# Lucid Dreaming > Attaining Lucidity > Lucid Aids >  >  Huperzine-A / Choline combo?

## alanl

I'm awaiting Galantamine delivery but have Choline Bitartrate and Huperzine-A at home.

Is it safe and useful to combine these in a WBTB?

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## gab

Quote from Steve Yuschak - The Power of supplements:

"Also be aware that there is another AChE inhibitor that is available without a prescription. This substance is Huperzine A and has been used in Chinese medicine for a very long time. At the present time I have not done any experiments with this substance but it may be an alternative to galantamine." End of quote.

Sounds like Hup-A has similar/same properties as Galantamine. I wanted to try, but my local store doesn't carry it. Sorry, son't know how much you should take. But WBTB is essential for WILDing. Good luck with it.  :smiley:

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## alanl

Yeah, I have his book. I have also read that an alternative to Galantamine/Choline is Hup-A/Nicotine - I'm a (very) light smoker so the very occasional 7mg patch for a few hours part of a WBTB isn't a moral issue for me.

And the Hup-Z/Choline combo didn't have much impact. This was Hup-A 200mcg and Choline bitartrate 500 mg and I don't want to exceed those doses

Just hope the Galantamine arrives soon :-) 

Never had a DILD before (that I can remember) but used to have WILD's/OBE's in my 20s - now late 30s and they never happen so hoping some supplemental help can improve my chances

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## Wolfwood

> And the Hup-Z/Choline combo didn't have much impact. This was Hup-A 200mcg and Choline bitartrate 500 mg and I don't want to exceed those doses



_210 participants with mild to moderate AD received either 200 mcg of huperzine A, 400 mcg of huperzine A, or placebo twice daily for 16 weeks. While no statistical difference in cognitive scores was noted in patients in the lower dose huperzine A (200mcg) group compared to placebo, the higher dose (400 mcg) of huperzine A led to improved cognition and activities of daily living._

Possibly the dosage then?

And yeah, huperzine A shares the same mechanism of action as a galantamine as an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. An important point, however, is that galantamine's half-life is 7 hours, and so its peak effect will likely last a night, whereas huperzine A's half-life is a lower 4.5 hours.

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## gab

> _210 participants with mild to moderate AD received either 200 mcg of huperzine A, 400 mcg of huperzine A, or placebo twice daily for 16 weeks. While no statistical difference in cognitive scores was noted in patients in the lower dose huperzine A (200mcg) group compared to placebo, the higher dose (400 mcg) of huperzine A led to improved cognition and activities of daily living._
> 
> Possibly the dosage then?



thanks for the info about the study.

The thing about the dosage is that Yuschak doesn't mention it and I don't want to just eyeball it. I would also be cautious about taking 'therapeutic' doses, like the ones you mention were used in the study. Just because, I know that galantamine dose for Alzheimer patiens in is several times higher than dose recommended for lucid dreaming.

Have you used Hup-A?

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## Wolfwood

> thanks for the info about the study.
> 
> The thing about the dosage is that Yuschak doesn't mention it and I don't want to just eyeball it. I would also be cautious about taking 'therapeutic' doses, like the ones you mention were used in the study. Just because, I know that galantamine dose for Alzheimer patiens in is several times higher than dose recommended for lucid dreaming.
> 
> Have you used Hup-A?



I have it, but not used it yet. I'm waiting to get Alpha-GPC, and then I'll combine.... I'm hoping I won't need to maximize the doses, but we'll see how that goes.

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## alanl

The Galantamine arrived 2 days ago and I tried last night. Reminded me of the days 18 years ago when I used to WILD unintentionally when having an extra sleep during the day as I worked nightshift at the time. I never had a WILD/OBE on this occassion but I think if I was able to have slept another 1-2 hours the vibrations would have kicked in.

I took 4mg Galantamine, 500mg Choline with .3mg melatonin around 3am (after 4 hours sleep as part of a WBTB). Unfortunately my daughter awoke soon after and took her an hour to get back to sleep. I was left wide awake :-S Finally got back to sleep around 5am, had a series of very short, very vivid, semi-lucid dreams, usually involving false awakenings. In the dreams I was aware that I had taken Galantamine and they were so real I presumed I was awake ... wish I'd remembered to do RC's :-S At one stage (around 6.30am) I had some brief and weak vibrations. 

This is *exactly* the pattern of events I used to have many years ago and they always lead to strong vibrations where I either had OBE or woke up too excited (or scared initially before I had my first OBE!). 

So I'm very happy about this and can see why the Galantamine/Choline combo is so famous in LD circles!

I'm taking a few days off so the Galantamine gets out of my system and will try again Wednesday. I'll either up the GM dose to 8mg OR try to get to bed earlier so I have a couple more hours during WBTB. 

I'll leave the Hup-A for now.

In between Galantamine attempts I may try alternative options using things like Melatonin, L-Theanine, L-Dopa, the amino acid combo I've just read about and see which ones work. 

Goal is full lucidity but even very vivid, intense and memorable non-lucids would be fine if lucidity fails :-)

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