# Lucid Dreaming > Attaining Lucidity > Lucid Aids >  >  L-aspartic acid, L-glutamine, L-theanine.

## Arthurium

Has anyone tried this yet? Seems interesting. 

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New article about LDS in the advancedld site: http://www.advancedld.com/f/Substanc...case_study.pdf

It seems that Yuschak found new combinations that does not require Galantamine, such as this combination: 2000mg L-aspartic acid, 4000mg L-glutamine, and 300mg L-theanine.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartic_acid
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glutamine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theanine

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## westonci

Thomas Yuschak, a respected Lucid Dream Researcher has just come out with a study on certain substances and how they increase your odds of becoming Lucid.

http://www.advancedld.com/f/Substanc...case_study.pdf

You can find the results in the end of the article.

One of the most successful substance he used was something he calls an "Amino Acid Blend" which is made up with

2000mg L-aspartic acid
4000mg L-glutamine
300mg L-theanine.

His research suggest that this "Amino Acid Blend" rivals Galantamine in its effectiveness, and has virtually no side effects at those dosages

I gotta try it, anyone know where i can by these?

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## I H8 Reality

It also says that 8 mg Galantamine + 40 mg Propranonol had a high success rate and had very high lucidity

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## unseen wombat

> Thomas Yuschak, a respected Lucid Dream Researcher has just come out with a study on certain substances and how they increase your odds of becoming Lucid.
> 
> http://www.advancedld.com/f/Substanc...case_study.pdf
> 
> You can find the results in the end of the article.
> 
> One of the most successful substance he used was something he calls an "Amino Acid Blend" which is made up with
> 
> 2000mg L-aspartic acid
> ...



The Vitamin Shoppe

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## Patrick

That is very interesting stuff, and I respect that man a lot for taking that line of research. Our scientific understanding of lucidity needs to be expanded - and that's what I hope to do in my future career. However, Yuschak didn't mention anything about if these drugs are widely availiable, and I presume that not all of them are.

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## superlox3

Although it is very interesting work, I would be hesitant about taking any of this.  But then again, maybe I'm just being overcautious.  How exactly are you supposed to take these though?  With water?  Straight up?  I'd like to know a bit more before I do anything.

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## westonci

> Although it is very interesting work, I would be hesitant about taking any of this.  But then again, maybe I'm just being overcautious.  How exactly are you supposed to take these though?  With water?  Straight up?  I'd like to know a bit more before I do anything.



I'll admit i wouldn't take most of the things they've listed. BUT, surprisingly the Amino Acid Blend which had one of the highest success rate has no virtually no side effects.

Its just amino acids, which are extremely safe.

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## westonci

> Although it is very interesting work, I would be hesitant about taking any of this.  But then again, maybe I'm just being overcautious.  How exactly are you supposed to take these though?  With water?  Straight up?  I'd like to know a bit more before I do anything.



*Experimental Investigation – Method*

On each experimental night, the subject slept naturally for approximately 3.5 to
4.5 hours before the testing period. The subject was awakened and then ingested the
prescribed supplements for that night’s test along with approximately 6oz of water. The
subject then immediately returned to bed and targeted falling to sleep approximately 45
minutes after the ingestion of the supplements. He reported the results by filling out a
detailed questionnaire the following morning which included rankings on dream
vividness, recall, lucidity, quality of sleep, and so on. The results were then compiled at
the end of the study.

Page. 11

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## superlox3

Thanks for the clarity.  And sorry about the inconvenience.  I'll read things more carefully next time.  Very interesting stuff!

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## Arthurium

I have done some research, and I do not understand why Aspartic Acid is necessary here.

In my limited understanding Aspartic Acid and Glutamine are both NMDA agonists, and Aspartic Acid has a limited ability to cross the blood brain barrier so It seems it would work as well to use the later two in combination to get the desired results. "Activation of NMDA receptors requires binding of glutamate or aspartate (aspartate does not stimulate the receptors as strongly.[7])"

What am I missing?

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## westonci

where can i buy these, at the prescribed dosages?

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## Arthurium

> where can i buy these, at the prescribed dosages?



I found the later two at Vitamin World, I think you have to buy aspartic acid off the net. I could not find those dosages or even close so I was going to take multiple pills to get the desired dosage.

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## Arthurium

I think I am going to try just the later two tonight and report back to you folks tomorrow.

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## TalkingHead

Does galantamine have side effects?

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## Zimmerman

> Does galantamine have side effects?



I've had and read about others having stomach upset the following morning, usually it's just for a couple hours or until i have a... movement  :Oops: .  sometimes i feel weak and shaky the next morning for a bit also, but other than that i'm usually ok.  especially if i just stick to the 4mg dose... 

also i've heard that the people who take piracetam the next morning have less side effects.

really curious to try out this amino acid blend, do you think all the ingredients are easy to get at a local pharmacy?

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## Arthurium

I woke up naturally after sleeping 2 1/2 hours, and took 4000mg Glutamine , and 500mg of Theanine. I stayed up for 30 minutes then went and layed down. 

I did the WILD method, but it did not work to get my lucid. Although, I had results. 

Eventually after 20 minutes my body went into SP, I began to feel as though I was traveling at amazing speeds and I was seeing lots of colors. But I ignored then and pretended to be asleep and they just went away. This repeated it self 3 times, and I counted to 550, then I had no will left and went to bed.

The combination did not have any side effects (As I would expect with the natural of the chemicals I ingested). Also, I feel completely normal this morning.

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## Zimmerman

> Eventually after 20 minutes my body went into SP, I began to feel as though I was traveling at amazing speeds and I was seeing lots of colors. But I ignored then and pretended to be asleep and they just went away. This repeated it self 3 times, and I counted to 550, then I had no will left and went to bed.
> 
> The combination did not have any side effects (As I would expect with the natural of the chemicals I ingested). Also, I feel completely normal this morning.



So Aspartic Acid really might not be necessary... that's cool if it's the harder one to find without ordering it off the net.

Definitely sounds like a possible Galantamine without side effects... eager to hear more results about this.  I might have to take a look around and see if I can't find this combo.

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## Arthurium

> So Aspartic Acid really might not be necessary... that's cool if it's the harder one to find without ordering it off the net.
> 
> Definitely sounds like a possible Galantamine without side effects... eager to hear more results about this.  I might have to take a look around and see if I can't find this combo.



I actually have a head ache but I think that is sleep related or lack there of lately. I will try these two and Galantamine tonight as they did in the study paper.

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## westonci

> I woke up naturally after sleeping 2 1/2 hours, and took 4000mg Glutamine , and 500mg of Theanine. I stayed up for 30 minutes then went and layed down. 
> 
> I did the WILD method, but it did not work to get my lucid. Although, I had results. 
> 
> Eventually after 20 minutes my body went into SP, I began to feel as though I was traveling at amazing speeds and I was seeing lots of colors. But I ignored then and pretended to be asleep and they just went away. This repeated it self 3 times, and I counted to 550, then I had no will left and went to bed.
> 
> The combination did not have any side effects (As I would expect with the natural of the chemicals I ingested). Also, I feel completely normal this morning.



According to the paper the test subject had 3.5-4.5 hours of sleep before waking up and ingesting the amino acid blend. So the next time you do it sleep a little longer. Try 5 hours of sleep next time

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## westonci

> I actually have a head ache but I think that is sleep related or lack there of lately. I will try these two and Galantamine tonight as they did in the study paper.



Although they has success with the combo of Amino Acid Blend and Galantamine, Yuschak said it resulted in short Lucid Dream. So I would recommend taking the Amino Acid Blend alone.

"The amino acid blend resulted in a significant increase in odds of experiencing a
lucid dream when used either alone or in combination with galantamine. The
combination, although effective, resulted in very short lucid episodes due to the increased
likelihood of awakening." 

Page 12

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## Arthurium

[quote]According to the paper the test subject had 3.5-4.5 hours of sleep before waking up and ingesting the amino acid blend. So the next time you do it sleep a little longer. Try 5 hours of sleep next time[quote]

It really does appear that is the issue. I will attempt this again tonight and tell you what happens. 

Would there be a problem with doing this without a break? Being they are just amino acids, I don't think a break is necessary.

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## westonci

Also im not to sure but I think L-aspratic acid is important.

"Aspartate (the conjugate base of aspartic acid) is a direct NMDA agonist. The ability of aspartic acid to cross the blood brain barrier is limited however, to an easily saturated transport mechanism [7] thus the addition of glutamine and theanine."

Page 9

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## westonci

[quote=Arthurium;672329][quote]According to the paper the test subject had 3.5-4.5 hours of sleep before waking up and ingesting the amino acid blend. So the next time you do it sleep a little longer. Try 5 hours of sleep next time



> It really does appear that is the issue. I will attempt this again tonight and tell you what happens. 
> 
> Would there be a problem with doing this without a break? Being they are just amino acids, I don't think a break is necessary.



A break (WBTB) is extremely important in the success of any supplement. Your first 4 hours of sleep is mostly deep non-rem sleep.

According to article

"On each experimental night, the subject slept naturally for approximately 3.5 to
4.5 hours before the testing period. The subject was awakened and then ingested the
prescribed supplements for that nights test along with approximately 6oz of water. The
subject then immediately returned to bed and targeted falling to sleep approximately 45
minutes after the ingestion of the supplements."

Page 11

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## Arthurium

> Also im not to sure but I think L-aspratic acid is important.
> 
> "Aspartate (the conjugate base of aspartic acid) is a direct NMDA agonist. The ability of aspartic acid to cross the blood brain barrier is limited however, to an easily saturated transport mechanism [7] thus the addition of glutamine and theanine."
> 
> Page 9



But Glutamate is a NMDA agonist also.

"Activation of NMDA receptors requires binding of glutamate or aspartate (aspartate does not stimulate the receptors as strongly.[7])"

Glutamate is far superior at crossing the blood brain barrier compared to Aspartate, so I do not understand why he wanted to use it.

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## Arthurium

> Although they has success with the combo of Amino Acid Blend and Galantamine, Yuschak said it resulted in short Lucid Dream. So I would recommend taking the Amino Acid Blend alone.
> 
> "The amino acid blend resulted in a significant increase in odds of experiencing a
> lucid dream when used either alone or in combination with galantamine. The
> combination, although effective, resulted in very short lucid episodes due to the increased
> likelihood of awakening." 
> 
> Page 12



I have tried Galantamine twice and gotten SP both times with no lucid, and this blend once with SP but no lucid so I was figuring that maybe combining them would work for me. But I am thinking that it makes more sense that I was waking way to early and was not in my REM stage of sleep. 

So tonight I will try the amino blend (the later two) and wake 5 hours after going to sleep. 

I will report back in the morning, but I am confident that if I can sleep without waking for five hours that this strategy will work for me.

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## westonci

> I have tried Galantamine twice and gotten SP both times with no lucid, and this blend once with SP but no lucid so I was figuring that maybe combining them would work for me. But I am thinking that it makes more sense that I was waking way to early and was not in my REM stage of sleep. 
> 
> So tonight I will try the amino blend (the later two) and wake 5 hours after going to sleep. 
> 
> I will report back in the morning, but I am confident that if I can sleep without waking for five hours that this strategy will work for me.



usually when i do WBTB i wake up 6 hours later after going to sleep, if i try it before that it doesn't work well for me.

Your odds of becoming lucid go up substantially after 5-6 hours of sleep

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## Arthurium

> usually when i do WBTB i wake up 6 hours later after going to sleep, if i try it before that it doesn't work well for me.
> 
> Your odds of becoming lucid go up substantially after 5-6 hours of sleep



Wow. I have never heard of six hours. I will try 5 and 6 the next few nights and report back. 

Thank a bunch.

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## dodobird

> But Glutamate is a NMDA agonist also.
> 
> "Activation of NMDA receptors requires binding of glutamate or aspartate (aspartate does not stimulate the receptors as strongly.[7])"
> 
> Glutamate is far superior at crossing the blood brain barrier compared to Aspartate, so I do not understand why he wanted to use it.



I suggest you ask him by email.

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## Arthurium

> It has long been observed that activation of microglia leads to the secretion of N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptor-activating substances, able to cause excitotoxicity [40 , 41 ], including glutamate itself [42 43 44 ]. Likewise, monocytes/macrophages also secrete NMDA receptor agonists in response to immune stimulation [45 46 47 ]. Nevertheless, glutamate itself may only account for 30&#37; of NMDA receptor stimulation by stimulated macrophage secretory products [47 ], suggesting that other agonists must be produced.



http://www.jleukbio.org/cgi/content/full/80/5/1067

Found another source that supports that you dont need Aspartic Acid, unless it is doing something other then stimulating secretion from NMDA receptors.

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## Arthurium

> I suggest you ask him by email.



Good idea.

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## Arthurium

> Hello,
> 
> Good questions.
> 
> L-glutamine leads to increased glutamate levels in the brain. Glutamate is a
> general agonist which means that it binds to the NMDA, AMPA, and Kainate
> type receptors pretty much equally. Aspartate binds only to the NMDA
> receptors. Lucid dreams are more favorable if the NMDA receptors are more
> targeted than the other receptor types. When you take L-glutamine then
> ...




This was the reply from him. Very interesting!

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## Arthurium

Here is a link to Aspartic Acid if you want it:

http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=998&at=0

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## Thor

> I'll admit i wouldn't take most of the things they've listed. BUT, surprisingly the Amino Acid Blend which had one of the highest success rate has no virtually no side effects.
> 
> Its just amino acids, which are extremely safe.



This is generally false. For example, whereas L-theanine is a very safe substance, L-aspartic acid is an excitotoxin.

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## Thor

> Does galantamine have side effects?



Plenty. For example, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, dizziness, decreased appetite or weight loss. Then again, I have never heard about anyone here on Dream Views who has experienced any significant side effects from galantamine, so they are probably not that common. You also have to keep in mind that the clinical studies of galantamine have focused on the use of galantamine as a treatment for Alzheimer's disease. Alzheimer's patients typically take 8-24mg of galantamine every day, whereas lucid dreamers take 4-8mg of galantamine maybe once or twice a week.

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## Lu¢idityy

I don't think i'll be taking anything. I might just stick with my body how it functions alredy.  :boogie:

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## Astrius

Okay, I've just purchased some aspartic acid, l-theanine and l-glutamine on-line. The question is... could I also add alpha-gpc to the mix? Thomas Yuschak recommends doing so with regard to galantamine/choline, but there's no mention of it in conection with this Amino Blend.

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## Arthurium

He reports in his paper 100% success rate with these 3 amino acids. So why complicate the results? You know "Don't fix it if its not broke".

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## Astrius

> He reports in his paper 100% success rate with these 3 amino acids. So why complicate the results? You know "Don't fix it if its not broke".



Yeah, that's true, I guess. However, it seems that alpha-gpc was specifically used to "extend" the period of lucidity. So even if the amino blend works great, I'm wondering if the actual _duration_ of lucidity could be extended with alpha-gpc, as in the case of galantamine/choline.

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## Arthurium

> Yeah, that's true, I guess. However, it seems that alpha-gpc was specifically used to "extend" the period of lucidity. So even if the amino blend works great, I'm wondering if the actual _duration_ of lucidity could be extended with alpha-gpc, as in the case of galantamine/choline.



"Alpha GPC apparently is able to deliver choline to the brain." -- from wikipedia. 

So this stuff causes the same reaction in your brain as the amino acid blend  and Galantamine / Choline. I would not use it at first due to the results he published as to the combination of the amino acid blend and galantimine.  Although, I do not believe it to be harmful because of the avenue it uses to be effective. 

"The amino acid blend resulted in a significant increase in odds of experiencing a
lucid dream when used either alone or in combination with galantamine. The
combination, although effective, resulted in very short lucid episodes due to the increased
likelihood of awakening." 

If you do try it please report your experience though  :smiley:

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## TalkingHead

Westonci:  Have you ordered these from the Vitamine Shoppe yet?  I think I'm going to have to make myself the Guinea Pig if no one else is..

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## westonci

im having trouble finding them at near those dosages, here in canada I cant find L-aspartic acid.

L-glutamine and L-Theanine I can get, but i cant find L-aspartic acid

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## Lu¢idityy

I researched these further. Taking these dosages has a extreme effect on how your body relaxes. When you go into a Day-to-Day dream it will be mega vivid and the recall on the dream will be great. If you get into a lucid, the quality of the dream will be a huge thing. You practically become a Game-Master inside a dream. ^^ Take these dosages with procaution. They may change your bodily functions and i don't think i'll take them still!

 ::D:

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## dodobird

Mods, it would be nice if you merge this thread with the second  L-aspartic acid, L-glutamine, L-theanine thread:
http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=51488

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## StephenT

Does anybody know if this would cause regular dreams to become less vivid like galantamine can do?

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## TalkingHead

Well I did just order those from VitaminShoppe.com  They were very close to the required dosages and I imagine you can go slightly over no?  As for the aspartic acid.. they have it in a powder that can be easily measured out.  

There's no reason why these have to be consumed in that exact ratio right?  It's okay to be close?

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## Astrius

Thomas was kind enough to reply to this question and here is what he wrote...





> I wouldn't add the GPC for a few reasons. It really isn't necessary when using the amino blend and personally I'm trying to keep the overall mix to a minimum. Also, GPC works on a completely different pathway than the amino blend. GPC and galantamine work on the cholinergic pathway and the amino blend works on the glutamateric pathway. By alternating these groups of substances, you may be able to achieve more frequent lucid dreams: galantamine mix one night, amino blend on the next attempt, followed by a galantamine mix, etc. I still suggest that you take at least one night off in-between attempts however. 
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Thomas Yuschak

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## westonci

> Well I did just order those from VitaminShoppe.com  They were very close to the required dosages and I imagine you can go slightly over no?  As for the aspartic acid.. they have it in a powder that can be easily measured out.  
> 
> There's no reason why these have to be consumed in that exact ratio right?  It's okay to be close?



I e-mailed Thomas Yuschak and asked him where he bought his amino acids, and he said.


*L-glutamine : http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....&pid=1695&at=1*

*L-aspartic acid: http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=998&at=1*

*L-theanine: http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=282&at=1*

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## unseen wombat

The only problem with these is that they resulted in only short episodes of lucidity. I can understand the attractiveness to someone who has been trying for years to LD with no success, but I want looooong LD's now that I know that I can get them. I think the Galantamine combined with Propranalol sounds more promising, but it's prescription.  :Sad: 

Also, the results are impressive, but the study included only one subject. Who is this guy? All it said is he was 40, and experienced in lucid induction techniques. Is he an ordinary LD'er, or is he some kind of lucid master who can LD at will? Could this one individual's brain chemistry have had an impact on the results? I would say yes. If I did a study and included one subject with an acetylcholine deficit in his brai, I would conclude that Choline Bitartrate is the holy grail of LD'ing, which is obviously not true. This study needs to be done over a broader range of subjects to have any meaning at all to the rest of us.

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## westonci

> The only problem with these is that they resulted in only short episodes of lucidity. I can understand the attractiveness to someone who has been trying for years to LD with no success, but I want looooong LD's now that I know that I can get them. I think the Galantamine combined with Propranalol sounds more promising, but it's prescription. 
> 
> Also, the results are impressive, but the study included only one subject. Who is this guy? All it said is he was 40, and experienced in lucid induction techniques. Is he an ordinary LD'er, or is he some kind of lucid master who can LD at will? Could this one individual's brain chemistry have had an impact on the results? I would say yes. If I did a study and included one subject with an acetylcholine deficit in his brai, I would conclude that Choline Bitartrate is the holy grail of LD'ing, which is obviously not true. This study needs to be done over a broader range of subjects to have any meaning at all to the rest of us.



I think you misread one part; the  Amino Acid Blend resulted in normal length Lucid Dreams *BUT* Amino acid blend combined with Galantamine resulted in short Ld's. 

Thats what i thought at first too. 

_"The amino acid blend resulted in a significant increase in odds of experiencing a lucid dream when used either alone or in combination with galantamine. The combination, although effective, resulted in very short lucid episodes due to the increased
likelihood of awakening."_

_page 12

_Go to page 13 of the paper, and you'll see that the Amino Acid Blend, and Amino acid blend+galantamine are separate.

The reason he mentions this is because contrary to assumptions that Galantamine would help the Amino Acid Blend, it reduces its effectiveness. I think its because Galantamine work on the cholinergic pathway and the amino blend works on the glutamateric pathway

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## nechong

hi west,

so how is it? so far how is your success rate with the combination? do u really got lucid dream everyhtime u use that?

thanks

chong

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## Needcatscan

Well i just ordered the blend, so I'll post results when I try them.

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## westonci

> hi west,
> 
> so how is it? so far how is your success rate with the combination? do u really got lucid dream everyhtime u use that?
> 
> thanks
> 
> chong



i just ordered them from www.iherb.com

*L-glutamine : http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....&pid=1695&at=1*

*L-aspartic acid: http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=998&at=1*

*L-theanine: http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=282&at=1*

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## Manifest

Are you just supposed to mix it all in a glass of water, or take them 1 at a time? :x

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## westonci

> Are you just supposed to mix it all in a glass of water, or take them 1 at a time? :x



either way it will all mix in your stomach, but the Glutamine and Aspartic acid are powder, and theanine is in capsules. 

So i would mix the glutamine and aspartic acid in water stir it, then drink it with the theanine capsule

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## dodobird

> Also, the results are impressive, but the study included only one subject. Who is this guy? All it said is he was 40, and experienced in lucid induction techniques. Is he an ordinary LD'er, or is he some kind of lucid master who can LD at will? Could this one individual's brain chemistry have had an impact on the results? I would say yes. If I did a study and included one subject with an acetylcholine deficit in his brai, I would conclude that Choline Bitartrate is the holy grail of LD'ing, which is obviously not true. This study needs to be done over a broader range of subjects to have any meaning at all to the rest of us.



I think the subject of the test was Yushchak himself. It is a limited study, but based on the success of his earlier methods, it is safe to assume that there is a chance of success to this method as well. In any case, several of us are going to test this method soon, and then we will have more data as to the effectiveness of it.

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## superlox3

Could someone please give it to me in a nutshell, as I have heard some contradicting statements on this subject.

Are these Amino Acids safe to take as is described in the study?
Are there short-term effects?
Are there long-term effects?

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## TalkingHead

> Could someone please give it to me in a nutshell, as I have heard some contradicting statements on this subject.
> 
> Are these Amino Acids safe to take as is described in the study?
> Are there short-term effects?
> Are there long-term effects?



(Man in laboratory with white coat): "Guinea Pigs don't get to ask those kinds of questions."   

I however will be happy to report back to you in 30 years though there are lots of variables in the way

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## TalkingHead

And haven't you ever heard the phrase "What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger"  ::alien::

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## StephenT

Well, taking Galantamine over time causes dreams to become less vivid without it, and it will cause you to need to take more and more over time.

So it would actually make you weaker.  Which is why I want to know if this will do it also.

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## Arthurium

> I've had and read about others having stomach upset the following morning, usually it's just for a couple hours or until i have a... movement .  sometimes i feel weak and shaky the next morning for a bit also, but other than that i'm usually ok.  especially if i just stick to the 4mg dose... 
> 
> also i've heard that the people who take piracetam the next morning have less side effects.
> 
> really curious to try out this amino acid blend, do you think all the ingredients are easy to get at a local pharmacy?




I have virtually no side effects with Galantamine or the amino acid blend.

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## StephenT

You've done the Amino?

How long have you been doing it for?  How frequently?  Have you experienced any loss in vividness or recall while not using the blend?

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## Arthurium

> You've done the Amino?
> 
> How long have you been doing it for? How frequently? Have you experienced any loss in vividness or recall while not using the blend?



I have done it 4 times, all without Aspartic Acid. 

I did it over the last week, and my vividness/recal has had no change when not using it. 

Although, I have had no LDs with it or Galantamine, I cant seem to get past SP and in to the dream state.

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## dodobird

> Well, taking Galantamine over time causes dreams to become less vivid without it, and it will cause you to need to take more and more over time.



Is this from your experience of Galantamine? I ask because I have not heard such a report yet.

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## unseen wombat

Yeah, that kind of scares me. It's the first I've heard of it too though.

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## Arthurium

I found out that Aspartic Acid is an excitotoxin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excitotoxicity). Meaning it can possibly cause damage to nerve cells in your brain.

Its interesting that Aspartame (The diet sweetener), partially turns to Aspartic Acid (40% of it). There is a large debate about how the damages your brain.

Aspartame in drinks has an average of 200mg per drink, which in turn is becomes 80mg of Aspartic Acid, and this combination suggests to take 20 times that amount.

Is this safe? I am doubting that. 

Anyone know anything about this? It concerns me.

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## Arthurium

Thomas Yuschak was kind enough to reply to me:





> Aspartic acid is quite safe when taken orally.  There is more than 2000mg of aspartic acid in just 3oz of orange roughy.  Aspartic acid would be considered an excitotoxin if it were injected directly  into the brain but when taken orally, the blood brain barrier controls the rate  at which it enters such that it stays well below the excitoxin level.  
> 
> Thomas

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## dodobird

> Thomas Yuschak was kind enough to reply to me:
> Quote:
> 
> Aspartic acid is quite safe when taken orally. There is more than 2000mg of aspartic acid in just 3oz of orange roughy. Aspartic acid would be considered an excitotoxin if it were injected directly into the brain but when taken orally, the blood brain barrier controls the rate at which it enters such that it stays well below the excitoxin level. 
> 
> Thomas
> 
> [/size][/font]



This looks like a mistake. According to nutritiondata.com, there is just about 120mg of aspartic acid in 3oz of orange.
However, there is lots and lots of aspartic acid in other foods. 
For example, a little bit more than half a cup of blanched almonds (75gr) has about 2000mg of aspartic acid, and also 4000mg of L-glutamine. This means that maybe we can eat food instead of taking the supplements ( apart of the L-Theanine ). The question is if it takes the food a longer time to be digested, or if the other nutrients interfer with the effect.

I will try tonight: I'll take 300mg L-theanine and 75 grams of blanched almonds when doing WBTB and report the results.

----------


## westonci

thanks for the info! 

I think you mistaken glutamine for glutamaric acid. 75mg of blanched almonds has 4000mg of glutameric acid not glutamine

But what makes blanched almonds, so different from normal almonds?

----------


## dodobird

> thanks for the info! 
> 
> I think you mistaken glutamine for glutamaric acid. 75mg of blanched almonds has 4000mg of glutameric acid not glutamine
> 
> But what makes blanched almonds, so different from normal almonds?



L-Glutamine = Glutamic acid.

Blanched almonds are pretty much the same as normal almonds, but I heard that they are healthier, though I'm not sure about that.

Further probing about Glutamic acid and Aspertic Acid sources, revealed that about 2/3 of a cup of cooked soy beans also contains more than enough Glutamic acid and Aspertic Acid for the Amino blend, and soy may be easier to eat before bed time or at WBTB than almonds.

The problem is that I don't know how long it takes to digest such food products. It may take longer than when taking the supplements because the body needs to break the proteins into the amino acids. 
If it takes too long, than it may not be very effective for LD induction because possibly a quick increase of the amino acids in the brain is needed. 
I will try different doses and sources, taken at different times, and report what I come up with

EDIT: westonci pointed out that Glutamic acid is different than Glutamine. I do not know which food products, if any contain enough Glutamine for the Amino Blend.

----------


## westonci

according to nutritiondata.com  Normal Almonds contain more aspartic acid and glutamic acid than blanched Almonds

----------


## westonci

i asked Thomas Yuschak about taking Almonds instead of Glutamine and Aspartic acid in free form.
*
Hello,

Foods might be an option but there are factors that could interfere. The absorption time would be considerably slower compared to a freeform amino acid. Also the food might contain other substances that could interfere with the result. 

I wouldn't rule it out but I also wouldn't necessarily consider it a direct replacement.

Also, glutamine is not the same thing as glutamic acid. They are related but very different. Glutamine crosses the blood brain barrier very easily but glutamic acid does not.

Good Luck*
_Thomas Yuschak_

----------


## dodobird

> i asked Thomas Yuschak about taking Almonds instead of Glutamine and Aspartic acid in free form.
> 
> _Hello,_
> 
> _Foods might be an option but there are factors that could interfere. The absorption time would be considerably slower compared to a freeform amino acid. Also the food might contain other substances that could interfere with the result._ 
> 
> _I wouldn't rule it out but I also wouldn't necessarily consider it a direct replacement._
> 
> _Also, glutamine is not the same thing as glutamic acid. They are related but very different. Glutamine crosses the blood brain barrier very easily but glutamic acid does not._
> ...



Thanks for the correction, westonci.
It's annoying that nutritiondata.com ( or any other site that I found ) does not display the amount of glutamine in the food products.

----------


## Arthurium

I have tried this so far about 8 times, and almost every single time I just fall asleep. 

It makes me really tired after I take it. Where as galantamine does not. 

Whats up with that?

----------


## westonci

> I have tried this so far about 8 times, and almost every single time I just fall asleep.
> 
> It makes me really tired after I take it. Where as galantamine does not.
> 
> Whats up with that?



what exactly do you take? (in what form)

When do you take it?

----------


## Arthurium

2000mg of aspartic acid in free form
4000mg of L-glutamine in free form
and 300mg L-Theanine in pills. 

I usually go to bed at 10 and wake up at 3:30, take the combo, stay up for 45 minutes. 

Then I go to bed, I used to be able to get to SP every time.

----------


## westonci

> 2000mg of aspartic acid in free form
> 4000mg of L-glutamine in free form
> and 300mg L-Theanine in pills. 
> 
> I usually go to bed at 10 and wake up at 3:30, take the combo, stay up for 45 minutes. 
> 
> Then I go to bed, I used to be able to get to SP every time.



Yous should e-mail Thomas Yuschak about this. He usually replies quickly.

----------


## Arthurium

Does it usually work for you? 

I will email him. Thanks.

----------


## westonci

According to his case study - Substances that facilitate lucid dreams

_Experimental Investigation – Method

On each experimental night, the subject slept naturally for approximately 3.5 to 4.5 hours before the testing period. The subject was awakened and then ingested the prescribed supplements for that night’s test along with approximately 6oz of water. The subject then immediately returned to bed and targeted falling to sleep approximately 45 minutes after the ingestion of the supplements. He reported the results by filling out a detailed questionnaire the following morning which included rankings on dream vividness, recall, lucidity, quality of sleep, and so on. The results were then compiled at the end of the study._

_page 11_

According to this you shouldn't stay awake for 45 minutes, but fall asleep immediately after taking the Amino Acid Blend. Next time try to fall asleep as soon as you ingest the supplement and "target falling to sleep approximately 45 minutes after the ingestion of the supplements"

----------


## Moonbeam

My stuff came yesterday, and I tried it last night.  It was really amazing--I had the most realistic lucids that I have ever had, I think--almost too realistic; it was so real I almost couldn't control anything and I woke myself up twice, both times into FA's in which I immediately became lucid again.   The whole thing lasted at least an hour.

I went to bed about 11:00, woke up about 4:20.  My scale isn't very accurate, so I probably had closer to 3 grams each of aspartic acid and glutamine (I wante to make sure I had enough).  I took that with 300 mg of theanine and went back to bed.  I had a little trouble falling asleep, I think it was between 4:45 and 5:00.  Then I woke up for real at about 6:10.  I got up, wrote down my dreams, and was able to go back to sleep and had more dreams but not lucid.

This is different than the galantamine-choline mix; that is a lot more trippy feeling, hard to remember exactly what happened, the strange body-awareness which can inhibit your dream actions, etc.  This experience was  reality-like in its vividness, but felt entirely like I was dreaming--no real-body awareness at all.

----------


## Astrius

> My stuff came yesterday, and I tried it last night.  It was really amazing



Hi Moonbeam. Glad to hear of your success with this combo. I also tried it last night, however, and it didn't seem to do anything at all as regards lucidity (see DJ). I did take it at bedtime though, which probably made a difference. Still, I _have_ taken theanine/glutamine after a few hours sleep before.... again, to no avail. Anyway, I think I'll have one more go with the full triple combo next week, this time after some sleep.

----------


## Moonbeam

I think it will work a lot better if you take it in the AM after some sleep.

----------


## westonci

> My stuff came yesterday, and I tried it last night.  It was really amazing--I had the most realistic lucids that I have ever had, I think--almost too realistic; it was so real I almost couldn't control anything and I woke myself up twice, both times into FA's in which I immediately became lucid again.   The whole thing lasted at least an hour.
> 
> I went to bed about 11:00, woke up about 4:20.  My scale isn't very accurate, so I probably had closer to 3 grams each of aspartic acid and glutamine (I wante to make sure I had enough).  I took that with 300 mg of theanine and went back to bed.  I had a little trouble falling asleep, I think it was between 4:45 and 5:00.  Then I woke up for real at about 6:10.  I got up, wrote down my dreams, and was able to go back to sleep and had more dreams but not lucid.
> 
> This is different than the galantamine-choline mix; that is a lot more trippy feeling, hard to remember exactly what happened, the strange body-awareness which can inhibit your dream actions, etc.  This experience was  reality-like in its vividness, but felt entirely like I was dreaming--no real-body awareness at all.



congratulations, wow an hour!! Now you really motivated me.

Did you go to sleep immediately after taking the supplement?

----------


## dodobird

> My stuff came yesterday, and I tried it last night. It was really amazing--I had the most realistic lucids that I have ever had, I think--almost too realistic; it was so real I almost couldn't control anything and I woke myself up twice, both times into FA's in which I immediately became lucid again. The whole thing lasted at least an hour.
> 
> I went to bed about 11:00, woke up about 4:20. My scale isn't very accurate, so I probably had closer to 3 grams each of aspartic acid and glutamine (I wante to make sure I had enough). I took that with 300 mg of theanine and went back to bed. I had a little trouble falling asleep, I think it was between 4:45 and 5:00. Then I woke up for real at about 6:10. I got up, wrote down my dreams, and was able to go back to sleep and had more dreams but not lucid.
> 
> This is different than the galantamine-choline mix; that is a lot more trippy feeling, hard to remember exactly what happened, the strange body-awareness which can inhibit your dream actions, etc. This experience was reality-like in its vividness, but felt entirely like I was dreaming--no real-body awareness at all.



cool!

did you take the glutamine and aspartic acid in powder form, or capsules?

----------


## Moonbeam

> cool!
> 
> did you take the glutamine and aspartic acid in powder form, or capsules?



Powder.  I measured it out, I'm pretty sure I was closer to 3 g than 2.  It was really amazing; a different feel to the dream than the Gm-induced.  More like a high level DILD.  Much less druggy-feeling than a Gm dream.

I wonder if this has the tolerance effect that Gm does, do you know dodo?

----------


## lucidus

> This is different than the galantamine-choline mix; that is a lot more trippy feeling, hard to remember exactly what happened, the strange body-awareness which can inhibit your dream actions, etc.  This experience was  reality-like in its vividness, but felt entirely like I was dreaming--no real-body awareness at all.



Hi Moonbeam,

when you say "the strange body-awareness which can inhibit your dream actions": do you mean that you feel your real body while dreaming on galantamine?

It seems so, because you say:

"no real-body awareness at all" (for AA blend).

I wonder how that felt, I mean did you feel a dream-body at all?

My theory is that dreams which take place earlier in the night are less waking-body-connected. I very much enjoyed one of my rare lucids after only 3 hours of sleep in which I had a perfectly disconnected dream-body and could do anything without problems, even dreamsex  :wink2:  Is that how it feels on the AA blend?

----------


## Moonbeam

Lucidus--you know how when you take Gm sometimes you think you can feel your real body?  That often happens to me; I feel as if I am too aware of my real body, and it inhibits my dreams sometimes.  I'm not always sure if I am feeling my real body, or just dreaming that I am feeling it, but either way it's kind of annoying.  When I talk in the dream, I think I am really talking in my sleep, etc.

With the AA combo, the dream was extremely realistic, including the feel of my dream-body--it was pretty much just like being awake. And I had absolutely no annoying awareness of my real (sleeping) body; it was just like a natural DILD.  At one point when I was talking in the dream, I had a little trouble getting the words out (when I first became lucid) and I was a little worried that my real body was becoming involved, but that quickly went away.

The dream-sex was pretty good too; it happened in the middle of the dream instead of at the beginning like it usually does on the Gm.  I'd say it was just like regular lucid-sex, and the AA blend is not the aphrodisiac that the Gm is.  Pretty fun, similar to IRL,  but without the extended orgasm that occurs with the Gm. 

I don't know if the time of night has anything to do with it.  Actually this time I slept a little longer than I usually do before I take anything; usually I wake up at about 3:30, this time it was an hour later.  I was almost afraid I had waited too late and wouldn't be able to get back to sleep at all.  I was tired from lack of sleep the previous night, so that probably helped.

----------


## westonci

> Lucidus--you know how when you take Gm sometimes you think you can feel your real body?  That happens to me; I feel as if I am too aware of my real body, and it inhibits my dream sometimes.  I'm not always sure if I am feeling my real body, or just dreaming that I am feeling it.  When I talk in the dream, I think I am really talking in my sleep, etc.
> 
> With the AA combo, the dream was extremely realistic, including the feel of my dream-body. And I had absolutely no annoying awareness of my real body; it was just like a natural DILD.  At one point when I was talking in the dream, I had a little trouble getting the words out (it was when I first became lucid) and I was a little worried my real body was becoming involved, but that quickly went away.



where did you buy your supplements? Please name the website/store and exact brand name

----------


## Moonbeam

OK, Westonci:

The L-Glutamine is LifeExtension brand, and I got that from i-herb.

The L-Aspartic acid is Source Naturals brand, and I got that from i-herb also.

The L-Theanine is Suntheanine by NSI (Nutraceuticals Sciences Insitute) brand, and I already had that so I can't remember where I got it from.  It was probably either i-herb or Vitamin Shoppe; those are mostly the places I shop for supplements.

I have used those brands for a lot of my other supplements and already had experience with those companies, so I knew they would most likely be good quality.  I just usually shop at those two places (i-herb and Vitamin Shoppe); sometimes also Relentless Improvement for things I can't find anywhere else.

----------


## westonci

try it again tonight, im hoping that this can become an alternative to galantamine

----------


## dodobird

> I wonder if this has the tolerance effect that Gm does, do you know dodo?



I don't know, but my guess is that it that there will be tolerance to this too if you take it every night.

----------


## Moonbeam

I wouldn't do that.  It's good to have something to alternate with the Gm anyway.

----------


## Needcatscan

Okay, my first report:

Considering my work and school schedule I can't really afford to get up in the middle of the night, stay up for an hour, and then take the chance of not falling back asleep.  Also my wife would be kind of ticked if I set the alarm and woke her up as well.  So I'm taken the amino blend for the last 3 nights before I went to bed.  The first night my dreams were vivider, but no lucidity.  The second night not much of anything.  The third, I woke up at 4:00 AM after going to sleep around 11:30 Pm and could fall back asleep.  I stayed up till 7:00 before falling back asleep in which I had 3 short lucids in a row.  This was after around a 2 month dry spell.

I'll report more as it happens.

----------


## dodobird

> Okay, my first report:
> 
> Considering my work and school schedule I can't really afford to get up in the middle of the night, stay up for an hour, and then take the chance of not falling back asleep. Also my wife would be kind of ticked if I set the alarm and woke her up as well. So I'm taken the amino blend for the last 3 nights before I went to bed. The first night my dreams were vivider, but no lucidity. The second night not much of anything. The third, I woke up at 4:00 AM after going to sleep around 11:30 Pm and could fall back asleep. I stayed up till 7:00 before falling back asleep in which I had 3 short lucids in a row. This was after around a 2 month dry spell.
> 
> I'll report more as it happens.



To try the amino bland, you don't have to stay up for a long time, you can just take it and go back to sleep right away.

----------


## westonci

your right dodo, its really simple just take it and go back to sleep

Needcatscan I would recommend doing it during a WBTB, as hard as it may be, because your odds of having a Lucid Dream with the Amino Acid blend goes up by a lot

----------


## TalkingHead

I have yet to try the blend.. it should be coming any day though.  Do you think it would be overthetop to take vitamin b as well?  I do that on a regular basis already.  

But so far,  I needcatscan's results look quite promising wouldn't you say?

----------


## westonci

> I have yet to try the blend.. it should be coming any day though.  Do you think it would be overthetop to take vitamin b as well?  I do that on a regular basis already.  
> 
> But so far,  I needcatscan's results look quite promising wouldn't you say?



for your first time try it without the vitamin b.

This is so we can see the effectiveness of the Amino Acid Blend

----------


## Needcatscan

> for your first time try it without the vitamin b.
> 
> This is so we can see the effectiveness of the Amino Acid Blend



Gonna try a WBTB tonight, we'll see how it goes

Wish me luck

----------


## Needcatscan

WBTB w/ the amino blend was a failure.  This was probably due to me being a sporadic insomniac and not falling asleep till 4:00 AM.

Anyone else got their's in yet?

----------


## moe007

> I don't know, but my guess is that it that there will be tolerance to this too if you take it every night.



To my knowledge, you do not form tolerance to amino acids. We eat loads of them everyday from food, alot more than 2000 mg. I doubt it would have a tolerance, even if it did, taking more would not harm you, unless as Yuschak said "must be directly injected into the brain" And that is only for the aspartic acid.

----------


## dodobird

> To my knowledge, you do not form tolerance to amino acids. We eat loads of them everyday from food, alot more than 2000 mg. I doubt it would have a tolerance, even if it did, taking more would not harm you, unless as Yuschak said "must be directly injected into the brain" And that is only for the aspartic acid.



I think that L-theanine does not exist in everyday food except for tea.
But in any case tolerance can happen psychologically. 
Anything that has a profound effect on our mental processes, its effect may be reduced if we take it all the time.
It's like a tolerance in the 'software' level, the level of mental processes, rather than the 'hardware' level, the level of the functioning of receptors.
For example, when you move from a quite area to a noisy city you may have trouble sleeping with all the noise, but after a while your system becomes habituated and you can sleep without problems. The change is not in the simple functioning of the receptors and neuro-transmitters in the brain, but in the complex mental processing of the brain.

In any case, I am not sure that this method will cause tolerance if taken everyday, but I'm just guessing that it will.

----------


## Moonbeam

I can't do it every night anyway; I don't wake up at the right times every night.  I was just hoping the tolerance wouldn't be as severe as with galantamine, which really limits its use.

----------


## TalkingHead

yes.. I took mine during a WBTB last night but wasn't able to fall asleep for awhile, And I kept having to get up becasue I drank way too much water.

I also felt naseous for a minute but who knows if that was the   cause.  When I finally fell asleep for 30 minutes or so I had a really vivid dream.  I'm going to take it before going to sleep tongiht first thing.

----------


## Astrius

I've tried the amino blend a couple of times now... once before bed on Feb 3rd and then, last night, after a few hours of sleep. My feeling is that it actually had a negative effect on my dreaming. It's also fairly unpleasant to take, particularly in the middle of the night. One has to drink so much water to swallow everything that it's not long before one has to get up again! You can read about my experiences in my Dream Journal.

----------


## Moonbeam

Are there two threads about this?  I had very good success with the AA blend.

----------


## pj

Yeah - seems to me I've seen two threads on this.  If somebody will PM me links to them, I'll merge 'em if it isn't going to make things too messy.

**EDIT**

Threads merged.

----------


## Arthurium

> I've tried the amino blend a couple of times now... once before bed on Feb 3rd and then, last night, after a few hours of sleep. My feeling is that it actually had a negative effect on my dreaming. It's also fairly unpleasant to take, particularly in the middle of the night. One has to drink so much water to swallow everything that it's not long before one has to get up again! You can read about my experiences in my Dream Journal.



Put it all in OJ, you cant taste it... works perfect.

----------


## dodobird

> Put it all in OJ, you cant taste it... works perfect.



Yes, OJ is quite tasteless.  ::-P: 
Ok seriously, what do you mean?

----------


## Arthurium

> Yes, OJ is quite tasteless. 
> Ok seriously, what do you mean?



Ok, I have L-Glutamine, and L-Aspartic acid in free form. So i measure the correct amounts and mix it in orange juice, and drink that with the  L-Theanine pills. 

The OJ covers the taste.

----------


## iadr

> I have tried this so far about 8 times, and almost every single time I just fall asleep. 
> 
> It makes me really tired after I take it. Where as galantamine does not. 
> 
> Whats up with that?



It's probably the L-Theanine that is making you feel tired Arthurium, as it is suppose to help in relaxing.

I tried the combo last night and just fell asleep, but was really impressed with how relaxed I felt after taking it, probably from the L-Theanine.

I may have to double up and take a double dose of everything except the L-Theanine in order to get this combo to work.

I was really impressed with how relaxed I got from the L-Theanine though so will probably take that with galantamine from now on.

----------


## Arthurium

> It's probably the L-Theanine that is making you feel tired Arthurium, as it is suppose to help in relaxing.
> 
> I tried the combo last night and just fell asleep, but was really impressed with how relaxed I felt after taking it, probably from the L-Theanine.
> 
> I may have to double up and take a double dose of everything except the L-Theanine in order to get this combo to work.
> 
> I was really impressed with how relaxed I got from the L-Theanine though so will probably take that with galantamine from now on.




You should not over dose on this stuff, instead try it in the way recommended in the tests.

Sleep for 5 hours, wake up, take it. Go instantly back to bed, and try to stay awake by doing WILD. 

The peak plasma of this stuff is 45 minutes, so when you start seeing HI and having SP you will have the perfect chemistry in your brain to have a long, clear, and stable lucid.  

Works for me...

----------


## iadr

> You should not over dose on this stuff, instead try it in the way recommended in the tests.
> 
> Sleep for 5 hours, wake up, take it. Go instantly back to bed, and try to stay awake by doing WILD. 
> 
> The peak plasma of this stuff is 45 minutes, so when you start seeing HI and having SP you will have the perfect chemistry in your brain to have a long, clear, and stable lucid. 
> 
> Works for me...



Sounds like it is working for you now.  Great!

Thanks for the information on the peak plasma time and the recommended way of doing it.  

I'd been wondering about both of those.

I may need to just stay awake a bit longer.

----------


## Arthurium

> Sounds like it is working for you now.  Great!
> 
> Thanks for the information on the peak plasma time and the recommended way of doing it.  
> 
> I'd been wondering about both of those.
> 
> I may need to just stay awake a bit longer.



I tried WILD after 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7 hours of sleep. Then I tried going instantly to bed each time, it was interesting that  3,4  I would pass out instantly, but between  5 and 6 it works for me. At 7 I cant get SP.  At 6 I can get SP 95% of the time. 

Also, I tried WILD after staying up for 30 minutes, after 3,4,5,6, and 7 hours of sleep... and 3 and 4 work for that way. But I would prefer the sleep and SP is easier to reach with just going back to bed. 

Maybe I should make a tutorial to customize your WILD to maximize effectiveness, because it took a lot of tweaking out of the box.

I systematically figured all this out... I am such a nerd.  ::D:

----------


## westonci

Thats a great idea Arthurium, a tutorial sounds good

----------


## TalkingHead

Just to update.. I tried the blend again after a little break had an extremely vivid lucid dream last night to the point where I wasted a lot of time doing continual reality checks because it was as vivid as real life.  

Right now I'd say I'm 1 for 2 because I'm not going to count my first attempt where I drank too much water and never even really fell back to sleep.

I'll continue to post my results or lack thereof if anyone's still interested!

----------


## I H8 Reality

> Just to update.. I tried the blend again after a little break had an extremely vivid lucid dream last night to the point where I wasted a lot of time doing continual reality checks because it was as vivid as real life.  
> 
> Right now I'd say I'm 1 for 2 because I'm not going to count my first attempt where I drank too much water and never even really fell back to sleep.
> 
> I'll continue to post my results or lack thereof if anyone's still interested!



congratulations!  How long did the Lucid Dream last?

----------


## Arthurium

::banana::  The attempt:

I went to bed at 11, and woke up at 3 am.
I stayed up till 4:30, and took the amino acids at 4:15. 

I did not have much trouble keeping conscience and eventually gave up still though, probably at 5:15am.

I rolled over and went to bed, but still tried to keep conscience for a while, and eventually lost it. 

I became lucid probably at about 5:40, and realized the quality was amazing. It lasted about 20 minutes before I lost it due to randomly having sex with some DC. lol.

----------


## TalkingHead

Haven't taken the formula at night.. but taking the L-Glutamine Muscle Surge during the day...  My muscle getting so big I don't know what to do!!  Las muchachas love me but now I buy all new shirts!   Help!

----------


## Moonbeam

I tried cutting the doses in half, but it failed.

----------


## StephenT

I've asked this before, but don't think I've gotten an answer.  :tongue2: 

Does this cause desensitization?

----------


## Arthurium

> I've asked this before, but don't think I've gotten an answer. 
> 
> Does this cause desensitization?



From what I have heard, it doesn't because it is it an amino acid. You get them all everyday from all foods and they are essential for life in general.

----------


## Moonbeam

They are acting as neurotransmitters at this level however.

I don't know if there is the same kind of tolerance that develops from galantamine.  I haven't managed to test it out enough.  However, I doubt it will be, practically--the limitations for me are mostly how many nights I actually wake up at the right times.  It probably won't turn out to be often enough anyway.

I'm still a little worried about the excitotoxin aspect; I'm really trying to keep this down to maybe once a week, if it works out.

----------


## Arthurium

> I'm still a little worried about the excitotoxin aspect; I'm really trying to keep this down to maybe once a week, if it works out.



Aspartic Acid has a limited ability to cross the brain blood barrier.

 I had asked thomas about this and he told me that it would require you injecting it into the brain to cause damage. 

Aspartic acid is actually in orange juice too.

----------


## Moonbeam

It's the glutamine-->glutamate I'm thinking of.  It's different when AA's are in food; they don't come in such pure amounts of large quantities, and aren't so quickly absorbed.

However, I'm pretty sure it's safe under normal cicrcumstances unless someone is exceptionally sensitive; like someone who has migraines.

----------


## lucidus

Hi Moonbeam,
actually I wouldn't worry too much about glutamine.

E.g.: _Curd_ contains large amounts of it, probably even glutamic acid. From what I have read, you would get a "Yuschak-dose" by eating about 250g of curd. And AFAIK it should not be a problem to eat large amounts of curd, right  :wink2: 

Glutamate of course is another story. If you eat it directly (it's in quite a few fast food products) then you will definitely encounter problems.

----------


## Moonbeam

You're probably right, lucidus--I haven't noticed any bad effects anyway.

----------


## Camels, Candles, Castles.

The case study sounds very promising, and the results which are being posted in this thread make this combination more so appealing. I looked around yesterday, only being able to find L-glutamine and L-Theanine- I figured it not being of use without the AA. So I've put in an order (all 3 being cheaper online anyway), once they arrive I'll post results. Really looking forward to this.

----------


## Moonbeam

Good luck.  Reports are mixed so far.  I haven't managed to try it enough times to know if it will work consistently for me.

----------


## moe007

I tried this last night, with 4 unsuccessful galantamine tries. AND IT WORKED


i dont think i drank the aspartic acid tho, because when i woke up i looked in the cup and the powder was muck, and was at the bottom of the cup.

I had a shitty lucid, but its the first in a lONGGGGGGGGG time

i noticed i was lucid and almost immediately woke up. my vision blacked out and i  couldnt keep them open, when i opened my eyes i was awake.



GOOD JOB THO.


but from the aspartic acid being in the cup, i think just the other two would work, the aspartic acid is just to prolong ur lucidity

----------


## Moonbeam

Congratulations!  

You gotta rinse out the cup and drink it several times to get it all down.

----------


## iadr

Finally, this combination worked for me and helped me to have a DILD.

And the non-lucid part of the dream was just as interesting as the lucid part as it was quite vivid.

Here's the dream I had.

I find myself standing by a stream where I see a snake which is about 2 foot long, 4 inches around, with a majestic looking head with short hair going about 12 inches along its head. 

Although the snake seems friendly enough I keep my distance from it. 

My cat shows up and starts playing with the snake, rolling around next to it, and then putting her paw out and touching the snake with her paw. 

I am trying to get my cat away from the snake to keep her from getting bit when I see 5 or 6 small otters sticking their heads up on the other side of the creek 

I see several other small animals also, and then see a couple of fairly large turtles walk across the creek in a shallow spot. 

Although one of the turtles makes it up the bank on the other side alright the other turtle gets stuck because the bank is too steep for it to get up. 

I walk over and push it up the rest of way onto the bank. 

When I return back to my side of the creek, I then see several small elephants only about a foot tall walking along the creek. 

Wait a minute I think, One foot tall Elephants! I must be dreaming! 

I decide to jump into the creek to test my dream state, thinking that the worst that could happen is that I could get all wet. 

So I jump out and as I head down toward the water back first, I stop right before hitting the water and begin to float. 

I spend the rest of the lucid floating along the top of the river on my back.

----------


## Moonbeam

That's a cool one, iadr.  I like the idea of floating along down the river; I'd like to try and find a river and do that.

----------


## StephenT

How is the success rate compared to galantamine?  

Is the success rate (if lower) worth not having to wait as long because of the desensitization of galantamine?

I'm probably going to get either this or galantamine tomorrow!

----------


## moe007

Theres no side effects, its just protein.


As for success, galantamine has not worked for me either of the 3 times ive tried it, and this worked the first time. 

Im trying it tonight so ill post my results tomo.

----------


## StephenT

Thanks for the tips!

Yeah, I figured there weren't side effects.  :tongue2: 

I'll see what a couple others have to say about this combo v. galantamine/choline.  And also what your results are.

----------


## StephenT

More people reply to my post a couple posts ago!  I'm going to go get either this or galantamine soon today and need to know which to get.  More opinions!

EDIT:  After some research, I'm going to get the Amino Blend unless somebody tells me otherwise.  :tongue2:

----------


## moe007

Okay, so the Amino blend did not work this second time for me. So it is at a 50% success ratio so far.

I think This try tough wasnt fair because ive been very stressed and i think that caused me not to be lucid .


I think the amino blend is very effective because although it didnt make me lucid the second time, i still got very vivid dreams.

----------


## StephenT

Theanine is supposed to reduce stress.  ::D:   Maybe you need to not be stressed so the Theanine can be overabundant or something.

You think that a health-food store would have them?

----------


## moe007

THe later two. but Aspartic acid is not found in store.

Buy it on amazon.com

----------


## StephenT

Damn.  I wanted to try it tomorrow night.

----------


## moe007

meh sorry.



Im going to try the galantamine + amino blend in the weekend. Ill post my success. Plus i want to try the amino blend again because i think last night was horrible.

----------


## I H8 Reality

> meh sorry.
> 
> 
> 
> Im going to try the galantamine + amino blend in the weekend. Ill post my success. Plus i want to try the amino blend again because i think last night was horrible.




I wouldnt try that, according to Thomas Yuschak mixing galantamine+amino blend leads to very short LD's.

http://www.advancedld.com/f/Substanc...case_study.pdf

On page 12 he says

_The amino acid blend resulted in a significant increase in odds of experiencing a
lucid dream when used either alone or in combination with galantamine. The
combination, although effective, resulted in very short lucid episodes due to the increased
likelihood of awakening._

On page 14 he says

_Also since the galantamine/amino combination resulted in very short lucid episodes (less than 5 minutes), one can conclude that excessive cerebral
activation, although effective, is limited due to the interference it causes with sleep ingeneral._

----------


## moe007

Considering every lucid that ive had (3), have been <1 minute.. Im willing to give anything a chance. 

Plus, Ive been blessed with extreme tolerance to everything. I done alot of research, and I found that it may not disturb me enough to wake me up.. Maybe to keep me from falling asleep, but once im slumberous i doubt itll wake me up.



I hope it doesnt  :smiley:

----------


## iadr

> I have tried Galantamine twice and gotten SP both times with no lucid, and this blend once with SP but no lucid so I was figuring that maybe combining them would work for me. But I am thinking that it makes more sense that I was waking way to early and was not in my REM stage of sleep. 
> 
> So tonight I will try the amino blend (the later two) and wake 5 hours after going to sleep.



I am still working on my ideal method, but what I am finding works best for me is to make my attempts with the supplements after I've already had at least 1 or 2 vivid dreams.

Because if I've already had 1 or 2 vivid dreams, then I know that the dreams are already coming on strong, so that I'm already close to being lucid.

Taking the supplements at this time helps me get lucid almost every time as the supplements just give me that little bit of extra awareness needed to become lucid.

----------


## StephenT

Going to a good vitamin store tommorow.

Going to get whatever they have.  Hopefully they'll have aspartic acid, but if they don't I'll order it online.

----------


## three and four

Last night, I slept about 4 hours, got up, took the Amino Blend as described by T. Yuschak, and went back to bed right away. I'm guessing it took me about 30 mins to get back to sleep.

I had no lucids, and I'm disappointed!

When I woke up this morning I could recall two average-length, uneventful non-lucids. I wrote them down.

I don't feel any major side-effects today, but I feel quite tired, and my mood sucks (could be just the weather, though).






> I am still working on my ideal method, but what I am finding works best for me is to make my attempts with the supplements after I've already had at least 1 or 2 vivid dreams.
> 
> Because if I've already had 1 or 2 vivid dreams, then I know that the dreams are already coming on strong, so that I'm already close to being lucid.
> 
> Taking the supplements at this time helps me get lucid almost every time as the supplements just give me that little bit of extra awareness needed to become lucid.



iadr, that's a really interesting idea, I'd like to try it (next time I try the Amino Blend). But tell me, how do you time when to wake up? Can you wake yourself without an alarm clock once you've had "1 or 2 vivid dreams"? I'm not sure I can do that...

----------


## Astrius

> I had no lucids, and I'm disappointed!



I've had more success with the amino blend when I exclude the aspartic acid (which seems to give me nightmares). I have also had more success when I take the amino blend at bedtime rather than during the sleep cycle. I still feel that it's unreliable, however, and am trying to find an alternative to aspartic acid. Perhaps GABA, L-Tyrosine, EGCG or DMAE. I will experiment again tonight.

Unfortunately, Yuschak's site is still under construction. And whilst it lists some of these supplements [L-Tyrosine, EGCG, L-Phenylalanine, etc.] there is no information on their usage/dosage, either in his book or on-line. 

Shouldn't some of us get together as a group and offer ourselves up to him as guinea pigs?  ::bowdown::  I'm in. Who else?

----------


## three and four

Thanks for the tip, Astrius. I'll also try without the L-Aspartic acid.

I wrote to Yuschak a few days ago about how best to use EGCg - here is what he said:

Hello,

EGCG acts as a dopamine reuptake inhibitor and therefore boosts dopamine levels. Adding it can enhance galantamine's performance but I don't think it's necessary if you are already using propranolol. There are some research papers that tested up to about 1000mg of EGCG on test subjects without any experiencing negative side effects. As little as 300mg can make a difference in dream quality. Most likely I will be including it in some future LDS combinations.

Thomas Yuschak

----------


## Astrius

> EGCG acts as a dopamine reuptake inhibitor and therefore boosts dopamine levels. Adding it can enhance galantamine's performance but I don't think it's necessary if you are already using propranolol. There are some research papers that tested up to about 1000mg of EGCG on test subjects without any experiencing negative side effects. As little as 300mg can make a difference in dream quality. Most likely I will be including it in some future LDS combinations.



Thanks for sharing that. I usually use EGCG by itself (175mg), at bedtime. It resulted in partial lucidity once, and nearly always generates "floaty" dreams, which tend to increase the chances of becoming lucid, if nothing else. I will definitely increase the dosage now, after reading the above.

----------


## Moonbeam

I had another amino acid failure.  I was still using less than recommended; 1/2 tsp each, and I took it after about 3  hours sleep (just because I happened to wake up then; I usually take supplements after about 4-5 hourse sleep).

I didn't notice a thing.  I guess I'm going to have to take the full dose to get results again.

----------


## iadr

> iadr, that's a really interesting idea, I'd like to try it (next time I try the Amino Blend). But tell me, how do you time when to wake up? Can you wake yourself without an alarm clock once you've had "1 or 2 vivid dreams"? I'm not sure I can do that...



I've been waking up every couple of hours after my dreams lately, so have had no need to use an alarm clock.

This seems to have started happening when I started taking the GABA every day, although lately I have just been taking the GABA every other day when I make lucid attempts.

As for the amino acid blend, I am only 1 for 4 with it, so am having a very low success rate with it.






> I didn't notice a thing.



That's the same effect I've had from the amino acid blend, even when I tried doubling up the dose, although I did manage to get lucid once when taking the recommended dose.

----------


## three and four

> I've been waking up every couple of hours after my dreams lately, so have had no need to use an alarm clock.
> 
> This seems to have started happening when I started taking the GABA every day, although lately I have just been taking the GABA every other day when I make lucid attempts.



Oh, I have some Gaba, but I've not done much experimenting with it. When do you take yours, what dose do you take, and what results have you obtained?

----------


## iadr

> Oh, I have some Gaba, but I've not done much experimenting with it. When do you take yours, what dose do you take, and what results have you obtained?



I usually take 4 grams when going to bed, another 4 grams when making a lucid attempt, and another 4 grams after my first lucid attempt which sometimes works in helping me get lucid on the 2nd try.

I think that taking the GABA every day may have made me more insensitive to the galantamine though because the galantamine became totally ineffective until I stopped taking the GABA every day, after which it was once again effective.

----------


## three and four

I tried the AA combo again last night, and again I failed to get lucid. That's two failures out of two attempts.

Damn, I had high hopes for this method. I'll try again in a few days...

----------


## lucidus

The same here..  ::?: 

I had about 3 failures and one partly successful attempt where I had a very short DILD, then quickly lost lucidity.

It seems, you cannot compare this combo to galantamine. Or we miss something. One idea was that additional magnesium is needed. But I already added this with no success.

Another idea is: this is not an "easy WILD pill" like galantamine. You need more experience to use these supplements to get lucid than you have to when using galantamine. So let's concentrate on those traditional techniques again (like I did years ago when I had many DILDs without the Yuschak supplements) and combine them with the amino acids.

----------


## three and four

Hi lucidus,

So what exactly is your plan? 

Sleep about 4 hours, get up, take the AA combo, stay up for 45 mins then try to WILD?

Would you drink some tea as well? I find this essential if I'm going to try and WILD with no supplements. But then... I suspect that tea AND supplements would make getting back to sleep pretty much impossible... Dunno - tell me what you think and what you try!

----------


## lucidus

Well, I usually sleep for 4-5 hours before doing a WBTB.
Then I stay up for at least 45 minutes, sometimes 60 or even 90.
45 minutes is somewhat minimum, especially when taking the
powder (going downstairs into my kitchen, preparing and drinking all
that stuff).

I could try having a tea also with the AA blend method. Sometimes I
did this with galantamine. I use japanese "Matcha" tea. It contains
large amounts of EGCG and probably also much l-theanine.
But it contains of course some caffeine. Maybe this isn't too bad
for this method. I think I will try that next time..

----------


## iadr

I had another lucid from this combo last night, so am now 2 for 6 with it.

It seems to be much weaker than the galantamine is, and for me requires staying up for at least 30 minutes and using the WBTB method to get it to work.

----------


## TalkingHead

Has anyone actually WILDed with this combo or just DILD'd..  I need to start again.

----------


## Arthurium

> Has anyone actually WILDed with this combo or just DILD'd..  I need to start again.



It has worked once for me. It was a DILD. 

I woke 3 hours after I went to bed. Stayed up for 1 1/2 hours , took it and fell  asleep.

----------


## iadr

> Has anyone actually WILDed with this combo or just DILD'd



Mine have both been DILDs, although I think this would be an excellent combination to WILD from since it is supposed to reach its peak in 45 minutes.

----------


## moe007

The first time i did it, i had a DILD, but initially the purpose of the blend is to WILD off of.

----------


## Out of the Blue

Alright, so I picked up some Glutamine and Theamine at the local Vitamin Shoppe, but I had to order Aspartic Acid online. Well, while waiting for the aspartic to arrive, I decided last night to go ahead and try the combo with just the two.

Well? *Partial Success!*
I took 4000 mg Glutamine and 300 mg Theamine after sleeping for 4 hours.

This was my first lucid lasting more than a minute in a while.

I failed the WILD but got a DILD. I had trouble relaxing enough to get the full-blown vibrations I'd normally get during a WILD attempt but I think I just wasn't being patient.

----------


## REMemberDreaming

I think people should try the L-Glutamine & L-Theanine combo by themselves. They are more easily accessible and very well studied in terms of safety profile. L-Theanine also reverses excitotoxicity, so it & aspartic acid might be having opposite effects.

I'm going to try 200mg of L-Theanine & 2000mg of L-Glutamine tonight... That's plenty for someone of my body weight & metabolism.

----------


## three and four

> I'm going to try 200mg of L-Theanine & 2000mg of L-Glutamine tonight...



Well, last night I took 300mg of L-Theanine and 4000mg of L-Glutamine, some tea, did a wbtb, tried to WILD, and... nothing. I'm having a success rate of zero with this combo. Damn.

----------


## Out of the Blue

Well, I'm going to try the full combo tonight. I took a night off and my aspartic acid arrived today.  I will of course let you know how it goes.

EDIT: *Failure*

I tried the combo last night with no luck. But, I never WILDed properly. I was having trouble focusing properly, I don't know if this was the result of any of the compounds.

Several vivid dreams, but can't say if this was different than normal though.

Also, the Aspartic Acid is nasty tasting, I didn't quite take the entire dosage because I was having trouble downing the whole solution. Oh well, I'll try again in a couple days, maybe Sunday.

----------


## Bad Robot

Anyone take whey protein to get the aminos? I've read it may not be safe to take individual aminos long term, e.g. l-tryptophan is carcinogenic, and it's already been mentioned that aspartic acid is an excitotoxin.

----------


## Arthurium

> Anyone take whey protein to get the aminos? I've read it may not be safe to take individual aminos long term, e.g. l-tryptophan is carcinogenic, and it's already been mentioned that aspartic acid is an excitotoxin.



That cant be true. 

"For many organisms (including humans), tryptophan is an essential amino acid. This means that it cannot be synthesized by the organism and therefore must be part of its diet. " - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tryptophan

----------


## Bad Robot

I was refering to when it is taken on its own. If taken with other aminos as part of food, i.e. turkey, whey protein, then it's likely to be safe because of the competition from other amino acids.

I don't have any direct references to science papers, but here is an article by a well known scientist:

http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/coconut-oil.shtml






> That cant be true. 
> 
> "For many organisms (including humans), tryptophan is an essential amino acid. This means that it cannot be synthesized by the organism and therefore must be part of its diet. " - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tryptophan

----------


## TalkingHead

> Well, I'm going to try the full combo tonight. I took a night off and my aspartic acid arrived today. I will of course let you know how it goes.
> 
> EDIT: *Failure*
> 
> I tried the combo last night with no luck. But, I never WILDed properly. I was having trouble focusing properly, I don't know if this was the result of any of the compounds.
> 
> Several vivid dreams, but can't say if this was different than normal though.
> 
> Also, the Aspartic Acid is nasty tasting, I didn't quite take the entire dosage because I was having trouble downing the whole solution. Oh well, I'll try again in a couple days, maybe Sunday.



 
Is it time that I just  feed the rest of these supplements to my dog?

----------


## clarkkent

Has there been any further updates re this mix? Successes, failures etc..?

----------


## Fiddler's Green

> Has there been any further updates re this mix? Successes, failures etc..?




I've tried this mix three times, using it after 5 or 6 hours sleep and then going back to bed after some WILD techniques.  *I have failed* using this combination every time, the dreams haven't even been vivid.

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## Thor

> I've tried this mix three times, using it after 5 or 6 hours sleep and then going back to bed after some WILD techniques.  *I have failed* using this combination every time, the dreams haven't even been vivid.



Same here. I was thinking that if it doesn't work on its own, maybe it could work as a potentiator of galantamine/choline or nicotine, but I haven't gotten around to trying it yet. Has anyone else tried this?

----------


## clarkkent

> Same here. I was thinking that if it doesn't work on its own, maybe it could work as a potentiator of galantamine/choline or nicotine, but I haven't gotten around to trying it yet. Has anyone else tried this?



I have some pea-based whey protein with tryptophan, l-glutamine but not l-theanine, so I prepared my mix with some of it, and I added two green teabags..

I woke up after 3 hours of sleep and took it.
I went back to sleep immediately and had a very vivid dream with better recall than the past few nights.
I can't conclude anything at this point, but I think I will try to buy an l-theanine supplement soon.

----------


## neuf08

Glutamine itself should be perfectly safe to take. You do want to be careful when supplementing with amino acids that you don't upset the body's balance of them. But glutamine has been reported to be fairly safe when taken in moderation. I don't know much about other specific amino acids, but I have never heard anything about L-tryptophan being carcinogenic. So I would just keep the glutamine in moderation and you should be fine.

----------


## moe007

It is no way carcinogenic, but it would not be smart to take more than 2 grams of tryptophan.

Yes it is an essential amino acid, but it is true what he said about how when there is no competition from other amino acids it is not very healthy.

You wont die, but it just isnt treating your body right. More harm than good.

Stick to low doses.

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## jpekarske

whats up everyone. no idea if this has already been brought up or if this stuff even works but all these amino acids you guys are talking about can be found in most protein supplements. i know this cause i basicly live off the stuff and always drink some before i go to bed to help wit muscle growth. i'm going to see if i find a difference in my ability to ld. but check it out its probably a whole lot cheaper then buying all the amino acids individualy and i feel like it might be healthier to. pc

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## Nihao

I got these "magic" powders and tried that combo 3 days ago with no result. Even the dreams were not any more vivid then usual. I tried to WILD after 4.5h of sleep. Couldn't get deeper for at least 1h then lost the conciousness:\
Galantamine+Choline was more efficient.
Despite that I'll try it again...

----------


## neuf08

I think glutamine is great, along with other amino acids. One thing I wanted to point out (I don't know if anyone mentioned it yet because I'll confess I didn't read the entire thread), is that it's best not to take glutamine and other amino acids every night. Taking amino acids when the body isn't being depleted of them (such as during heavy or intense exercising) can upset the body's balance of amino acids. That being said, they're great to take on occasion.

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## Nihao

I tried it again after one week and failed. Now is 0 for 2. I had vivid, very detailed dreams instead. Anyhow it looks like Mr Yuschak made a great joke at us :wink2:

----------


## fatboy

Where can I get these amino acids and at what price?

----------


## clarkkent

> I tried it again after one week and failed. Now is 0 for 2. I had vivid, very detailed dreams instead. Anyhow it looks like Mr Yuschak made a great joke at us



L-theanine is good for recall, I don't think he was joking.

----------


## clarkkent

> Where can I get these amino acids and at what price?



Try your local health store or ebay...

----------


## Verre

> Thomas Yuschak was kind enough to reply to me: 
> 
> Aspartic acid is quite safe when taken orally. There is more than 2000mg of aspartic acid in just 3oz of orange roughy. Aspartic  acid would be considered an excitotoxin if it were injected directly into the brain but when taken orally, the blood brain barrier controls the rate at which it enters such that it stays well below the excitoxin level.







> This looks like a mistake. According to nutritiondata.com, there is just about 120mg of aspartic acid in 3oz of orange.



Orange roughy is a not an orange, it's a fish. According to the "extended nutritional details" here ( Calories in Roughy, Orange ) a 3oz serving contains 2.141g of aspartic acid.

----------


## Dahthla

Anyone here have the original article? It is down for me.

----------


## Verre

My L-Aspartic acid finally came in the mail, so the other morning I got to try the L-A + L-G + L-T combo for the first time. It worked astonishingly well! It took me an hour to get back to sleep, but eventually I did and it was the clearest transition I've ever experienced from waking to dreaming. I felt the SP set in with its characteristic vibrations, and after that I was aware that I was dreaming, and I just sat up and got out of the bed, in my dream body, in a perfectly casual and straightforward way. It was the most lucid, life-like dream experience I've ever had, better in many ways than Galantamine-induced LDs. Today (two days later) I tried again and did not have success, but I blame my cat for knocking things around and preventing me from getting back to sleep within an effective time frame.

----------


## Dr Who

I've been away doing other things for a while but I'm getting back into LD now in a bigger and more serious way. I've had a great deal of success with Galantamine+Choline but I'm going to try this AA combo too. I've ordered the stuff and while I'm waiting, does anyone have the original pdf this was all based on or does Thomas still frequent the forum ? I have his book which is great and I'm considering starting a LD web store so people can order the supplements. I have a contact in China and we're going to make them up according to the original Thomas formulas. D'you think you guys would be interested in this idea ?

----------


## Dr Who

Well, I was really disappointed with my first results, particularly as there are those that this AA combo appears to work well for.
My drugs finally arrived from iherb and I made my first dose as per the recipe which I dissolved in orange juice. I went to bed early at about 10pm, set my alarm for 03:30, woke up, took the concoction which I washed down with a further glass of water and then did a few things for about 20 mins and then went back to bed.
Nichts, nothing, zippo. Not even a remembered dream let alone anything approaching lucidity.
And I had such high hopes because of my great success with galantamine. I'll try again, this time not dissolving the powders in orange juice just to see if that makes any difference.
Perhaps those that galantamine works for aren't able to get the AA combo to work. Are there any stats for this ?
The problem for me is that galantamine makes me very aggressive and short tempered for the next day or so, although I may have the solution to that by ingesting aniracetam. We'll see....

----------


## Cosmix

Hey Dr Who, I've experimented five times over the past four weeks with a Galatamine, Choline, l-Theanine combo and have had a lucid 3 of 5 so 60% success rate so far.  Yesterday my AA finally arrived and I gave this combo a try last night.  I woke up about 3.5 - 4 hours after falling asleep (I'm going to try 5 next time) and mixed Glutamine and AA in water while washing Theanine down and damn AA is nasty in water lol.  I stayed up for 10 minutes then went back to bed.  Took me about 30 more minutes and Bam, I could really feel the combo kicking in - body vibrations, HI getting intense, sp, and then I ended up in a lucid.  I had three relatively short ones back to back - the third started as a regular dream but a DC kept telling me "you took Glutamine combo, your dreaming!" until I finally became lucid.  In the first lucid I flew around and entered a Guitar Center to find a couple DC's that were people I knew back in high school.  I said they were in my dream and they got really pissed saying they weren't, then attacked me.  I hit one in the head with a shovel but the other ended up knifing me in the spine, it was a very surreal feeling.  But anyway I'm 1 for 1 with this combo, I'll report when I try it a few more times.

I also found that to me G + C and this combo seem pretty similar to each other.  This combo being possibly... slightly more in detail.  I'd say try making the concoction when you wake up rather than before you go to bed.  I don't know about these amino acids but I know when working out and taking Creatine you want to take it pretty much right after you mix it because it breaks down to creatinine which is useless.


PS.  I woke with a headache that persisted for a couple hours.  Not sure if it was due to the supplements or not, I'll find out with further testing.

----------


## Dr Who

Cosmix, thanks for the heads up regarding mixing the concoction once I wake up. Good idea. I'll try that on Saturday and see how it goes. I must say, from what others (and you) have said, I was really surprised that absolutely nothing happened, so lets hope it was because I mixed it early.Watch this space.

----------


## Dr Who

Well, I did as I said I would and didn't make up my AA dose until I woke up at 03:30. I mixed the powders with water and drank it all down, stayed awake for 25 mins and then went back to bed to sleep.
But absolutely nothing happened, not even a normal dream. Very disappointing but I suppose my biochemistry just isn't suited to this AA combo and I'll have to stay with G+C.
That said, the G+C mix seems to guarantee an LD, so at least I have a method of induction.

----------


## Verre

I posted earlier about my initial success with the AA combo, but unfortunately the combo has not been reliable for me since then. I had the success on the first try, after that I had multiple attempts that failed because I was unable to get back to sleep. I then had another success which was short-lived -- it was funny, actually, because my "body" felt so real in the LD that I felt uncomfortable going outside naked and spent the entire dream trying to pick out clothes to wear, then woke up and was unable to resume the dream -- and subsequent to the second success the AA combo has simply failed to work, even when I fall back asleep promptly.

----------


## dr1ft

Just tried the "three aminos" combo and it did not work for me as well. However, the night before I had taken Galantamine and Piracetam the morning after, so perhaps I tried too soon. I'll try again tonight  :wink2: 

So far, 0 for 1.

----------


## nakah

This combo did nothing for me either...I think the %100 success rate claimed by thomas yuschak was just a coincidence....

----------

