dose and had a rough time, mostly paranoia or claustrophobia, but I always learned from it. No matter how rough a trip was when I was coming down slowly I always learned. The scariest [art of the trip is when it comes on fast and you are going to the peak. If you are peaking, and you are having a rough time, remember that it is a smooth coast downhill. It comes on fast and wears off slowly. One hit won't get you too high. It is perfect. You may even love it so much that you wish you did more. But be careful if you have never done it before, it is easy to underestimate the power of a high dose of LSD based on the sublime beauty of one dose. 
  As to where to get it and how much it costs, I have never paid more than a dollar for it, but that was back when. I mostly got it for free. It is a cheap drug to make because it is such a small small amount that makes up a hit. I always got it from friends, or at Rainbow Gatherings (where everything is free and the old school master chemists supply the LSD), or at Concerts like the Grateful Dead or Phish. I always either knew from experience or from word of mouth from trusted friends what the good "brand" was that was going around and if someone had that I would try some. You know, people would be talking about how great 'flying eyeballs' are or 'sunshine'. 
If your acid isn't pure it won't kill you or even make you have a bad trip. It just might give you some smelly farts or you will feel like you need to stretch your back real good. Do some yoga. Drink orange juice while you are high, the vitamin C is good for you and it tastes great. Be in the woods on a full moon night is highly recommended. Hopefully you will still be somewhat high to watch the sunrise before you go to bed. That is always the best way to end the trip: watching the sunrise and smoking a bowl with your friend. Do it with a friend or two who you really feel comfortable around. Don't do it around anyone where there is a possibiltiy of subtle mind-games. Even if you are sexually attracted to someone it can add a strange vibe because of the telepathic/empathic nature of the experience. But if the feeling is mutual it might be great, but the thing is to connect to the other person as a human being and not as an object of lust. Lust seems wierd when on acid. 
      As for it being bad for you... there is nothing about it that can harm you, chemically speaking. If your brain chemsitry is already off it can have some strange effects. But you would know already. Don't take it if you are taking anti-depressants or anti-psychotics. they don't mix at all!!!
      If you think you can fly, try taking off from the ground. Don't jump off a roof or out of a window! Take off from the ground! I think that that is an urban myth. If you are happy and you love yourself you will become all the wiser from the experience. Have fun.

----------


## Motumz

> Wow, So much to say. It took me hours to read this thread, I don't know how I haven't seen it before.
>      Like a lot of you here, I was a curious teenager. I researched LSD. All the research I did gave me a false impression of it. I thought that it would put me into an _unreal_ frame of mind where I would be overcome by swirly colors and not know what reality is. I was afraid that I would 'freak out'. I was still curious. 
>      The first time I tried LSD was at a Rainbow Gathering. It was my first day at my first Rainbow Gathering and I went down to the main fire pit drum circle and was watching all the hippies playing drums and dancing when up comes a hippie chick and puts a tab of acid in my hand and dances off! I looked at it and thought "Here is LSD! Should I take it? What if I freak out? Well, I'm having a good time, everyone else is having a good time, I'm in the middle of the woods, what the hell!" And I ate it.
>      Then I just started dancing. And I forgot that I took it. After a while I thought 'it must've been bunk, I don't feel anything. I just feel good from dancing'. And I jept dancing. I felt very very good. I went to pee in the bushes and I thought I saw someone in the bush and I realized that there was nobody there. Someone walking by said "look, he's tripping!' and I laughed because they thought I was tripping when obviously the acid was bunk and I was just high from dancing, or was I? Oh, I was tripping! I felt like a child and I saw the world fresh like I did when I was three years old. Everything was beautiful! I understood the depth and truth of subjective feelings and was filled with insights. i was laughing hysterically! There was nothing to be afraid of! This is so natural and fun! It is like losing your virginity or falling in love. Yes, falling in love can be dangerous. You can become obsessed with the beloved, you can get your heart broken. I was in love with everything! 
>     Since then I did it a lot, I lost all fear of it. Sometimes I took too high of a dose and had a rough time, mostly paranoia or claustrophobia, but I always learned from it. No matter how rough a trip was when I was coming down slowly I always learned. The scariest [art of the trip is when it comes on fast and you are going to the peak. If you are peaking, and you are having a rough time, remember that it is a smooth coast downhill. It comes on fast and wears off slowly. One hit won't get you too high. It is perfect. You may even love it so much that you wish you did more. But be careful if you have never done it before, it is easy to underestimate the power of a high dose of LSD based on the sublime beauty of one dose. 
>   As to where to get it and how much it costs, I have never paid more than a dollar for it, but that was back when. I mostly got it for free. It is a cheap drug to make because it is such a small small amount that makes up a hit. I always got it from friends, or at Rainbow Gatherings (where everything is free and the old school master chemists supply the LSD), or at Concerts like the Grateful Dead or Phish. I always either knew from experience or from word of mouth from trusted friends what the good "brand" was that was going around and if someone had that I would try some. You know, people would be talking about how great 'flying eyeballs' are or 'sunshine'. 
> If your acid isn't pure it won't kill you or even make you have a bad trip. It just might give you some smelly farts or you will feel like you need to stretch your back real good. Do some yoga. Drink orange juice while you are high, the vitamin C is good for you and it tastes great. Be in the woods on a full moon night is highly recommended. Hopefully you will still be somewhat high to watch the sunrise before you go to bed. That is always the best way to end the trip: watching the sunrise and smoking a bowl with your friend. Do it with a friend or two who you really feel comfortable around. Don't do it around anyone where there is a possibiltiy of subtle mind-games. Even if you are sexually attracted to someone it can add a strange vibe because of the telepathic/empathic nature of the experience. But if the feeling is mutual it might be great, but the thing is to connect to the other person as a human being and not as an object of lust. Lust seems wierd when on acid. 
>       As for it being bad for you... there is nothing about it that can harm you, chemically speaking. If your brain chemsitry is already off it can have some strange effects. But you would know already. Don't take it if you are taking anti-depressants or anti-psychotics. they don't mix at all!!!
>       If you think you can fly, try taking off from the ground. Don't jump off a roof or out of a window! Take off from the ground! I think that that is an urban myth. If you are happy and you love yourself you will become all the wiser from the experience. Have fun.



Hey man great post. Loved it.

I have a few question though. I will be taking acid soon. It *should* be pretty pure, or at least really good. Because the people that are hooking me up with it are almost daily users. So I'm pretty confident in that area.

But what I was going to do when I take acid, was bring my best friend, lock us in the upstairs. And then take the acid. I'd also smoke the friend out for sitting me, and so he wouldn't be so bored (I don't really want him playing some violent video game while I'm tripping)

But I was thinking, since Spring Break is coming up, maybe I could get some then and trip during the day or something? Which would you personally prefer? I was thinking outdoors would be awesome.. But I don't know if I could stay out there for a full 12 hours. But I do love nature.


But anyways, do you have any tips for a first time LSD user? Meditate before? Listen to calming music during the trip? Stuff like that. Thanks  :smiley:

----------


## Dannon Oneironaut

> Hey man great post. Loved it.
> 
> I have a few question though. I will be taking acid soon. It *should* be pretty pure, or at least really good. Because the people that are hooking me up with it are almost daily users. So I'm pretty confident in that area.
> 
> But what I was going to do when I take acid, was bring my best friend, lock us in the upstairs. And then take the acid. I'd also smoke the friend out for sitting me, and so he wouldn't be so bored (I don't really want him playing some violent video game while I'm tripping)
> 
> But I was thinking, since Spring Break is coming up, maybe I could get some then and trip during the day or something? Which would you personally prefer? I was thinking outdoors would be awesome.. But I don't know if I could stay out there for a full 12 hours. But I do love nature.
> 
> 
> But anyways, do you have any tips for a first time LSD user? Meditate before? Listen to calming music during the trip? Stuff like that. Thanks



Personally, I like it better at night. But that is just me, and a lot of my friends. Let me tell you why. You don't need daylight to see, especially when you are high on acid. Also, it is good to have shadows around yourself so you can step into a shadow and not feel so conspicuous. Also, the darkness is beautiful, as is the moon and the stars and even streetlights reflected in puddles. I would definately NOT lock myself in a room. You will probably want to go for a walk. And a walk can turn into a very insightful pleasant adventure. Kind of like the Wizard of Oz! staying closed up in one room can get kind of claustrophobic sometimes. Just keep it open. Don't plan out your whole trip beforehand. keep it open. As for before you trip: just don't have any worries. That's it. Nice music befrore your trip won't influence your trip. But nice music while you are tripping is the most amazing thing there is. You never heard music until you heard it tripping! Seriously! Have your friend bring some of his/her favorite music also. And if your friend has ever done it before, might as well have him/her do some with you. Don't worry that he/she won't be able to babysit you. It helps to have someone on the same wavelength mentally as you. Communication will be so much easier and satisfying. there is even such a thing as telepathy, although some skeptics might disagree, but you may experience it. Definitely there is such thing as empathy! And empathy is beautiful! Also, you will be talking to him/her. He/she shouldn't be doing his/her own thing like playing video games. He/she should be having the same adventure as you. It will be fun and revelatory! If he/she is playing video games you will want to look over at him/her and want to get out of there. You will say "let's go for a walk outside!" Go for a walk outside at night, unless you live in the ghetto. Then come home and listen to some good music and smoke a bowl when you want to.

If the weather is nice go camping and build a fire and watch the dragons and snakes coil around in the coals!
    You will have a great time, especially if your friends all say it is good stuff! Have fun!

----------


## Motumz

> Personally, I like it better at night. But that is just me, and a lot of my friends. Let me tell you why. You don't need daylight to see, especially when you are high on acid. Also, it is good to have shadows around yourself so you can step into a shadow and not feel so conspicuous. Also, the darkness is beautiful, as is the moon and the stars and even streetlights reflected in puddles. I would definately NOT lock myself in a room. You will probably want to go for a walk. And a walk can turn into a very insightful pleasant adventure. Kind of like the Wizard of Oz! staying closed up in one room can get kind of claustrophobic sometimes. Just keep it open. Don't plan out your whole trip beforehand. keep it open. As for before you trip: just don't have any worries. That's it. Nice music befrore your trip won't influence your trip. But nice music while you are tripping is the most amazing thing there is. You never heard music until you heard it tripping! Seriously! Have your friend bring some of his/her favorite music also. And if your friend has ever done it before, might as well have him/her do some with you. Don't worry that he/she won't be able to babysit you. It helps to have someone on the same wavelength mentally as you. Communication will be so much easier and satisfying. there is even such a thing as telepathy, although some skeptics might disagree, but you may experience it. Definitely there is such thing as empathy! And empathy is beautiful! Also, you will be talking to him/her. He/she shouldn't be doing his/her own thing like playing video games. He/she should be having the same adventure as you. It will be fun and revelatory! If he/she is playing video games you will want to look over at him/her and want to get out of there. You will say "let's go for a walk outside!" Go for a walk outside at night, unless you live in the ghetto. Then come home and listen to some good music and smoke a bowl when you want to.
> 
> If the weather is nice go camping and build a fire and watch the dragons and snakes coil around in the coals!
>     You will have a great time, especially if your friends all say it is good stuff! Have fun!



This is so cool  ::D:  I have a great feeling I will have a more than good trip. And yea man, the stars out here look awesome. Especially while laying on the trampoline. I can't wait  ::D: 

Thanks a *ton* for the advice!  ::D:

----------


## Dannon Oneironaut

Definately jump on the trampoline!

----------


## Foggy

Here's Tom with the weather..  :smiley:  Haha

----------


## Motumz

> Here's Tom with the weather..  Haha



Definately tripping.

----------


## Supernova

Hey Motumz, you ever take that acid?  I guess find myself interested because if all goes well I'll be taking shrooms with a very close friend in a few weeks.  Either way, sounds like you were set up pretty good, I'd like to hear about it.

----------


## dream yogi

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc

----------


## Motumz

> Hey Motumz, you ever take that acid?  I guess find myself interested because if all goes well I'll be taking shrooms with a very close friend in a few weeks.  Either way, sounds like you were set up pretty good, I'd like to hear about it.



Sure did. Tripped a total of 6 times in probably 2 months. Laying on my trampoline listening to music surrounded by nature was probably the best thing I've ever experienced. I was tripping with a friend, and we were both struggling to hold on to reality as we were floating through space hah. We kept leaving our body every 5 minutes and snapping back because we knew we couldn't stay out there all night. Haha, then when we got in my house my parents were watching Napoleon Dynamite and the dude's head was like morphing. It was hilarious. My last trip was a great night. Full of euphoria, laughter, and crazy ideas.

Sadly, my tripping has come to an end, for now. I did something very bad recently and it has both robbed me of money, and my happiness. I'm pretty sure I'm depressed right now, so tripping is not an option. I don't even have the money to trip.

Karma is really hating on me right now..  :Sad:

----------


## LucidFlanders

Why do people even care about people smoking weed? it's like the most harmless drug on the planet, even more harmless then asprin. I smoke it so i'm frowned upon. I guess some people really believe everything the government say about it. It's iritating when you hear stories like "this person went crazy" or "Lots of people have died from it" and when you ask for a source they dodge.

----------


## Supernova

> Sure did. Tripped a total of 6 times in probably 2 months. Laying on my trampoline listening to music surrounded by nature was probably the best thing I've ever experienced. I was tripping with a friend, and we were both struggling to hold on to reality as we were floating through space hah. We kept leaving our body every 5 minutes and snapping back because we knew we couldn't stay out there all night. Haha, then when we got in my house my parents were watching Napoleon Dynamite and the dude's head was like morphing. It was hilarious. My last trip was a great night. Full of euphoria, laughter, and crazy ideas.



Sounds awesome, man.  Did your parents know or are you just fucking good at hiding it?  ::lol:: 

I'd love to try LSD someday, although I understand it's difficult to obtain nowadays.
/jealous





> Why do people even care about people smoking weed? it's like the most harmless drug on the planet, even more harmless then asprin. I smoke it so i'm frowned upon. I guess some people really believe everything the government say about it. It's iritating when you hear stories like "this person went crazy" or "Lots of people have died from it" and when you ask for a source they dodge.



Don't worry about those morons, they don't get it.  Do what you're going to do, as long as you're not hurting anyone else anyone who has a problem with that can fuck off.

----------


## tommo

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHzdsFiBbFc



I posted a thread on this video just a while back.  It got like 2 views coz I posted it in Science and Mathematics.  I thought people might wanna discuss the Science side of it.  Guess I was wrong lol

But here's my thread on it, check it out.  The study was actually real but some people just did a parody of it.

http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=97387





> Why do people even care about people smoking weed? it's like the most harmless drug on the planet, even more harmless then asprin. I smoke it so i'm frowned upon. I guess some people really believe everything the government say about it. It's iritating when you hear stories like "this person went crazy" or "Lots of people have died from it" and when you ask for a source they dodge.



It's coz people are generally fucking morons.  They don't have the balls to do what they want to do so they try to stop other people from doing their own thing too.  I always here of people going crazy from weed.  It's a logical fallacy.  Correlation does not equal causation.
People don't see it any other way because it's been pounded in to their heads by media/government and people who have been influenced by media and government.

But if you just look at that solid scientific evidence, saying that Cannabis causes people to go crazy is just as illogical as saying police cause fights.  Just coz the police are there, doesn't mean they caused the fight.  And obviously it is actually (mostly) the opposite, police come to a fight to break it up.
In the same way, Cannabis is used by a person likely to become crazy because it helps them reduce their symptoms.
I suggest you show them studies of CBD.  It is a Cannabinoid found in the Cannabis plant which actually has been shown in scientific studies to be just as effective as atypical antipsychotics (the newest ones) but with less side effects.

As for the dying from weed.... lol  Show them studies from the 1950's ffs.  Scientists have actually tried purposely to kill animals with ounces of Cannabis extract injected in to them.  The dogs fell asleep for 2 and a half days and woke up a bit tired.

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## dream yogi

Sorry missed your thread. Good catch. I'd seen that vid on another forum a while back. So funny so had to post. I didn't know it was based on a real study. Whoever put the vid together did a great job. Thanx for the background info on it.

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## JamesLD

> Why do people even care about people smoking weed? it's like the most harmless drug on the planet, even more harmless then asprin. I smoke it so i'm frowned upon. I guess some people really believe everything the government say about it. It's iritating when you hear stories like "this person went crazy" or "Lots of people have died from it" and when you ask for a source they dodge.



everyone now days is completely brainwashed and doesnt know the truth about marijuana.
its actually really sad why marijuana is illegal in the first place, it has nothing to do with it being "dangerous" but it has every thing to do with racism and greed.
heres a little history lesson.

first ill speak of the racism.
the government thought they could get rid of the growing population of mexicans by making cannabis illegal, since many mexicans coming to america brought pot with them.

now the greed.
before 1937 hemp was used for almost EVERYTHING. but big businesses saw the industrial use of hemp as a threat to there big companies that used trees for paper, cotton for clothing, and so on and so forth, therefore marijuana must be eliminated. shit the government even made up the word "Marijuana" everyone in the world knew what cannabis hemp was because it was basically the number one cash crop in america, so the government through propaganda and harry j. anslinger created the word "marijuana" and started spreading false information about it so that they could get the people to vote to outlaw "Marijuana" and they didnt realize that what they were voting to make illegal was actually cannabis hemp.

in george washingtons times you could actually get arrested if you didnt grow hemp! george washington was also a hemp farmer

so in the end the governmant won and a harmless plant was made illegal. dont you think making nature illegal is a little, unnatural?

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## Motumz

> Sounds awesome, man.  Did your parents know or are you just fucking good at hiding it?



They probably knew. Don't ask don't tell  :smiley:  They won't say anything until like proof of me smoking or something is in their face. They know I'm just having fun, why ruin it?

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## Supernova

> They probably knew. Don't ask don't tell  They won't say anything until like proof of me smoking or something is in their face. They know I'm just having fun, why ruin it?



Good attitude, wish my dad was the same. When he goes on vacation to North Carolina in a few weeks, I will just have gotten back from Spain, so...I figure I'll be wanting some time to relax at home by then, although he can still go...nudge nudge, wink wink





> Lucid dream checklist: Meet Jim Morrison in the middle of a desert and trip on peyote with him[]



My, what a marvelous idea  :tongue2: 
I've actually been thinking about trying to meet Jim Morrison in a LD.

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## Supernova

Oh, man
marinol + herb
* W O W *

just a little tip there.

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## tommo

> Oh, man
> marinol + herb
> * W O W *
> 
> just a little tip there.



You have marinol?  Where is it? lol  Seriously, details man!

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## Supernova

One of my grandmother's friends (younger than her) has a prescription for marinol. He gave her a few evidently  ::thumbup::

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## SKA

I've seen there's a movie on DMT comming out too. Called DMT: The Spirit Molecule. It's based on Dr. Rick Strassman's DMT research.
Here: http://thespiritmolecule.com/html/

check this out too:
http://www.rickstrassman.com/

Thank you openminded, forward scientists for breaking the ice and making entheogenesis open for exploration and documentation again. Good riddance restrictive tabboos.
I don't think it'll be long before LSD will be reapplied in psychotherapy to treat PTS disorders and drug Addiction once again. It has allready proven to be very effective for these applications.

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## Motumz

So I went in to the doctor's pretty high. I got my wisdom teeth removed. Haha, I actually asked the nurse (who had obviously used nitrous before) to give me more than I needed. Anyways, I had like a 15 minute trip while she let me lay there and enjoy my surroundings. I felt like... a baby.. just being born. Exploring my new life and the hot nurse standing beside me.

I had lots of visuals, but I get visuals without drugs now so they don't really impress me. I still love em though.

To make this thread on-topic though, *what have you felt on LSD?* I've felt many times that I was been new to my surroundings (literally, new to my own room). Learning, exploring, and laughing. The feeling of being re-born is quite a profound experience. Thoughts?





> I've seen there's a movie on DMT comming out too. Called DMT: The Spirit Molecule. It's based on Dr. Rick Strassman's DMT research.
> Here: http://thespiritmolecule.com/html/
> 
> check this out too:
> http://www.rickstrassman.com/



I've been waiting for a year now. I can't wait for it to come out!

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## tommo

> One of my grandmother's friends (younger than her) has a prescription for marinol. He gave her a few evidently



 Oh that's fortunate.  I also meant details as in, what was it like?  Was it more relaxing than normal bud?  I'm guessing it would be because of the extra CBD from Marinol which western Cannabis lacks.





> I've seen there's a movie on DMT comming out too. Called DMT: The Spirit Molecule. It's based on Dr. Rick Strassman's DMT research.
> Here: http://thespiritmolecule.com/html/
> 
> check this out too:
> http://www.rickstrassman.com/
> 
> Thank you openminded, forward scientists for breaking the ice and making entheogenesis open for exploration and documentation again. Good riddance restrictive tabboos.
> I don't think it'll be long before LSD will be reapplied in psychotherapy to treat PTS disorders and drug Addiction once again. It has allready proven to be very effective for these applications.



Yes I've been waiting for so long!  The end of this year it apparently should come out on DVD.
I think that MDMA is more likely to be revived for psychotherapeutic use, especially in PTSD and depression/anxiety.  There's way less chance of anything detrimental happening.  Although studies do show that under the care of a therapist of some sort, bad trips are more easily worked through and less likely to happen.





> So I went in to the doctor's pretty high. I got my wisdom teeth removed. Haha, I actually asked the nurse (who had obviously used nitrous before) to give me more than I needed. Anyways, I had like a 15 minute trip while she let me lay there and enjoy my surroundings. I felt like... a baby.. just being born. Exploring my new life and the hot nurse standing beside me.



Wow.  It annoys me that I never get any cool drugs.  I've had fillings done (which I didn't even need which I was pissed off about lol) and also a chipped tooth carved away at and some cement stuff stuck on.  All I got was local anaesthetic and the best thing in that is the small amount of amphetamine/adrenaline.  Wisdom teeth removed, had to be done under general anaesthetic and I was hoping I'd get Ketamine.  But again I didn't.

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## Supernova

Well, I felt a nice buzz coming on, combined with some mild munchies because apparently it was supposed to be for people who needed an appetite boost, but then I just had the herb, so I'm not sure what was that and what was the marinol.  Tell you what though, I had a pretty good sativa-like mind high going on, plus a total indicata body high, both at the same time.  So I got the best of both worlds  ::D: 





> I've seen there's a movie on DMT comming out too. Called DMT: The Spirit Molecule. It's based on Dr. Rick Strassman's DMT research.
> Here: http://thespiritmolecule.com/html/
> 
> check this out too:
> http://www.rickstrassman.com/
> 
> Thank you openminded, forward scientists for breaking the ice and making entheogenesis open for exploration and documentation again. Good riddance restrictive tabboos.
> I don't think it'll be long before LSD will be reapplied in psychotherapy to treat PTS disorders and drug Addiction once again. It has allready proven to be very effective for these applications.



Man, that first link sent me on a 45 minute youtube spree (about 70% of that being the Mad Hippy's videos  :tongue2: )

That's pretty cool, though, I'll be looking forward to that movie's release.

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## ninja9578

Watched it last night and took lsd.  Good times.

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## ChrissyMaria

> Watched it last night and took lsd.  Good times.



OMG im jealous, I haven't come across that good old stuff in over 5 years....i remember after the last trip i felt a steady and slight happy fleeting feeling about life, which eventually slowly faded.

IMO LSD along with Cannabis are the two most significant discoveries in human history.

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## Supernova

Man, wasn't tripping last night but I felt like it.  Very high with Fragile in my cd player (surround system, awesone for music) and I was getting the most vivid CEV I'd ever had with cannabis.  Interesting geometric figures over, and giving way to, amazing kaliedascopic visuals.  Wasn't overly engrossing or super vivid or anything, but more than I expected to see on even a high dose.  People forget a lot that cannabis really is a psychadelic when used properly.  People just light up and get high with the same attitude they get dunk with, whithout ever realizing the potential.  It's more than many people realize it is.

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## ChrissyMaria

Interesting, I get those when im sober and awake, I have HPPD where hallucinations are constant and never go away, but my hallucinations are just geometric shapes that move around, quite harmless and colorful, and pretty...

When im in airplanes looking out of the window the cities below look like they are morphing its so insane lol.

I thought of it as a curse at first but now I look at it as a gift, like I have unlocked a certain perception and now I cannot go back to the old perception.

I did lsd twice from what I recall the 2nd experience was more intense and after seeing the grim reaper rise out of the floor that was a little traumatic and well LSD can cause a mild form of PTSD which causes HPPD in many people, but i only see patterns and no reapers thankfully.

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## Motumz

> Wow.  It annoys me that I never get any cool drugs.  I've had fillings done (which I didn't even need which I was pissed off about lol) and also a chipped tooth carved away at and some cement stuff stuck on.  All I got was local anaesthetic and the best thing in that is the small amount of amphetamine/adrenaline.  Wisdom teeth removed, had to be done under general anaesthetic and I was hoping I'd get Ketamine.  But again I didn't.



I don't want to further make you annoyed, but I got Ketamine lol. It lasted until I went to sleep late that night. I had some pretty fucked up thoughts. and apparently my mom thinks I'm hilarious fucked up  :tongue2:  Oh, and I just thought I should mention, I'm still not the same from Ketamine. Like all psychedelic after glows, I can't explain it. it's just there. It's nice though whatever it is.

Y'all should post your most fucked up thoughts. My recent one on Ketamine was *"Whoaaa.. if this is what the afterlife feels like, I should kill myself right now and just have an eternity of this."* Fucking lucky I was too fucked up and just kept staring out the window. Gives me the cold chills every time I think about it.

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## Philosopher8659

I did LSD a few times when I was young. I found the trips way too long, and way too boring. I mean, really, what is there of interest in hallucinations? Especially when reality is much more fun?

And, how backwords the whole thing is! some have claimed to have had flashbacks afterwords, I never have, but the purpose of the human mind is to flash forward.

Once one has spent enough time learning to distinquish the self from not self by lucid dreaming, this ability does not leave one even during drug experiementation of youth. One can, however, see the simplicity of the drug effect, and it compares poorly.

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## tommo

> I don't want to further make you annoyed, but I got Ketamine lol. It lasted until I went to sleep late that night. I had some pretty fucked up thoughts. and apparently my mom thinks I'm hilarious fucked up  Oh, and I just thought I should mention, I'm still not the same from Ketamine. Like all psychedelic after glows, I can't explain it. it's just there. It's nice though whatever it is.



Slut.... lol jk

People say that Ketamine feels like resetting your brain.  Also it's proven that it gets rid of or significantly lessens depression for up to months afterward.  I spose you could prolong that if you have the intent.

Definitely if I go for surgery ever again where I need general anaesthetic I'm gonna say I'm allergic to all of them except Ketamine haha

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## Motumz

> Definitely if I go for surgery ever again where I need general anaesthetic I'm gonna say I'm allergic to all of them except Ketamine haha



Sounds flawless!  ::D:  It's not like they can really do anything about it. Lol if you get the chance, you should totally steal the Ketamine hah. Just sayin. You'll prolly be too engulfed in your own little world though.

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## tommo

haha yeah well they can't really check if I am allergic afaik.  
Don't think stealing it is possible though.  Think they keep it pretty locked up in Aus.  I had a look in a vet surgery once (where they use it most now) at the drug shelf but couldn't see it anywhere either.

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## Motumz

Yea and I'm pretty sure they'll fuck you up the ass if they catch you stealing a drug such as Ketamine hah. You'll get some eventually. Maybe you'll find Ex with some Ketamine in it? I've heard those tabs are supposed to be awesome. MDMA + Ketamine = deeeeeep.

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## ragincajun2288

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJbh-O7-44Y

Saw you guys talking about DMT and Marijuana and thought you would enjoy this video, I sure did. Very informational, funny, and all quite true.

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## Motumz

A DMT documentary I found. Haven't finished it yet, but it is really good so far.

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E62nk...eature=related

Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPYqF...eature=related

Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlIHC...eature=related

Part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1USpL...eature=related

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## JamesLD

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJbh-O7-44Y
> 
> Saw you guys talking about DMT and Marijuana and thought you would enjoy this video, I sure did. Very informational, funny, and all quite true.



this video is great. most of the stuff it talked about i already knew, but its just awesome and refreshing to hear joe rogan rant about it lol

all plants should be legal!

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## Motumz

> this video is great. most of the stuff it talked about i already knew, but its just awesome and refreshing to hear joe rogan rant about it lol
> 
> all plants should be legal!



I just laugh every time I hear that though. They are literally illegalizing PLANTS. Fucking retarded as hell. /rant

I have a nice picture though, before our government was a bunch of dickheads.. (click to enlarge the picture, lol)
abram.jpg

Also..
gen.jpg

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## Universal Mind

I would love to hear American Southern Baptists respond to those pictures.  ::chuckle::  I think they would probably be speechless.

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## JamesLD

i think its great how our founding fathers grew and smoked hemp. its also funny how in their time you could be arrested if you refused to grow hemp because it was such a valuable resource. oh how times have changed

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## Motumz

> i think its great how our founding fathers grew and smoked hemp. its also funny how in their time you could be arrested if you refused to grow hemp because it was such a valuable resource. oh how times have changed



*
"America’s first marijuana law was enacted at Jamestown Colony, Virginia in 1619. It was a law “ordering” all farmers to grow Indian hempseed. There were several other “must grow” laws over the next 200 years (you could be jailed for not growing hemp during times of shortage in Virginia between 1763 and 1767), and during most of that time, hemp was legal tender (you could even pay your taxes with hemp — try that today!) Hemp was such a critical crop for a number of purposes (including essential war requirements – rope, etc.) that the government went out of its way to encourage growth."*

But sadly, thanks to this stupid sack of shit, *Harry J. Anslinger*, Marijuana was made illegal. And well, you know the rest..

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## Foggy

DMT! Man! I can't believe more people don't know more about this prophecy. Someone must have had the genious idea of having a bong of it in a lucid dream. That's my next goal, although I'm not too experienced at it. I'll be actually tripping on DMT anyway coz that's what causes dreams, I just hope I survive to tell the tale  :smiley:

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## JamesLD

> But sadly, thanks to this stupid sack of shit, *Harry J. Anslinger*, Marijuana was made illegal. And well, you know the rest..



its sad that most everybody in Amercia doesn't know the truth and thinks cannabis was made illegal cause its "Dangerous". Fucking sheep

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## Motumz

> its sad that most everybody in Amercia doesn't know the truth and thinks cannabis was made illegal cause its "Dangerous". Fucking sheep



Sheep, what a perfect word for people like them.





> DMT! Man! I can't believe more people don't know more about this prophecy. Someone must have had the genious idea of having a bong of it in a lucid dream. That's my next goal, although I'm not too experienced at it. I'll be actually tripping on DMT anyway coz that's what causes dreams, I just hope I survive to tell the tale



Of course you'll survive, unless you have like a heart attack or something haha.

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## JamesLD

i believe it was terrence mckenna that said if you smoked dmt in your dream it would have the same effect.

can an experienced lucid dreamer please test this out?

ive been wanting to know if its true for a long time. id try it myself but i dont have ld's quite as often as id like, and when i do i usually just fly or fuck lol

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## Supernova

The real question is, would it if you haven't smoked DMT in waking life?  This result would be quite interesting, and I'll be trying it next time I have a solid LD.

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## tommo

Yeah it would be good to get people who are experienced and people who are not experienced IRL to smoke it in their dreams.  Compare results.

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## Supernova

That would be an interesting experiment.  I've actually been thinking, it would be nice to get some experiments of that sort going.  A lot of questions, like how a drug in a dream would compare to the real thing, are answered by mostly speculation.  In fact, later I think I might whip up a thread for an experiment on te DMT thing.

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## dajo

I did take LSD in a dream before I did IRL. If I remember, I will try again after having taken it, but I guess the dream is an entire trip itself and it probably is going to be different from the actual experience no matter what. (I don't have lucids very regularly at the moment and I sometimes have a hard time remembering the things I wanted to do in them) 

In the dream, it was a lot quicker, but also a lot more possessive. Interesting experiment though.

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## Motumz

> i believe it was terrence mckenna that said if you smoked dmt in your dream it would have the same effect.
> 
> can an experienced lucid dreamer please test this out?
> 
> ive been wanting to know if its true for a long time. id try it myself but i dont have ld's quite as often as id like, and when i do i usually just fly or fuck lol



Although I was not lucid, I still smoked DMT in my dream. It was quite amazing with some huge effects. I don't believe I broke through in my dream though, but it was still great. I also woke up with a sense of euphoria. Quite strong as a matter of fact.

Note: I've never smoked DMT in my waking life.

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## Codename

> Yes, I've personally found mushrooms to be more effective in the way of ego dissolution. Every mushroom trip I take just seems to go there whether I want it to or not. They make me feel okay with myself in a very profound way, like I'm finally accepting myself for who I really am, flaws and all. In this state of "okayness," I can let my guard down completely and no longer need to project an image of respectability out to the world in order to make people think a certain way about me.
> 
> LSD however is also a very powerful drug with much healing potential. For me personally I have found it most useful in the area of creativity enhancement. I have noticed that since my 5th or 6th or 7th LSD trip, I have an overall greatly expanded appreciation for natural beauty. I find myself stopping to stare in awe at a beautiful wisp of cloud, or a tree, or even something as simple as the mark of old leaves left on the sidewalk that no one would ever think to look twice at. I also have to say that my musical appreciation and tastes have grown exponentially since I started using LSD.




WHOOAAA! Double Rainbow!

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## Foggy

I ALMOST succeeded in taking a bong of DMT! I became lucid in a strange little bar and immediately began searching for a bong. I new I'd find it, but it took me a couple of minutes. At one point I became dangerously close to waking, but I sat down and relaxed, making my lucid state much higher. I eventually found the bong behind the bar on one of the shelves. It was an amazing and intriguing glass bong, shaped like a shell in an intricate swirl. There was a small pool of water in a bowl at the top, and a few strands of trippy looking grass on the gauze. I was very excited at this point, and everything was getting trippier already, I pulled a lighter out of my pocket in a strange comical way, and was seconds away from lighting the DMT containing grass, when I woke up with a flash. Man I was dissapointed!

I quite like the idea of taking some DMT or mushrooms in waking life soon. I've tried LSD before-amazing! But I've just about had enough of Ego's recently!

----------


## greenhavoc

I love threads like these - they're so unbiased. I mean god forbid some douchebag walks in and shits all over the delusion. Btw, Has anyone mentioned the real reason they'll will never drop again, or even smoke for that matter? No - maybe it's because none of you have lost your damn mind searching for something that doesn't actually exist. Unbiased indeed.

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## Motumz

> I ALMOST succeeded in taking a bong of DMT! I became lucid in a strange little bar and immediately began searching for a bong. I new I'd find it, but it took me a couple of minutes. At one point I became dangerously close to waking, but I sat down and relaxed, making my lucid state much higher. I eventually found the bong behind the bar on one of the shelves. It was an amazing and intriguing glass bong, shaped like a shell in an intricate swirl. There was a small pool of water in a bowl at the top, and a few strands of trippy looking grass on the gauze. I was very excited at this point, and everything was getting trippier already, I pulled a lighter out of my pocket in a strange comical way, and was seconds away from lighting the DMT containing grass, when I woke up with a flash. Man I was dissapointed!
> 
> I quite like the idea of taking some DMT or mushrooms in waking life soon. I've tried LSD before-amazing! But I've just about had enough of Ego's recently!



Like you've had enough of your ego? If so, then trip on Shrooms. Everyone needs a cleanse sometime. If you mean you have had enough of other people's egos.. well then just get used to it.

----------


## fairytale complex

> I love threads like these - they're so unbiased. I mean god forbid some douchebag walks in and shits all over the delusion. Btw, Has anyone mentioned the real reason they'll will never drop again, or even smoke for that matter? No - maybe it's because none of you have lost your damn mind searching for something that doesn't actually exist. Unbiased indeed.



yo. greenhavoc may have a point.    i have a personal story to share , but i wont.

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## katielovestrees

> yo. greenhavoc may have a point.    i have a personal story to share , but i wont.



Tease.  :wink2:

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## Spartiate

He doesn't really, he just wants the attention.

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## Motumz

> He doesn't really, he just wants the attention.



This.

----------

