# Lucid Dreaming > Attaining Lucidity > Wake Initiated Lucid Dreams (WILD) >  >  WILD Symptoms / Fast heart rate and sweating

## venn99

Hi

I think I am getting a better idea of what a WILD actually is, although there are still some stumbling blocks for me.

Those being:

1) Increased Heart Rate
2) Intense Perspiration
3) Legs Cramping (or the need to wildly kick them and move about the bad because of intense full body cramping)

Other than that I get the idea of interacting with the hypnogagic imagery and it seems to becoming more advanced and easy to form it and play with it, but the symptoms are still really strong to be able to advance into the dream.

I need ideas on how to minimize it.  I have found that not forcing the images helps and flowing with the already forming images minimizes the symptoms but does not eliminate them.  Any ideas?  Maybe just more practice?

I also wanted to add that sometimes it causes me to have to get out of bed because of the intensity.  Usually even after I get up my heard is still fluttering for 20 minutes or so!  Its almost more like it just vibrates or there is a weird vibration to it.  Sweating pretty much always accompanies it and this restlessness that makes it mandatory for me to flop about or just get up.

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## Zoth

I think you need to relax more. You seem too restless when you attempt to induce a WILD, which can pretty much ruin the whole experience.

Your goal is to simply relax and fall asleep, with a tiny amount of awareness of your intent, nothing else. Not paying active attention to HH, or any other events, like your heart rate or respiration, but instead just perceive them as an outside of your own body, tends to make it easier in order to fall asleep.

Have you considered trying meditation? It helped me a lot for WILD, as did some exercises of mindfulness.

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## gab

As zoth00 says, treat WILDing attempt as normal going to sleep event. I know I used to get very excited about it and it was hard to relax. If you must, trick your mind by telling yourself, that you just going to sleep normally. Then when getting close to falling asleep, start with mantra and do your thing.

*_Moved to WILD_

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## venn99

Yeah I think you just need to go with it rather than fight against it trying to make it happen, then you dont get those symptoms.  I'm waiting for it all to click.  Come s with self exploration

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## cmind

> I think I am getting a better idea of what a WILD actually is,



Apparently not, because this:





> 1) Increased Heart Rate
> 2) Intense Perspiration
> 3) Legs Cramping (or the need to wildly kick them and move about the bad because of intense full body cramping)



Has nothing, zero, zilch, to do with WILD. At no point during a WILD should you feel anything even close to these sensations.

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## venn99

> Apparently not, because this:
> 
> 
> 
> Has nothing, zero, zilch, to do with WILD. At no point during a WILD should you feel anything even close to these sensations.



OK Supreme Master Sensai

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## Sivason

I disagree. These sensations are experienced for a reason and at certain stages. The change in perceived body temp is likely because he is aware as his metabolism shifts. Experiencing any of this is not adverse to WILD, it is just adverse to pay much mind to it.

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## venn99

It gets too much to handle.  The symptoms are a good guide post to know I'm focusing too hard on keeping my mind awake.  Intrinsically, my mind wants to sleepor my body, but I'm not allowing it which is when the symptoms start for me.  Its really about a calibration of the senses.  The transition into wild, for me, needs to be more like a meditation and not a thought.  A smooth shift into a dream.  I've done it before and it was like a, snap of a finger but it came as the result of a placebo effect from a pill.  I had the thought in mind the pill would make me lucid .  Going to bed intending on waking up to take the pill to induce a lucid actually did so without taking it.  I dreamed I woke up and took it and had the best lucid of my life.  The moral of the story is, the belief , the thought, and the anchor or placebo was the mitigating factor.  Now I know thats the only thing missing.  Now that I realize the pill does nothing, and doesnt and hasn't, I need a new thought that will catapolt me into dream awareness like placebo.  I need some sort of thought / belief anchor that will one hundred percent work without becoming overbearing or stressful and naturally aid to the transition effortlessly.

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## Sageous

I'm not sure if you were making fun of CMind or not, Venna99, but he is absolutely right.  The symptoms you list truly have nothing to do with WILD.

I have no idea of course why you're getting those symptoms, but they have nothing to do with moving your consciousness from wake to dreaming.  Yes, HI and weird "noise" like vibrations might be witnessed on the way to a LD (and should, as Sivason just said, be ignored), but leg cramps, sweating, and an increased heart rate are symptoms of something else altogether.

You might consider looking into their cause and fixing the problem before your next WILD attempt.

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## venn99

> I'm not sure if you were making fun of CMind or not, Venna99, but he is absolutely right.  The symptoms you list truly have nothing to do with WILD.
> 
> I have no idea of course why you're getting those symptoms, but they have nothing to do with moving your consciousness from wake to dreaming.  Yes, HI and weird "noise" like vibrations might be witnessed on the way to a LD (and should, as Sivason just said, be ignored), but leg cramps, sweating, and an increased heart rate are symptoms of something else altogether.
> 
> You might consider looking into their cause and fixing the problem before your next WILD attempt.



He, nor you actually read the post.  The whole point of the thread was to reduce eliminate the symptoms altogether.  I am fully aware that they have little to nothing to do with initiating a successful WILD (because it feels like torture) and prevents me from sleeping), which is why each point I made clearly emphasizes on the distracting qualities of the sensations.  Although, I have entered SP after dealing with these sensations on multiple occasions .  I believe though the most successful WILD comes without frustration and should be an easy / smooth transition with little side effects, vibrations or the likes.

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## venn99

o_0

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## Scionox

> 3) Legs Cramping



Sounds like some intense hypnic jerk, i had alot of problems with hypnic jerks that were not letting me to fall asleep for WILD when i changed my sleeping schedule at one point, solved it by changing the schedule back, so maybe you could try changing the time at which you WILD?  :Thinking:

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## venn99

Yeah its annoying.  If I didn't have the symptoms, WILD would be a, breeze.  I have to learn to become quite surgical in my attempts.  Trial and error mostly

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## Sageous

> He, nor you actually read the post.  The whole point of the thread was to reduce eliminate the symptoms altogether.  I am fully aware that they have little to nothing to do with initiating a successful WILD (because it feels like torture) and prevents me from sleeping), which is why each point I made clearly emphasizes on the distracting qualities of the sensations.  Although, I have entered SP after dealing with these sensations on multiple occasions .  I believe though the most successful WILD comes without frustration and should be an easy / smooth transition with little side effects, vibrations or the likes.



I did read the post, though it did appear after I made my post, _and_ I did read the OP which was entitled "WILD Symptoms." Sorry I misunderstood, but I hope you can see why that happened... did _you_ read your posts?  

Aside from repeating that you really shouldn't be getting your medical advice from website forums, I think I'll just say never mind, then; sorry to bother you.

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## venn99

The symptoms have nothing to do with a medical issue and have everything to do with a, state of dis ease from forcing my mind awake .
when its trying to sleep as its the only time it occurs.

essentially I was looking for a, way to minimize the buffer effect that seems to arise during wild.  I didn't think I had enough room for all that in the title.

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## Sageous

^^  Then you _are_ saying these things are symptoms of attempting WILD, which by definition is the conscious "forcing" of wakefulness straight through to sleep. This is very confusing.

 I'll stop now, as I can see that any advice offered will be met with argument rather than consideration. I, and apparently a few others here, clearly do not understand what you're looking for. Sorry for taking the time to offer help.

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## venn99

No its pretty much just you.  All  posts are considered and helpful even if not directly.  I'm not bothered by you or your comments so dont apologize.  It seemed some clarification was needed.  No need to hyperventillate about it.  I disagree the definition of WILD is forcing yourself awake.  I personally believe, and your perceptions , definitions and ideologies may differ, and thats fine, but I think its more about making an emotional connection to the dream state than forcing the mind to do things that translate into discomfort in the body, but thats just me.

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## Sageous

^^ Sigh.  Trust me, I don't "hyperventilate," I was only trying to help.

I never said WILD was "forcing the mind to do things that translate into discomfort for the body."  In fact I'm pretty sure I  said exactly the opposite when I said that those "symptoms" are not associated with WILD.  But what's the point, right?  It's your thread, where you can define WILD anyway you'd like, regardless of its accepted definition.  

As I said, never mind. I'll unsubscribe from this thread now, and be careful not to darken your door again.

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## venn99

LOL.  Ok have a, good one.  I hope youll be alright

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## gab

> LOL.  Ok have a, good one.  I hope youll be alright



Yeah, he'll be allright. No need to get so defensive and rude. He is not just _trying_ to help, he actually is helping. So is everybody else in this thread.

Those 3 symptoms you listed really are not symptoms of a WILD. On occasion, some people do complain of cramps, increased heart rate or breathing. Some of those could be from excitement, some, like heartrate may be increased as you enter dream (I have experienced this myself), but most likely you feel your body because you are concentrating on how your body feels. Or you may have some condition.

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## Caboose128

Okay, for starters I don't see the point of all the arguing that has gone on in this thread. Everyone's WILD attempts will be unique their own body/mind/expectations, so by saying the OP's 3 listed symptoms have absolutely nothing to do with a "true" WILD, is pretty silly if you ask me. I have had both successful and unsuccessful WILD attempts, and on my unsuccessful ones I experience a lot of what you said you were going through. I'd get all sweaty, heart rate would increase (due to anxiety), and my body would insist on making sudden jerking movements. In fact, these symptoms appear to some extent every time I have trouble sleeping. I suffer from occasional insomnia, when this happens I find I'm just too anxious and unable to shut off or calm my mind. Too many racing thoughts, which leads to anxiety about not getting to sleep which leads to body discomfort and so on. This is what I believe is happening to you, OP. You are simply trying to hard, focusing too much, which in turn just makes it harder and takes you farther away from your goal. Relax a little more, understanding that the WILD will come when it is ready, especially if you continue to carry that emotional attachment to the dream state which you were referring to. I also believe this to be very helpful, just the act of holding the intention that you will WILD eventually helps immensely. You just need to let it happen.

On a side note, almost every single time I have awoken from a lucid dream, WILD, DILD, DEILD what have you, I have noticed that I have been sweating profusely. The more lucid I am in the dream, the more I'll be sweating. At first I thought maybe sweating and the dream state are related. But it wasn't that simple. Upon waking from non lucid dreams I found myself not sweating at all, which lead to believe there's a connection between sweating and one's level of lucidity. 

Good luck and hope this was helpful!

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## gab

Oh yeah, forgot to lock this thread, sorry. OP is not with us anymore. If there is a new question, please make a new thread.

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